Why not redefine "formal"?

[annebill]

Have you ever wondered how people of past centuries could stand to wear the fashionable clothes of those times--the stiff high collars, the yards of embroidery, the ridiculous hats, the waist piching corsets, etc.? I predict that sometime in the near future people will look back at us and wonder why we put up with our "fashionable" attire--particularly the coats and "chokers" for men and the shoes for women. Who decreed that men should have to wear coats and ties to be fashionable or formal, anyway? Have you ever attended an outdoor wedding in a tux when the temperature was about 95 and the humidity 98% ? It ain't fun, folks.

 

I think we should just say "enough" to the fashion setters and declare our own dressy and formal fashions. My suggestion would be to copy our Mexican friends and start wearing a Guayabera (sp?) type shirt--you know, those open collar and untucked type shirts. They can have all kinds of fancy embroidery down the front, different colors, etc. The Mexicans wear them for all formal and dressy occasions and they not only look nice, but are much cooler and more comfortable than coats and ties.

[sail7seas]

My preference is for traditional dress.

 

Why is it asbsolutely mandatory that we always have to be extremely comfortable in our clothes? IMO sometimes it is worth expending a little energy/effort to make something special from the everyday ordinary. JMHO....but I feel the specialness of seeing my husband in his tuxedo is very worth some slight amount of lack of sweatpant comfort.

 

<img src=http://domania.us/DaveEdwards/HALlogo.gif>

 

 

 

 

[LAFFNVEGAS]

I totally agree with sail7seas, I love seeing my husband in a tux and guess what, he loves to dress up in a tux. The weeks before we go he runs around town looking for a new cumberbun or vest to change the look or maybe get new cufflinks. It started out on our first cruise as a joke that he would wear anything for lobster night but it has gone way past that we feel that it is part of what cruising is. Kind of a celebration of what cruising was and still should be. Cruising is more than a vacation, there is a special feeling when you are on a cruise and being at sea. I feel it is my obligation to continue to dress up on formal night, to keep the True Cruising Tradition Alive. There is nothing like that special feeling of walking among the other passengers that are all dressed up and feeling really good about yourself. You can almost feel what it must of been like for those passengers on ships like the Titanic.

I for one want to continue that wonderful tradition. I am not trying to be something I am not but for 2 nights my husband and I feel really special and we feel really special about each other.

 

Lisa L

 

Monarch of the Seas-March 2002 West. Carib.

MS Zuiderdam-April 2003 East.Carib.

Monarch of the Seas-December 2003 Baja Mexico

MS Oosterdam-May 2004 Alaska

 

Till we set sail on the MS Ryndam-Sea of Cortez-November 2004

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Till We set sail on the MS Westerdam-Western Caribbean March 2005

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[Randyk47]

Personally I have no problem with the present definition of "formal". I like it, my wife likes it and we'll continue to adher to the dress code. Our next cruise has 3 formal nights and we're looking forward to those. For us they're part of the cruise experience that we enjoy.

 

Until Galaxy

 

 

[annebill]

Would you be broadminded enough to accept "alternative formal" in the dining room ?

[LAFFNVEGAS]

IMHO that would be Norwegian or Princess Cruise Lines.

 

Lisa L

 

Monarch of the Seas-March 2002 West. Carib.

MS Zuiderdam-April 2003 East.Carib.

Monarch of the Seas-December 2003 Baja Mexico

MS Oosterdam-May 2004 Alaska

 

Till we set sail on the MS Ryndam-Sea of Cortez-November 2004

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Till We set sail on the MS Westerdam-Western Caribbean March 2005

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[ron46936]

Princess does not have an exception to formal dress in the PC dining room. Only NCL is sensible enough to designate one dining room as formal and others as casual. That way you have the choice of dining with people who are formally attired if that is your preference. Those who come to the formal room in casual clothes are told they might be more comfortable in another dining room.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Sorry ron46936 I was under the impression from my TA that you can choose on Princess what style of dining you preferred and they had several different alternative dining options.

 

Lisa L

 

Monarch of the Seas-March 2002 West. Carib.

MS Zuiderdam-April 2003 East.Carib.

Monarch of the Seas-December 2003 Baja Mexico

MS Oosterdam-May 2004 Alaska

 

Till we set sail on the MS Ryndam-Sea of Cortez-November 2004

<center>

 

Till We set sail on the MS Westerdam-Western Caribbean March 2005

<center>

 

href="http://www.escati.com/counter98/free_time_codes.htm">

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[Krazy Kruizers]

Formal

 

It doesn't bother us at all to be dressed up. We love it and don't mind be dressed up FOR THE ENTIRE EVENING. We also had to do it when we were working. There were special occasions while working that required husband to wear a tuxedo and I, of course, had to be dressed up.

 

Husband has several bow ties and cummerbuns. Now that the ruffled shirts are coming back in style, he even bought a new black and white one last Christmas.

 

If you don't want to dress up - go to another cruise line like NCL.

 

[Randyk47]

"Alternative formal" is just a new definition of formal and I don't see a need to change the definition. Has nothing to do with being or not being broadminded. I'm not old or set in my ways or conservative or any other label you wish to pick....well....might be willing to say we're traditional.

 

Until Galaxy

[ASM]

What's so uncomfortable about formal clothes?

[sail7seas]

ASM...for the gents, it seems to me a tuxedo is a suit with a satin stripe down the trouser leg and satin lapels. Maybe some men do not like wearing a cumerbund if their abs are not quite as flat as they might like So, there is always the choice of a vest. I cannot see how a guy is all that uncomfortable wearing a suit.

 

For the ladies, maybe the high heels and strappy sandals pinch the feet a bit after wearing flat shoes/sneakers/low heeled sandals most of the time. And, to put it "delicately", some ladies find it prefereable to wear special undergarments with their closer fitting dresses. Maybe they are not hugely comfortable but such is the price of beauty No one says it is necessary to be pinched and tugged and pulled into agony.

 

As has been written on this board a million (or more) times.....they can wear a pair of silk/satin evening pants and a beaded or jeweled or dressy top of some sort, put on a dressy shoe and maybe a pretty earring and they'd be dressed appropriately.

 

<img src=http://domania.us/DaveEdwards/HALlogo.gif>

 

 

 

 

[Randyk47]

There shouldn't be anything uncomfortable about formal wear. Having been in the clothing business I know from experience that men, for instance, seem determined to buy the wrong size shirts...particularly the collar and then complain it's too tight.

 

Until Galaxy

 

 

[ASM]

I agree the heels are literally a pain! DH has never found formal wear a problem and he's a very outdoorsy kind of guy. I guess I just don't understand why people have issues with different clothes for different occasions. Oh well, to each his own.

[annebill]

As s7s points out, women have a much, much wider range and choices for "formal" than do men. Is this not so ? All I was suggesting was to let us have a choice of what is to be considered "formal". Would you ladies like to be limited to long evening gowns only, or do you enjoy being able to chose between that, short formals, pants, etc.? What would you think if a Mexican gentleman wore his "formal" wedding shirt--the type I described--in the dining room in your presence. What would you think if a man were offended by your wearing pants instead of a long formal gown, even if you wore a jeweled top and all that stuff ?

[WindyCity]

My husband liked dressing up for formal nights so much that he went out yesterday and purchased a tuxedo. It makes for such a special evening and it is comfortable - unless you get it too small as a previous poster had mentioned.

 

I also like to wear an evening gown - low heels, as long as they are dressy enough or sandals work well - so no need to suffer with high heels.

 

As I stated earlier - dressing up for the entire evening in formal wear makes the night special... something that rarely happens in our hectic day to day life and we look forward to formal nights.

 

Westerdam Eastern Caribbean 12/12/04

 

[gliles]

I agree with s7s, I love to see my husband in a tux, he looks so good. I find comfortable ways to dress formal myself and although not as comfortable as a pair of jeans, it's fun to dress sometimes since we don't have much occasion to otherwise. We also have to look good for the formal pictures we send to his mother after the cruise.

 

Oosterdam

Husbands are like pancakes, you have to throw the first one out.

[GAndie]

My formal attire consists of very formal pantsuits or palazzos. I'm comfortable, not bad to look at and fit right in!

 

The important thing is to get clothes that fit and not to try to squeeze a size 14 into a size 6...won't work, won't feel good!

[ocngypz]

My evening wear is just as comfortable as the clothes.. including shoes.. I wear everyday.

Only the fabric and length of skirt changes.

[ron46936]

I asked the question on the Princess board regarding formal nights. The reply I got (which is consistent with their brochure) is that Princess is basically the same as HAL for dress. That is you go to the buffet if you wish not to dress formally. There were several people that did go to the Lido on our Noordam cruise because they did not wish to dress formally.

[annebill]

Some are missing my point---it was not whether or not to go formal, but could there be more options for "formal" for men, as there are for ladies. Somewhere along the line it was decided that women didn't have to be in long gowns to be considered formal.Why not some similar options for men---and I don't mean suit vs tux, I mean the option to not wear coats and ties. BTW, I carry my tux on every cruise and always follow the rules. This is just for discussion.

[superstein61]

All righty - here we go again

 

Love the idea Annebill. Neckties are the scourge of the fashion industry and should be abolished. Not only are they uncomfortable, they serve no practical purpose and they can cost a lot

 

I am forgoing my necktie this summer on HAL !!!

 

And my jacket is probably going overboard as well Where can I find one of those Mexican Guayaberas?

[superstein61]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sail7seas:

Why is it asbsolutely mandatory that we always have to be extremely comfortable in our clothes? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

Spoken from someone who doesn't have to wear a nectie and coat in 90 degree weather.

 

And why should we be comfortable - c'mon, you've got to be kidding me. Do you harken back to the days of tight laced up corsets and huge hoop skirts for women?

[Roadguy]

Question: When was it 90 degrees in the dining room?...

 

While We are at it , are there any other words We should redefine?.........

 

It's only money!!

 

Zaandam 12/01

Zeiderdam 12/02

Volendam 12/02

Rotterdam 11/03

Maasdam 04/04

Oosterdam 12/04

Veendam 11/05

[annebill]

You are a man after my own heart, Superstein61. Do you think we two could start a trend ? Off hand, I don't know just where to find one but have seen them in various catalogs. I have also seen them in a Steinmart.The other thread seemed to be getting some terribly upset, so thought I'd try something in a lighter vein.