Things you wish someone told you before your first Baltic cruise

[SoBaycruiser]

At least here in Finland you will now be out of luck without the chip card.

 

All the ATMs got upgraded over a year ago, and I see the last remaining chains of stores have recently upgraded theirs as well. The shops are still allowed to use the backup method of showing your ID and the credit card, but are not obliged to do so.

 

On which Finnish ATMs accept which international cards, please see:

http://www.otto.fi/in-english/

 

Also:

https://www.korttiturvallisuus.fi/en/In-a-shop/Paying-with-a-chip-card/

 

So from your first link it looks like those of us with magnetic strip credit cards can still use them at the OTTO ATMs as long as we use the yellow/orange slot for card input...is that correct? So not totally out of luck.

Edited May 9, 2013 by SoBaycruiser

[Subarctic]

So from your first link it looks like those of us with magnetic strip credit cards can still use them at the OTTO ATMs as long as we use the yellow/orange slot for card input...is that correct? So not totally out of luck.

 

I really would not recommend people to trust their magnetic cards will work. As most if not all magnetic stripe cards issues by the Finnish banks have now been replaced with a chip card, the only clientele remaining will be the people outside the EUs new common payments and transfer system SEPA.

For instance the Finnish Railways automatic ticket vending will not accept magnetic stripes any longer.

 

Translation by yours truly from the officialdom:

 

http://www.finanssivalvonta.fi/fi/Finanssiasiakas/Finanssialan_palveluita/Maksupalvelut/Maksuvalineet/Maksukortit/Pages/Default.aspx

 

"From magnetic stripe cards to chip cards.

 

Along with SEPA, the banks have replaced the magnetic stripe cards with the new chip cards. They have a chip enhancing their security. Copying of chip cards is considered more difficult than with the magnetic stripe cards. With chip cards the payment is verified by keying in the PIN. With chip cards there will be a magnetic stripe used for some time longer, as in many extra-SEPA countries paying with chip cards is not yet possible.

 

The customer is able to withdraw money and make payments throughout the common SEPA area. The shops and service providers have changed their equipment to chip terminals. The vendors are free to decide on their own which cards they will accept as the means of payment."

[hugsthecat]

Thanks for all your comments to date.. There are a number of us who will be on the new Royal Princess next year. Gil found this site..so expect comments from a lot of new people..

Michael

[SoBaycruiser]

While I appreciate the "official" word on the chip and pin cards, I don't think the magnetic strip cards will be refused in most tourist locations where there is a person to accept it.

 

Merchants would be very short sighted to not accept magnetic strip cards since 98% of Americans ( that's my number) have never heard of a chip and pin card. Thousands of American tourists will be getting off their ships for the day and have nothing but magnetic strip cards. It will be the merchants loss if they don't accept the card. They will lose money since souvenirs don't HAVE to be purchased.

 

I have been aware of the chip and pin cards for a number of years and have not been able to get one in the US. This year I have found a number of places that will provide a chip and sign card (e.g. AAA) and only very recently have I discovered a few chip and pin cards available. If it's been that hard for me to get one, I rather doubt the average cruiser will have one.

 

So if Helsinki doesn't want my money ( via credit card), then I'm okay with that. I'm sure another port/ country will be happy to take my magnet strip credit card.

 

(Sorry if I sound annoyed...I am at the US credit card companies for not switching to chip and pin ...and I'll BE annoyed if a merchant refuses my card)

[jade ring]

Do you remember the name of the street for the sweaters?

[Subarctic]

While I appreciate the "official" word on the chip and pin cards, I don't think the magnetic strip cards will be refused in most tourist locations where there is a person to accept it.

 

Merchants would be very short sighted to not accept magnetic strip cards since 98% of Americans ( that's my number) have never heard of a chip and pin card. Thousands of American tourists will be getting off their ships for the day and have nothing but magnetic strip cards. It will be the merchants loss if they don't accept the card. They will lose money since souvenirs don't HAVE to be purchased.

 

I have been aware of the chip and pin cards for a number of years and have not been able to get one in the US. This year I have found a number of places that will provide a chip and sign card (e.g. AAA) and only very recently have I discovered a few chip and pin cards available. If it's been that hard for me to get one, I rather doubt the average cruiser will have one.

 

So if Helsinki doesn't want my money ( via credit card), then I'm okay with that. I'm sure another port/ country will be happy to take my magnet strip credit card.

 

(Sorry if I sound annoyed...I am at the US credit card companies for not switching to chip and pin ...and I'll BE annoyed if a merchant refuses my card)

 

That's ok. However, the same SEPA arrangement will be effective in all the EU countries as well as Norway, being an EEA country. Our hands are tied. In the past with the national system, for instance, the automatic payments like your paycheck would be on your account at 00:00 the day they were supposed to. With the new pan-European system they will pop up sometime in the morning.

 

I wanted to warn people not to rely solely on the magnetic stripe cards. I learned this the hard way by having forgotten the PIN of my credit card lately. I thought there woud be no problem, as I had succesfully used the backup method of IDs and signature in the past. Turned out the central offices of many shops had disallowed the use of the backup method lately. I got me a new combo debit/credit card and was eventually fine. All credit card management in the country has now been sold to a Danish firm as well.

 

The touristy and/or high street shops _may_ be willing to make an exception, but they are not required to.

 

If I may quote from a U.S. source:

 

If you're traveling overseas this summer [2012], you may want to shop for more than a swimsuit and walking shoes before you go. As EMV smart cards continue to proliferate outside the U.S., it's becoming increasingly difficult to use traditional magnetic stripe credit cards in certain travel situations. But a handful of new U.S. credit cards could help American travelers.

 

Read more: http://www.creditcards.com/credit-card-news/american-travelers-guide-emv-chip-cards-1271.php#ixzz2SquaPsq4

Compare credit cards here - CreditCards.com

Edited May 10, 2013 by Subarctic

[Subarctic]

Adding: perhaps the US consumers should voice their concern at their banks? The EMV system is not really going to go away.

Edited May 10, 2013 by Subarctic

[Quilting_Cruiser]

That's ok. However, the same SEPA arrangement will be effective in all the EU countries as well as Norway, being an EEA country. Our hands are tied. In the past with the national system, for instance, the automatic payments like your paycheck would be on your account at 00:00 the day they were supposed to. With the new pan-European system they will pop up sometime in the morning.

 

I wanted to warn people not to rely solely on the magnetic stripe cards. I learned this the hard way by having forgotten the PIN of my credit card lately. I thought there woud be no problem, as I had succesfully used the backup method of IDs and signature in the past. Turned out the central offices of many shops had disallowed the use of the backup method lately. I got me a new combo debit/credit card and was eventually fine. All credit card management in the country has now been sold to a Danish firm as well.

 

The touristy and/or high street shops _may_ be willing to make an exception, but they are not required to.

 

If I may quote from a U.S. source:

 

If you're traveling overseas this summer [2012], you may want to shop for more than a swimsuit and walking shoes before you go. As EMV smart cards continue to proliferate outside the U.S., it's becoming increasingly difficult to use traditional magnetic stripe credit cards in certain travel situations. But a handful of new U.S. credit cards could help American travelers.

 

Read more: http://www.creditcards.com/credit-card-news/american-travelers-guide-emv-chip-cards-1271.php#ixzz2SquaPsq4

Compare credit cards here - CreditCards.com

 

 

Thank you for the warnings. Not sure what we can do about it, but it's good to know the potential for issues. When I was in Ireland and Amsterdam last year, I was able to use my debit card in ATM machines but I had to go to the ticket window in Amsterdam to purchase train tickets as the machines wouldn't accept my card. I wasn't aware it had become even more difficult. I did get a PIN for my credit card, but my bank doesn't issue pin and chip cards. Looks like I have some more research to do!

[Quilting_Cruiser]

I just found this information that may be helpful. It's not hard and fast, but gives me some hope! It's also my experience from last year. This information was in response to a question about using credit cards in France. FWIW.

 

 

• Takes magnetic strip + signature: Any place that takes credit card and has a live person collecting payment (e.g. cashier, waiter, etc). This means just about all stores, restaurants, manned gasoline stations and manned ticket booths will accept mag+signature, as well as chip+pin.
  
• Does not take mag strip+signature: most gasoline stations after hours, bicycle rental kiosks, metro ticket kiosks and train ticket kiosks. Essentially any self-service payment place. Many of these do not take cash either.
  

[Tennant]

What about ATMs in the rest of the baltic area? We are planning to use ATMs in Stockholm, Copenhagen, Tallinn, etc with a traditional American debt card. Hope it will work! Anyone have actual experience to report?

[Subarctic]

What about ATMs in the rest of the baltic area? We are planning to use ATMs in Stockholm, Copenhagen, Tallinn, etc with a traditional American debt card. Hope it will work! Anyone have actual experience to report?

 

They will basically be under the same EU regulations:

 

see e.g.

 

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g189852-i233-k5775519-Use_of_foreign_credit_cards_in_sweden-Stockholm.html

 

and http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/do-atms-charge.cfm

 

The general rule is, again, NOT to rely solely on the old traditional magnetic card.

[Mediana]

I just found this information that may be helpful. It's not hard and fast, but gives me some hope! It's also my experience from last year. This information was in response to a question about using credit cards in France. FWIW.

 

 

• Takes magnetic strip + signature: Any place that takes credit card and has a live person collecting payment (e.g. cashier, waiter, etc). This means just about all stores, restaurants, manned gasoline stations and manned ticket booths will accept mag+signature, as well as chip+pin.
  
• Does not take mag strip+signature: most gasoline stations after hours, bicycle rental kiosks, metro ticket kiosks and train ticket kiosks. Essentially any self-service payment place. Many of these do not take cash either.
  

 

If you don't have a pin code make sure to bring valid identification. I can't press this enough. Here in Sweden the bank requires proof of identification for any amount above SEK200 if you don't have a pin code. (A copy of your passport will not be enough).

 

What about ATMs in the rest of the baltic area? We are planning to use ATMs in Stockholm, Copenhagen, Tallinn, etc with a traditional American debt card. Hope it will work! Anyone have actual experience to report?

 

It's the same as in Finland. Just to make sure I called and ask my bank today. They said that there might be one or two ATM:s out there that still takes magnet strip but he couldn't say where they were. The goal is to exchange them all. If you don't have a card with chip I would suggest you bring cash for small things and card the rest. My experience is that Magnet strip + pin will work, Magnet strip + signature showing passport will work.

[Subarctic]

If you don't have a pin code make sure to bring valid identification. I can't press this enough. Here in Sweden the bank requires proof of identification for any amount above SEK200 if you don't have a pin code. (A copy of your passport will not be enough).

 

 

 

It's the same as in Finland. Just to make sure I called and ask my bank today. They said that there might be one or two ATM:s out there that still takes magnet strip but he couldn't say where they were. The goal is to exchange them all. If you don't have a card with chip I would suggest you bring cash for small things and card the rest. My experience is that Magnet strip + pin will work, Magnet strip + signature showing passport will work.

 

I should think that also in Sweden the merchant will be responsible for any losses if thay accept payment using the old method, therefore they may be reluctant, and also be instructed against it by their head offices.

 

The Finnish ATMs are actually unique in that they have two slots, one for the EVMs, one for the old ones. This was done in order to prevent some of the skimming activities (copying of the stripe by an attached device) as for the chip slot the card will not be going in all the way. Therefore they _may_ be useable for the old cards for a while.

 

Another thing is that the banks may have instated a continental block on the use of an European card in the U.S. and vv. as it's typical for fraudsters to transfer card info across the world. This can be done on request but I don't know if this is the default anywhere.

[Quilting_Cruiser]

If you don't have a pin code make sure to bring valid identification. I can't press this enough. Here in Sweden the bank requires proof of identification for any amount above SEK200 if you don't have a pin code. (A copy of your passport will not be enough).

 

 

 

 

I do have a PIN for my debt and credit cards and will, of course, have my passport with me. I've traveled to Europe twice in the past year and haven't had any trouble finding ATMs that will accept my magnetic strip card, so hoping the countries we're traveling to haven't completely converted since we've been there! I did get some pocket money in the currencies of the countries we'll be visiting--12 countries, 5 different currencies, so I'll be able to pay for any small items without visiting an ATM or using one of my cards.

[lost in translation]

We just got back from the baltics and didn't have any problems using American credit cards. If they ask for a PIN just use the one you have for cash advances. However, not sure either of us used a credit card in Helsinki.

[Quilting_Cruiser]

We just got back from the baltics and didn't have any problems using American credit cards. If they ask for a PIN just use the one you have for cash advances. However, not sure either of us used a credit card in Helsinki.

 

 

Wonderful! Thanks for the information!

 

How was the trip??? :D

[Alaskanb]

We just got back from the baltics and didn't have any problems using American credit cards. If they ask for a PIN just use the one you have for cash advances. However, not sure either of us used a credit card in Helsinki.

How did this show up on your account and what type of charges did you accrue? Did it show as a cash advance?

[lost in translation]

How did this show up on your account and what type of charges did you accrue? Did it show as a cash advance?

They just showed up as regular charges not cash advances.

[Mediana]

We just got back from the baltics and didn't have any problems using American credit cards. If they ask for a PIN just use the one you have for cash advances. However, not sure either of us used a credit card in Helsinki.

 

Did you try the ATM machines?

[lost in translation]

Did you try the ATM machines?

The only place we used an ATM was in Tallinn. Didn't have any problems there.

[Lucky Dave]

This was probably covered above but just in case: I use a certain card for travel due to no charges for international purchases. Just got the new one with a chip, so this will be 1st time using it. Never used for cash advance/ATM, so I called my bank about a PIN. They strongly (STRONGLY) discouraged giving the vendor a PIN. Bank told me it would show up on my statement as a cash advance. They said to tell the vendor to just hit "enter" on the register and sign instead.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Lucky Dave

[SoBaycruiser]

Just a reminder to those getting new cards with a chip, be sure to shield them in some way with either small covers or putting them in a wallet/purse/backpack with shielding to prevent theft by proximity. We bought the little card covers through amazon dot com. I wonder though if putting a small piece of aluminum foil in your wallet would block thieves just as well.

[BoomerM4]

Just a reminder to those getting new cards with a chip, be sure to shield them in some way with either small covers or putting them in a wallet/purse/backpack with shielding to prevent theft by proximity. We bought the little card covers through amazon dot com. I wonder though if putting a small piece of aluminum foil in your wallet would block thieves just as well.

 

The new 'chipped' cards are not RFID - therefore, they can not be read by a remote reader. No need to protect this card any more than you would protect a normal credit/debit card.

 

peter

[SoBaycruiser]

The new 'chipped' cards are not RFID - therefore, they can not be read by a remote reader. No need to protect this card any more than you would protect a normal credit/debit card.

 

peter

 

Ok, so I guess I'm confused. Do all RFID cards have a chip but all chip cards aren't RFID?

[Quilting_Cruiser]

Ok, so I guess I'm confused. Do all RFID cards have a chip but all chip cards aren't RFID?

 

 

That's confusing to me, too. I watched a travel show last weekend in which they talked about protecting the chip cards and did a demo of how easy it is to get the card information if you have the right technology...