Jump to content

Dark Side Craps Strategies


Deckhawk

Recommended Posts

Ok, I need a lesson.

 

If I lay $25 on DON"T and 6 becomes the point, and I lay $24 on 6, what do I win if 6 hits?

 

Do I win $4?

 

I guess I don't understand the odds.

 

Thanks for the help.

 

HHHHHEEEEELLLLLLLLLLOOOOO F22Smitty: If you bet $25 on the Don't Pass then six is the point and you lay 24 dollars on 6 and six hits you lose. Collect the Don'ts and pay the line.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, I need a lesson.

 

If I lay $25 on DON"T and 6 becomes the point, and I lay $24 on 6, what do I win if 6 hits?

 

Do I win $4?

 

I guess I don't understand the odds.

 

Thanks for the help.

 

If 7 comes you win $25 on the DP and $20 on your lay... 5/6 on the lay bet

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, I need a lesson.

 

If I lay $25 on DON"T and 6 becomes the point, and I lay $24 on 6, what do I win if 6 hits?

 

Do I win $4?

 

I guess I don't understand the odds.

 

Thanks for the help.

Hard to answer as it's unclear as to what you're doing/asking. Proper craps terminology will help.

 

Lay = A bet against a number rolling that is either made after a Don't Come bet goes to a number. Or a bet against a number rolling that is made directly, usually a vig is charged on this bet.

 

If what you're asking is "If I bet $25 on DON"T and 6 becomes the point, and I play $24 on 6, what do I win if 6 hits? The answer is $3, you lose the $25 Don't Come bet and win $28 from the $24 place bet if the 6 rolls. You can then leave the place bet, or take it down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Proper craps terminology will help.

 

If what you're asking is "If I bet $25 on DON"T and 6 becomes the point, and I play $24 on 6, what do I win if 6 hits? The answer is $3, you lose the $25 Don't Come bet and win $28 from the $24 place bet if the 6 rolls. You can then leave the place bet, or take it down.

 

Thanks MrCo9, that's exactly what I was asking. I guess it would help if I knew what I was sayin. :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
All,

 

I thought I'd start a thread on Dark Side craps strategies. From being on this board the last few years I've only seen a few people post about playing the dark side. Would be interested to hear your strategies and other thoughts related to it. I've got a few strategies to share, but want to hear yours before mine get blown out of the water. :)

 

Fascinating thread ~ one of the best and most entertaining I've read in ages! :D Thanks for starting it, Deckhawk, and for everyone's contributions so far. I'm itching to stick my toe in the Dark Waters after reading here... I may have to change the color of my fedora from light to dark when I fill the hat... :cool:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fascinating thread ~ one of the best and most entertaining I've read in ages! :D Thanks for starting it, Deckhawk, and for everyone's contributions so far. I'm itching to stick my toe in the Dark Waters after reading here... I may have to change the color of my fedora from light to dark when I fill the hat... :cool:

Welcome catroo. Hope to get you on the dark side. Hey is it this thread that made u start posting? You said best thread in ages but u just joined. Haha. Anyway hope to see more if ya almost fellow dark sider.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Welcome catroo. Hope to get you on the dark side. Hey is it this thread that made u start posting? You said best thread in ages but u just joined. Haha. Anyway hope to see more if ya almost fellow dark sider.

 

Thanks much! I read a lot of stuff around the interwebnet linkages, and I've just added CC to my arsenal of "Check this out!" (Where have y'all been hiding!?!?) :rolleyes:

 

After hitting the Roll Call for Serenade in Nov, this thread caught my eye next. When I'm on-board, if I'm not in the Windjammer filling my stomach, I'm in the Casino filling my hat... so here I am, amongst thie... er, friends. ;)

 

I'm watching, reading & learning from you Dark Siders. "When in Rome... (or Antigua, or Mazatlán, or...)" :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just got back from a cruise. I have noticed in interesting thing. This pertains to tables that have single odds, which sucks, but on a ship you are trapped. If you try to slip in one cent more when you take odds on the pass line they will catch it and tell you to take off the additional odds you have there.

 

When you play the don't pass line on a single odds table you are limited to laying enough odds that if a seven is rolled before the point you will be paid an amount that is equal to your flat bet (don't pass bet).

 

It seems you can lay more than the amount that would give you a win equal to your flat bet on single odds tables. I don't know if it is a matter of them not paying attention, ignorance, or simply not caring. Thought it was interesting. This has happened more than once. The more odds you can lay the better off you are. Especially if the point is 4 or 10 you got a real good chance of winning.

 

I'm confused of what you're saying. Are you saying if you have a $5 flat bet on the don't. Out on a point of 9, with single odds you can lay $9.

 

Because of the break down, there are some amounts that let you "up" your odds due to the "break" 3 goes to 4, 5 goes to 6. If you have a $6 come bet that's on the 6, you can go to $10 odds on a single odds table. You get the extra $5 for the extra $1 on the bet. Where I work, we're all 5 times odds, so it's been a long time since I've dealt with single odds.

 

I'm not sure if what I explained is what you're talking about! But if it is, I hope I helped!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just got back from a cruise. I have noticed in interesting thing. This pertains to tables that have single odds, which sucks, but on a ship you are trapped. If you try to slip in one cent more when you take odds on the pass line they will catch it and tell you to take off the additional odds you have there.

 

When you play the don't pass line on a single odds table you are limited to laying enough odds that if a seven is rolled before the point you will be paid an amount that is equal to your flat bet (don't pass bet).

 

It seems you can lay more than the amount that would give you a win equal to your flat bet on single odds tables. I don't know if it is a matter of them not paying attention, ignorance, or simply not caring. Thought it was interesting. This has happened more than once. The more odds you can lay the better off you are. Especially if the point is 4 or 10 you got a real good chance of winning.

Not really, on a don't bet you're better off with a bigger initial bet (It pays what you bet) a bigger lay pays less than what you bet. Say you have a point of 10, if you bet $50 initially on the Don't Pass and then lay $100 your total win on a 7 out is $100 ($50 for your Don't Pass bet and $50 for your $100 lay bet), if instead you were to bet the whole $150 before the point of 10 is established you'd win $150 on a 7 out.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not really, on a don't bet you're better off with a bigger initial bet (It pays what you bet) a bigger lay pays less than what you bet. Say you have a point of 10, if you bet $50 initially on the Don't Pass and then lay $100 your total win on a 7 out is $100 ($50 for your Don't Pass bet and $50 for your $100 lay bet), if instead you were to bet the whole $150 before the point of 10 is established you'd win $150 on a 7 out.

What you say here is very interesting.....Let me see if I get what you are saying....

 

Are you suggesting that a dark side player should NEVER lay odds, and simply increase their flat bet to better increase their chances of WINNING MORE money?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What you say here is very interesting.....Let me see if I get what you are saying....

 

Are you suggesting that a dark side player should NEVER lay odds, and simply increase their flat bet to better increase their chances of WINNING MORE money?

You have more at risk on the first roll when the 7 or 11 rolls, but, YES, you will win more by betting more initially and not laying odds if you do get that 7 out. The problem is on the first roll you're at an 8:3 disadvantage, 6 ways for the 7 to roll, 2 for the 11 and you only win if the 2 or 3 rolls (3 ways between them out of 36). A Do player should do the opposite, instead of a big pass line or come bet, make a smaller bet and use the rest as odds.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well what he is saying is true except he left out an important point.

This only works out if you are willing to risk the full $150 bet on the come out roll. I'm sure that the odds work out that if you do (instead of risking just the $50 on the come out and laying the odds after the point is made and known) you will loose the extra $100 more often than you win (get past the come out and get to the point). It also ignores the other possible points where the difference is not as great.

 

If this we not true then the casinos would go broke....

 

BUT its called gambling. In the short term this might work to your advantage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well what he is saying is true except he left out an important point.

This only works out if you are willing to risk the full $150 bet on the come out roll. I'm sure that the odds work out that if you do (instead of risking just the $50 on the come out and laying the odds after the point is made and known) you will loose the extra $100 more often than you win (get past the come out and get to the point). It also ignores the other possible points where the difference is not as great.

 

If this we not true then the casinos would go broke....

 

BUT its called gambling. In the short term this might work to your advantage.

Yes, indeed....I am gonna run some practice rounds on the computer game and play my same way and not lay any odds and see if there is any significant difference. It certainly will be if more sevens are rolled on the come out roll. But, you hit the nail on the head. It is gambling. Thanks, guys.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Betting either way will depend on the table. You have to keep that in mind. On paper yes, betting the don't is the way to go. However after 11 years of seeing it, sometimes it doesn't work. Same as the field. On paper it's the worse bet on the table, but I've seen people make a ton of money on it, and loose a ton. It's what the table is doing. If the table is making numbers, the don't is going to be a bad bet. If it's point 7 all the time, it's a good bet.

 

If you're going to play both sides of the fence, you have to know when you hope over to the other side before you fall off.

 

Also, laying the odds of course isn't in your best interest due to the fact you have the edge. Just like you can take so many odds, because the fact is, 7 is the most common number.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well what he is saying is true except he left out an important point.

This only works out if you are willing to risk the full $150 bet on the come out roll. I'm sure that the odds work out that if you do (instead of risking just the $50 on the come out and laying the odds after the point is made and known) you will loose the extra $100 more often than you win (get past the come out and get to the point). It also ignores the other possible points where the difference is not as great.

 

If this we not true then the casinos would go broke....

 

BUT its called gambling. In the short term this might work to your advantage.

Learn to read Sailor boy, I didn't leave ANYTHING out. I started out with "You have more at risk" See??

 

You have more at risk on the first roll when the 7 or 11 rolls, but, YES, you will win more by betting more initially and not laying odds if you do get that 7 out. The problem is on the first roll you're at an 8:3 disadvantage, 6 ways for the 7 to roll, 2 for the 11 and you only win if the 2 or 3 rolls (3 ways between them out of 36). A Do player should do the opposite, instead of a big pass line or come bet, make a smaller bet and use the rest as odds.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry Mr CO9 but when I started typing your reply with that comment was not posted... check my posting time vs yours... I typed it in and hit the submit button without looking at the thread again.... If I had then of course my comment was not needed...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So back to the original point of the thread - any good strategies for don't players that anyone wants to share?

 

While nothing is more fun than a hot, winning table, the opposite is more common. When the dice are cold, here's what I do.

 

On the comeout:

 

1. Bet $54 on the Don't Pass.

2. Bet $4 on the Yo (eleven)

 

Shooter shoots: If they make 7, you lose. Otherwise they crap, you win $54 unless its twelve, then you push. If they hit yo, you lose your "Don't" bet, but your yo bet pays you $60, so you replace your $54 "Don't".

Or, they make a point.

Once the point is set:

 

1. Bet $54 across ($52 if point is six or eight) which is basically placing all the numbers for $10 each ($12 on six and eight).

 

If they seven out immediately, your darn close to even. If not, you've got money playing both ways.

 

Now just play the place bets like you normally would. Press, buy, etc. Even if they only hit a few and then "seven out", you win. Ideally they roll all over the place and then seven out.

 

If they quickly make their point (resulting in your loss of the $54 "Don't", just ride your place bets until the next "comeout".

 

This way, you're not just hovering at the end of the table waiting for a loss, but aggressively betting on the place bets, and when the eventual loss comes, you get $54 bonus.

 

I've had pretty good success with this.:cool:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Betting either way will depend on the table. You have to keep that in mind. On paper yes, betting the don't is the way to go. However after 11 years of seeing it, sometimes it doesn't work. Same as the field. On paper it's the worse bet on the table, but I've seen people make a ton of money on it, and loose a ton. It's what the table is doing. If the table is making numbers, the don't is going to be a bad bet. If it's point 7 all the time, it's a good bet.

 

If you're going to play both sides of the fence, you have to know when you hope over to the other side before you fall off.

 

Also, laying the odds of course isn't in your best interest due to the fact you have the edge. Just like you can take so many odds, because the fact is, 7 is the most common number.

 

This is also an excellent point. Just like you shouldn't keep throwing money on the pass line when the dice are cold, learn to notice a shift and accept that a table is getting hot. Also, don't feel obligated to bet the Pass or Don't Pass. (unless you're the shooter). I've had many a night when the dice were back and forth/ win/ lose, but they rolled the hell out of a particular number (ie.six or eight, or even hard ways). Look for repetitive patterns.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

After a hot streak or a cold one I always find re-reviewing the craps section on wizardofodds.com a good reality check. :)

 

On the other hand its also a good retort to long-runs versus short-runs, that in the long run we all end up dead, but there are times along the way that can be a heck of a lot of fun.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 year later...
While nothing is more fun than a hot, winning table, the opposite is more common. When the dice are cold, here's what I do.

 

On the comeout:

 

1. Bet $54 on the Don't Pass.

2. Bet $4 on the Yo (eleven)

 

Shooter shoots: If they make 7, you lose. Otherwise they crap, you win $54 unless its twelve, then you push. If they hit yo, you lose your "Don't" bet, but your yo bet pays you $60, so you replace your $54 "Don't".

Or, they make a point.

Once the point is set:

 

1. Bet $54 across ($52 if point is six or eight) which is basically placing all the numbers for $10 each ($12 on six and eight).

 

If they seven out immediately, your darn close to even. If not, you've got money playing both ways.

 

Now just play the place bets like you normally would. Press, buy, etc. Even if they only hit a few and then "seven out", you win. Ideally they roll all over the place and then seven out.

 

If they quickly make their point (resulting in your loss of the $54 "Don't", just ride your place bets until the next "comeout".

 

This way, you're not just hovering at the end of the table waiting for a loss, but aggressively betting on the place bets, and when the eventual loss comes, you get $54 bonus.

 

I've had pretty good success with this.:cool:

What happens if after establishing the point the next number rolled is the point? You lose your $54 plus the $4 you bet on the yo and you did not get paid on a single place bet. If you want to be guaranteed to make $$ after you made it past the first roll (You know, the one where the house has an 8:3 advantage OVER you) you should be placing the point instead of the other numbers. $48 if the point is 6 or 8, $40-50 on a 5 or 9 and $30-50 on a 4 or 10. If you want to protect your $54 Don't Pass bet on the come out roll, you might want to think of laying a number in addition to betting the yo, that way when that 7 rolls 1 time out of 6, you get money back. Or, you can try actually gambling and JUST bet the Don't Pass without all the other bets.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Forum Jump
    • Categories
      • Welcome to Cruise Critic
      • New Cruisers
      • Cruise Lines “A – O”
      • Cruise Lines “P – Z”
      • River Cruising
      • ROLL CALLS
      • Digital Photography & Cruise Technology
      • Special Interest Cruising
      • Cruise Discussion Topics
      • UK Cruising
      • Australia & New Zealand Cruisers
      • Canadian Cruisers
      • North American Homeports
      • Ports of Call
      • Cruise Conversations
×
×
  • Create New...