Which Cruise Line to take?

[CCMP]

Karen,

 

My family has been on three HAL cruises, starting when my kids were 9 (they are now 12--twins.) They have always had a great time, but each cruise was in the summer and there were other families and kids on-board as well as some older folks as well.

 

My girls and I took a short three day cruise on Carnival and enjoyed it as well. However, I believe my kids actually liked the kids club on HAL better than that on Carnival. But perhaps it was because the other HAL cruises were all either 7 or 10 days long.

 

We are considering taking HAL to Bermuda this summer as well. We can cram the four of us into one cabin on HAL as the cabins are roomier than some of the other cruise lines. I think there is so much to do on Bermuda that is kid friendly--aquarium, snorkeling, zoo, beaches, etc. that I think you can't go wrong.

 

CCMP

[jimswims]

Hi ~ We are a group (all family) interested in a cruise to Bermuda (summer 2010). We are in the NYC area so leaving out of Bayone or NYC works best for us. We range in age from 10 to 87 and there are 16 of us.

 

We were on RCI EOS this past August and spend a day in Bermuda and we would all like to cruise to Bermuda again to spend more time on the Island. The 5 day cruise is not for us as it's not long enough.

 

Any suggestions ~ Kids ages are 10, 12, 18, 20, 22. Thanks for your input and suggestions.

 

I think Bermuda is a great destination for families of all ages. We went on the Spirit last August with a group of 13, three generations. The multi-day stay in Bermuda made it ideal for us.

 

We have been out of NYC and Boston to Bermuda several times. I was happy to see that Celebrity and HAL were getting back into the mix for the Bermuda runs.

 

I have been to St. George twice and also to King's Wharf three times. At first I missed St. George but now King's Wharf is thriving with many of the stores that were in St. George. I also think that it is so much easier and quicker to get to the beaches that I prefer on the island, Horseshoe Bay, Church Bay from King's Wharf/Dockyard.

 

The only thing that worries me about HAL is the fact that there is tendering to St. George. We cruised on the Majesty twice in August. We got into the pier fine. For two years in a row we were able to sit on deck and watch the Celebrity ship (Horizon or Zenith) try to get through the cut with out success. One time, the ship tried to come in backwards. The Captain of the Majesty provided the commentary. It was quite a sight to see. It seemed fine in the harbor but outside the cut the current and the winds made it impossible. My guess is that if the current and waves are bad, there will be no tendering at all just like on any other cruise that has a tender port. However, the ship did not just go home.The Celebrity ship went to Dockyard both years. Now, maybe, since the Spirit and the Dawn, and other ships will be there, the HAL ship may just go to Hamilton in this situation. This may be desirable to some! I am going to Alaska this year so I have the benefit of being able to follow how this will work for the 2010 Bermuda season.

 

I think that it is great to have choices to get to Bermuda. We love NCL for the freestyle dining options and it works well with our family especially when we are at an island for multiple days.

 

Have a great time on whatever you decide to sail on:D!

[Jett456]

I like NCL because I'm not fond of dressing up so much on vacation. I am considering HAL only because it has 4 overnights as compared to all the other's with three. Why is that? Does anyone know. It seems so silly to have 2 sea days going and 2 coming when I know the ship can get there much faster. I did Horizon some years ago and I think that old ship got there in 1.5 each way. I know some love the sea days but I just want to get there and stay on the island. Bermuda is magical.

[Arzeena]

Thank you again everyone - I did know that NCL also sailed to Bermuda (my now 17 year old sailed on her last summer with a friend and the friend's mom). I've also read that Princess will be doing cruises in August and September to Bermuda.

 

My husband and I were debating over Hal's Veendam and NCL Dawn for a cruise to Bermuda in August. We chose NCL's Dawn (August 29th sailing), because he wanted to try the "free style" and another cruise line. I am a Royal Caribbean fan so I hope the Dawn doesn't disappoint me.

[AAAAmerican]

The Greater NYC/NJ area now is coming back with many more Cruise lines and Ships.

 

So yes in the most competitive place in the world us the consumer do have what everyone should..More Choices.

 

We have been to the Bermudian Islands ( Somers Isles ) many times..well never enough not even in 5-6 decades.. My kin was there with those wrecked vessels going to Jamestowne and that first English newly settled Colony (in the New World) .

 

 

We do like the HOLLAND AMERICA LINE Best.

 

They have spent millions in Bermuda even before CCL/CUK :NYSE/ LSE took them over. They used have a Home Port in the City of Hoboken, Hudson County, New Jersey as well New York City, NY and leave a few times a week with ships from here.

 

That wonderful Cruise line has schools built in other countries for training there crews and staff too.

 

It is many steps above all Cruise lines going to Bermuda , IMHO.

 

 

NCL has one main advantage. Which is ONLY a lower price .....before the Nickels and Dimes get added on very quickly..

 

Celebrity is nice and provides good services too.

 

Princess is a few steps in many things above Celebrity.

 

 

Etc..etc..

 

 

Bottom line_____________________XXX $$$ $US = $BDM

 

It is your personal choice what you want and how you want to be served too..it is your dollars being paid...;)

 

 

PS: We are booked again next in Mid-May. I am taking my family and a few friends for my B-Day.

 

 

[iheartbda]

 

 

NCL has one main advantage. Which is ONLY a lower price .....before the Nickels and Dimes get added on very quickly..

 

Most of what you posted is personal opinion but I beg to differ with you on this. Having sailed on 2 other lines that were more expensive than NCL, we did NOT find NCL to charge for anything that other lines also did. Pictures, bingo, drinks, spa? ALL lines charge for those things. What is nickel and diming anyway???

[AAAAmerican]

Maam,

 

I have been on lots of ships and cruise lines numerous times.

 

NCL and the current owners have , IMHO, created there own revenue haven.

 

A perfect example is the Port Fees.

 

What have you paid on NCL ? Have they ever broken these down, when/if you asked them? Did you know the Government of Bermuda only Charges ONE PORT FEE/TA? Yes even if the Ship Docks at all three...

 

Compare this with others.

 

Why do they have poor service and food quality. Sorry I do like food prepared and served well. As I am paying my monies for this.

 

I am that way in most everything .. the Quality/Cost Basis is the majority of my final decision.

 

Lower cost do not always mean a lessening... but in all of Gods odds they do Maam.

 

That age old adage..you pay for what you get is a truism and holds well throughout the ages.

 

 

In any venue if it is a ship, store, mall, distinct (so called Outlet ) they target there clients well with market saturations.

 

Here in the Greater NYC Area , NCL as you will see in there numbers is not doing as well as also what happened in the Sandwich Islands ( Hawaii ) too.

 

 

If you go to a All Inclusive Property as so many Cruise lines/Ships Used to be and only a few left doing that fully.. They do not try to charge for this and that then make you go to a Pay For Eatery and be not happy with the appy then main dish..

 

They created a Revenue Generation sourcing to derive more monies from You as well I Maam. Not benefit us Cruisers...

 

:eek:

 

 

 

Most of what you posted is personal opinion but I beg to differ with you on this. Having sailed on 2 other lines that were more expensive than NCL, we did NOT find NCL to charge for anything that other lines also did. Pictures, bingo, drinks, spa? ALL lines charge for those things. What is nickel and diming anyway???

[Mooder]

Maam,

 

I have been on lots of ships and cruise lines numerous times.

 

NCL and the current owners have , IMHO, created there own revenue haven.

 

A perfect example is the Port Fees.

 

What have you paid on NCL ? Have they ever broken these down, when/if you asked them? Did you know the Government of Bermuda only Charges ONE PORT FEE/TA? Yes even if the Ship Docks at all three...

 

Compare this with others.

 

Why do they have poor service and food quality. Sorry I do like food prepared and served well. As I am paying my monies for this.

 

I am that way in most everything .. the Quality/Cost Basis is the majority of my final decision.

 

Lower cost do not always mean a lessening... but in all of Gods odds they do Maam.

 

That age old adage..you pay for what you get is a truism and holds well throughout the ages.

 

 

In any venue if it is a ship, store, mall, distinct (so called Outlet ) they target there clients well with market saturations.

 

Here in the Greater NYC Area , NCL as you will see in there numbers is not doing as well as also what happened in the Sandwich Islands ( Hawaii ) too.

 

 

If you go to a All Inclusive Property as so many Cruise lines/Ships Used to be and only a few left doing that fully.. They do not try to charge for this and that then make you go to a Pay For Eatery and be not happy with the appy then main dish..

 

They created a Revenue Generation sourcing to derive more monies from You as well I Maam. Not benefit us Cruisers...

 

:eek:

 

 

I am having difficulty understanding a lot of your writing :confused:, but I think I get enough to say that I disagree with your comment that the food and service on NCL are inferior. I feel you receive a very good value on NCL. The food and service are very good, making it a superior value. I appreciate a cruise where I can choose where my vacation dollars are spent. If I want to keep expenses down, I can eat in the main dining room and receive a wonderful meal, but I can upgrade a bit by eating at one of the specialty restaurants. If it were truly all-inclusive, I would be paying for a lot of things I don't use. That's why most of the cruise lines have moved to that business model.

 

As to the original question, I have loved both NCL cruises to Bermuda and would highly recommend it.

[AAAAmerican]

Maam or Sir,

 

I would hope as you said " I disagree with your comment that the food and service on NCL are inferior. I feel you receive a very good value on NCL. The food and service are very good, making it a superior value "

 

What have you done in cruises to compare NCL to too?;)

 

But seeing all you have taken in Cruises , Cruise line Companies and Ship Trips has been on NCL. That I do think makes you a NCL-Phile.:rolleyes:

 

Why not try other lines/ships too then your able to compare. Otherwise it is like only before buying Yugos and saying ..well since you have to repair them all the time its is really an upgrade of that product...

 

Sorry if by why I wrote you could not as you say " I am having difficulty understanding a lot of your writing"

 

Then please ask what YOU do not understand then, so I am able to make something simple enough for you to see well.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am having difficulty understanding a lot of your writing :confused:, but I think I get enough to say that I disagree with your comment that the food and service on NCL are inferior. I feel you receive a very good value on NCL. The food and service are very good, making it a superior value. I appreciate a cruise where I can choose where my vacation dollars are spent. If I want to keep expenses down, I can eat in the main dining room and receive a wonderful meal, but I can upgrade a bit by eating at one of the specialty restaurants. If it were truly all-inclusive, I would be paying for a lot of things I don't use. That's why most of the cruise lines have moved to that business model.

 

As to the original question, I have loved both NCL cruises to Bermuda and would highly recommend it.

[Mooder]

Maam or Sir,

 

I would hope as you said " I disagree with your comment that the food and service on NCL are inferior. I feel you receive a very good value on NCL. The food and service are very good, making it a superior value "

 

What have you done in cruises to compare NCL to too?;)

 

But seeing all you have taken in Cruises , Cruise line Companies and Ship Trips has been on NCL. That I do think makes you a NCL-Phile.:rolleyes:

 

Why not try other lines/ships too then your able to compare. Otherwise it is like only before buying Yugos and saying ..well since you have to repair them all the time its is really an upgrade of that product...

 

Sorry if by why I wrote you could not as you say " I am having difficulty understanding a lot of your writing"

 

Then please ask what YOU do not understand then, so I am able to make something simple enough for you to see well.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are absolutely correct that I have no other cruise line experience for comparison. But I have dined all over the world so I believe I know good food and service when I experience it. I can judge good value without comparing all the competition. They may be of equally good value. As for asking about what I do not understand in your posts, I am not sure where to begin. It is not that it is not simple enough, it is more the use broken and incomplete sentences and misspellings that make it difficult to get through. I have no desire to criticize, it is simply an explanation of my difficulty. I reacted to the statements that were clear and will leave the rest for others to learn from and/or respond to.

[AAAAmerican]

I am glad you have dined in different parts of the World. As I have dined, been served as well we have prepared then taught before on 6 of the 7 continents.

 

 

We are still learning and comparing.. as that in any life segment is vital.

 

If you have nothing to compare to where is is your plane of knowledge from? One source? Two?

 

How many Ph.D's do you hold?

 

I guess you must have one in language(s) and/or grammar..or do you think your way of spelling is the only accurate way.

 

Yes I am not a human dictionary but have a modicum of knowledge in New as well older English words.

 

 

Have you noticed in even the reply you posted how many times you put the word (( I )) in it ?

 

We all make mistakes as to err is human and Yes I do and have made mistakes especially when I freely post my thoughts on this Cruise Critic site.

 

If the spelling offends you. SORRY. It was not meant. But then forgive and go forward with your editing of others too.

 

 

In incomplete sentences.. Sorry i do/did not see any.

 

Sentence

Origin:

1175–1225 a.d.; (n.) ME < OF < L sententia opinion, decision, equiv. to sent- (base of sentīre to feel) + -entia -ence; (v.) ME: to pass judgment, decide judicially < OF sentencier, deriv. of sentence.

 

—Related forms

sen·tenc·er, noun

pre·sen·tence, verb (used with object),-tenced, -tenc·ing.

re·sen·tence, noun, verb (used with object),-tenced, -tenc·ing.

un·sen·tenced, adjective

 

 

 

–noun

1.

Grammar. a grammatical unit of one or more words, bearing minimal syntactic relation to the words that precede or follow it, often preceded and followed in speech by pauses, having one of a small number of characteristic intonation patterns, and typically expressing an independent statement, question, request, command, etc., as Summer is here. or Who is it? or Stop!

 

 

...

 

 

As you say here. " I can judge good value without comparing all the competition "

 

How is that ever possible when you have nothing but one to compare itself to too? Not all the competition... just a few then yet not just the only one. In the childrens game of baseball even the MLB has more than one team.

 

 

Is that not a bit like a person which has a name Narcissus in Greek Mythology?

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are absolutely correct that I have no other cruise line experience for comparison. But I have dined all over the world so I believe I know good food and service when I experience it. I can judge good value without comparing all the competition. They may be of equally good value. As for asking about what I do not understand in your posts, I am not sure where to begin. It is not that it is not simple enough, it is more the use broken and incomplete sentences and misspellings that make it difficult to get through. I have no desire to criticize, it is simply an explanation of my difficulty. I reacted to the statements that were clear and will leave the rest for others to learn from and/or respond to.

[mbisson]

Well golly gosh gee! I'm just a poor unedumacated country boy, but I am figuring out that my old daddy (God rest his soul) may have been right and Ph.D means piled higher and deeper

[Mooder]

I am glad you have dined in different parts of the World. As I have dined, been served as well we have prepared then taught before on 6 of the 7 continents.

 

 

We are still learning and comparing.. as that in any life segment is vital.

 

If you have nothing to compare to where is is your plane of knowledge from? One source? Two?

 

How many Ph.D's do you hold?

 

I guess you must have one in language(s) and/or grammar..or do you think your way of spelling is the only accurate way.

 

Yes I am not a human dictionary but have a modicum of knowledge in New as well older English words.

 

 

Have you noticed in even the reply you posted how many times you put the word (( I )) in it ?

 

We all make mistakes as to err is human and Yes I do and have made mistakes especially when I freely post my thoughts on this Cruise Critic site.

 

If the spelling offends you. SORRY. It was not meant. But then forgive and go forward with your editing of others too.

 

 

In incomplete sentences.. Sorry i do/did not see any.

 

Sentence

Origin:

1175–1225 a.d.; (n.) ME < OF < L sententia opinion, decision, equiv. to sent- (base of sentīre to feel) + -entia -ence; (v.) ME: to pass judgment, decide judicially < OF sentencier, deriv. of sentence.

 

—Related forms

sen·tenc·er, noun

pre·sen·tence, verb (used with object),-tenced, -tenc·ing.

re·sen·tence, noun, verb (used with object),-tenced, -tenc·ing.

un·sen·tenced, adjective

 

 

 

–noun

1.

Grammar. a grammatical unit of one or more words, bearing minimal syntactic relation to the words that precede or follow it, often preceded and followed in speech by pauses, having one of a small number of characteristic intonation patterns, and typically expressing an independent statement, question, request, command, etc., as Summer is here. or Who is it? or Stop!

 

 

...

 

 

As you say here. " I can judge good value without comparing all the competition "

 

How is that ever possible when you have nothing but one to compare itself to too? Not all the competition... just a few then yet not just the only one. In the childrens game of baseball even the MLB has more than one team.

 

 

Is that not a bit like a person which has a name Narcissus in Greek Mythology?

 

 

 

 

 

I was not at all offended and don't mind incomplete sentences. I generally make it a habit NOT to edit other people as this is a friendly "live and let live" forum. You asked me what was difficult to understand about your post so I attempted to explain. Incomplete sentences do not make a point so a response cannot be formulated. I responded to what I could discern which was that you believe NCL is not a good value. I say it is. I do not have to have experienced other cruiselines to know whether the food and service are good or whether I am receiving good value. I have plenty of other dining experiences to compare.

 

Yes, I do think there is only one way to spell some words. The problem is that by changing the spelling of certain words, you change their meaning. Hence, the lack of clarity in your posts.

 

As for the use of the word "I," that is meant as a courtesy as I can only speak for myself.

 

I apologize if I offended your sense of accomplishment. It was not my intention and there is no need to compare degrees.

 

I thank you for your response and appreciate the dialogue.

[Mooder]

Well golly gosh gee! I'm just a poor unedumacated country boy, but I am figuring out that my old daddy (God rest his soul) may have been right and Ph.D means piled higher and deeper

 

But did your Daddy know how to cut and paste? It appears to be an important skill!

[chezcarp]

In addition to HAL and Celebrity, NCL cruises to Bermuda (Dockyard) from NY. (Colette...I'm surprised you didn't mention this!)

 

To the OP:

 

NCL is far less formal than either HAL or Celebrity. There are no mandatory formal nights, for example. In my opinion, having cruised on all three, that NCL will be more appealing to the younger members of your group (the children).

 

You may want to start by pricing the three options, just to see how they fit in your budget.

Karen, we have been to Bermuda three times and on each visit docked in Hamilton and St. George. Both are lovely, clean, and appeared to be very safe. If docked where we were, Hamilton is just a few yards form the ship. It was the first place where we let our daughter and friend (both age 12 or so at the time) leave the ship alone and wander main street. Sailing into and out of St. George is amazing as the entry to the harbor is a narrow rock channel. Lots of history there and easy walk from the ship. We were on Celebrity for those trips and sing their praises. But for this trip HAL has the ideal itinerary.

[bamelin]

Not much mention about Explorer of the Seas run by Royal Caribbean in this thread ... they do 2 day stops in Bermuda at the Royal Dockyards on the way to the Bahamas (9 day voyage)

[iheartbda]

Mooder,

You've done very well in your discussion, especially when it has involved things that are compleletly irrelevant to the subject at hand. BTW, there are words that only one spelling is correct.;)

 

I HAVE cruised other lines beside NCL, maybe not as many as someone else, but I can compare food and service, food being very subjective so I will not go into details. One only has to look at reviews of HAL to see that it is not held in high esteem by everyone at all times. Bottom line.....everyone has a favorite and that is all well and good since there is a line for everyone's tastes, and or, they consider it a good value. However, nothing is accomplished by trashing another line, except for the possibility, that it may make another person's choice "look better".

[iheartbda]

Not much mention about Explorer of the Seas run by Royal Caribbean in this thread ... they do 2 day stops in Bermuda at the Royal Dockyards on the way to the Bahamas (9 day voyage)

I think because most were responding to the OP's original question. She had been on an EOS 5 day and she did not feel it was enough time in Bermuda so others were talking about 7 day cruises to just Bermuda. The 9 day still is not enought time on the island. Now, if that 9 day went only to BDA, THAT would be glorious.:)

[Mooder]

Mooder,

You've done very well in your discussion, especially when it has involved things that are compleletly irrelevant to the subject at hand. BTW, there are words that only one spelling is correct.;)

 

I HAVE cruised other lines beside NCL, maybe not as many as someone else, but I can compare food and service, food being very subjective so I will not go into details. One only has to look at reviews of HAL to see that it is not held in high esteem by everyone at all times. Bottom line.....everyone has a favorite and that is all well and good since there is a line for everyone's tastes, and or, they consider it a good value. However, nothing is accomplished by trashing another line, except for the possibility, that it may make another person's choice "look better".

 

I couldn't have said it better, Iheart! The need to trash something to make yourself or your choices look better is a symptom of insecurity. I love NCL so I see no need to go elsewhere so long as they have itineraries I want. Someday, for the right itinerary, I might try another line. But I compare all vacations, on land or sea, when deciding on value.

 

As for Bermuda, many people choose based on how long the itinerary is in port on the island. NCL compares well in that area.

[jdarch]

Mooder,

You've done very well in your discussion, especially when it has involved things that are compleletly irrelevant to the subject at hand. BTW, there are words that only one spelling is correct.;)

 

I HAVE cruised other lines beside NCL, maybe not as many as someone else, but I can compare food and service, food being very subjective so I will not go into details. One only has to look at reviews of HAL to see that it is not held in high esteem by everyone at all times. Bottom line.....everyone has a favorite and that is all well and good since there is a line for everyone's tastes, and or, they consider it a good value. However, nothing is accomplished by trashing another line, except for the possibility, that it may make another person's choice "look better".

 

IHeartBDA, I was just looking for more butter for our popcorn when you posted. Guess I can save those cals for our cruise now... Thanks to all those being the voice of reason and bringing this back to the original point: WE love Bermuda!

[iheartbda]

IHeartBDA, I was just looking for more butter for our popcorn when you posted. Guess I can save those cals for our cruise now... Thanks to all those being the voice of reason and bringing this back to the original point: WE love Bermuda!

Use some on a rum swizzle.:)

Don't know if we're going to get there this year......BAHWAAAA:(

Drove throught the battlefield yesterday. Are casinos a yes or a no for you?

[jdarch]

Use some on a rum swizzle.:)

Don't know if we're going to get there this year......BAHWAAAA:(

Drove throught the battlefield yesterday. Are casinos a yes or a no for you?

 

I have nothing against casinos, just not where they use sacred ground as a calling card. One of my hats is as a guide in the National Park - almost all the visitors who mention it think its terrible idea...

[mag]

I was looking at booking the Veendam for my 2010 Bermuda trip cause of the ports and extra night. Then came the news that they will be tendering into St. George...IMHO one of the best parts is going thru the cut and being greeted by the Town Crier. I think that this will also take away from time spent on the island.

 

I also agree that the ship will just go to Hamilton if the seas are rough and/or windy. That is actually what we had to do several years ago (on the Dream), then we went back the next day into St. George (yay!).

 

The ferries are wonderful and the dockyard has grown so much (I remember taking the ferry over when only the fort was there and 2 stores open in the mall) that I now do not mind it at all.

 

SO we considered all the info and read all the reviews and compared prices...and yes there was a difference in the prices. We did end up staying with NCL and booking the Spirit...we sailed her last year and it was wicked (that word has more than 2 meanings - especially in MA) awesome!

 

I really really like NCL and no I have not tried all the cruiselines and no I have not traveled all the world (but some of it) and no I have not eaten in all the best restaurants but I do know what I like. My charges are sometimes less than $100 at the end of the cruise so I was not nickeled and dimed at all. Yes, sometimes my charges are more...depends how I spend my $$$$$.

 

I agree with the poster who said respect others opinions without knocking down other posters or cruiselines. Be informed and make the best choice for you. You don't need a college degree or have lots of $$$ to be a smart consumer. The important thing is to have fun!

[jdarch]

Your post is excellent and brings up another point. Part of the difficulty in responding to newbies' requests for info is not only the personal nature of who enjoys what cruise line, and why, but what experience you expect - which you can only gain by taking the cruise! You quickly find how important the balance is between the destination and the ship itself.

We've cruised the Dawn twice and we enjoy it for what it is. No, it's not Celebrity, much less Azamara, but it's also not the French freighter to Devil's Island some seem to think it is.

We'd love to go on the Veendam (despite the extra $$) if we knew we could repeat the experience of going through Town Cut, docking at St Georges (which we loved), and that connection to "old" Bermuda.

However, once they started talking tendering, so much for that connection with our favorite spot -that did it for HAL. Just our opinion.

[iheartbda]

Your post is excellent and brings up another point. Part of the difficulty in responding to newbies' requests for info is not only the personal nature of who enjoys what cruise line, and why, but what experience you expect - which you can only gain by taking the cruise! You quickly find how important the balance is between the destination and the ship itself.

We've cruised the Dawn twice and we enjoy it for what it is. No, it's not Celebrity, much less Azamara, but it's also not the French freighter to Devil's Island some seem to think it is.

We'd love to go on the Veendam (despite the extra $$) if we knew we could repeat the experience of going through Town Cut, docking at St Georges (which we loved), and that connection to "old" Bermuda.

However, once they started talking tendering, so much for that connection with our favorite spot -that did it for HAL. Just our opinion.

Couldn't agree with you more on all points, especially the highlighted.