Surge Suppressor Onboard Ship is a NO-NO

Nearly every surge protector will need to "have a part replaced", if a power surge of more than a couple of hundred volts happens. Once the joule rating of the MOV semi-conductor is reached, that MOV will never protect against a power surge again. Also, I doubt you would get a marine grade surge protector past cruise line security anyway, as you would have to include a written, technical description of the surge protector, and there would have to be someone on the ship who could verify that it was safe. If the security are trained at all, they are trained to see ratings in "joules" or "VPR" (voltage protection rating) on the device, and they will confiscate anything with these ratings. As for a "custom built" surge protector, that is another problem, unless the device has a UL or CE certification, it is not allowed on a ship.

The custom built is actually safer, but I understand your point as I’ve had to explain power plugs on a variety of different devices that the xray people couldn’t figure out. Iirc, my custom built power protector is “set” rather low, based on a quick destruct disc like device which destructs faster than a resistor in normal protectors.

For what it is worth, I’ve never had anyone look at whether a power strip was UL listed etc. that scares me more! I was just looking at power strips for 220 applications, the number not certified was scary. And one had an engineer pointing out that the wire was too thin too! Normally my the things I’ve needed to plug in in foreign countries are 110-240v and all I’ve needed is adapters. Now with multiple Types of medical equipment i need at least four outlets in a hotel, with at least two of them being surge protected.

Again I’m glad I’ve found the explanations, but i still need to carry these devices on cruise ships even if I don’t use them!

The only surge protector that is safe onboard a ship is a marine specific one, that will run you about $60-100 for a six outlet power strip, and they are difficult to locate, typically only being sold by marine industrial wholesale companies. There is a difference between a power strip, even one with a circuit breaker (the little lighted switch), and a surge protected power strip, but the cruise lines don't want to rely on poorly trained port security to recognize whether a power strip is surge protected or not. Power strips, without surge protection, are safe to use on ships, but again some cruise lines just blanket disallow power strips as being the easy way out. No surge protector that you can buy in a retail outlet or online is safe to use on a ship. Very likely the one you bought is a Belkin Mini, and this is not safe to use on ships, just like any consumer surge protector.

 

Very unusual that your power strip was kept at the port, as the port security does this on the instructions of the cruise line (it is not a problem for the port), and the cruise line has no justification for permanently confiscating your property. And, even if it were kept at the port, they don't have the legal ability to take and destroy your property either, it should have been at the table on disembarkation. Did you check?

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We've cruised with our Belkin strip from day one. Not one security officer has given it so much as a second look.

We've cruised with our Belkin strip from day one. Not one security officer has given it so much as a second look.

My mother used to tell me, “If you know better, you do better.” After reading this thread, you now know better. :) Get one with only two prongs, (no surge suppressor) and you’ll be fine in the future too.

Our devices (phones, tablets, Switch, point-n-shoot) are all chargeable with USB, I just bring a USB 5-port adapter and lots of cables. SWMBO is fine with the provided hairdryer.

The only remaining AC plug devices I have is my laptop brick and charger for my DSLR batteries. But recently I found out about USB chargers for DSLR batteries. Got one, so far so good, I charge overnight and in the AM two fully charged batteries for the day. :cool:

We've cruised with our Belkin strip from day one. Not one security officer has given it so much as a second look.

This seems to be fairly recent. Last September, 2017, was the first time I’d seen it happen in the U.S.

My mother used to tell me, “If you know better, you do better.” After reading this thread, you now know better. :) Get one with only two prongs, (no surge suppressor) and you’ll be fine in the future too.

It might indeed be interesting to see if this might be accepted! https://www.amazon.com/Regvolt-Universal-3-outlet-110v-250v-Worldwide/dp/B00MNRCOPC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1530726909&sr=8-2&keywords=regvolt+220+surge+protector

I expect if the cord itself isn’t an issue, the circuit breaker will be. This would definitely solve our issue with the medical equipment on and off the ship. It’s shame the US version isn’t UL approved/listed, but this one is CE approved.

It might indeed be interesting to see if this might be accepted! https://www.amazon.com/Regvolt-Universal-3-outlet-110v-250v-Worldwide/dp/B00MNRCOPC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1530726909&sr=8-2&keywords=regvolt+220+surge+protector

 

I expect if the cord itself isn’t an issue, the circuit breaker will be. This would definitely solve our issue with the medical equipment on and off the ship. It’s shame the US version isn’t UL approved/listed, but this one is CE approved.

Again, the cord is not the issue. The circuit breaker is not the issue (every outlet on the ship is protected by a circuit breaker, which only controls current. The issue is that this is a surge protector, and no consumer grade surge protector is safe to use onboard a ship. While I said that everything used on a ship must be UL or CE approved, that does not mean that everything that is UL or CE approved is approved or acceptable for marine use on a delta wired floating ground electrical system.

Again, the cord is not the issue. The circuit breaker is not the issue (every outlet on the ship is protected by a circuit breaker, which only controls current. The issue is that this is a surge protector, and no consumer grade surge protector is safe to use onboard a ship. While I said that everything used on a ship must be UL or CE approved, that does not mean that everything that is UL or CE approved is approved or acceptable for marine use on a delta wired floating ground electrical system.

I’m not disagreeing, just pointing out that there are devices that meet the shorthand rules that probably aren’t acptable. Right now no one will tell us that these commercial ships are protecting equipment! And, they are allowing surge protectors that are not on power strips!

Could you explain the stepdowns for the 220 circuits?

I’m not disagreeing, just pointing out that there are devices that meet the shorthand rules that probably aren’t acptable. Right now no one will tell us that these commercial ships are protecting equipment! And, they are allowing surge protectors that are not on power strips!

 

Could you explain the stepdowns for the 220 circuits?

As for a guarantee that they are protecting equipment, the very nature of ship's wiring guarantees this. As I've said, none of the ship's electronics have surge protectors.

The only reason they are "allowing" surge protectors "not on a cord" is that they are not being found, not that they are being allowed.

Now for power distribution, the 10,000 volts generated goes to 2-4 transformers to be stepped down to 480 volts. This 480 is then distributed to power panels in each of the 6-8 fire zones where it is stepped down to 220 volts. The transformers are all laminated core two winding transformers with no direct wiring between primary and secondary. There are multiple main 480 volt transformers so that one failure won't shut down the whole system. Each fire zone has it's own power distribution system so each zone can be isolated in a fire. So the 220 volts in each zone is isolated from the other zones.

As for a guarantee that they are protecting equipment, the very nature of ship's wiring guarantees this. As I've said, none of the ship's electronics have surge protectors.

 

The only reason they are "allowing" surge protectors "not on a cord" is that they are not being found, not that they are being allowed.

 

Now for power distribution, the 10,000 volts generated goes to 2-4 transformers to be stepped down to 480 volts. This 480 is then distributed to power panels in each of the 6-8 fire zones where it is stepped down to 220 volts. The transformers are all laminated core two winding transformers with no direct wiring between primary and secondary. There are multiple main 480 volt transformers so that one failure won't shut down the whole system. Each fire zone has it's own power distribution system so each zone can be isolated in a fire. So the 220 volts in each zone is isolated from the other zones.

Please note that the non corded surge protector was paid for by the ship. Since it was a recent event there has been much finding to do. We were given permission to purchase it and then reimbursed for its purchase. I’ll grant you that those involved, including the liaison to the president of the company most likely didn’t understand the significance of that decision. Thanks for the explanations.

This is the first time someone has tried to explain why it isn’t needed, that makes some sense. I’m still not sure why some cruises allow the surge protected power strips but require an inspection and others won’t bother. I have no problem with the inspection, btw!

Do a search for Chief's posts and you will find numerous explanations.

Do a search for Chief's posts and you will find numerous explanations.

I’ve read them, they were the first time I’d seen any explanation for how a device designed to stop input current might create an additional problem. And, yes, I’ve asked the people on the ships that should know!

Nevertheless, there needs to be a way to take these aboard ship, and stow them without having to chase your luggage, because they can’t identify a curling iron, and return them for use in your final port.

I learned in grade school not to overload circuits, fortunately not from a bad experience. I was never allowed to plug an iron into any extension cord either! When we got a new iron Dad always put a new, longer, iron cord on it so there would be no temptation.

I’ve read them, they were the first time I’d seen any explanation for how a device designed to stop input current might create an additional problem. And, yes, I’ve asked the people on the ships that should know!

 

Nevertheless, there needs to be a way to take these aboard ship, and stow them without having to chase your luggage, because they can’t identify a curling iron, and return them for use in your final port.

 

I learned in grade school not to overload circuits, fortunately not from a bad experience. I was never allowed to plug an iron into any extension cord either! When we got a new iron Dad always put a new, longer, iron cord on it so there would be no temptation.

Since guests can't be trusted to not use one and because safety is paramount, a complete ban is safest. Relaying on Security to "catch" surge protectors that guests who should be aware (insert excuse of how they didn't know") they are prohibited and yet bring them on. Frankly, if an item is banned, no explanation is necessary. It isn't a negotiation and the guests isn't going to introduce some OMG new information that will change the policy. I don't need to know how fires burn to understand why candles aren't permitted. Chief has given you great information and you argue.

Since guests can't be trusted to not use one and because safety is paramount, a complete ban is safest. Relaying on Security to "catch" surge protectors that guests who should be aware (insert excuse of how they didn't know") they are prohibited and yet bring them on. Frankly, if an item is banned, no explanation is necessary. It isn't a negotiation and the guests isn't going to introduce some OMG new information that will change the policy. I don't need to know how fires burn to understand why candles aren't permitted. Chief has given you great information and you argue.

We’ve been here before. I’ll have one for the hotels both before and after, I don’t mind giving it up on the ship, but it still needs to be on the ship! And no I’m not arguing with Chief, in fact I complimented him on the first explanation anyone had given. The first time I was caught by surprise, and it wasn’t on the website for Australia. The second time was a different cruiseline and still wasn’t on their website. The explanation was it’s an extension cord, which with a 6-12 inch cord very few would call it that. On that cruise we were told we could have a surge protector without a cord, which as Chief has pointed out is flat wrong! And for the record, I’ve had a kettle that was never found, and still not plugged in even though the cruiseline allowed their own. Why, because I’m probably as paranoid about fire as any staff onboard or shore and using their kettle would be the preferred protocol! In fact, I believe curling irons and the like should be banned!

On 8/3/2017 at 3:29 PM, easyboy said:

I guess the risks are just not appreciated by others as it is more covenient to pack what is used at home where they need surge protection.

 

That protector in a home creates the same fire hazard.   A power strip with a UL 1363 listing has no protector parts - is safe.  One with a UL 1449 is the type that so often results in fires.

Ships simply take the threat far more seriously.  Details provided here 

A quick search on Amazon yields plenty of results for cruise safe outlet strips https://www.amazon.com/s?k=cruise+ship+power+strip&crid=1RU6M12763DAM&sprefix=cruise+ship+%2Caps%2C219&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_6_12

9 hours ago, millermommyx3 said:

A quick search on Amazon yields plenty of results for cruise safe outlet strips https://www.amazon.com/s?k=cruise+ship+power+strip&crid=1RU6M12763DAM&sprefix=cruise+ship+%2Caps%2C219&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_6_12

Purchase with care.  It doesn’t matter if Amazon deems them safe for a cruise.  If the cruise line doesn’t allow them, they have the last say.

3 hours ago, lisiamc said:

 

Purchase with care.  It doesn’t matter if Amazon deems them safe for a cruise.  If the cruise line doesn’t allow them, they have the last say.

We found, the hard way, that it is better to place it in locked luggage.  Yes, you will have to go get your luggage but the device will be on the ship and if you can prove a medical need they will check whether their engineer will approve it.   That happened on Australia.   If it is in your carry on it is taken and held at the port, Miami. 

On our last trip it was in checked baggage, we got our luggage, but we didn’t use it as it was used pre and post cruise.  I believe their system was set to detect protector because a multi tap we had tripped a circuit.  It was quickly reset without much explanation and we did not repeat the experiment.  

Our main reason is pre and post cruise on most cruises that will provide an extension cord. 

On 8/4/2017 at 4:25 AM, lisiamc said:

 

For UK cruisers, would I be correct in thinking that if the third prong on the plug is plastic, not metal, that means there is no ground, and therefore no surge protection?

Yes.

The UK outlet requires the "ground" pin (which is longer than the other two) to retract safety shutters to allow the other two prongs to be inserted.

I have an outlet adapter with 2x USB ports that the Euro, US, and Aussie plugs are 2 pin, and the UK has the plastic 3rd pin.

Most of the cheaper "surge suppressors" are not worth the few cents more it costs to make them.

They do not protect again lower voltage surges.  And they will only protect against a single surge/spike event.  The second event has NO protection.  And few have any indication that they have had an event.

If it makes you feel better to use one at your home, then fine.  But it really isn't doing much.  If you really want to protect sensitive equipment, you need something more robust, and a good computer UPS.  It protects against surges and spikes, plus it regulates against over or under voltage.

11 minutes ago, SRF said:

Most of the cheaper "surge suppressors" are not worth the few cents more it costs to make them.

 

They do not protect again lower voltage surges.  And they will only protect against a single surge/spike event.  The second event has NO protection.  And few have any indication that they have had an event.

 

If it makes you feel better to use one at your home, then fine.  But it really isn't doing much.  If you really want to protect sensitive equipment, you need something more robust, and a good computer UPS.  It protects against surges and spikes, plus it regulates against over or under voltage.

 

My first surge protector was custom made.  The first surge destroys a part designed for that purpose and thus there is no second surge as the part needs to be replaced!  

Without that my expensive equipment was indeed put on a UPS type system, which is a bit large for a suitcase.

Most people have surge protector strips for two reasons, the multiple outlets and the single switch turn off.  The circuit breaker was supposed to trip on those so that equipment was protected.  I was lead to believe that later ones had failed when the light flickered or burned out, however I never believed that protected as well as a circuit breaker and even that could trip after the fact in some situations.  

I had a phobia, as a child, of fire.  All from a demonstration during fire prevention weak when I was 7.  My father never allowed extension cords on irons and other heavy pull appliances.  And yes, he is the one that built my original surge protector.  

In college i smelled a burn smell in the lobby of my dorm.  It was slight and very localized.  As my dorm mother watched me digging in the sofas and chairs she kept say it was probably a cigarette that had been smoked in the area.  She became a bit more aggressive in trying to get me to let it go when I found the smoldering cigarette.  It didn’t smell like cigarette, it smelled like burning trash.  Needless to say tones changed after that and I still trusted them enough to go to bed before they actually put it out!  While I know from that experience others can’t smell as well as that, I also have a great respect for fire.  And yes, I’ve move away from the fear of a child to a respect of how they are started. I couldn’t be a firman, but I could be a fire inspector if I had more training. 

19 hours ago, millermommyx3 said:

A quick search on Amazon yields plenty of results for cruise safe outlet strips https://www.amazon.com/s?k=cruise+ship+power+strip&crid=1RU6M12763DAM&sprefix=cruise+ship+%2Caps%2C219&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_6_12

And if you go to the first item in Amazon's list of "cruise safe" devices (the "Cruise On" device), and look at the photo that the manufacturer put out for the back of the unit, it has clearly written on it "VPR(L-N): 800V".  "VPR" is voltage protection rating, and is a measure of when a surge protector activates, so this device is surge protected.

9 hours ago, SRF said:

They do not protect again lower voltage surges.  And they will only protect against a single surge/spike event.  The second event has NO protection. 

 

Demonstrated is why plug-in protectors cause fires.  Its protector part must never fail catastrophically.  It may only degrade.  Described is a catastrophic failure traceable to a number in its specifications - joules.  What happens when a hundred or thousand joule protector tries to 'block' or  'absorb' hundreds of thousands of joules?

Either a 1 amp thermal fuse disconnects protector parts as fast as possible.  Or, if too slow, then a protector part fails catastrophically - causes a fire.  Meanwhile, that surge remains connected to the appliance (which has better protection internally).

Effective protectors answer this question.  Where do hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate?  Those degrade; do not fail catastrophically.

Hundreds or thousand joules?  Electronics routinely convert a surge that tiny into rock stable, low DC voltages to safely power semiconductors.  Why would anyone spend so much money on a protector that is inferior to what is already inside appliances?  How many never read those numbers?  How many joules does it claim to absorb?

Any protector that fails means ineffective protection exists or existed.  Catastrophic failure is why some protectors create fires (in ships or homes).

4 minutes ago, westom said:

Demonstrated is why plug-in protectors cause fires.  Its protector part must never fail catastrophically.  It may only degrade.  Described is a catastrophic failure traceable to a number in its specifications - joules.  What happens when a hundred or thousand joule protector tries to 'block' or  'absorb' hundreds of thousands of joules?

 

Either a 1 amp thermal fuse disconnects protector parts as fast as possible.  Or, if too slow, then a protector part fails catastrophically - causes a fire.  Meanwhile, that surge remains connected to the appliance (which has better protection internally).

 

Effective protectors answer this question.  Where do hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate?  Those degrade; do not fail catastrophically.

 

Hundreds or thousand joules?  Electronics routinely convert a surge that tiny into rock stable, low DC voltages to safely power semiconductors.  Why would anyone spend so much money on a protector that is inferior to what is already inside appliances?  How many never read those numbers?  How many joules does it claim to absorb?

 

Any protector that fails means ineffective protection exists or existed.  Catastrophic failure is why some protectors create fires (in ships or homes).

 

One of our sewing machine stores was teaching that joules matter when trying to protect expensive embroidery machines!  It was the first time I’d seen anyone pointing out that it really mattered!  Yea!  

Apparently someone had experienced a pretty fried machine and was anxious to point out that it matters.