DSC for happy cruisers

[luvtheships]

You don't know that and, short of being in a contract with NCL, there is no way you could know that.

 

 

Um ok let's pretend none of us understand correct accounting reporting principles ok?

 

Now answer this....

 

Do you really think the laundry crew who has zero contact with pax thus no way to insure that pax get great personal service actually work for Ncl with the understanding their pay for 60 or 70 hour work weeks is dependent on pax NOT removing dsc?

 

It doesn't take a genius or law degree or cpa cert to know they are going to get paid

 

 

If you believe that crew only get paid based on dsc remaining in tact that is like saying the person pouring your $4 coffee is getting paid based in the quarters the customers leave in the jar

[triptolemus]

It's not about what I believe or what I think. It's about what the facts are. And right now, you don't have any.

 

I get what you're trying to say. Do you get what I'm trying to say? Stop floating your suppositions as fact.

[luvtheships]

Seriously, you do not have a clue.

 

 

Ok then tell us all what you think will happen if say 50% of all pax on a particular sailing...which of course may straddle 2 pay periods....removed the dsc?

 

 

Remember I'm talking pay checks NOT silly crew parties or extra time off ...commonly known as "crew incentives"

Edited May 7, 2016 by luvtheships

[luvtheships]

It's not about what I believe or what I think. It's about what the facts are. And right now, you don't have any.

 

 

 

I get what you're trying to say. Do you get what I'm trying to say? Stop floating your suppositions as fact.

 

 

Ok well then let's keep it simple....and you don't need a Ph.D. To know this is fact....

 

Pax have the option to remove dsc

 

 

Ncl has the obligation to pay its employees an agreed upon contractually set salary

 

 

While the first issue may well occur more than any of us might like to think....

 

The second issue is going to happen on a guaranteed weekly or biweekly basis regardless of the first issue

 

Prove me wrong ....you can't because you know Ncl must pay their employees regardless of pax dsc

 

Pax dsc is discretionary for many many reasons. Mostly for tax and legal purposes. Removing it does not effect the pay checks. It might effect other crew "incentives" but not paychecks

Edited May 7, 2016 by luvtheships

[triptolemus]

 

Ncl has the obligation to pay its employees an agreed upon contractually set salary

 

Prove me wrong ....you can't

 

You have no idea what the terms of the contract are.

[luvtheships]

You have no idea what the terms of the contract are.

 

 

That's funny I don't need to know the terms but you seem to think the crew is signing on to work for Ncl with the understanding that paying them a set base salary is optional

 

You are actually very funny in a dry sort of way if you think Ncl is relying on every pax to leave dsc alone in order to pay their crew

 

Btw I'm not saying Ncl is a joy to work for but if crew keeps signing contracts over and over they are getting properly compensated

 

If they don't like the new contract they are not chained in their bunks and can leave

 

Nor am I saying that all contract renewals are great for crew

 

But using my brains plus my business acumen...I don't need to do much research to know the crew gets paid regardless of dsc

 

That's not to say the crew is jumping for joy or that they don't stage work slowdowns at times because the biweekly crew incentive party was cancelled or their current check was just their contracted amount and didn't contain a little "extra"

 

I'm saying they still get a contracted pay amount regardless of dsc.

Edited May 7, 2016 by luvtheships

[triptolemus]

You have no idea what I'm thinking, either.

 

Clearly.

 

One needs to know the terms of the contract in order to discuss the contract. Otherwise, it's all just horsesh\t.

Edited May 7, 2016 by triptolemus

[luvtheships]

You have no idea what I'm thinking, either.

 

Clearly.

 

One needs to know the terms of the contract in order to discuss the contract. Otherwise, it's all just horsesh\t.

 

 

Obviously you didn't study business in school and that's fine of course

 

We need doctors dentists carpenters engineers and postal workers to live

 

But

 

A company like Ncl that is dependent on massive back room crew to run its ships is going to pay them a set amount on a set schedule

 

Ncl may or may not give them something extra from time to time but paychecks are steady and at a base amount

 

You can't really think Ncl paychecks and minimum agreed amounts are optional to Ncl can you

[luvtheships]

Trip....I will let you win if you want but only because I know I'm correct with my logical thinking plus my real life is calling

Edited May 7, 2016 by luvtheships

[Crusin6]

I've heard a couple of things when talking to crew members. Several have told me that three complaints and you are on a plane home (these were food servers).

 

 

 

We use the comment cards for exemplary service.

 

 

 

I've also heard that its a good idea to add an extra tip to a crew member via the service desk, on your account. They get the money directly and management knows they have been recognized not only with words, but with an extra tip. Does anyone know if this is true?

 

 

 

(Tips are not taxable for many of the crew members because of the tax laws in their home countries, so there's no "tax penalty" for them to collect tips this way).

 

 

There is an income tax implication for ncl if they collect dsc specifically for paying crew salary and that is more than likely the reason they state it is discretionary and removable by the pax

 

If it weren't it would be taxable reportable income to ncl

 

They way it's currently stated seems to indicate it's not taxable revenue to ncl

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

[luddite]

Ok then tell us all what you think will happen if say 50% of all pax on a particular sailing...which of course may straddle 2 pay periods....removed the dsc?

 

 

Remember I'm talking pay checks NOT silly crew parties or extra time off ...commonly known as "crew incentives"

 

If I loan you the money, will you buy a clue?

[fshagan]

There is an income tax implication for ncl if they collect dsc specifically for paying crew salary and that is more than likely the reason they state it is discretionary and removable by the pax

 

If it weren't it would be taxable reportable income to ncl

 

They way it's currently stated seems to indicate it's not taxable revenue to ncl

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

 

That's not the way it works.

 

Corporations in the US pay taxes based on net income.

 

Wages are an expense, and reduce net income. If NCL collects $100 of every fare as wages it is a sales receipt that is reduced by the wage expense when paid out.

 

If NCL passes through a tip, it is not counted in net income and is also not an expense. There is no tax benefit to NCL.

 

If NCL collects the DSC into a special fund, like they say, they have to accrue it for the purpose it is designed for. Tips would be passed through. Benefits or services purchased for employees would not be deductible as an expense, so if it's not considered income they lose the deduction and they don't count the income.

 

If, however, NCL grabs the money out of that special fund and uses it for something else then they have to claim it as income. And they can expense what they buy with it.

 

There's no tax implication to NCL at all with tips. There is to the employees, but not NCL.

[luvtheships]

That's not the way it works.

 

 

 

Corporations in the US pay taxes based on net income.

 

 

 

Wages are an expense, and reduce net income. If NCL collects $100 of every fare as wages it is a sales receipt that is reduced by the wage expense when paid out.

 

 

 

If NCL passes through a tip, it is not counted in net income and is also not an expense. There is no tax benefit to NCL.

 

 

 

If NCL collects the DSC into a special fund, like they say, they have to accrue it for the purpose it is designed for. Tips would be passed through. Benefits or services purchased for employees would not be deductible as an expense, so if it's not considered income they lose the deduction and they don't count the income.

 

 

 

If, however, NCL grabs the money out of that special fund and uses it for something else then they have to claim it as income. And they can expense what they buy with it.

 

 

 

There's no tax implication to NCL at all with tips. There is to the employees, but not NCL.

 

 

Duh. That is exactly what the poster you quote is saying

 

By calling dsc a tip there is no tax implication for Ncl

 

That's the point of calling it dsc or tip and that is why is is discretionary

 

By calling it a tip Ncl doesn't add it to gross income that's the point

Edited May 8, 2016 by luvtheships

[luvtheships]

If I loan you the money, will you buy a clue?

 

 

You can't answer the question can you?

 

So again.....

 

If 50% of pax remove dsc.....will Ncl reduce that weeks paycheck by 50%?

 

Never mind I'll answer for you....

 

No

Edited May 8, 2016 by luvtheships

[triptolemus]

I thought your real life was calling? I guess it didn't have much to say...

[luvtheships]

I thought your real life was calling? I guess it didn't have much to say...

 

 

That was hours ago. Very pleasant evening btw. Thanks for asking.

 

Found a minute though to check in to see if you responded

 

Funny though how no one can answer my question isn't it

 

So if 50% of pax remove dsc will Ncl reduce that weeks paychecks by 50%?

Edited May 8, 2016 by luvtheships

[kathybelcher2433]

Of course NCL is paying their employees as expected. No respectable employer would do otherwise. They also are aware that only a minuscule percent of guests are removing all or some of their D.SC. They can handle that tiny percent regardless of how many of you protest and attempt to pull others into your way of thinking.

[DMH15]

You can't answer the question can you?

 

So again.....

 

If 50% of pax remove dsc.....will Ncl reduce that weeks paycheck by 50%?

 

Never mind I'll answer for you....

 

No

 

 

If 50% remove tips consistently either our fares or the DSC for those of us who pay it goes up. It won't come out of NCL's profits.

[DiamondGirl83]

You will get service.

Pay your bills.

 

Why are you so bothered about this? It's absolutely nothing to do with you what I do.

[sparks1093]

That was hours ago. Very pleasant evening btw. Thanks for asking.

 

Found a minute though to check in to see if you responded

 

Funny though how no one can answer my question isn't it

 

So if 50% of pax remove dsc will Ncl reduce that weeks paychecks by 50%?

 

I look at it this way- in a land based restaurant in the US are paid a sub-minimum wage in most states and the rest of their income comes from the tips that they receive. If the individual server does not make at least enough in tips to reach the full minimum wage the employer is obligated to make up the difference. Now, if 50% of the customers decided not to leave a tip the server's income would go down, but it would never go below the minimum wage. So if the server nets $20 an hour with tips their total income would be cut in half if people didn't leave tips and the employer has no obligation to pay them what they would have made had people left tips (over and above paying minimum wage).

 

So the workers on NCL that receive a portion of the service charges are probably guaranteed a minimum as you state, but if too many people remove the service charges their total income is likely affected. They'll get the minimum but they certainly won't earn what they are used to earning since NCL is under no obligation to make up that short fall.

Edited May 8, 2016 by sparks1093

[sjbdtz]

Sorry but every single pax could remove the dsc in total and the crew is still getting their paycheck for the same amount

 

 

Logical? Hardly. You're biased and trying to convert people to your predetermined way of thinking.

 

Logical would be to take the consensus (think of it as the wikipedia of cruise crew contracts) which is that crew are paid a VERY small wage (on the order of $50 / month), food & lodging, and a variable % of the DSC collected.

 

That's not much different than a salesperson. Would you take a job if you knew that the prospect could say 'no', and your take-home pay would decline as a result? Really NOT earning commission is pretty much the same thing as NOT getting a share of a DSC.

 

Conversely, by your logic, every restaurant on land must be paying their staff full wages, and just collecting the tips. That's what you are proposing is happening here.

 

NCL state that the DSC supports the crew wage. They specifically mention behind-the-scenes personnel.

 

Should the laundry be punished if the passengers are unhappy? Who knows, but within the theory that the entire crew are a team (see other post today about room steward replaced for a day, by a busboy), if the room steward can't get enough fresh towels, passenger is unhappy and removes DSC. Should the room steward be the only one to suffer?

 

What if the napkin at the restaurant is dirty, or burned, or torn? Should the waiter lose their income and not the laundry?

 

The nature of the DSC is to create an all-in price, while still holding the service component separate, for two reasons: 1. Because of CREW tax implications in the Philippines. 2. To showcase that tipping is not required, notwithstanding the long tradition of envelopes in the cruise industry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why are you so bothered about this? It's absolutely nothing to do with you what I do.

 

What you do, has everything to do with every other passenger, and shareholder. Why? It's the Butterfly Effect.

 

You decrease / eliminate DSC. Every crewmember's take-home pay decreases. Shortly, other jobs which don't require 8 months away from home start to reach income parity.

 

It becomes harder to retain staff, and the cruiseline expends time & effort to constantly retrain the churning crew.

 

Service becomes inconsistent, because experience is the best driver of consistency, and my cruise quality is diminished.

 

Thanks, DiamondGirl. :mad:

 

 

 

Stephen

 

.

[DiamondGirl83]

Stephen, you're missing my point, what I do with MY money is MY decision.

I won't be told to 'pay my bills' by anyone.

[DiamondGirl83]

Plus as well isn't it the job of NCL to pay their staffs wages? I'm sure their profits can cover it!

[DiamondGirl83]

I have no objections to paying the DSC, I just think it's too much to then have to tip and pay 18% gratuities as well.

I have paid the DSC on my last two cruises as well as tipping as i go and I've ended up spending too much. There has to be a line drawn somewhere.

Edited May 8, 2016 by DiamondGirl83

[phoenix1181]

I shouldn't imagine $75 is going to affect anyone that much. I just think it's a bit much, the daily service charge, the 18% gratuities, extra tips plus I pay a solo supplement for my cabin.

It mounts up quite a lot, if I can I'd rather know where the money has gone.

 

I see. You are choosing not to pay it. It has nothing to do with the service one way or the other.

 

The vacation you have chosen costs more than you want to spend so you're going to stiff the people who make the trip enjoyable........... Maybe you should take a vacation that fits your budget better.