Ever increasing sales pressure?

[Stateroom_Sailor]

4 minutes ago, lisiamc said:

 

 

Prior to Millennium, the Century and Horizon class ships didn’t have any speciality dining rooms.  So the $15 extra charge dates from 2000 for Celebrity.

 

Ok, so with inflation that is $22.15 today, much more reasonable.

[Caribbean Chris]

11 hours ago, lisiamc said:

 

The tea in the carafe frightens me, though.  It’s a different colour (and flavour?  I don’t know, I’d rather not drink it) every day.  After it sits all night, foamy legs start extending down into the liquid from the top surface.  I worry that if I take the lid off, it might lunge at me.

 

Loved this post! 😀 I also thought that the aging tea carafe was a little scary, and the taste didn’t appeal to me anyway when it first appeared.

 

But it went away, never to return.

[mfs2k]

18 minutes ago, Stateroom_Sailor said:

 

Ok, so with inflation that is $22.15 today, much more reasonable.

 

It seems Celebrity was willing to trade fewer guests for higher prices. 

They can have the same revenue in a specialty restaurant and lower their food costs at the same time because they’re serving fewer people there.  

 

Hotels do this daily. When they raise rates, demand (occupancy) drops so they’re constantly looking for the sweet spot with maximum revenue. 

[hcat]

23 minutes ago, Stateroom_Sailor said:

 

Ok, so with inflation that is $22.15 today, much more reasonable.

 

The first Specialty Restaurants were " special" in  terms of service, ambiance, menu and quality of food.  And  they were worth an upgraded price..not always so nowadays , nd the prices are higher.  Making staff push upgrades is degrading!

[mfs2k]

1 minute ago, hcat said:

  Making staff push upgrades is degrading!

 

I feel like cruise staff have been pushing up-sells for as long as I remember since my first cruise in the 80’s. It started with photos;; drinks by the pool; massages, excursions; shop sales (remember gold chains by the inch?) and port talks pushing specific stores which kicked back commissions to the cruise lines. Now it’s also art, specialty restaurants, mocha macchiatos, premium drink packages, glass blowing classes, spa treatments, fitness classes,  etc. 

 

This is what mass market cruising is all about and if you hate it,  you’re not going to have a good time on board unless you can tune it all out and not let it bother you. 

[Stateroom_Sailor]

35 minutes ago, mfs2k said:

 

It seems Celebrity was willing to trade fewer guests for higher prices. 

They can have the same revenue in a specialty restaurant and lower their food costs at the same time because they’re serving fewer people there.  

 

Hotels do this daily. When they raise rates, demand (occupancy) drops so they’re constantly looking for the sweet spot with maximum revenue. 

 

Fine by me, X just needs to learn to be ok with it too.

[Cruise a holic]

On 2/17/2019 at 7:36 PM, tallnthensome said:

Yea, they could start by charging half of what they do normally if they want to fill specialty restaurants. I'm not paying six thousand dollars for a cruise and then paying another $30 per person to eat. They can kiss my rear end ...... Glad to hear they have to beg. Maybe they'll buy a clue. 

Ironically on the edge- which is a more expensive cruise with more expensive specialty restaurants, we were closed out of many. Many people will still pay additional for the experience.  It works for some-  We book a special package before the cruise that works out for half of what it would cost "retail".

Edited February 20, 2019 by Cruise a holic

[yorky]

3 hours ago, mfs2k said:

 

It seems Celebrity was willing to trade fewer guests for higher prices. 

They can have the same revenue in a specialty restaurant and lower their food costs at the same time because they’re serving fewer people there.  

 

Hotels do this daily. When they raise rates, demand (occupancy) drops so they’re constantly looking for the sweet spot with maximum revenue. 

Paying for the speciality restaurants in advance it’s £26 for us. With inflation not that different.

[floralscent]

On our last cruise, which was a month ago on the Edge, we had specialty restaurants reserved for 6 of the 7 nights and we were still hounded.  I find it super annoying to have paid extra for meals and then still having to deal with being asked to visit the restaurants. I know the crew didn’t know we had already reserved dining but come on Celebrity. We reserved prior to boarding so we didn’t have to think about it. 

 

The other annoyance to me was the number of voicemails being left on our cabin phone about deals on spa services, invites to events, etc.  

 

Celebrity...hear this, stop the madness!  It’s out of control. 

[mfs2k]

This thread reminds me of all inclusive guests complaining because the resort has a sales team to sell time-shares and they find it intrusive.

 

"Just say 'no'" 

"Don't sweat the small stuff." 

"Life is too short."

"Go with the flow"

"Any day at sea, fending off aggressive salespeople, is better than a day at work."  

 

Insert your own cliché here. 

[Stateroom_Sailor]

7 minutes ago, mfs2k said:

This thread reminds me of all inclusive guests complaining because the resort has a sales team to sell time-shares and they find it intrusive.

 

"Just say 'no'" 

"Don't sweat the small stuff." 

"Life is too short."

"Go with the flow"

"Any day at sea, fending off aggressive salespeople, is better than a day at work."  

 

Insert your own cliché here. 

 

I will not be surprised to see timeshares sold at sea sometime soon.  For only $40,000, and $2,000 a year in maintenance dues, you can sail each year in the Caribbean for *FREE*.  Terms apply, subject to off season availability, an inside cabin for 5-7 days. 

[mfs2k]

10 minutes ago, Stateroom_Sailor said:

 

I will not be surprised to see timeshares sold at sea sometime soon.  For only $40,000, and $2,000 a year in maintenance dues, you can sail each year in the Caribbean for *FREE*.  Terms apply, subject to off season availability, an inside cabin for 5-7 days. 

 

https://www.sellmytimesharenow.com/blog/set-sail-cruise-timeshare/

 

[Jim_Iain]

20 hours ago, mek said:

And that is exactly why I personally think being a "loyalist" to one brand eventually leads to disappointment.  Same old, same old - and when cutbacks, changes, or whatever you want to call them occur they become major problems.  By switching brands, things always seem new(er) and  different and changes are less noticeable.

I have to agree.   It is not limited to cruise ships.   Look how the airlines are nickle and dimeing us to death.

Based in San Francisco I am a 2 Million Flyer on United and have Gold Status for life and free upgrade to Premium Economy for Life.    In the past 2 years 90% of our travel has been on Delta - as of recent better service, better prices.    Would I prefer United yes but only if they are competitive.   Let your feet to the walking.

 

If you don't like the product find a better one.     I personally still like the Celebrity product but do miss some of the things that have disappeared.

[effinaround]

My wife and I have become Cruise and Airline agnostic. We'll travel on a variety of carriers and cruise lines wherever we think we'll get the best fit for that particular itinerary.  The one thing the cruise lines need to understand, and I mentioned this on my very first cruise a couple of years ago on the NCL Jade, for some of us the cruise is the destination, or a big part of it, and not just a conveyance.  I got the distinct impression NCL was trying to Ryanair the voyage. Some don't mind looking at air travel as nothing more than an A to B experience but to me, a cruise is a floating resort that allows me to see a number of places in comfort and with good service.  If they start treating it as a ferry service, that's troubling. 

[hcat]

5 hours ago, mfs2k said:

 

I feel like cruise staff have been pushing up-sells for as long as I remember since my first cruise in the 80’s. It started with photos;; drinks by the pool; massages, excursions; shop sales (remember gold chains by the inch?) and port talks pushing specific stores which kicked back commissions to the cruise lines. Now it’s also art, specialty restaurants, mocha macchiatos, premium drink packages, glass blowing classes, spa treatments, fitness classes,  etc. 

 

This is what mass market cruising is all about and if you hate it,  you’re not going to have a good time on board unless you can tune it all out and not let it bother you. 

 

We always have a good time but   it is sad that Celebrity has succumbed by being ."Royalized! "

 

The Mattress sales pitches are a new twist!

[Baron Barracuda]

14 hours ago, richstowe said:

Umm , like how much of a discount ? 

 

We don't bite for less than 50% off,and on longer sailings are usually able to get it.  Also, after dining in specialty have often been approached by hw and offered 50% off to return later in cruise.

[jan-n-john]

1 hour ago, Baron Barracuda said:

 

We don't bite for less than 50% off,and on longer sailings are usually able to get it.  Also, after dining in specialty have often been approached by hw and offered 50% off to return later in cruise.

 

Are there discounts on specialty dining available on Edge as yet, and if so how much?  Is there much choice of dining times?  Anyone have any experience to share so far? 

[chemmo]

1 hour ago, Baron Barracuda said:

 

We don't bite for less than 50% off,and on longer sailings are usually able to get it.  Also, after dining in specialty have often been approached by hw and offered 50% off to return later in cruise.

 

Whilst I am pleased you personally  get these deals it is the fact you can that is probably resulting in the present scenario.....

 

X can keep pre cruise prices for speciality restaurants high knowing that if sales are low there will be guests on board who will ‘bite’ when the price drops low enough....

 

The fact that many cruisers with your philosophy may walk away when they offer you 40% off but turn and agree at a 50% discount may explain some of the ‘chasing down the hallway’ experiences described here...

 

For us, personally, we have never had a real issue. We generally book RS so have speciality dining included...When approached we can say we are all sorted. I just find it sad that guests who are happy to pay more for a special meal are in a situation of either risking ‘paying over the top’ pre cruise or needing to ‘haggle’ for a deal on board.

 

Haggling to me is not a good marketing ploy for X or a pleasant holiday experience for cruise guests. ‘Haggling’ is something that should take place in a European market square, not on a cruise ship...Having ‘vendors’ becoming insistent and invasive is also not acceptable.

 

Some of the contributors to this post are CC and Celebrity regulars who don’t regularly moan so for them to post that their cruise experience is being compromised by excessive marketing does imply that the system needs managing or at least monitoring.

 

Baron Baraccuda, my apologies if this seems to be critical of you, my comments are not directed to you but the present system.  

 

If more and more cruisers wait until they cruise for ‘bargains on board’ because pre cruise pricing is not appealing the situation is unlikely to improve. 

 

If I was on the Celebrity sales team I would be looking at selling more pre cruise dining packages....

 

 

 

 

[ghstudio]

29 minutes ago, chemmo said:

 

 

Some of the contributors to this post are CC and Celebrity regulars who don’t regularly moan so for them to post that their cruise experience is being compromised by excessive marketing does imply that the system needs managing or at least monitoring.

 

If I was on the Celebrity sales team I would be looking at selling more pre cruise dining packages....

 

I am sure that Celebrity is focused on selling pre-cruise dining, excursions, spa packages, etc.  Perhaps they could send more emails with special sales.....

 

As far as being hassled, I actually find haggling for a good price a more interesting activity than "ping pong table open between 9 and 5 for free play" or "the grand chocolate diamond unveiling".  Perhaps celebrity should consider putting another activity on the daily schedule  9-10AM  "Haggling 101: try your luck and maybe win a specialty restaurant meal with your offer"....hmm, actually not a bad idea and certainly better (sorry, I know this is argumentative) than the Park West Art Auctions.

[chemmo]

5 minutes ago, ghstudio said:

I am sure that Celebrity is focused on selling pre-cruise dining, excursions, spa packages, etc.  Perhaps they could send more emails with special sales.....

 

As far as being hassled, I actually find haggling for a good price a more interesting activity than "ping pong table open between 9 and 5 for free play" or "the grand chocolate diamond unveiling".  Perhaps celebrity should consider putting another activity on the daily schedule  9-10AM  "Haggling 101: try your luck and maybe win a specialty restaurant meal with your offer"....hmm, actually not a bad idea and certainly better (sorry, I know this is argumentative) than the Park West Art Auctions.

 

Perhaps you have the two key phrases  to this thread..

 

‘haggling’ and ‘being hassled’...At what point is the boundary crossed?

[yorky]

3 hours ago, effinaround said:

My wife and I have become Cruise and Airline agnostic. We'll travel on a variety of carriers and cruise lines wherever we think we'll get the best fit for that particular itinerary.  The one thing the cruise lines need to understand, and I mentioned this on my very first cruise a couple of years ago on the NCL Jade, for some of us the cruise is the destination, or a big part of it, and not just a conveyance.  I got the distinct impression NCL was trying to Ryanair the voyage. Some don't mind looking at air travel as nothing more than an A to B experience but to me, a cruise is a floating resort that allows me to see a number of places in comfort and with good service.  If they start treating it as a ferry service, that's troubling. 

Agreed, the cruise ship is the holiday for us and not the destination in many ways. Celebrity, certainly on the S class ships still has an awful lot we like. The design of the pool area with plenty of shade, indoor pool, buffet area, speciality restaurant( Murano) free room service with breakfast on our balcony, the staff, ship design and decor. It’s not what it was, but it’s still our preferred choice just ahead of Cunard.

[ghstudio]

46 minutes ago, chemmo said:

 

Perhaps you have the two key phrases  to this thread..

 

‘haggling’ and ‘being hassled’...At what point is the boundary crossed?

 

One doesn't know what hassling is until you've been to Turkey, Morocco. India.   It's a bit like the drivers in Rome being the worst in the world (my taxi drove on the sidewalk)...until you go to Istanbul (where I covered my eyes).  But then you realize that Turkish drivers are actually wonderful drivers when you go to Northern Vietnam(imagine a six lane road where any lane can go in any direction depending on who's there first).  Do not ever ever ever consider renting a car in Northern Vietnam 🙂

 

No offense meant to those who live in any of the countries I mentioned...this is based on my personal observations.

Edited February 20, 2019 by ghstudio

[Baron Barracuda]

We have no problem haggling.  Treat it as a game to see how low they are willing to go.  Would never pay anywhere near list price because frankly don't feel specialties are all that special.  Back in the day Ocean Liners was much more special and at a significantly lower price.  Long, luxurious meal comparable to Chef's Table today.

[smtcan]

3 hours ago, ghstudio said:

 

One doesn't know what hassling is until you've been to Turkey, Morocco. India.   It's a bit like the drivers in Rome being the worst in the world (my taxi drove on the sidewalk)...until you go to Istanbul (where I covered my eyes).  But then you realize that Turkish drivers are actually wonderful drivers when you go to Northern Vietnam(imagine a six lane road where any lane can go in any direction depending on who's there first).  Do not ever ever ever consider renting a car in Northern Vietnam 🙂

 

No offense meant to those who live in any of the countries I mentioned...this is based on my personal observations.

I loved this post.  In Istanbul a taxi actually drove  us down a street of outdoor restaurants - the customers moved their chairs so we could reach our hotel.  We are heading to Vietnam on our next cruise so will see if that experience exceeds Istanbul.

[freddie]

4 hours ago, chemmo said:

 

If more and more cruisers wait until they cruise for ‘bargains on board’ because pre cruise pricing is not appealing the situation is unlikely to improve. 

 

If I was on the Celebrity sales team I would be looking at selling more pre cruise dining packages....

 

Chemmo - Your comments seem to be quite reasonable.   If X creates a pattern that suggests that waiting to book until one is aboard will give the opportunity for a better price for specialty dining, then, of course, people will wait until they are aboard to book such.   That results in the unpleasant dynamic described in this thread of touts dashing about the ship trying to convince, cajole, or coerce pax into signing up for restaurant Y or Z.  Hmm, perhaps the same "suit" who hired a designer who has never been on a ship to determine what will work in the "Revolutionized" cabins is the same person who has determined that it would be preferable for people for be harassed for specialty dining than simply be offered the same price in advance of boarding??