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No Rabbi on the Muse for Passover


marienbad
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I’m with Jolly. Why would you expect a Rabbi on board?

 

Or, did you also expect SS to have a priest for the Catholics, a pastor for the Protestants, a preacher for the Baptists, or a Vicar for the Angelicans, since Easter is at the same time as Passover?

 

 

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We’ve been on Silversea at Easter ,think it was the Silver Cloud, there was a Catholic priest and a Rabbi on board.
Sounds like a joke on the new sitcom “Living Biblically“; a priest, a rabbi, and <insert name here> walk onto a cruise ship...

 

 

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I’m with Jolly. Why would you expect a Rabbi on board?

 

Or, did you also expect SS to have a priest for the Catholics, a pastor for the Protestants, a preacher for the Baptists, or a Vicar for the Angelicans, since Easter is at the same time as Passover?

 

 

Many large and small cruise ships do have rabbis and priests onboard for major religious holidays.

I found the following information about Silversea by googling Rabbis and Silversea.

 

Silversea: On Passover, a rabbi will be onboard to conduct religious services and host a table at dinner. For Easter, depending on the vessel and whether it is a port or sea day, Silversea will feature a holiday luncheon or a Gala Dinner onboard. Easter baskets, bunnies and eggs will be a turndown gift in every suite. Clergy is onboard to conduct religious services.

 

 

We have been on other ships for Passover where there was a Rabbi and a wonderful Seder. So we were disappointed.

 

 

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It’s a shame you didn’t ask them before booking if this really was important.

 

To avoid any further dissapointments it might be worthwhile if you made your requirements for a seder table known now so that it can be provided. SS doesn’t cater for full kosher requirements, and the environment around you will be far from passover friendly for frum Jews, ie they will not be throwing all the chametz overboard, but as long as you are flexible, and have a decent table and someone who can claim to be the youngest to ask the oldest “the traditional questions” then you might have a passable passover experience. Remember to take the appropriate book with you. ;)

 

Best wishes and enjoy your SS Pesach.

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I always think if holidays are of vital importance to people they have choices to make.......if you are going on a vacation and want to celebrate said holiday (this case Passover) then your best bet is to call the cruise line beforehand to make sure whatever it is you are wanting will be provided.....then you will know and can book (or not) accordingly. The other choices would be to find a cruise line that offers a Rabbi, or, not travel over the holiday. Or....try a land trip where a Synagogue would be part of the trip.......I bet they would have a Seder

where visitors would be welcomed.

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When we were aboard Voyager in 2015, Dubai to Cape Town, there were special times and dinners to celebrate Chanukah.

One dinner had 110 participants for a special night. Someone who took part might post about it.

As far as I know there was no rabbi on board for this.

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It’s a shame you didn’t ask them before booking if this really was important.

 

To avoid any further dissapointments it might be worthwhile if you made your requirements for a seder table known now so that it can be provided. SS doesn’t cater for full kosher requirements, and the environment around you will be far from passover friendly for frum Jews, ie they will not be throwing all the chametz overboard, but as long as you are flexible, and have a decent table and someone who can claim to be the youngest to ask the oldest “the traditional questions” then you might have a passable passover experience. Remember to take the appropriate book with you. ;)

 

Best wishes and enjoy your SS Pesach.

 

 

 

Thank you for your thoughtful replies.

Passover Seder does not have to be kosher as you know.

By the way there is a catholic priest onboard and they are celebrating Palm Sunday.

 

 

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Thank you for your thoughtful replies.

Passover Seder does not have to be kosher as you know.

By the way there is a catholic priest onboard and they are celebrating Palm Sunday.

 

 

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Arguably, if seder night needn’t be kosher then a rabbi is even less essential.

 

It seems to me that the majority of jews do not attend synagogue even though many more enjoy a family seder night often to ensure that family traditions are kept alive.

 

Your comment about the Catholic priest implies a feeling you have of unfairness. But many non-catholics observe Easter festivities and would be content to share a service conducted by a catholic priest and it would be far easier for SS to satisfy a larger number of passengers because priests would be easier to locate in almost all ports that SS visits (if not all) which cannot be said for the greater challenge of finding a rabbi.

 

I understand your dissapointment, but presumably SS didn’t advertise that a rabbi would be on your cruise and the fault does rest with you for making incorrect assumptions without checking with SS before booking, if the issue was so important to you. In my view fwiw it is unfair to blame SS for your lack of checking. I hope we can disagree on that small point without us falling out .... :)

 

I would love to see a 65 year old asking a 75 year old “why is this night different from all other nights”! :)

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Arguably, if seder night needn’t be kosher then a rabbi is even less essential.

 

It seems to me that the majority of jews do not attend synagogue even though many more enjoy a family seder night often to ensure that family traditions are kept alive.

 

Your comment about the Catholic priest implies a feeling you have of unfairness. But many non-catholics observe Easter festivities and would be content to share a service conducted by a catholic priest and it would be far easier for SS to satisfy a larger number of passengers because priests would be easier to locate in almost all ports that SS visits (if not all) which cannot be said for the greater challenge of finding a rabbi.

 

I understand your dissapointment, but presumably SS didn’t advertise that a rabbi would be on your cruise and the fault does rest with you for making incorrect assumptions without checking with SS before booking, if the issue was so important to you. In my view fwiw it is unfair to blame SS for your lack of checking. I hope we can disagree on that small point without us falling out .... :)

 

I would love to see a 65 year old asking a 75 year old “why is this night different from all other nights”! :)

 

 

 

Many non Jews have joined the Passover Seder on other cruises we have been on.

I do see a lack of parity here and I am glad to have noted this on cruisecritic for those who consult these boards for information on cruise experiences.

 

 

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The lack of parity bothers me as well, and I am neither Catholic nor Jewish.

 

marienbad, I also encourage you to contact SS and let them know you are hoping for an appropriate celebration of some kind. I'm sure you are not alone. It isn't for a few days yet, so hopefully they can pull something together.

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It might be worth noting that a substantial number of crew (including those from the Philippines) are Catholic, and the priest on holiday cruises I have be on celebrates Mass for those crew members who wish to attend. I have noticed that crew attendance has been robust at these events.

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We are on the Muse and expected that there would be a Rabbi on for Passover.

We have been told that there will be no Rabbi onboard for this holiday. We are surprised and disappointed.

 

 

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Unfortunately most cruise lines don't have Rabbi's on board even for the Holidays.

 

There are some who never had them and some who used to and eliminated them to fill rooms with paying guests.

 

We are fortunate that Crystal Cruises still has a Rabbi on board for the Jewish Holidays and a Protestant Clergy on for some selected holidays along with Catholic priests who are on for all voyages.

 

It certainly has been special for us.

 

Keith

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The lack of parity bothers me as well, and I am neither Catholic nor Jewish.

 

I do not see it as a matter of entitlement or as you say ”parity” but see it more as a matter of sound commercial judgement about how far you are prepared to increase costs for all passengers for a small number of people who should not have been expecting it. I think the challenges have been under-estimated and not fully understood.

 

Having a rabbi on board for a single night probably means taking a further suite out of the revenue pool for the whole cruise as well as any other remunerations. That cost is then lost to revenue and spread across all passengers.

 

There is an additional challenge in that an orthodox rabbi might not be willing to stay on a cruise ship without a fully compliant kosher kitchen even if he restricted himself to vegetarian food, because the vegetables might be contaminated with pork or some other non-kosher food. Over passover, he might not be willing to be on a ship with bread, or have his food served on a plate that hasn’t been kept “free of bread.”

 

If a non-orthodox rabbi was secured, he or she might not be seen as being an acceptable rabbi by some orthodox jews. For some orthodox jews a non-orthodox rabbi or progressive or liberal rabbi would be as useful to them as a catholic priest.

 

There is also an additional challenge that whereas liberal and progressive jews might find an orthodox rabbi acceptable to conduct a service for all, the orthodox rabbi would not be willing to conduct a service if there was less than ten jewish males ie a minyan. So the service may not take place at all.

 

Clearly it is in SS’s judgement that they will not offer it and there is no obligation for them to do so unless they advertise it in the hope,of attracting more jewish passengers.

 

These may be amongst the issues causing SS to try and avoid providing rabbi led services.

Edited by UKCruiseJeff
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Jeff, the thread is about Passover.

 

Kosher is not relevant. You can have a Passover meal and the service can follow the Passover prayers and the food that accompanies it can also comply with the traditions of Passover. But no it is not practical on the ship that the kitchen and all of the pots and pans used to cook the meal and all of the flatware and dishes can be made kosher. Most everyone of the Jewish faith would understand that and many don't do that either in their own homes. Those who can't wouldn't book the cruise.

 

I am sure they would not get an Orthodox Rabbi to be on for any Jewish Holiday but rather someone of the Conservative or Reform faith would be chosen. And yes not everyone will like them and some will be better thought of then others. But that is OK. We are talking about a cruise over Passover and there would be much to do for the Rabbi between Passover and Sabbath.

 

I want to note that not all Catholic Clergy are highly regarded and how each one conducts their services varies.

 

Anyway, cruise lines are a business and as part of that business Silversea like the vast majority of cruise lines has no Rabbi on board. That is their business decision.

 

My point is that if they wanted to have a Rabbi on board it could be done right in the same manner that cruise lines try to have member of the Catholic Clergy on board and try to find ones that will fit in. When that is not the case then the Priest is not asked to return just as if a lecturer does not work out they are not asked to return.

 

Keith

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Keith I provided a fuller explanation in the post that crossed. The kosher issue is relevant in respect to using an orthodox rabbi. A progressive or liberal rabbi is not a rabbi so far as orthodox jews are concerned but an orthodox rabbi is acceptable to most.

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Keith I provided a fuller explanation in the post that crossed. The kosher issue is relevant in respect to using an orthodox rabbi. A progressive or liberal rabbi is not a rabbi so far as orthodox jews are concerned but an orthodox rabbi is acceptable to most.

 

Jeff, yes we must have posted around the same time.

 

 

I really doubt there will be any orthodox jews on board during that time of year although anything is possilbe.

 

 

By the way my brother and sister in law go to an orthodox synagogue along with their two children.

 

They would indeed attend services performed by conservative or orthodox rabbis if that was the only option and they do accept them as Rabbis.

 

Like most things all people don't follow or think entirely the same way and that includes religion. I really don't subscribe to generalizing all people of one faith or sect of that faith as following all of the same practices or thinking the same way.

 

 

Keith

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Thanks Keith, yes I agree.

 

These things are not always rational and I agree that fully observant jews would never take an SS cruise. However there is I suspect a far larger number of jews who have been brought up in a family environment that attends an orthodox synagogue - parks their car a few streets away from the synagogue - and that also do not comply with dietary laws but also seemingly irrationally feel that liberal and progressive rabbis aren’t “real” rabbis.

 

I’m no expert, but aren’t chrisitians content to have services conducted by a wider range of church leaders than jews are?

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Jeff, based on my own views and that of my wife I don't think that christians are more content then jews when it comes to this. I would add that I have sailed on a number of long cruises with all three members of the clergy present and think that in each case it comes down to the clergy as to whether or not the majority of people attending will be happy. I have seen in all three cases some clergy that everyone liked and some that were not well liked.

 

Again I just would avoid generalities when it comes to all of this IMHO.

 

Back to Passover I think the right Rabbi would make it special no matter if they were Reform, Conservative or Orthodox but once again know that this is a business and Silversea like all cruise lines will make those business decisions based on several factors.

 

 

Keith

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I’m no expert, but aren’t chrisitians content to have services conducted by a wider range of church leaders than jews are?

 

Not quite answering your question but a now humorous recollection....

 

As a youth growing up in Flatbush in the '50s/'60s, most of the kids in my neighborhood were Catholic and Jewish. My contact with the "outside world" consisted primarily of riding the subway into Manhattan.

That said, I remember a day at Midwood HS when I met a relatively new kid and, upon learning that he was not going to services on a Jewish holy day, I mentioned that I had not ever seen him at our neighborhood Catholic church (St. Vincent Ferrer).

He responded that he was not Catholic and was a Lutheran.

Perplexed, I asked him: "do you mean the guy who nailed his complaints on the church door?" He answered "yes" to which I queried: "They're still around?"

 

 

 

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