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Two people, 3 airline seats?????


heatescapee
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However I have a problem with a FA giving items to Joe Cheaptix who is their neighbor or high school drinking buddy. That type of thing impacts costs and service levels and is flat out against their written SOP.

 

Aaaannnnnddddd here we have the crux of it. You're PO'd because someone is getting something they don't "deserve" because they didn't pay for it. Because you get to stand in judgment. And I guess you never, ever have taken anything from a friend....business referrals, the back way in that avoids the line, nothing, never. And I guess you know that the gifted passenger paid a cheapo fare instead of full fare coach, too. (And, yes, fare varies a LOT, even within the basic economy cabin.)

 

And I'll repeat what I said earlier - unused wine from open bottles gets DUMPED. Giving it to a friend has ZERO impact on costs. FAR more of an impact on costs are the people in first class loading up on free drinks because they're free. Or asking for a different wine because this one doesn't quite please the palate.

 

As for the plane/bar comparison....specious. People frequent bars far more frequently than they fly. And I guarantee you people get free drinks. It's there under 'server discretion'. Anyone who abuses the discretion would get disciplined.

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Another way of getting 3 seats for 2 for free, but NOT guaranteed is this simple trick.

 

Only buy 2 tickets, but when choosing your seat online, pick the window and the aisle. That will eliminate all but single travelers, and they will likely choose the middle seat LAST.

 

If someone does claim the middle seat, the person on the aisle can just slide over. Didn't gain anything, but you don't lose anything either. If no one takes the middle seat, you win. I find the middle seat only sucks when you are solo, when you are with a companion, there's nothing wrong with it.

 

I despise people that do that, when I go to check in for a flight the night before, and there isn't a single pair of seats next to each other for my husband and me - because everyone checked in on 3-seat rows leaving the middle seat empty.

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I despise people that do that, when I go to check in for a flight the night before, and there isn't a single pair of seats next to each other for my husband and me - because everyone checked in on 3-seat rows leaving the middle seat empty.

 

Wow, I don't think I've ever been on a flight where the entire plane did this..... I wasn't aware it was so common a practice.

 

You do realize if they sat aisle-middle or window-middle you still wouldn't have two seats together right? In fact, if you read her post she said that if someone needs the middle seat, they give up the aisle instead. No reason for the hate :)

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I despise people that do that, when I go to check in for a flight the night before, and there isn't a single pair of seats next to each other for my husband and me - because everyone checked in on 3-seat rows leaving the middle seat empty.

 

 

Even if they took aisle center there still wouldn't be two next to each other. Either check in earlier or pay for advance seat assignments. Problem solved.

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Or do all your flying on regional jets or turboprops, where all you have are two seats on each side (or with the old ERJs, 1-2). ;)

 

Or, look for those multi-aisle craft that have the 2-3-2 or 2-4-2 or 2-5-2 rows and snag those "2" seats… Plus, some of those MD-80/90/717 planes have the 2-3 setup. Yes, I frequently search for domestic flights by seating type if I'm doing a mainline flight. But, a good many of my destinations do involve the Barbie Jet.

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Even if they took aisle center there still wouldn't be two next to each other. Either check in earlier or pay for advance seat assignments. Problem solved.

You're automatically making an assumption that these are just 2-person parties - I've paid attention, and those could be parties of 4-5 or more, that try to take up at least 1 more row than they would get if they just took seats next to each other.

 

The worst ones are those with toddlers that don't want to pay for the kid's airfare, so they say "kid will be in my lap" but then they try to leave an empty middle seat to seat their kid for free.

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You're automatically making an assumption that these are just 2-person parties - I've paid attention, and those could be parties of 4-5 or more, that try to take up at least 1 more row than they would get if they just took seats next to each other.

 

Then don't respond that you "despise" people who do that in a party of two, as the poster was in your response.

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Then don't respond that you "despise" people who do that in a party of two, as the poster was in your response.

I'll respond any way I see fit, thank you. You're still no better if you do it in a party of two, they create just as bad of a chain reaction for others trying to check in after them (especially for large parties). At the very least, maybe I could've gotten 2 aisle seats that are in the same row if people would just check into 2 adjacent seats.

Edited by Illyria
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Aaaannnnnddddd here we have the crux of it. You're PO'd because someone is getting something they don't "deserve" because they didn't pay for it. Because you get to stand in judgment. And I guess you never, ever have taken anything from a friend....business referrals, the back way in that avoids the line, nothing, never. And I guess you know that the gifted passenger paid a cheapo fare instead of full fare coach, too. (And, yes, fare varies a LOT, even within the basic economy cabin.)

 

And I'll repeat what I said earlier - unused wine from open bottles gets DUMPED. Giving it to a friend has ZERO impact on costs. FAR more of an impact on costs are the people in first class loading up on free drinks because they're free. Or asking for a different wine because this one doesn't quite please the palate.

 

As for the plane/bar comparison....specious. People frequent bars far more frequently than they fly. And I guarantee you people get free drinks. It's there under 'server discretion'. Anyone who abuses the discretion would get disciplined.

 

You nailed it! This thread has evolved into a FA bashing that has nothing to do with the original seat question.

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You're automatically making an assumption that these are just 2-person parties - I've paid attention, and those could be parties of 4-5 or more, that try to take up at least 1 more row than they would get if they just took seats next to each other.

 

The worst ones are those with toddlers that don't want to pay for the kid's airfare, so they say "kid will be in my lap" but then they try to leave an empty middle seat to seat their kid for free.

 

 

Bottom line, if it is that important to you, check in earlier or pay to book your seats in advance. It seems that you want to claim but not be part of the solution.

 

BTW, we usually book a window and aisle leaving the middle seat free. We usually get upgraded, but when we don't, someone may end up in between us. We don't mind, but he prefers window and I prefer aisle, so no, we aren't moving for you.

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I'll respond any way I see fit, thank you. You're still no better if you do it in a party of two, they create just as bad of a chain reaction for others trying to check in after them (especially for large parties). At the very least, maybe I could've gotten 2 aisle seats that are in the same row if people would just check into 2 adjacent seats.

 

 

This makes no sense. If we book the window and aisle and a couple across from us books window and aisle, you can still have the middles in the same row.

 

Oh wait, you want aisles. Too bad, so do I. Check in earlier or pay for them. Or fly enough to earn status to get them without paying for them.

Edited by ducklite
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Aaaannnnnddddd here we have the crux of it. You're PO'd because someone is getting something they don't "deserve" because they didn't pay for it. Because you get to stand in judgment. And I guess you never, ever have taken anything from a friend....business referrals, the back way in that avoids the line, nothing, never. And I guess you know that the gifted passenger paid a cheapo fare instead of full fare coach, too. (And, yes, fare varies a LOT, even within the basic economy cabin.)

 

 

 

And I'll repeat what I said earlier - unused wine from open bottles gets DUMPED. Giving it to a friend has ZERO impact on costs. FAR more of an impact on costs are the people in first class loading up on free drinks because they're free. Or asking for a different wine because this one doesn't quite please the palate.

 

 

 

As for the plane/bar comparison....specious. People frequent bars far more frequently than they fly. And I guarantee you people get free drinks. It's there under 'server discretion'. Anyone who abuses the discretion would get disciplined.

 

 

You make a lot of assumptions. Half the time I get nothing to drink other than maybe a glass of water. I also seldom frequent bars, but I spend a lot of time in planes. (About 25 hours in the past 10 days)

 

Business referrals are not a valid comparison and the only time I get "back-doored in" is when it is on the pre-approved guest list.

 

The fare the passenger paid is irrelevant. SOP is clear, and the FA is risking being disciplined for their actions chomping alcohol from First to non-status friends in coach. They need to do their job which does not mean canoodling with their friends.

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Getting a little hot around here.

 

A few of thoughts. 1) People are going to book seats that are best for them. The rest of the world can take a flying leap. 2) With the nearly full loads, the window/aisle thing rarely works, and you could end up with the person who gets the middle not wanting to switch. 3) If an FA breaks the rules, there have a good likelihood of being reported by a knowledgeable frequent flyer.

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and you could end up with the person who gets the middle not wanting to switch.

 

Are you saying there are people who prefer a middle over an aisle seat.... who would rather be up close and personal with two strangers instead of one and have less room to move one side of their body?

 

And to the person who keeps saying unused wine in business/first gets dumped, there is never unused wine. The FA will find passengers in first who will take a refill... at least when I'm on board. ;)

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At the very least, maybe I could've gotten 2 aisle seats that are in the same row if people would just check into 2 adjacent seats.

 

And you just as likely could end up in a row where people already chose aisle/middle, and you and your spouse are stuck on opposite ends of the row with the 2 window seats. As others have said, if seat selection matters to you, and if you can't be apart for the duration of a few hours' flight time, do whatever you need to do to select seats in advance, rather than complain about the seats selection made by others.

 

That said, I will second what someone else said about those in the aisle/window club, hoping to have an empty middle seat between them. That rarely works these days, with flights operating at near capacity. If it's worked for you in the past, good for you, you got lucky, but I wouldn't expect it to work on a regular basis.

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Are you saying there are people who prefer a middle over an aisle seat.... who would rather be up close and personal with two strangers instead of one and have less room to move one side of their body?
They may not prefer the middle, but they do like saying "no" just because it's something someone else wants.
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My DH and I always do the aisle/window reservation. If the middle seat fills, we politely offer that person their choice of staying in the middle or taking the aisle or window. Not surprisingly, no one has ever stayed in the middle. DH prefers the aisle, I prefer the window so when it works, great, when it doesn't oh well.

 

I have often been offered a free upgrade when traveling by myself for offering to be voluntarily denied boarding. Several years ago we ended up with over 10 free tickets over three trips. Being polite and cooperative has gotten me free drinks, free snacks, and if nothing else a genuine smile and a sincere thank you.

 

As far as buying two seats if you need or want two seats, go for it. No guilt if others are not happy. Would you feel guilty if you bought first class and others didn't?

 

And as far as kids on airplanes.... Don't get me started on the parents who come unprepared without snacks, books, distractions and who ignore their crying kicking kids. Love to have well behaved kids, fun, happy kids on board with me. I feel for them when they cannot equalize the pressure and cry on the way down. What is 15 minutes of someone else's crying child to me? Nothing! Rather that than loud drunks, especially the drunk loud praying church ladies on a recent flight!

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And to the person who keeps saying unused wine in business/first gets dumped, there is never unused wine. The FA will find passengers in first who will take a refill... at least when I'm on board. ;)

 

"Keeps saying".....merely pointed it out (and repeated once only, btw, because clearly no one read it (at least, until now)) to explain that a glass of wine offered to someone in coach is exceedingly unlikely to be adding to costs, and is, as such, a dubious rationale to be offered.

 

And - as I KEEP saying :rolleyes: - I have also been in first, plenty of times, and have been specifically offered more wine 'before it's dumped'. And usually say 'no'. Besides which....just goes to prove my point. Even if a glass is taken back to coach, it just means one less FC person that will be coerced into having another glass s/he wasn't planning on.

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You make a lot of assumptions. Half the time I get nothing to drink other than maybe a glass of water. I also seldom frequent bars, but I spend a lot of time in planes. (About 25 hours in the past 10 days)

 

US enplanements are about 800 million per year (you can find this on line). Population of the US is about 319 million (ditto). That's about 2.5 plane flights per person per year. Even if I knock out 1/2 the population as too young or too old to be expected to fly, that's still 5 flights a year. Yes, certainly some people are above average. Just as we all know an overweight, heavy smoker still going strong at 80.

Now, for the bar (restaurants serving liquor count here, too, as comping definitely goes on there). The average US person eats out 5 times a week. Granted, a lot of those are 'fast food'. Let's say 90%, leaving 1/2 a restaurant visit each week. Knocking out that same 1/2 the population as too young or too old, I'm up to once a week, or about 50 times per year. I'm not even counting bars that don't serve food, just restaurants. Think it should be less? You'd have to cut it another order of magnitude just to be equivalent.

Yep - some people don't drink when they go to bars or restaurants. Some don't on planes, either.

 

Business referrals are not a valid comparison and the only time I get "back-doored in" is when it is on the pre-approved guest list.

OF COURSE they are. Not only that, they're more than relevant. Whereas someone getting a free drink doesn't take anything away from you, someone getting customers steered to them takes business away from other companies or providers. And how about a friend saving your seat at an open-seating performance, lecture, or even airplane flight? Takes a better seat away from someone there earlier because you had a friend who enabled you to get that better seat even though you arrived later. If you're going to complain about friends doing things for friends, you can't just restrict it to the things you don't like or you haven't benefited from.

 

The fare the passenger paid is irrelevant. SOP is clear, and the FA is risking being disciplined for their actions chomping alcohol from First to non-status friends in coach. They need to do their job which does not mean canoodling with their friends.

I was reacting to the 'Cheapo fare' comment, and I do believe you know that. There's unhappiness about people getting things they didn't pay for, even though, given the airfare rigmarole, it's entirely possible that a person sitting in coach has paid more for his/her fare than someone sitting in first class who got upgraded...or even someone who pays the at-gate fee to buy a last-minute upgrade.

Edited by azevedan
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US enplanements are about 800 million per year (you can find this on line). Population of the US is about 319 million (ditto). That's about 2.5 plane flights per person per year. Even if I knock out 1/2 the population as too young or too old to be expected to fly, that's still 5 flights a year. Yes, certainly some people are above average. Just as we all know an overweight, heavy smoker still going strong at 80.

Now, for the bar (restaurants serving liquor count here, too, as comping definitely goes on there). The average US person eats out 5 times a week. Granted, a lot of those are 'fast food'. Let's say 90%, leaving 1/2 a restaurant visit each week. Knocking out that same 1/2 the population as too young or too old, I'm up to once a week, or about 50 times per year. I'm not even counting bars that don't serve food, just restaurants. Think it should be less? You'd have to cut it another order of magnitude just to be equivalent.

Yep - some people don't drink when they go to bars or restaurants. Some don't on planes, either.

 

You missed the point. The majority of people in first aren't knocking back drink after drink. Figure that over half of them are on business and about half the time are on am flights where they will be going to meetings as soon as they land... I have seen more tanked idiots in economy who poured themselves onto the plane and then proceeded to continue to drink until they landed because they were "on vacation."

 

 

OF COURSE they are. Not only that, they're more than relevant. Whereas someone getting a free drink doesn't take anything away from you, someone getting customers steered to them takes business away from other companies or providers. And how about a friend saving your seat at an open-seating performance, lecture, or even airplane flight? Takes a better seat away from someone there earlier because you had a friend who enabled you to get that better seat even though you arrived later. If you're going to complain about friends doing things for friends, you can't just restrict it to the things you don't like or you haven't benefited from.

 

It is rare that anyone actually gets a deal due to a friendship. They get a foot in the door, an introduction, but businesses are savvy, have procurement processes, and you are dreaming if you think that they buy from someone just because it's a drinking buddy if there is an equal or better product at a lower price point. Major corps and government have very tight procurement policies that prevent sole source purchases without considerable due diligence to determine there is no other choice.

 

I can't say I have had anyone save me a seat or that I have saved one for anyone.

 

I was reacting to the 'Cheapo fare' comment, and I do believe you know that. There's unhappiness about people getting things they didn't pay for, even though, given the airfare rigmarole, it's entirely possible that a person sitting in coach has paid more for his/her fare than someone sitting in first class who got upgraded...or even someone who pays the at-gate fee to buy a last-minute upgrade.

 

 

I guess it depends on how you look at it. I often have a lower fare and first class upgrade due to status. But in the long run I have paid a lot more due to my loyalty and spending habits since 1989. I can pretty well guarantee my million plus miles cost a lot more than a few full price economy seats each year. Airlines don't care about the consumers who will go elsewhere to save $2, even if they are in a full price seat in that flight. And the cost of a ticket has no bearing on the benefits that come with it, the class of cabin should be respected, the only exception would be if the passenger is a top tier FF and due to an or ops is in a lower cabin. On a few carriers top tiers are also entitled to full upper class amenities.

Edited by ducklite
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They may not prefer the middle, but they do like saying "no" just because it's something someone else wants.

 

 

That's absurd. I don't care what someone's preferences are. I book the seat I want and it is not my problem if someone else gets their shorts in a knot because of their poor planning.

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They may not prefer the middle, but they do like saying "no" just because it's something someone else wants.

 

Sure, if they're 12. Adults however generally don't want to cut their nose off to spite their face by spending 4 hours in a much less comfortable position just to say "so there".

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"Keeps saying".....merely pointed it out (and repeated once only, btw, because clearly no one read it (at least, until now)) to explain that a glass of wine offered to someone in coach is exceedingly unlikely to be adding to costs, and is, as such, a dubious rationale to be offered.

 

And - as I KEEP saying :rolleyes: - I have also been in first, plenty of times, and have been specifically offered more wine 'before it's dumped'. And usually say 'no'. Besides which....just goes to prove my point. Even if a glass is taken back to coach, it just means one less FC person that will be coerced into having another glass s/he wasn't planning on.

 

Sounds like you need more wine. Maybe you should start saying "yes" :D

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You missed the point. The majority of people in first aren't knocking back drink after drink.

 

No, I didn't. I'm still making the point that the original defense that "giving a drink to someone in coach raises prices for everyone and so that's why I'm against it" is ridiculous. The majority of people in FC don't have to knock back multiple drinks...it just has to be more common than people in coach getting freebies for my point to be valid.

 

As for the rest of your latest reply, never, ever had someone save you a seat or saved one for someone else? :rolleyes: If so....that really does make you a rare person. Besides which, there are any number of other situations I could bring up. ;) And we are going to have to disagree on the business referrals. Getting in the door is 90% of the task.

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