Princess screwed our Med Cruise

[born2cruize]

Remember the old adage - Misery Loves Company.

 

In July I WAS on Norwegian Dream for our "dream" Alaska cruise. I knew enough of what was going on that I still wanted to go. The cruise was OK (I love cliches) "nothing to write home about". Until we got to Seward, our tour was cancelled because of weather. Then ALL the misery folks vented all there frustration. And it even brought my wife and I down. That was until I exposed there half-truths about the problems.

 

We ARE getting only one side of the issue (We are getting the truth from some passengers point-of-view). Please define soon enough! People are creatures of habit. Even employees of Princess. When you put people outside of there comfort zone chaos can occur. These employees know they are representing Princess, do you want truth, half-truths or lies.

 

Could Princess folks have handle it better. YES. Could the passengers have handled it better. That up to them to decide (I wish if I had been there that I could have handled it better).

 

Show of hands how many people want to be told a truth at 11:00 when a better truth (based on new information) could be given at 12:00 or the next morning.

 

Maybe (as Jack Nicholson said, YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH).

[greatam]

Obviously this is not the Princess standard – otherwise they wouldn’t still be in business when other cruise lines supposedly offer better quality and service. So one has to ask, why – if what has been related is based in fact – would Princess let this type of situation happen? Is Princess totally oblivious?

I don’t think so – otherwise none of us would continue to sail the line. I doubt that I would ever run into these kinds of conditions on a Princess ship, but if I did, I would have done this:

Regarding the curtains – talk to steward. No results? Talk (do not write) to head of housekeeping or Hotel Manager, including bringing them into the room and get documentation of the situation. Don’t pin a note to the pillow that the steward might not be able to understand. No results? Talk to the Passenger Services Director and get documentation of the situation. No results? Send all that documentation and pictures to Princess. We had an issue with a creaky wall in our cabin on Island Princess – we were told that the ship moves and we should expect some noise, but they sent technicians up to our room anyway and fixed the problem within six hours of reporting it – including the replacement of ceiling panels. I can’t understand how a dirty sheer would be overlooked…

Dinner – if you were in traditional, you should be thankful they let you in 45 minutes late. Given that the full dining room needed to be fed, its not surprising that they didn’t have time to deliver a message that you’d be late to your tablemates.

You should have sailed Regal Princess – she’s “old” according to some, but she’s in perfect shape.

 

The main point of my posts is as you stated in the first part of yours. I was truly amazed that Princess would just obviously ignore repeat requests. Bad communications, language barriers, whatever, I never saw anyone in authority do anything about the three things that really were out of bounds-the curtains, the carpet, and not letting the solo couple know that we were going to be very late, through no fault of our own.

 

And yes, I did send a letter, WITH PICTURES, to Princess Customer Relations and what did I receive? A form letter. No assurances that the problems would be remedied. No "I'm sorry's". Just, 'we could have done a better job'.

 

We had traditional dining and that is the VERY reason we called the maitre de. We wanted to let the other couple know and ask would we be allowed into the dining room or should we make other arrangements? The excursion arrived back at the ship 12 minutes before second seating was to start. There were 21 people total who were stranded at the glacier. Princess handled it well and managed to get enough helicopters to pick us all up, after the original helicopter developed problems.

 

I was willing to chalk all this up to a bad cruise or bad ship management and try Princess again. You can imagine my shock when within a month of sailing, Princess informs us that they will not send the letter they KNEW we needed when they rebooked us on the reverse itinerary. They had helped us with the air tickets when they cancelled the 2003 cruise, due to SARS. That was just the worst customer service I have ever experienced.

 

I guess we should be thankful we didn't get to go on the Asia cruise. The ship broke down in Singapore, I think, and missed all of Vietnam. Vietnam was the only thing we really wanted to see, as we would have already spent two weeks in China pre-cruise, so going to Shanghai wasn't a big deal.

 

We own a global logistics company, so changes and a lot of flexibility are the norm for us. When one of our customers makes a request, we do our best to accomodate (unless we don't want to keep the customer). Makes you wander if some of these cruise lines feel they have an endless supply of customers and are letting a lot of little things slide. I hope not, but it sure seems the number of complaints on almost all lines is growing.

[sandbag7]

A fair post GreatAM; as I think CC veterans are aware, these things sometimes happen on even the most professional of lines; I wish there was available a record of breakdowns over a 1 and 5 year periods for all ships and cruise lines; I'd think twice about sailing on a badly maintained ship or a cruise line that delays maintenance to the detriment of its passengers.

[roysue]

Ealier this year I took a 10 day Caribbean with my husband, my sister and brother-in-law. When we left Fort Lauderdale, the Captain suggested that if anyone thought they might need sea sickness medicine that they should take it "now". The seas were rough with a strong wind most days. There were some sick passengers due to the seas. I went to bed early one night due to a queasy stomach. The pools were also closed most days due to the rough seas. And of course that meant that the on board entertanment involving the pool was cancelled. We needed sweaters on board due to the brisk and cool wind. We missed Barbados due to mechanical problems and Tortola was substituted.

 

 

Our bottom line - We had a ball! We laughed, giggled, we met new people, ate wonderful food, saw some great entertainment and some not-so-good entertainment and we even laughed at that. The rough seas gave us great sound at night with the balcony door open. One night the sea was so rough my husband and I both sat straight up in bed - and then we laughed at that!

 

Cruising, like life, is what you make it - What would life be without the lemonade that we choose to make from bitter fruit?

[bdjam]

The main point of my posts is as you stated in the first part of yours. I was truly amazed that Princess would just obviously ignore repeat requests. Bad communications, language barriers, whatever, I never saw anyone in authority do anything about the three things that really were out of bounds-the curtains, the carpet, and not letting the solo couple know that we were going to be very late, through no fault of our own.

Did you talk to anyone in authority or did you expect them to take care of it? I think your expectation that the couple at the table be notified that you were going to be late is a bit much and I don’t see why they wouldn’t have understood your explanation.

And yes, I did send a letter, WITH PICTURES, to Princess Customer Relations and what did I receive? A form letter. No assurances that the problems would be remedied. No "I'm sorry's". Just, 'we could have done a better job'.

Did you get documentation of your complaints when you were on board? Documentation – not just pictures – is the key here. The people in the corporate office have no idea how these situations go down on the ships – that’s why you need the documentation. Of course their response was cursory – if they didn’t have documentation beside the pictures, they didn’t have much to go on. I think Princess admitting they didn't do their job was pretty much an apology.

We had traditional dining and that is the VERY reason we called the maitre de. We wanted to let the other couple know

Did you ask the Matre’d to let the other couple know or did you assume he would?

You can imagine my shock when within a month of sailing, Princess informs us that they will not send the letter they KNEW we needed when they rebooked us on the reverse itinerary. They had helped us with the air tickets when they cancelled the 2003 cruise, due to SARS. That was just the worst customer service I have ever experienced.

I think it’s pretty well known by travel agents and those who cruise that unless you’ve booked air with the cruise line, the amount of help they are going to be is probably superficial. It would seem they’d have enough to do taking care of those who have paid for the air service they offer without having to worry about those they didn’t. Customer Service doesn’t mean doing everything the customer wants – there has to be a reasonable request from the customer. I used to work in Customer Service and talk about being shocked - some of the requests were beyond our capabilities and when we couldn’t fulfill them, we were accused of offering bad customer service.

I guess we should be thankful we didn't get to go on the Asia cruise. The ship broke down in Singapore, I think, and missed all of Vietnam. Vietnam was the only thing we really wanted to see, as we would have already spent two weeks in China pre-cruise, so going to Shanghai wasn't a big deal.

I think there’s been plenty posted here about the Med cruise breakdown on Grand Princess. If you really only want to see one port – and it’s essential for a successful vacation – it might be prudent to take a land vacation there.

When one of our customers makes a request, we do our best to accomodate (unless we don't want to keep the customer). Makes you wander if some of these cruise lines feel they have an endless supply of customers and are letting a lot of little things slide. I hope not, but it sure seems the number of complaints on almost all lines is growing.

I guess we should applaud you for being so customer focused, but after stating this, what do you do with customers that ask you for something you can’t handle or expect you to recognize they need help when they don’t ask? It is interesting that you would not offer customer service to customers you don’t want.

Bottom line, if you feel that Princess still owes you something, you should continue to use your energy communicating with them - we can't give you any more than what you've already gotten from the cruise line. And given that the majority of those posting here walk off a Princess ship satisfied, not many will heed your implication to go somewhere else.

[Colo Cruiser]

Just let it go.:D

[jstweed]

Sailed on a RCCL's Navigator of the Seas on a 7 day Western Caribbean last year that left two days late because of Hurricane Francis. RCCL gave us a $500 room credit and -50% off our next cruise and our CSA travel insurance paid us $465.00 for the two missed days. We booked this cruise especially because it stopped at Ocho Rios, Jamaica. So what port got cancelled - You got it Ocho Rios! Were we disapointed - yes. Did it ruin our cruise NO WAY. I was even in a cast at the time from a broken wrist and we still had a blast. Got a special water proof cast so I could still swim and it was even colored to match my formal wear. Had great table mates for dinner that we went to the shows with. We thought we made out like bandits between what RCCL gave us and what the trip insurance paid, so much so that we will be in our first balcony cabin in 1 week on the Explorer of the Seas thanks to that -50% coupon. We even booked the Explorer trip while onboard the Navigator which gave us an additional $100 Explorer room credit. Guess it's all in what you make of things but I thought RCCL took very good care of us and you should always get trip insurance that covers trip interuption.

[greatam]

bdjam,

 

Do you work for Princess PR dept or do you just want to argue? I'm sorry that slipped out, but you keep implying that I did nothing to alleviate the situations. Your posts also imply this was my first cruise-NO, it was the first PRINCESS cruise.

 

I stated VERY succinctly that I talked to the housekeeper, NOT the steward, twice. I also stated that I wrote a letter to the Hotel Manager two days BEFORE we disembarked. NO ONE EVER SHOWED UP, CALLED, or in anyway even acknowledged our REPEATED requests. A copy of the letter to hotel manager and name of housekeeper and approximate time of our discussions were included in letter with pictures to the corporate office.

 

And if the maitre de's job is not to solve problems and relay important messages to pax and staff alike, whose job is it? We were trying to be courteous, letting the other couple know. And we all needed to know if we could still have dinner in the dining room or if we needed to make alternative dining arrangements. The dining room was well aware of the delayed excursion when I called.

 

I certainly was not asking Princess for any help with air. I needed a letter from their port agent, excursion director, heck, the phone answerer would have been fine. I needed a letter merely stating that I was invited to China, with attached itinerary. Sign name. Send letter to Zierer to include with Chinese visa package. WE WERE TOLD BY PRINCESS in 2003 this would be NO problem or we never would have booked the cruise. They stated they would have their Chinese port agent draft the letter. To repeat myself, I have 7 emails and 2 letters, one a draft of the document needed, verifying this information. I knew the requirements, Princess knew the requirements. When we rebooked the cruise, we were all on the same page. What happened a year and a half later? Customer service let down the ball.

 

Our company's customer service is excellent and yes, we have some VERY difficult requests and customers. We do accomodate most requests (that is what logistics is all about) and those we cannot, we make an effort to send the customer to a company that can accomodate. Other than some of our "problem" customers, we always acknowledge within 2 hours, via phone or email. Our business is EXTREMELY time senstive-we deal in perishable food products from all over the world.

 

And yes, sometimes a customer can be more problems (late bill payment, repeated freight claims) than their business is worth. We do tend to overlook those customers and don't give them our best efforts. Some have stayed with us, some have not. The ones we have lost are now another company's headache. I hear about them from collegues frequently.

 

I have never said Princess owes me anything. Where you got that, I have NO idea. They kept my deposit and I don't believe that was FAIR, but I never said they owed me anything. I DID NOT ask for compensation. IT was NOT offered.

 

I did everything I could think to do to resolve the problems. It is truly difficult to resolve problems when the conversation is one way.

[spongerob]

I didn't deserve this tirade.

 

You're right. If all the problems you listed were so serious that they are worth the energy being expended to discuss them three years later, then who am I to comment?

 

Told my steward in the morning and by afternoon there was a knock on my door. Opened the door and a crewman was there with light bulbs, not only for the one that was burnt out but for every other one in the cabin. He told us the room steward told him to replace all of them in case another was ready to blow.. Nice service.. Nice tip after..

 

Which just goes to show you, some people get a visit from the Lightbulb Fairy, others from the Bad Cruise Fairy. I know it's not always true, but in reading the two responses, I am left wondering how much of the so-called bad service is self-inflicted by the passengers themselves, and how often a good attitude results in outstanding service. Princess definitely screws up from time to time, but to get so petty as to complain about a maitre d' being unable to read someone's mind some three years ago, it's hard to take anything else posted very seriously.

 

I work in a service business, too, and there are a lot of old adages out there, like "the customer is always right" and "a dissatisfied customer tells everyone they know." People who don't work in the business come up with such things. The truth is, "The customer is sometimes a moron and he or she is best sent to your competitors."

[bdjam]

bdjam,

 

Do you work for Princess PR dept or do you just want to argue? I'm sorry that slipped out, but you keep implying that I did nothing to alleviate the situations. Your posts also imply this was my first cruise-NO, it was the first PRINCESS cruise.

Here we go again. :rolleyes: Since no one will believe me when I answer truthfully, instead I’ll say yes, I work for Princess in the PR department and I surf all of the cruise boards for negative posts against the cruise line. Then when I find them, I engage myself in the debate until everyone is exhausted. If the topic lays dormant for three days, they pay me $500 – instead of giving compensation to those who have missed ports. I argue against MUTS just to throw everyone off the scent.

 

No, I don’t work for Princess but I have worked in Customer Service and I know from a customer’s perspective how to positively take care of issues, expending my energies where they should be expended. Do I just want to argue? Well, I am debating your points, so if you call that arguing, then I guess so – but I thought debates were part of this board. I never tried to imply this was your first cruise.

stated VERY succinctly that I talked to the housekeeper

Yes you did and I’m sorry that I missed that in your post. However my point remains that if you didn’t have satisfaction, you should have continued up the chain of command rather than taking down the sheers.

And if the maitre de's job is not to solve problems and relay important messages to pax and staff alike, whose job is it?

I don’t know exactly what’s in the Matre’d job description – my point is that perhaps getting the message to the other couple at your table, when they have more than one dining room and some specialty restaurants to take care of, might not have been their highest priority. Is that bad customer service – maybe for you, but maybe he was busy servicing some other customers. You don’t think that he purposefully didn’t tell the other couple at the table after he told you he would?

What happened a year and a half later? Customer service let down the ball.

Or did the rules change? A year and a half seems like a large piece of time given the state of international relations. Did you pursue the reason that you think Princess “let down the ball?”

I have never said Princess owes me anything. Where you got that, I have NO idea. They kept my deposit and I don't believe that was FAIR, but I never said they owed me anything. I DID NOT ask for compensation. IT was NOT offered.

Perhaps I should stop reading your posts because I’m obviously not interpreting them correctly. I assumed that you were seeking something from Princess – not necessarily money – in response to these issues. But I still think that rather than venting your angst here, you should use the energy to engage Princess. If you’re past that, then I still think your complaints here are going to be met with sideways glances.

At least they will from me – I’ve had an occasion to write Princess after one of my cruises with constructive comments on what I thought could go better. While they responded in corporate fashion – that’s what happens when you have a large base of customer issues to deal with all at once – they were very nice to me and quite accommodating. I’ve heard the same from others who have had issues with Princess including one couple especially happy with the cruise line after their cruise was abbreviated by 6 days and they were off-loaded in Honolulu. Princess took very good care of them while they were waiting for a flight home.

It’s difficult to believe we’re talking about the same cruise line.

[Don Haynes]

Everyone complains when they miss a port of call that they lost a full day, and want compensation for the full day. But in a one week cruise, the seven or eight hours of the port of call is around 5 percent of a one week cruise, not seventeen percent.

 

The four hundred dollars you received as far as a stockholder is concerned, is way too much......

 

Wihout stockholders, there wouldn't be a cruise line.

[Cruisin' Chick]

I remember reading on another website (that sells cruises but also has great info) last year after the hurricanes letters the site received about passengers' experiences. Just about every person had good things to say about how the cruiselines handled the hurricanes. A few people did complain about this or that but many received a free extra day, free Internet access so as to make arrangements for the change in travel, other assistance, etc. I do acknowledge that yes this site sells cruises and wants the cruiselines to get good press -- helps their business, but it seems most of the lines did try to help people out.

[KAYEF]

If you specifically want to see cities/sights in Europe, you go on a TOUR

 

but

 

remember, they are NOT as relaxing as a cruise.

 

We were on the Dream this summer as well...........missed ports..........didn't even get port taxes refunded (they are pre-paid). You got a BIG credit for missing a port; they don't have to do that. Guess we should have gone Princess and not NCL.

 

Go on a land tour for your next anniversary.

[sandbag7]

You should read the Berlitz Cruise Guide, a very informative guide to all cruise lines and cruise ships. It states in relevant part that RCCL for example has declined in quality to the level of Carnival as a result of going public. I'm sure you and many others would argue the point, but I'm not sure the presence of stock holders is necessarily a good thing for service or quality, as the profit motive/need can interfere with those categories.

[KAYEF]

 

I'm SURE he got paid for the time he spent on those business trips. Those of us who never had jobs with such SUPER PERCS view those free trips for the whole family as FREE. They ARE FREE to you; you don't even claim all those benefits on taxes!!

 

As I said pages ago, if one wants to see Europe take LAND TOUR...... cruising is for cruising.:eek:

[Pam in CA]

The tickets certainly weren't FREE. My DH made 17 business trips from LA to Austrailia in the space of 13 months at a total cost of over $50,000. Why wouldn't we want to use what he rightfully earned the hard way?

 

Actually, your tickets were free since they were earned through air miles already paid for. I'm assuming from your comment that your DH paid the $50,000 directly out of his own pocket. Otherwise, his company paid for them, not him.

 

If you choose to use Frequent Flyer miles for tickets to/from a cruise, that's your choice. However, if you do so, Princess has NO responsibility for your flights, whether you make it to your ship or home, have to reschedule, or have any problems whatsoever with your flights. When you make your own arrangements, you are 100% responsible. The only times when this is not the case is if there is a major disruption such as what happened 9/11 or is happening to the people who boarded Carnival cruises out of Galveston over a week ago.

 

When you make your own flight arrangements, you know and accept the responsibility that if the ship comes in late or there are any changes, it's up to you to make them. Depending on the circumstances, Princess will provide internet access for free so that people can make flight changes. That, to me, is Customer Service.

[greatam]

I'm SURE he got paid for the time he spent on those business trips. Those of us who never had jobs with such SUPER PERCS view those free trips for the whole family as FREE. They ARE FREE to you; you don't even claim all those benefits on taxes!!

 

As I said pages ago, if one wants to see Europe take LAND TOUR...... cruising is for cruising.:eek:

 

Well, it's like this. We own the company. If the deal works, yes, we get paid out of LONG TERM revenues. But if the deal does not, it is money out of our pocket which does not bear any fruits. Had some very expensive business trips where the deal just did not work out-one to Japan still sticks in my mind. But that is what being in business is all about. Some you win and some you loose.

 

How you think flying over and over to Australia is a "SUPER PERC" is beyond me? You try it-two days traveling time EACH WAY, go see a bunch of people, sleep in a hotel, be away from your family, eat hotel or fast food, run up an exorbitant phone bill. The first couple of trips are fun. The rest are just an ordeal to be dealt with. Just ask any "road warrior" over 40. They would be happy to take less "PERCS" and more time in the office.

 

I am flying to Iraq on a chartered jet in December. Want to go???? One of the "PERCS" of the job. Could be kidnapped, could be killed, definitely will miss my DH and my animals. Made sure my life insurance was paid up-even got kidnapping insurance. But what the heck, I get a "PERC". Free trip to Iraq!!!

 

Yes, we accumulated over 600,000 FF miles on Qantas. But I could have purchased them cheaper, if I was allowed to purchase that many. For over $50,000, I could have chartered a private jet to fly to Asia. Or paid for first class tickets 2 or three times.

 

And lastly, you have me mixed up with the OP. I have been to Europe too many times to count. I don't need a land tour or a cruise in Europe.

[greatam]

Actually, your tickets were free since they were earned through air miles already paid for. I'm assuming from your comment that your DH paid the $50,000 directly out of his own pocket. Otherwise, his company paid for them, not him.

 

If you choose to use Frequent Flyer miles for tickets to/from a cruise, that's your choice. However, if you do so, Princess has NO responsibility for your flights, whether you make it to your ship or home, have to reschedule, or have any problems whatsoever with your flights. When you make your own arrangements, you are 100% responsible. The only times when this is not the case is if there is a major disruption such as what happened 9/11 or is happening to the people who boarded Carnival cruises out of Galveston over a week ago.

 

When you make your own flight arrangements, you know and accept the responsibility that if the ship comes in late or there are any changes, it's up to you to make them. Depending on the circumstances, Princess will provide internet access for free so that people can make flight changes. That, to me, is Customer Service.

 

To repeat myself again, the FF tickets were booked in 2002 to coincide with a Princess Asia cruise departing in 2003. Cruise was cancelled BY PRINCESS (rather prematurely-April 2003 for an October cruise) due to SARS. No ones fault there was SARS.

 

Princess offered everyone on our cruise either a free 7 day Caribbean cruise, a 50% coupon on a future "exotic" cruise (to be taken within one year) or help rebooking everything EXACTLY as it was in 2003. There is the problem. Princess KNEW in April 2003 that I needed a triple (or multiple) entry visa. They KNEW about my Qantas tickets. Heck, they called Qantas to make the date change themselves.

 

I chose none of the "compensation". All I asked for was a letter to be able to duplicate EXACTLY the 2003 cruise. The only cruise available, with the same cabin, had a reverse itinerary. Was promised the letter. Was promised the letter REPEATEDLY. Have 7 emails and 2 letters to verify this information. ONE MONTH before the cruise, I was informed NO letter would be forthcoming.

 

I had the air tickets in hand, I had tickets from Beijing to depart Bangkok in hand and I paid for those tickets. I was arriving Bangkok 2 days early. I had NO problems with air. I needed a letter for my Chinese visa. I did not get the letter. It was such a simple thing. Princess has port agents all over Asia. Why didn't I get the letter? Someone let down the ball in customer service. The cruise was oversold, so it was just easier to let a passenger fall by the wayside.

[bdjam]

We own the company. If the deal works, yes, we get paid out of LONG TERM revenues. But if the deal does not, it is money out of our pocket which does not bear any fruits. Had some very expensive business trips where the deal just did not work out-one to Japan still sticks in my mind. But that is what being in business is all about. Some you win and some you loose.

Either way, the frequent flyer mileage came as a reward for your buying tickets. You would have used the money to buy the tickets you flew to do business on whether or not you got the frequent flyer miles, right? Or were the frequent flyer miles an incentive for you to use the particular airline. It’s unfortunate that business travel is sometimes grueling and takes people sometimes to dangerous places. But the business one is in is their own choice, correct?

I needed a letter for my Chinese visa. I did not get the letter. It was such a simple thing. Princess has port agents all over Asia. Why didn't I get the letter? Someone let down the ball in customer service. The cruise was oversold, so it was just easier to let a passenger fall by the wayside.

Did you ask Princess why you didn’t get the letter and if so, what was their response? And is your statement that the cruise was oversold so it was easier to let a passenger fall by the wayside rather than write a letter based in fact and if so, how do you substantiate the statement?

I'll restate what I said above - customer service is one thing, but every business can only offer reasonable service. The tendency for customers who ask for the unreasonable and who have their requests unfulfilled is to claim poor customer service and to make false claims. I was in the business and I saw it many times.

[LARGIN]

I'll restate what I said above - customer service is one thing, but every business can only offer reasonable service. The tendency for customers who ask for the unreasonable and who have their requests unfulfilled is to claim poor customer service and to make false claims. I was in the business and I saw it many times.

 

Agree.. People in customer service know exactly what bdjam means..

[Charliesmom]

Did I miss comments on the lack of cleanliness on the ship? I think that is an issue that Princess ought to address with the hotel manager. It is my belief that a dirty ship is inexcusable.

 

A ship that has cleanliness issues generally is a ship that has morale problems. This happened to us on the Royal Princess on a 14 day cruise around South America.

 

The public rooms were dirty (even Princess Di's plaque was so dirty my husband wrote "clean me" on it - and it wasn't cleaned for a week).

 

However, I did speak to my room steward and asked him to remove the dirty curtains and have them washed (he did). Anything else in our cabin that was not clean ended up being cleaned at my request.

 

I vowed to never go back on that ship. Yet, the Royal Princess had a LOT of very loyal followers who loved being on her.

 

I'm sorry that you missed your ports. I have found in the past that doing a sightseeing itinerary by ship just doesn't make it. Even a land tour barely gives you enough time to scratch the surface of a new place. At best, it is a frustrating experience to visit new places by ship - and you never get a real chance to find out what the place is all about.

 

Chalk this one up to experience. Plan a land tour to see what you missed in Instanbul and Kusadasi. There are lots of good tour companies out there. You are fortunate enough to be young enough to physically withstand the rigors of travel. Enjoy it while you may.

 

And next time you take a cruise, make it a Caribbean cruise and just relax. Another good trip is a Panama Canal cruise. Make the ship your destination, not the ports.

 

Roberta

[NEW YORK LADY2]

For a tourist, multiple entry visa for China a letter may not be required if you send in a copy of your airline tickets and flight itinerary, cruise document and itinerary along with you passport, appropriate pictures and visa request form. Did you try doing this and submitting to the Chinese Consulate or Visa Service in your area? If you did and still needed the letter I would have been very surprised but if you booked via a TA they could have done a letter for you. You would only need an invitation letter to travel to China to do business, not as a tourist. I work for an international company and do visas for China all the time, but they are business visas mostly so they do require an invitation letter. If a spouse is accompanying their husband we can get a tourist visa and have never needed the invitation letter. Watch, the next time I do a spouse tourist visa they will require one and I'll have to come back here and eat crow.

 

Jackie

[greatam]

For a tourist, multiple entry visa for China a letter may not be required if you send in a copy of your airline tickets and flight itinerary, cruise document and itinerary along with you passport, appropriate pictures and visa request form. Did you try doing this and submitting to the Chinese Consulate or Visa Service in your area? If you did and still needed the letter I would have been very surprised but if you booked via a TA they could have done a letter for you. You would only need an invitation letter to travel to China to do business, not as a tourist. I work for an international company and do visas for China all the time, but they are business visas mostly so they do require an invitation letter. If a spouse is accompanying their husband we can get a tourist visa and have never needed the invitation letter. Watch, the next time I do a spouse tourist visa they will require one and I'll have to come back here and eat crow.

 

Jackie

 

Thanks for the help, but see rules below directly off the embassy website.

 

I had gone to the consulate in Los Angeles, with my plane tickets, with the cruise itinerary, pictures, passport, everything I thought I needed. I had known in advance, when I rebooked the cruise, that I needed a letter. I was HOPING that maybe the consulate would overlook the need for the letter, since I was going to be on a cruise ship and only making a short port stop in Shanghai. I even volunteered to stay on the ship in Shanghai. The rules state I could make "application" for frequent tourist visits. However, it also states in the rules that the final determination is made at the consulate.

 

The consulate informed me I needed the letter and they would NOT issue the visa without it. And I needed it from someone who had an office in China-like the Princess port agent. Oh, well, I leave Monday for Beijing, with my MULTIPLE ENTRY visa. The chinese agent I booked the Yangtze cruise with was able to accomodate with the letter this time.

 

Updated: 04/06/2005

 

4. To apply for a Multiple Entry "L" Visa valid for 6 months or 1 year, one of the following requirements shall be met:

 

l submit documents that certify he/she will come to China frequently for family visits or sightseeing. Acceptable documents include an invitation letter from your family member in China or proof of the kinship; or ownership certificate of real estate in China, or sale agreement or lease agreement of an apartment in China; or a copy of adoption certificate or the child's former Chinese passport if he/she has adopted a child from China; or

 

l foreign Chinese born in China who has visited China at least twice in the past 12 months, shall submit a copy of the visa(s); or

 

l submit an official letter issued by the host institution in China, or an application letter which explains the need to visit China frequently for tourism; or

 

l Renew a multiple entry "L" visa, and shall submit a copy of the visa if it's in a different passport rather than the one submitted for a new visa.

 

The visa application form shall be filled out completely, correctly and legibly, otherwise this can cause a delay in processing or the refusal of the requested visa.

[Breezey]

Did I miss comments on the lack of cleanliness on the ship? I think that is an issue that Princess ought to address with the hotel manager. It is my belief that a dirty ship is inexcusable.

 

A ship that has cleanliness issues generally is a ship that has morale problems. This happened to us on the Royal Princess on a 14 day cruise around South America.

 

The public rooms were dirty (even Princess Di's plaque was so dirty my husband wrote "clean me" on it - and it wasn't cleaned for a week).

 

However, I did speak to my room steward and asked him to remove the dirty curtains and have them washed (he did). Anything else in our cabin that was not clean ended up being cleaned at my request.

 

I vowed to never go back on that ship. Yet, the Royal Princess had a LOT of very loyal followers who loved being on her.

 

I'm sorry that you missed your ports. I have found in the past that doing a sightseeing itinerary by ship just doesn't make it. Even a land tour barely gives you enough time to scratch the surface of a new place. At best, it is a frustrating experience to visit new places by ship - and you never get a real chance to find out what the place is all about.

 

Chalk this one up to experience. Plan a land tour to see what you missed in Instanbul and Kusadasi. There are lots of good tour companies out there. You are fortunate enough to be young enough to physically withstand the rigors of travel. Enjoy it while you may.

 

And next time you take a cruise, make it a Caribbean cruise and just relax. Another good trip is a Panama Canal cruise. Make the ship your destination, not the ports.

 

Roberta

 

 

Roberta

I am just back from the Med Cruise on the Grand and dont plan on reading all the 172 posts on this thread but saw yours and agree 100%. A land tour (or in my case prefer a non-formal tour through europe) is the way to see these sites.

 

Next time I cruise it will be only to relax and I will most definitely find a cruise line and ship that meets my needs for that (quality of food and service are high on my must haves). So whats your ship of choice?

[NEW YORK LADY]

Roberta, that is interesting since I am looking at our application for a China 2 entry Visa - 2 Day Processing Requirements from our Visa Service and it says:

 

"In order for _ _ _ _ to process this travel document request, you will need to send us the following:

 

Application Forms: Provide 1 fully completed and szinged copy of the attached application form.

Passport: Your signed passport with sufficient blank pages for any visa stams. the passport must be valid for at least 6 months past your scheduled return date to the US.

Photographs: 1 passport size and quality photograph about 2 in by 2 in, is required. Photos may be B&W or color, unless noted below, but should have a white background. _ _ _ _ can duplicate most photos for this request from a single original for $8 per copy.

Other: _ _ _ _ must receive your documents by 8 am for two day processing. Emergency service fees will apply. If you were born in China you must submit your last Chinese passport and your Naturalization Certificate for your first visa.

 

The expected processing time for this request is 3 business days at a cost of $166.00 including the consulate fees. Rush processing in 2 days is also possible at a coszt of $196.00 including the consultate fees. Pleasze note that all processing times, fees, and requirements are based on government rules that are subject to change without notice."

 

Maybe the difference is the use of a Visa Service even though the cost is expensive. I don't know what to tell you but I would have tried this route rather than going it direct to the Consulate.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

 

Jackie