Future of Celebrity

What is thefuture of Celebrity?

We are thrilled to travel with Celebrity.

But we now ask ourselves if we travel even further with celebrity

The pricesare getting higher and higher.

The solstice ships get new cabins that´s good but the retreat Deck ?? Will there be a sports court? I don´t think so. I don´t have a family but I don´t think celebrity will be interesting for families in the future. What will the new Edge class be like? We don´t know much. I don´t believe that there will be a sports court. I think celebrity wants to have a audience like Viking or Regent Seven Seas Cruises. Rich people who can afford the cruise without problems. I loved the audience on my celebrity trips. Young people, older people.Everything different.

Maybe I'm wrong.

Maybe the prices go down again when Beyond travels on the seas

It looks like the suites are more important. But maybe no kids club no sports court..... And a normal balcony cabin on a transatlantic cost 3500 € That´s not my way…

this time next year will tell a lot. Full payment will be do for the first batch of Edge sailings. Then people will have to decide if they really want to pay that much or cancel their reservations making X put their cabin up for sale. When tat happens prices should go down.

There's no question that the pricing on Edge is very high. Even Sky Suites, which lets face it are just regular large balcony rooms are priced higher than suites on Seaborne suite only ships sailing comparable itineraries. If anyone can tell me how they can justify that then post away....

But at around $600 - $700 per person per night Celebrity are certainly ambitious / trying their look there!

I agree with Ox Fan Cruiser that time will tell us a lot.

I suspect people will see decreases in prices on M class ships in due course due to their age and general lack of appeal compared to the newer ships from Celebrity and other cruise lines.

Celebrity will try to benefit from the hype about Edge as long as they can. Why would they not. There are enough people willing to pay the prices and Celebrity is not a non-profit-organisation.

Personally, if I am not willing to pay a certain price for a cruise, I just don´t book it.

That beeing said, we got extremely good prices on our last three cruises (Adriatic, Southeast Asia, Japan) and very reasonable prices for our next two cruises (Japan & China, Western Med). Actually we booked for less than we did before and no, we did not book last minute but more than a year out.

Anyway, whatever the future of Celebrity will be, it will either be with our without me. However, as long as they find enough people walking the path with them, I am fully aware that they will not wait for me to join - no matter how much I´d cry about it.

We love Celebrity and have done 10 cruises with them. Unfortunately, except for cruises like transatlantic price bundling prevails, which means very high prices. Promos are included that we don't want. Drinks packages don't make sense for us, since we average about $300 spending on alcohol for a two week cruise.

We booked Royal Carib. for two cruises out of Sydney for 2018 instead of Celebrity because Royal's prices were not bundled. The NZ cruise we booked with Royal was 11 days and a little over half the price of the 10 day Celebrity NZ cruise (yes the drinks packages were included, but that value is minimal to us).

What is the future of Celebrity?

The prices are getting higher and higher.

Everything different.

...as with most mass market cruise lines. They all tend to watch what the other does and then follow suit. Nothing with any of them - especially pricing - is as it was in the past. But then again, the cruise industry as a whole is nothing as it was in the past either.

In a few years when several Edge-Class ships are sailing routinely, prices on them will return to a market-set level. This happened with S-Class early on and on other RCI new build cruise ships such as Oasis Class and Quantum Class when first launched. If you don't want to pay high prices for Edge, just wait a couple of years and sail other ships with better pricing. Nobody is being forced to sail on Edge and pay high prices. If you don't like the idea of a private Suite area on Edge, again there are plenty of ships out there to meet your needs and ideals.

Marketing is a big part of any cruise line's business plan. Celebrity is simply being smart by hyping and promoting its new class of ship. And there are enough folks, who are into trying anything new, who are going to jump at the chance to try a new ship. But that initial surge does wear-off after a period of time and then reputation is what matters. A cruise line can demand very high prices for high quality (just look at lines like Seabourn, Regent, Sea Dream, etc that charge $1000 per passenger day). But when a line cuts-back on quality and service, and simultaneously raises prices, it is generally heading for future disaster. Eventually the public moves to the product that offers the best bang for the buck. Will Celebrity be able to attract enough younger (and new) customers to offset the losses they are now feeling as folks like me, turn to other lines/options? LLP is gambling that she can fill her ships with many new customers who are willing to pay more for less. Perhaps she is right.....and then again....perhaps she will become one of those CEOs who folks will say "do you remember when LLP ruined Celebrity?"

The industry is again going through a major period of change. But there are some new players on the block with deep pockets and interesting ideas. For example, MSC (which is essentially a family owned company) is rapidly expanding their cruise division. They have gone from a very small player (especially in the North American market) to a real player...and with another 10 new builds coming...will soon be a very big player. And now you have Richard Branson who is in the process of building his first "Virgin" cruise ship....which is going to target the 7 day Caribbean market. Anyone familiar with Branson's products knows they are generally high quality with excellent service. He is actually accepting deposits for the first Virgin cruises.....and folks are plunking down their money to try out a new cruise line/ship...before they even know the itinerary or even the dates. Viking is another relatively new player (not impacting the US market in a big way) who is easily filling their ships and getting many rave reviews. It is just a matter of time until Viking decides to make a major move into the lucrative Caribbean market.

Where does this leave Celebrity? Will it simply be RCI Lite...trying to survive on luring RCI cruisers to something different? My prediction is that Celebrity has made a mistake in their future pricing. When a line overprices its product they ultimately have to offer many incentives (pricing and amenities) to fill unbooked berths. Cruise lines cannot survive with empty berths..and they will go to extraordinary lengths to put bodies into every bed. From where I sit (as one who has cruised extensively for forty years), future Celebrity cruises are overpriced...for the product being offered. We have simply moved our future business elsewhere...have many of our cruising friends. Celebrity can certainly lure us back, but it will have to be with better deals and a decent product.

A few years ago, DW and I regularly cruised on RCI (our DD was Diamond by the age of 15). But one day we realized that RCI was no longer delivering the product we wanted so we simply moved on (and booked more cruises with other lines). A good friend said to us (about 6 years ago) that we would be back (to RCI) and we actually thought he was right. But since the time that we stopped with RCI we have never gone back on one of their ships and have no RCI cruises planned for the future (despite the fact that we cruise over 100 days in many years). Now, we are repeating that pattern with Celebrity (our last booked Celebrity cruise is in a few days) which we have already replaced with more cruises on other lines. What is interesting (to us) is that LLP was a key executive at RCI when we gave up on that line. Now she is at the helm of Celebrity...and we are quickly losing interest in cruising that line. Perhaps its a coincidence.

Hank

There's no question that the pricing on Edge is very high. Even Sky Suites, which lets face it are just regular large balcony rooms are priced higher than suites on Seaborne suite only ships sailing comparable itineraries. If anyone can tell me how they can justify that then post away....

 

But at around $600 - $700 per person per night Celebrity are certainly ambitious / trying their look there!

 

I agree with Ox Fan Cruiser that time will tell us a lot.

 

I suspect people will see decreases in prices on M class ships in due course due to their age and general lack of appeal compared to the newer ships from Celebrity and other cruise lines.

We booked a 14 day trip on the Reflection for about $2600PP. This is on the Concierge level, which I feel is a good price, otherwise we wouldn't have booked it.

I guess I'll weigh in here. I have been cruising since 1990 and I also have given thought to the value of a Celebrity Cruise. We are booked on The Silhouette 7 day Eastern Caribbean in February, and The Solstice 18 night Tahitian Treasures Cruise in October. So I looked back to my first cruise on board The Norwegian Seaward 7 day Western Caribbean which was a year old at the time of my cruise in 1990. Around 40,000 tons The Seaward was a beautiful ship in it's day. No balcony staterooms, we enjoyed a ocean view stateroom with a large window. The cost of this cruise was around $800 plus gratuities, and drinks, which was considered a very good price at the time. So let's briefly compare that cruise with our upcoming Silhouette Cruise in February.

As you can imagine, the amenities, food options, activities, and size of the ship has increased greatly over the past 27 years. As we have cruised Silhouette before, we are aware of all this ship has to offer. We are booked in an Aqua Class Balcony stateroom with gratuities, classic drink package, and $300 on board credit! Our cost for this cruise is a little over $1500 pp including port charges.

So we get all the above mentioned features, including Blu, balcony, drinks, gratuities, and on board credit, on a far superior ship! Looking at value per money spent, $950 in 1990 dollars equates to $1779 in 2017. If we had chosen , we could have booked an ocean view stateroom with the drinks, gratuities, and on board credit on The Silhouette for about $850, a true bargain versus my 1990 sailing. Because of ship size, (ie. more passengers) plus efficiencies developed over the years, I believe Celebrity and most mainline Cruise Companies offer a tremendous vacation value. Change is constant in the Cruise Industry, if not, we would all be staring out of portholes in our cabins on 40,000 ton ships!

Islandfan

There are always people willing, nay anxious, to pay more for the latest and greatest, and X would be dumb to not accommodate them.

Take a look at the Europe 2018 itineraries, the prices are huge,

Over £4000 for a guarantee balcony on 10 night cruises.

7 nighters in the carribean this December were £700 with the same perks, i know because we have one booked, decided to upgrade to Aqua since the price was so good.

Celebrity have priced us out of cruising in Europe, when we can travel further a field and get a cruise inc flights for less.

You folks already in Florida, get to make the most of some great deals

The difference in price between my Reflection TA to Europe in 2917 and Edge TA in 2019 to Europe is less than $500 for the same category of suite. However, I booked the Edge during the first hour. I think they are both expensive. For next year I have a 10 day Greece and Italy (S1 )suite for 7400 for the two of us. Again, I booked the first hour...pretty happy with that price on the Reflection.

What I will do in the future is TBD, but I will continue to watch prices considerably! I am just not going to throw money at Celebrity. Again, time will tell. My suite on the Edge is now over, $8000 pp. I would never pay that for an S1 Corner Aft.) I can get more bang for my buck elsewhere...also, I can enjoy Aqua or Concierge, along with a 1A or anything , but inside or on a very low deck. That is where I started...With the new tax bill who knows what will happen, as we never know until we actually go through it!

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My family are quite new to celebrity, we took 2 X cruises this year and have another booked in 2018 so maybe we're the 'new' customers? We are in our 40/50s and have a teenage son who loves celebrity. We don't like huge ships and don't mind too much if they're a little old (loved Constellation). We're not looking for loads of entertainment or activities, we want a relatively quiet ship with good food and drinks, nice bars, good itineraries. A quiz and some wine tasting is always welcome too. Good speciality restaurants are helpful too.

We previously sailed some more upmarket lines (Azamara, Oceania, Seabourn) but their prices got a bit too high so we tried X and thought it was much better value for money with a nice atmosphere. We disliked RCI, too manic, too crowded.

We've generally paid around £5k for 14 nights for 3 in a balcony with drinks included. I think that is pretty good.

I read an article today that effective 11/29/17 they are starting nonrefundable deposits just like royal caribbean implemented in July. To get a refundable price you pay a higher price.

 

 

 

As you can imagine, the amenities, food options, activities, and size of the ship has increased greatly over the past 27 years. As we have cruised Silhouette before, we are aware of all this ship has to offer. We are booked in an Aqua Class Balcony stateroom with gratuities, classic drink package, and $300 on board credit! Our cost for this cruise is a little over $1500 pp including port charges.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Islandfan

And I think $3,000 is expensive for two for a 7 night Caribbean cruise, even in AQU. So it depends on what people consider a good or bad value.

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Celebrity management is not stupid. I don't like their direction, but it is hard to argue with their financial results including advanced bookings which have made Richard Fain excited on an interview by Jim Crammer which was almost a commercial. :eek: They are incorporating technology into everything. They are targeting a demographic that cannot put down a smart phone/smart devise and not be texting, etc frequently. Personal touch will take on a new meaning in future as in 'you do the personal touching of your devise to order, schedule, buy, interact with most anything on ship.'

I come from a time when I turned off my phone and put in safe and took out morning of disembarkation. Also, we never used up our limited 'included' internet minutes even when I was working full time.

I do believe though that the cruise industry can price themselves out of reach of many passengers and then with all the new competition and capacity coming on, can create some interesting supply/demand challenges.

We, for sure, are value cruisers and are NOT seeing the value like we use to and thus sail less. Also, now having 4 granddaughters changes our priorities! :) We will visit the Mouse in Orlando 3 times in next 12 months with kids and grandkids!

I read an article today that effective 11/29/17 they are starting nonrefundable deposits just like royal caribbean implemented in July. To get a refundable price you pay a higher price.

And why not, we in UK have been subjected to non refundable deposits ever since we started cruising (1996)

Take a look at the Europe 2018 itineraries, the prices are huge,

 

Over £4000 for a guarantee balcony on 10 night cruises

Our 23.06.18 Baltic cruise on Silhouette works out at £130 p.p.p.n in a balcony cabin with a Classic package.

Marketing is a big part of any cruise line's business plan. Celebrity is simply being smart by hyping and promoting its new class of ship. And there are enough folks, who are into trying anything new, who are going to jump at the chance to try a new ship. But that initial surge does wear-off after a period of time and then reputation is what matters. A cruise line can demand very high prices for high quality (just look at lines like Seabourn, Regent, Sea Dream, etc that charge $1000 per passenger day). But when a line cuts-back on quality and service, and simultaneously raises prices, it is generally heading for future disaster. Eventually the public moves to the product that offers the best bang for the buck. Will Celebrity be able to attract enough younger (and new) customers to offset the losses they are now feeling as folks like me, turn to other lines/options? LLP is gambling that she can fill her ships with many new customers who are willing to pay more for less. Perhaps she is right.....and then again....perhaps she will become one of those CEOs who folks will say "do you remember when LLP ruined Celebrity?"

 

The industry is again going through a major period of change. But there are some new players on the block with deep pockets and interesting ideas. For example, MSC (which is essentially a family owned company) is rapidly expanding their cruise division. They have gone from a very small player (especially in the North American market) to a real player...and with another 10 new builds coming...will soon be a very big player. And now you have Richard Branson who is in the process of building his first "Virgin" cruise ship....which is going to target the 7 day Caribbean market. Anyone familiar with Branson's products knows they are generally high quality with excellent service. He is actually accepting deposits for the first Virgin cruises.....and folks are plunking down their money to try out a new cruise line/ship...before they even know the itinerary or even the dates. Viking is another relatively new player (not impacting the US market in a big way) who is easily filling their ships and getting many rave reviews. It is just a matter of time until Viking decides to make a major move into the lucrative Caribbean market.

 

Where does this leave Celebrity? Will it simply be RCI Lite...trying to survive on luring RCI cruisers to something different? My prediction is that Celebrity has made a mistake in their future pricing. When a line overprices its product they ultimately have to offer many incentives (pricing and amenities) to fill unbooked berths. Cruise lines cannot survive with empty berths..and they will go to extraordinary lengths to put bodies into every bed. From where I sit (as one who has cruised extensively for forty years), future Celebrity cruises are overpriced...for the product being offered. We have simply moved our future business elsewhere...have many of our cruising friends. Celebrity can certainly lure us back, but it will have to be with better deals and a decent product.

 

A few years ago, DW and I regularly cruised on RCI (our DD was Diamond by the age of 15). But one day we realized that RCI was no longer delivering the product we wanted so we simply moved on (and booked more cruises with other lines). A good friend said to us (about 6 years ago) that we would be back (to RCI) and we actually thought he was right. But since the time that we stopped with RCI we have never gone back on one of their ships and have no RCI cruises planned for the future (despite the fact that we cruise over 100 days in many years). Now, we are repeating that pattern with Celebrity (our last booked Celebrity cruise is in a few days) which we have already replaced with more cruises on other lines. What is interesting (to us) is that LLP was a key executive at RCI when we gave up on that line. Now she is at the helm of Celebrity...and we are quickly losing interest in cruising that line. Perhaps its a coincidence.

 

Hank

Hank,

Excellent analysis. Thanks for the interesting information.

George

Take a look at the Europe 2018 itineraries, the prices are huge,

 

Over £4000 for a guarantee balcony on 10 night cruises.

 

7 nighters in the carribean this December were £700 with the same perks, i know because we have one booked, decided to upgrade to Aqua since the price was so good.

 

Celebrity have priced us out of cruising in Europe, when we can travel further a field and get a cruise inc flights for less.

 

You folks already in Florida, get to make the most of some great deals

I agree, the pricing on European Cruises is really high. Why should the same class ships with the same amenities, same service etc. be twice the price in Europe? It always works out cheaper to pay for flights to the US for a cruise. It is so annoying. .

Marketing is a big part of any cruise line's business plan. Celebrity is simply being smart by hyping and promoting its new class of ship. And there are enough folks, who are into trying anything new, who are going to jump at the chance to try a new ship. But that initial surge does wear-off after a period of time and then reputation is what matters. A cruise line can demand very high prices for high quality (just look at lines like Seabourn, Regent, Sea Dream, etc that charge $1000 per passenger day). But when a line cuts-back on quality and service, and simultaneously raises prices, it is generally heading for future disaster. Eventually the public moves to the product that offers the best bang for the buck. Will Celebrity be able to attract enough younger (and new) customers to offset the losses they are now feeling as folks like me, turn to other lines/options? LLP is gambling that she can fill her ships with many new customers who are willing to pay more for less. Perhaps she is right.....and then again....perhaps she will become one of those CEOs who folks will say "do you remember when LLP ruined Celebrity?"

 

The industry is again going through a major period of change. But there are some new players on the block with deep pockets and interesting ideas. For example, MSC (which is essentially a family owned company) is rapidly expanding their cruise division. They have gone from a very small player (especially in the North American market) to a real player...and with another 10 new builds coming...will soon be a very big player. And now you have Richard Branson who is in the process of building his first "Virgin" cruise ship....which is going to target the 7 day Caribbean market. Anyone familiar with Branson's products knows they are generally high quality with excellent service. He is actually accepting deposits for the first Virgin cruises.....and folks are plunking down their money to try out a new cruise line/ship...before they even know the itinerary or even the dates. Viking is another relatively new player (not impacting the US market in a big way) who is easily filling their ships and getting many rave reviews. It is just a matter of time until Viking decides to make a major move into the lucrative Caribbean market.

 

Where does this leave Celebrity? Will it simply be RCI Lite...trying to survive on luring RCI cruisers to something different? My prediction is that Celebrity has made a mistake in their future pricing. When a line overprices its product they ultimately have to offer many incentives (pricing and amenities) to fill unbooked berths. Cruise lines cannot survive with empty berths..and they will go to extraordinary lengths to put bodies into every bed. From where I sit (as one who has cruised extensively for forty years), future Celebrity cruises are overpriced...for the product being offered. We have simply moved our future business elsewhere...have many of our cruising friends. Celebrity can certainly lure us back, but it will have to be with better deals and a decent product.

 

A few years ago, DW and I regularly cruised on RCI (our DD was Diamond by the age of 15). But one day we realized that RCI was no longer delivering the product we wanted so we simply moved on (and booked more cruises with other lines). A good friend said to us (about 6 years ago) that we would be back (to RCI) and we actually thought he was right. But since the time that we stopped with RCI we have never gone back on one of their ships and have no RCI cruises planned for the future (despite the fact that we cruise over 100 days in many years). Now, we are repeating that pattern with Celebrity (our last booked Celebrity cruise is in a few days) which we have already replaced with more cruises on other lines. What is interesting (to us) is that LLP was a key executive at RCI when we gave up on that line. Now she is at the helm of Celebrity...and we are quickly losing interest in cruising that line. Perhaps its a coincidence.

 

Hank

Excellent analysis! Perhaps it is NOT a coincidence.

To elevate their rating to a higher end line, they need to up their game considerably, starting from the top with a CEO familiar with luxury lines and , a large staff retraining program..What they offer now ( other than for suite guests ) is very weak compared to when Celebrity first make its mark!

And I think $3,000 is expensive for two for a 7 night Caribbean cruise, even in AQU. So it depends on what people consider a good or bad value.

 

 

 

 

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When you factor in the gratuities, classic drink package and $300 on board credit at a cost of $735pp, I find the fare to be very reasonable for 7 day cruise! Granted My 18 day Tahitian Treasures cruise is not near the value, however we are happy to pay the fare to experience the south pacific. Remember something is worth what someone is willing to pay. If the prices are to high for the marketplace, Celebrity will adjust accordingly.

Islandfan

I guess I'll weigh in here. I have been cruising since 1990 and I also have given thought to the value of a Celebrity Cruise. We are booked on The Silhouette 7 day Eastern Caribbean in February, and The Solstice 18 night Tahitian Treasures Cruise in October. So I looked back to my first cruise on board The Norwegian Seaward 7 day Western Caribbean which was a year old at the time of my cruise in 1990. Around 40,000 tons The Seaward was a beautiful ship in it's day. No balcony staterooms, we enjoyed a ocean view stateroom with a large window. The cost of this cruise was around $800 plus gratuities, and drinks, which was considered a very good price at the time. So let's briefly compare that cruise with our upcoming Silhouette Cruise in February.

 

As you can imagine, the amenities, food options, activities, and size of the ship has increased greatly over the past 27 years. As we have cruised Silhouette before, we are aware of all this ship has to offer. We are booked in an Aqua Class Balcony stateroom with gratuities, classic drink package, and $300 on board credit! Our cost for this cruise is a little over $1500 pp including port charges.

 

So we get all the above mentioned features, including Blu, balcony, drinks, gratuities, and on board credit, on a far superior ship! Looking at value per money spent, $950 in 1990 dollars equates to $1779 in 2017. If we had chosen , we could have booked an ocean view stateroom with the drinks, gratuities, and on board credit on The Silhouette for about $850, a true bargain versus my 1990 sailing. Because of ship size, (ie. more passengers) plus efficiencies developed over the years, I believe Celebrity and most mainline Cruise Companies offer a tremendous vacation value. Change is constant in the Cruise Industry, if not, we would all be staring out of portholes in our cabins on 40,000 ton ships!

 

Islandfan

Cruise prices also fell pretty significantly when the economy tanked in 2007. Cruises we were paying well over $1000pp dropped to around $700. Here we are a decade later and prices have gone back to more normal levels. Prices go up that's just a fact of life. I don't like paying $7 for a beer when I go out, I remember when they were $3.

Our first cruise was in July 2001 of the Voyager of the Seas. We had a balcony cabin and there were no perks or incentives on that voyage.

Fast forward 16 years and about 30 or so cruises later; on our next cruise on Equinox in December, we will (again) stay in a Sky Suite. Factoring in the perks, OBC, drink package etc., we will pay just about the same price for a considerably larger cabin and all suite amenities.

Considering that inflation has been about 40% since 2001, I think Celebrity has done an incredible job delivering a superior product while still containing cost. We keep coming back to Celebrity because based on our experiences - they continue to deliver a quality product at a very competitive price.

Of course there will always be people who pay these prices. But celebrity makes advertising with modern luxury and evening chic. I suppose they also want to attract younger audiences. But what if the young person can not afford these prices? I wanted to book transatlantic. I would have to pay 6000 € for balcony cabin for two people. 1200 € for flights. One or two nights in a hotel in Fort Lauderdale cost around 400-500 € again. That's almost 8000 € for two people. For the 14 day Caribbean tour on the Eclipse paid for the route and flights a bit more than half.

We will see what the future holds