Viking 'Footsteps of the Cossacks' (Ukraine)

[Old Pete]

hi Pete,

always like your posts, but this time you are not right.

First, what Russian language has to do with Ukraine?

Second, Ukrainian language is phonetic - you pronounce the words

exactly the way they are spelled. That is why it's so easy to learn

to read in Ukrainian. Russian language, on the contrary, is

traditional, meaning, that they spelled the words they way they were

spelled centuries ago, the same as English. So, Russians spelled it

shokolad (chocolate) and pronounce it /chikalat/. They spell it

"gorod" (city), and pronounce it /gorat/, and so on and so forth.

Back to your examples:

Restaurant - pronounced /restaran/ in Russian, spelled

"restoran".

Metro - spelled "metro", pronounced /meetro/ (ee like i in the

English word "this")

Vino - wine, spelled "vino", pronounced /vieno/ (ie like in Vienna)

Whereas, in Ukrainian language, what you see - you pronounce, with

the five exceptions.

Sorry to be a spoilsport and such.

 

Hi Altiva

Uh... did you read my initial post? the one that stated that I WAS BORN in Odessa???

So I dont think I can be considered "ignorant" in the languages - I am quite proficient in both

 

1. What does Russian has to do with Ukrainian? Nothing much except that from what I saw - most of the people STILL prefer to converse in Russian not Ukrainian (all "nationalist" sentiments aside) just like they did during Soviet times. Granted - there is a LOT MORE of the Ukrainian spoken than then - but I firmly stand my my observation.

And, that said - we are talking about tourism and everywhere I've been - hotels, restaurants and the Cruise about which we are talking here - not a WORD was spoken in Ukrainian (the band on the cruise playing Ukrainian songs - not counting) - it is ALL IN RUSSIAN

Thus, I would humbly put forth that for a tourist who will be in the country for a period of 2 weeks (maybe 3 with extensions) it is better to get familiar with Russian and not Ukrainian

 

2. Now, as far as pronunciation goes - I think you somewhat misunderstand what I said. I said that there is no 'weird" spelling in Russian as there is in languages like English and French. Using the example I provided - the word "daughter" most likely would be spelled in Russian "doter" because that is how it is pronounced (i.e. no "gh"). Or, if we were to flip-flop - the way it IS spelled it would be pronounced "dah-oo-gkh-er" (даугхер - if you can read Cyrillic)

 

hence I said - the way you write it is the way you read it and say it

 

You are talking about dialects which is different (and again - never mind the difference between the Russian and Ukrainian languages - i am talking STRICTLY Russian here)

The differences between the pronunciation of a and o are plentiful in Russian language. Again - if you know the Russian language surely you must be aware of the joking references to O-pronunciation of the Moscow region (i.e. окать по-московски). Chances are the dialects would differ even in Ukraine itself -from Kiev to Odessa (although I DO have to 'take it back" - Odessa as we all know has its own language\dialect that cannot be duplicated ANYWHERE... except perhaps on Brighton Beach in Brooklyn NY :D)

 

Seriously - if anyone from this cruise (or any other tour) asks where is restoran vs restaran - chances are they will be understood

(and speaking of - one of my American friends here at home who was in Russia when he was a student jokes that the first word he learned how to read was Peck-toh-pah (PECTOPAH). We thought it was rather quite funny).

 

Anyways - I sincerely hope you can see where it is that I was going with my post and why I said what I said ;)

[Old Pete]

Peregrina -

I agree with what you say. Yes unfortunately the tourism in the post-Soviet countries is still not quite up to par that we wish it to be but to give the credit - I already saw a big difference between 2008 and 2010!

The 'eateries' learned how to serve with the smile the fastest (I guess the concept of tips had a LOT to do with it), seems the hotels are beginning to follow (in 2008 I was 'greeted' with the typical Soviet-attitude type of gloomy face behind the check-in counter and any question during subsequent state had to be like being a dentist - PULLED! The same hotel in 2010 was nothing but smiles and a big willingness to help no matter what was asked)

 

I wouldn't say that the guides on this cruise were UN-knowledgeable - quite the contrary! They simply still have a big language barrier. Our bus guide - Tanya - was actually majoring in French and spoke that language BEAUTIFULLY! She told me that she has no idea why she was assigned to an English-speaking cruise and mine just happened to be this "first one" so on top of everything else - she was NERVOUS as nervous can get.

I hope 2 years hence you will get "better".

 

Trust me - you are NOT missing anything in Kremenchug! Kanev - AH! _ that i would've LOVEd to visit (if anything that is where Taras Shevchenko - the GREAT (if not GREATEST) Ukrainian poet is buried) but it was not on the itinerary and I don't think it is now... A shame! Maybe Viking will take note :rolleyes:

 

From what I saw - The InterContinental in Kiev is gorgeous and has a location TO DIE FOR! of course that will come with "applicable price" per night - no doubt - but thought i'd mention it to you!

 

Yes - the "air deviation"... and unfortunately Viking charges crazy fee for providing this "option". Does Czech Airlines fly from Boston? Remember - mine was 1 hop through Prague (we sat there for roughly 4 hours but at the same time had a nice lunch and drank some Czech beer :p) and landed in Odessa mid-afternoon.

be persistent in your Quest - you WILL find choices... I would just suggest not to tarry too much: seems the dreaded fuel prices are on the rise again and we all know what THAT means :mad:

 

For the umptiest time - GOOD LUCK!

Edited November 21, 2011 by Old Pete
addition to the post

[Peregrina651]

Allan --

 

We did a tour in St.P a few years back and our wonderful, wonderful guide Elena explained why service people don't smile. She said that it is because one does not smile while one is working because it means that you don't take your job seriously. It is part of the Russian work ethic. I can live that.

 

While the American motto is "Service with a smile," it doesn't mean that the rest of the world subscribes to that standard and there are times when we just have to leave our standards home and function in the culture that we are visiting. So, when I am in Russia, I don't expect a smile. When I am in Spain, I expect that restaurant service will be slower and that the waiter won't be showing up with a check before I have even finished my main course. In China, I expect to bargain for every purchase (now, there is a people who understand that the sale begins at 'no.') For me, that is the fun of traveling.

 

I have found a B&B with great reviews and am waiting to dicker with Viking over flights before I make my final decision.

 

I don't know much about Kaniv other than that is where Grandma lived when she was girl. She went to school in Kiev (we have her class picture, with all the girls in uniform). She didn't go into much detail about it and rarely told stories from her childhood. Allan, like your father, they just wanted to get away there. Not all of the family emigrated but sadly over the years, we have completely lost touch with those who remained. I've been trying to locate family members but not speaking or reading Russian makes it difficult.

 

I'll look into Czech airlines to see if they have anything. Thanks.

 

BTW, my profile says Boston, but I grew up in Philadelphia (well actually, Montco but close enough).

 

A

 

[Old Pete]

YUP - I hear you!

One of the most funniest moments was when we had a HUUUGE family & friends shindig about 10 years ago.

One of our friends (same as I inasmuch as that he immigrated from USSR while still a teenage eons ago...interestingly enough he is from Kiev) was looking at the photos some time after and somewhat "angrily" commented on "What is the MATTER with "these people" (meaning other "Russians") - they DO NOT SMILE!". 5 or so pictures later - there was his... looking as grim and stern as one can :rolleyes:

Like I said - 2010 proved that they are catching on.

 

As far as bargaining - do the same in Ukraine. They understand the concept very well (although not in restaurants but if you buy anything from a street vendor, esp. souvenirs and stuff like that)

 

One more thing I am going to say about Viking Air - dicker and stand your ground. While they are promising "the best available and the most effective" - we all know that it is whatever the "block" they bought of. One of the couples on our cruise was initially scheduled for a 3-stop change over :eek:

Needless to say the gentleman complained profusely and Lo & behold - somehow "mysteriously" :rolleyes: he got a 1-stop over itinerary.

 

HEY - I live in MontCo. Abington to be exact! Small world!!!!

Love Boston... at least to visit (your prices are a KILLER :D)

[Peregrina651]

And I grew up in Cheltenham. Even smaller world!

 

________________________________________

 

I just filled out the Viking PIF and started to read the FAQs. Here is some helpful advice from the folks at Viking for those who not using Viking transfers to the boat:

Please note: The ship’s docking location is at the discretion of port authorities, and your ship’s Captain can be ordered to move the ship without notice.

Do not dismiss your taxi until you have positively located the ship.

Here is docking information and the link to the whole Viking docking pdf:

KIEV (pdf includes a map)

Pochtova Square 3, River Passenger Terminal.

 

ODESSA (no map)

Primorskaya Street No. 6, Sea Terminal

Interesting to note that Viking includes the address in Cyrillic for its Moscow and St. Petersburg passengers but not for Kiev and Odessa.

[altiva]

Hi Altiva

Uh... did you read my initial post? the one that stated that I WAS BORN in Odessa???

So I dont think I can be considered "ignorant" in the languages - I am quite proficient in both

 

1. What does Russian has to do with Ukrainian? Nothing much except that from what I saw - most of the people STILL prefer to converse in Russian not Ukrainian (all "nationalist" sentiments aside) just like they did during Soviet times. Granted - there is a LOT MORE of the Ukrainian spoken than then - but I firmly stand my my observation.

And, that said - we are talking about tourism and everywhere I've been - hotels, restaurants and the Cruise about which we are talking here - not a WORD was spoken in Ukrainian (the band on the cruise playing Ukrainian songs - not counting) - it is ALL IN RUSSIAN

Thus, I would humbly put forth that for a tourist who will be in the country for a period of 2 weeks (maybe 3 with extensions) it is better to get familiar with Russian and not Ukrainian

 

2. Now, as far as pronunciation goes - I think you somewhat misunderstand what I said. I said that there is no 'weird" spelling in Russian as there is in languages like English and French. Using the example I provided - the word "daughter" most likely would be spelled in Russian "doter" because that is how it is pronounced (i.e. no "gh"). Or, if we were to flip-flop - the way it IS spelled it would be pronounced "dah-oo-gkh-er" (даугхер - if you can read Cyrillic)

 

hence I said - the way you write it is the way you read it and say it

 

You are talking about dialects which is different (and again - never mind the difference between the Russian and Ukrainian languages - i am talking STRICTLY Russian here)

The differences between the pronunciation of a and o are plentiful in Russian language. Again - if you know the Russian language surely you must be aware of the joking references to O-pronunciation of the Moscow region (i.e. окать по-московски). Chances are the dialects would differ even in Ukraine itself -from Kiev to Odessa (although I DO have to 'take it back" - Odessa as we all know has its own language\dialect that cannot be duplicated ANYWHERE... except perhaps on Brighton Beach in Brooklyn NY :D)

 

Seriously - if anyone from this cruise (or any other tour) asks where is restoran vs restaran - chances are they will be understood

(and speaking of - one of my American friends here at home who was in Russia when he was a student jokes that the first word he learned how to read was Peck-toh-pah (PECTOPAH). We thought it was rather quite funny).

 

Anyways - I sincerely hope you can see where it is that I was going with my post and why I said what I said ;)

 

 

Hi Pete,

I see that you picked up on one syllable words and ignored my

comments, on for example, chocolate. Strangely, too, Russians

themselves acknowledge their spelling to be traditional, rather than

phonetical. I could have said a lot about this, as well as about

"well, Ukrainians, they like to speak Russian and they are Russians",

but I do not want to spoil this lovely lady's thread.

[altiva]

We want spend a couple of extra nights in Kiev and Viking isn't offering a post cruise on our trip. Now I am working on putting it together on my own. I've been reading TripAdvisor but I thought I would ask for your input. I would prefer not to do an apartment since I like knowing that there is always some available if I need help.

 

Where have you stayed and what are your thoughts on the place?

 

hi Peregrina,

In Kyiv, I love Premier Palace, it's a wonderful place, but the

prices are sky high. When I am not on business, I do apartments.

Because, I am afraid, that in Ukraine it's like this: either the

place is good, with high prices, or not as good, with not that low

prices either. It's easy to find something super, but quite difficult

to find a clean, non-expensive place. That is why so many people do

apartments. I understand your desire to be with others, so to speak,

and maybe someone will yet come and uncover to us that hidden jewel.

I am quite interested myself. Do stop in Kyiv and make sure to visit

Pirogovo - it's an open air museum, reconstructing ancient Ukrainian

village. You can see how people lived back then. They have houses,

furniture, even a wind mill from 12 century, an old church, in which

you can even get married, and much more. You can see photos here:

http://pirogovo.org.ua/index.php/fotogalereya.html

You can use a mini cab number 156 from Bessarabsky market. I hope you

will enjoy it.

[Peregrina651]

Do stop in Kyiv and make sure to visit

Pirogovo - it's an open air museum, reconstructing ancient Ukrainian

village. You can see how people lived back then. They have houses,

furniture, even a wind mill from 12 century, an old church, in which

you can even get married, and much more.

 

 

It sounds a lot like Plimoth Plantation here in Massachusetts, a re-creation of the settlement built by the Pilgrims in the early 1600s. It is one of my favorite places to take visitors. Here are a couple of photos from my last visit.

 

It all depends on how much time we actually have in Kyiv if we will get to see Pirogovo. There are so many things to see.

[Peregrina651]

I just want to wish everyone a belated but Happy Thanksgiving. :)

[Old Pete]

Please note: The ship’s docking location is at the discretion of port authorities, and your ship’s Captain can be ordered to move the ship without notice.

Do not dismiss your taxi until you have positively located the ship.

Here is docking information and the link to the whole Viking docking pdf:

KIEV (pdf includes a map)

Pochtova Square 3, River Passenger Terminal.

 

ODESSA (no map)

Primorskaya Street No. 6, Sea Terminal

Interesting to note that Viking includes the address in Cyrillic for its Moscow and St. Petersburg passengers but not for Kiev and Odessa.

 

 

Andrea -

Perhaps the addresses omitted is precisely due to what Altiva alludes to - difference between Russian & Ukrainian spelling

 

I did not have any problems with ship's location. Of all the ports we visited - the only one that the ship changed locations was Sevastopol when we docked in the Count's Harbor 1st Day and were switched to Artillery Harbor early on the morning of Day 2. That said - once moored - that's where it stayed for the duration of the day.

 

In Odessa - you REALLY do not have to worry. There is only ONE "Sea (Marine) Terminal". Granted - it juts out into the Harbor in such manner that the ships can be moored on either of 3 sides (if you look at some photos you will see that) but that said - you are still in the same place and all-in-all I would not recommend to take it THAT CLOSE to the departure time with the taxi.

The Terminal is clearly seen from the top of the Potemkin Steps so it is very much accessible if you decide to go out for a walk and return - all on foot. If you do engage a taxi - there are 2 options: the cab can drop you off by the main entrance of the terminal and you will descend roughly 2 flights of stairs to the dock (that obviously works if you have no luggage) or it can take you right to the ship but that involves a small entry fee that you must pay for it to get through the gate. (IIRC 5UAH). Either way - you just can't get lost.

 

Primorskaya St in Russian is Pree-mor-skah-yah Oo-lee-tsah and can be written as Приморская ул. or ул.Приморская (ул. being the St. abbreviation)

 

here is pretty good site I've used myself and found very helpful http://www.odessaonline.com.ua/eng/

Got a map plus other stuff you may find interesting.

[Old Pete]

Altiva - here are two "Classic" examples of what we are talking about - spelling vs. pronunciation:

 

1. - Девушка, кем это вы себя мните?

- Не ваше это дело, кем я себя мну!

 

2. - Сара, шо вы пишете "Два мужика надорвались на мине"?

Не "надорвались", а "подорвались"!

- Нет, таки надорвались! Не на мИне, а на минЕ!

:D:rolleyes:

[Peregrina651]

Andrea -

Perhaps the addresses omitted is precisely due to what Altiva alludes to - difference between Russian & Ukrainian spelling

 

 

The idea is to provide an address that can be printed out and given to a cab-driver. So, if they have to provide the address in two languages, then they should. I was just pointing out an incongruity. In any case, your description of the port is very helpful for those who will be arriving by cab and for those who will be wondering on their own while we are visiting the city.

 

We decided not to stay on in Kiev after the cruise and so were able to book our flights. With custom air, I was able to make certain requests for timing to avoid arriving after dinner on Day 1 and departing the ship before dawn on Day 12.

[Peregrina651]

In any case, your description of the port is very helpful for those who will be arriving by cab and for those who will be wondering on their own while we are visiting the city.

 

 

make that wandering

[Peregrina651]

Next on my to do list is to learn more about the optional tours and to start finding out about private guides in the cities where we have free time.

 

Viking doesn't send the optional tour info until it sends the docs, three weeks before the tour, and that is a bit late for anyone who is considering arranging private tours. I wish they would post it on their website or link to a pdf with the info as it does for some things (like laundry prices and beverage packages).

Edited December 1, 2011 by Peregrina651

[Old Pete]

The only optional tour that i actually signed up for was Baby Yar in Kiev.

it is actually not advertised (or at least wasn't last year). The cost was 300UAH\pp. Since the time in Kiev is VERY LIMITED (one has to remember that you need to PACK in order to get off the ship "tomorrow morning") basically you board the Babi Yar bus practically after you come back from the St Sophia\Kiev-Pechersky tour

You'll be back right before dinner

The guide (unfortunatley i do not recall her name) was very informative and spoke English! The tour made 3 stops: the "top" of the Yar, the "pseudo-memorial" (was build by the Soviets at the place that has nothing to do with the issue) and the "bottom"

I guess if you are interested and know what Baby yar is about - you can hire a cab for cheaper than 600UAH it would cost you. Whether you will get the story and above-mentioned 3 stops is highly questionable; hence I would probably go with the Viking Tour.

 

I didn't take any optional tours in Odessa since I know the city better than the tour guides :D One of the tours offered - Jewish Odessa - takes you to the district I was born and lived at. No need to pay $$$ for someone to show me my appt building :rolleyes:

Same with the Opera Theater Performance - if you so incline you can walk up to the Theater (10 mins walk if that from the Richelieu monument atop of Potemkin Steps) and ask what is playing. The most expensive ticket - sitting in the Tzar's Box - ran me 135UAH pp. We actually opted to do that the 1st night on the ship - had dinner at The Steakhouse around 5:00 pm and then casually walked to the theater for a 7:00 pm performance.

The Viking Optional Tour took folks to the performance the night the ship was leaving - it was hurried and they were fed dinner on the ship when they returned, which was close to 10 pm (too late for me to eat dinners and I am not sure I'd enjoy the performance if i was hungry)

 

http://www.opera-ballet.tm.odessa.ua/english/repertoiren_now.html

 

This will get you the schedule. Once more - if you do decide to go - DO NOT buy any tickets online!!! they will cost you 10 times what they will on the spot if you pay in Hrivnas

 

As I also mentioned prior - I went "all out" in Crimea by hiring Sergey. THAT ran me a pretty penny but it was worth every bit of it based on what I saw vs what others saw.

 

Good luck!

[Peregrina651]

Allan --

 

Thank you for all the information. You really did answer so many of the questions that I had. Still, I have more that really aren't germaine to this discussion thread, so would you contact me using the address below? Thanks.

 

Andrea

Edited December 2, 2011 by Peregrina651

[Peregrina651]

I posted this same info in another thread but I'm going to repeat it here because it pertains to folks on this itinerary as well.

 

This is a heads up. It looks like some of the airlines have changed the rules as to what class fares maybe upgraded. By class it does not mean economy, business, etc but rather the letter determining fare type such as Y, K etc. which have to more with how much was paid for a seat rather than its location.

 

The airlines are on to us! They know that we get cheap seats by booking through the cruise lines or consolidators and then upgrade to business or first using our points. The airlines are closing the loophole; they want their money. Star Alliance airlines for sure have changed their rules; I don't know about the others.

 

Whether we are booking through Viking or online, we are now going to have pay careful attention to what category fare we have if we are planning on using miles to upgrade the ticket.

[Bellaggio Cruisers]

We have booked the July 30, 2012 trip- from Odessa to Kiev. We are planning to remain in Kiev several days and will investigate some private tours to small towns in which our parents and grandparents were born and raised. Does anyone know a private guide that can help us with these arrangements?

We appreciate any help we can get--

We are arranging flights on American Airlines --JFK to Budapest - then Malev from Budapest to Odessa -- We are returning on Lufthanse through Frankfurt to JFK.

Sheila and Herb - Lake Worth Florida

[Peregrina651]

Hello, Sheila and Herb --

 

Welcome to the conversation! Sorry we won't be on the same cruise but I promise to post when I get back.

 

There are a number of threads with information for this cruise.

 

I have found these to be the most helpful so far:

 

1. This thread includes links to pictures and a review.
   
2. This thread was set up in the roll call section as one roll call for all sail dates.
   

Also, don't forget Trip Advisor for information about guides.

[Peregrina651]

I found the Lonely Planet guide book for Ukraine at the bookstore. Are there any other current guidebooks for the country?

Edited December 14, 2011 by Peregrina651

[altiva]

Altiva - here are two "Classic" examples of what we are talking about - spelling vs. pronunciation:

 

1. - Девушка, кем это вы себя мните?

- Не ваше это дело, кем я себя мну!

 

2. - Сара, шо вы пишете "Два мужика надорвались на мине"?

Не "надорвались", а "подорвались"!

- Нет, таки надорвались! Не на мИне, а на минЕ!

:D:rolleyes:

 

And where is the classic example of what you did to Ukrainian people?

Since Russian brutally occupied Ukraine, and not a single Western

country protested about it, Ukrainian people were beaten, tortured and

killed for speaking their own language. If you spoke Ukrainian on the

streets, they were fired from their jobs, thrown into prison, shot on

the spot, starved to death, or drowned alive in the Black sea, with anchors weighting

them down, and now you come here and say "Ukrainian people PREFER

Russian"? If they preferred Russian, why did you need to kill, torture

and starve them? Surely if they "PREFERRED" Russian dialect, they

would have jumped at the chance to speak it? Why did you need to do it

to them, if your dialect is so wonderful? Why did you need to kill and

starve MILLIONS, so now you can say "they prefer"?

Ah, and about your gloomy Russian friends from Kiev. Obviously, they

were Russian occupants. We all know that when Russians occupied

Ukraine, they killed all Ukrainian speaking people - politicians,

writers, actors, prominent figures. They sent Russians from Siberia

and Ural to occupy their places, and these Russians walked into their

empty flats, with all the possessions intact, with a hot cup of coffee

still on the table, so Russians took the flat, drank the coffee, put

someone else's clothes on and went to work, previously occupied by

Ukrainians. And how many people they burned alive and killed in Baby

Yar! So, perhaps your RUSSIAN friend from KYIV has guilty conscience,

and, as much, can't even show us his teeth. His crimes weight him down.

[altiva]

We have booked the July 30, 2012 trip- from Odessa to Kiev. We are planning to remain in Kiev several days and will investigate some private tours to small towns in which our parents and grandparents were born and raised. Does anyone know a private guide that can help us with these arrangements?

We appreciate any help we can get--

We are arranging flights on American Airlines --JFK to Budapest - then Malev from Budapest to Odessa -- We are returning on Lufthanse through Frankfurt to JFK.

Sheila and Herb - Lake Worth Florida

 

hi Sheila and Herb,

maybe if you actually named the towns you want to visit, you'd get a better response. There are so many little towns and villages around Kyev.

[Peregrina651]

I'm still working on finding guidebooks to help plan all the free time that we have in Odesa, Sevastopol and Yalta. I'm thinking about hiring guides for half day tours in those cities but before I start looking for a guide, I'd like to have an idea of what I would like to see. (Yes, I know that I am answering my own questions, but there are so few of us following this thread at this point that I am not waiting for answers; I'm just plowing ahead and sharing what I find. It's one way to keep us at the top of the list ;-) )

 

Frommer, Fodor and D-K don't have guides for Ukraine. Insight Guides lumps Russia, Belarus and Ukraine into one guide and there are less than 50 pages covering both countries. I was able to check out the table of contents on Amazon and decided not to buy the book because there can't be anymore there than is in the Lonely Plant title that I already have. I also saw a couple of titles available on Kindle.

 

I did find one book on the customs and culture of Ukraine. It's quick read--but I won't know if it is helpful until we get back. It's called Culture Smart Ukraine and it's written by Anna Shevchenko.

 

National Geographic's Jewish Heritage Travel: A Guide to Eastern Europe has about 40 pages dedicated to Ukraine and includes a list of websites and a short bibliography.

 

Next step: finding helpful websites

[raychips]

We are doing Kiev to odessa in May 2012. Can you tell us about the ship "Lomonosov". It is hard to find any objective info. Thanks.

[Peregrina651]

Hey, Ray. Glad you have joined us. It is going to be slow here for a while until more people find us. I guess we are just going to have to be patient.

 

There is an old thread with some comments about the ship and a couple of links to reviews.

 

Look for Robert Bacon's blog on Facebook (wish I could remember where I copied it from but probably from the Discussions). Also, earlier on this thread, there is a link to a review by 'coasters.' They are the only two blog/review/journals that i have found so far for this trip.