New "fee" of $14/day on Perks Drink Package to be added?

[Fouremco]

2 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

If you, normally drink the alcohol, coffees, sodas, etc, then it makes sense. If you increase your consumption just to get your "monies worth", then you are the target demographic.

To repeat what I've already said several times, sometimes we get the package and sometimes we don't, the itinerary and the cost being two of the deciding factors. So, no, we would never increase our consumption to get our money's worth. That said, yes, we drink more on some cruises than we would typically at home. On a Caribbean cruise sitting around the pool on a hot sea day, we'll definitively consume more liquids than we would on a normal day at home, but the liquids are by no means all booze. We are also more inclined to have wine with and perhaps a specialty coffee and liquor after dinner when we are on holiday. But we are also inclined to see a show every night while cruising, something we'd not do at home, so comparing life aboard with life at home is really a bit silly.

[bubbachief]

We stopped getting the beverage package as we are Elite + and find the happy hour is enough for drinks and we get free coffee at Cafe El Bacio.

We take the  $300 OBC in lieu of the drink package and IF we feel the need for a special drink, use it instead.

[hcat]

we are moving in that direction next time we book

[Oceangoer2]

16 hours ago, RICCruisers said:

Trying to theorize why X is implementing this new charge is fruitless.

 

None of us were in the room where the decision was made. I know many people complain about X’s IT Department. I can assure you those IT folks are using a wide variety of analytics to slice and dice the revenue to make a variety of recommendations on how maximize revenue. Celebrity has all of our personal information like age, zip codes, # of cruises, which perks are selected, which web pages we view and much much more. Toss all of this information into a computer program and we’d all be amazed at what gets spit out. 

 

They likely analyze each cruise and  know how many guests had which perks. They can then run the numbers against the demographics of that cruise. They can then run the numbers breaking them out by who the Captain, Hotel Director, Cruise Director or F&B Director was. The number of Sea Days can also be thrown into the mix which can tell them the optimal number when planning future cruise calendars. The amount of information available is endless. The tricky part is how to best use it. 

 

Or or maybe I’m totally wrong and they just throw ideas against the wall and see what sticks. 

 

Many of you have strong opinions about LLP. I have my own. Pro or Con, one thing I do know is she is a smart businesswoman who is definitely making changes at Celebrity and using as much input as she can get in order make Celebrity successful. 

 

Time to get off my soapbox, my time is up. 

It seems to me the most important data would be breaking down the number of drinks per passenger by age group.  Not a generalization in any way, but past cruisers majority may have been of a more senior generation (who MAY have been less inclined to take advantage of the BP), but since the BP perk has encouraged a younger demographic the # of drinks MAY have increased per passenger.  So....IMO...the older generation may now be supplementing the younger one.  Not sure what this has to do with marketing, pricing, etc....sort "by who the Captain, Hotel Director, Cruise Director or F&B Director was"

Edited September 30, 2019 by oceangoer2

[Oceangoer2]

1 hour ago, Wine-O said:

Can you drink $70 worth of booze, coffee, water, juice, soft drinks, wine, etc. each and every day at home?  I would say, probably not.  If you were to drink $70-$100 worth of "stuff" on a cruise ship at the price they charge, the cruise ship's actual cost probably wouldn't be anywhere close to $10 a day.  This is a pure money maker for Celebrity -- that's why they are pushing it.  🍷

I wish I knew what the cost of each drink onboard is...after many cruises with X and purchasing the BP (probably because of convenience not quantity), I'd like to break it out and see if we are actually overpaying with the BP.  Beer, Wine by the glass, mimosa, occasional mixed drink, water, canned cola...have no idea what each costs.

[angelhelly]

I am allergic to alcohol so I would just get the classic non alcoholic package if I had to book out of pocket. My husband would book the premium package. Now, compare to a $300 obc, the packages still wins. If we add $14 a day on top of it, I'm not so sure.  Since the classic non-alcoholic is $18 per day, I'd say we basically just have my husband's for free, and even then. 

 

I wish we could decide the level of package we want, and pay the upcharge accordingly. 

Edited September 30, 2019 by angelhelly

[wpgcycler]

3 minutes ago, oceangoer2 said:

I wish I knew what the cost of each drink onboard is...after many cruises with X and purchasing the BP (probably because of convenience not quantity), I'd like to break it out and see if we are actually overpaying with the BP.  Beer, Wine by the glass, mimosa, occasional mixed drink, water, canned cola...have no idea what each costs.

 

wallie5446 who seems to have not posted here for some time came up with what he called his "RUFF" run down of a day with the Premium Beverage Package. His post is at least 5 years old - the drink prices have surely increased since then. Here is a copy of his original post:

 

Here is my "RUFF" run down of a day with a drink pkg on another thread:

 

For us at least, the package was not just about 'grog' that would make us not remember the cruise! It was everything else that the pkg includes.

 

A speciality coffee each on the balcony while the wifester is putting on her face, $5 ea.

 

Evian or San Pellegrino with fresh squeezed juice with that second coffee at breakfast, $15 ea.

 

Grab a bottle water on the way to stake out a deck chair, $4 ea.

$24 each before any mind altering liquid is consumed.

 

A beer or the drink of the day by the pool, $6 ea

Then off to lunch, maybe a soda, or another San Pellegrino $5 ea

The sun is hot hot hot! A cold beer or drink of the day is in order, $6 ea

The burger at the Mast Grill is calling our names, it does not go down with out some liquid assistance, $5 ea, then it is time to meet friends to watch the sun set from the Sunset Bar, $6 ea. Afternoon total $28.

And the evening fun has yet to begin.

San Pellegrino and a couple of glasses of wine with dinner, and another speciality coffee with desert, $26 ea

Now it is time for some mind altering sampling to happen, or not A cocktail with friends at one of the watering holes on ship $7 ea, or 2 if we are letting our hair down!

One more bottle water on the way back to the cabin just in case we get thirsty during the night, $4. Evening total, $44.

Morning, $24, day, $28, evening $44, total $96.00 each useing the low end of the cost scale and not much mind altering substance.

Some evening's we will grab another coffee ( or worse) and go and sit on deck 5 to unwind, listen to the swoosh of the waves gently breaking down the side of the ship before heading to the cabin.

 

We upgraded to the Premium on the Reflection last Nov as most of the wine the wifester drank was at a higher price point, as were my selections from the Craft beer menu.

 

 

[RICCruisers]

7 minutes ago, oceangoer2 said:

It seems to me the most important data would be breaking down the number of drinks per passenger by age group.  Not a generalization in any way, but past cruisers majority may have been of a more senior generation (who MAY have been less inclined to take advantage of the BP), but since the BP perk has encouraged a younger demographic the # of drinks MAY have increased per passenger.  So....IMO...the older generation may now be supplementing the younger one.  Not sure what this has to do with marketing, pricing, etc....sort "by who the Captain, Hotel Director, Cruise Director or F&B Director was"

The main purpose of my post was to show that Celebrity has a vast amount of data that they collect on passengers and where they drink, eat and spend their discretionary dollars. 

 

The comment about the staff positions was meant to show how Celebrity can track onboard spending and maybe get useful information about which officers are the most profitable for the cruise line.  This is a financial data analysis vs. a marketing analysis and is totally off topic, but sometimes I write in a stream of consciousness.  If Captain/CD/Hotel Director/F&B Director Y is consistently generating a higher per capita in onboard spending than Captain/CD/Hotel Director/F&B Director Z on comparable cruises, is there a best practice that Officers Y are implementing that could be adopted across all ships.  Celebrity could also use this as one metric when reviewing performance and likely are for the revenue producing departments.

 

 

 

 

[Fogfog]

Can someone show WHERE it reads that it is $14 pp pd IF one choses the classic as a "perk"?

The perks always raised the cruisefare as they were bundled/discounted

 

I am reading that the bev package will raise the cruisefare--but thats always been the case

 

I thought this flyer meant there was an additional $200 obc per stateroom if booked between certain dates and sailing between certain dates

 

All other terms/conditions seemed the same as before, some refundable, some non refundables,  2 or 4 perks...which always raises the cruisefare.

 

As for "serious" drinkers--the bev package can be a deal If you drink a variety of drinks such as specialty coffees (espressos or cappuchinos several times a day), vitamin waters, pelligrino, etc, smoothies, fresh juices at breakfast, then a drink before dinner, wine pairing with dinner... and so on

So it is not about consuming large amounts of alcohol that makes the bev package a value

YMMV

[Oceangoer2]

11 minutes ago, RICCruisers said:

The main purpose of my post was to show that Celebrity has a vast amount of data that they collect on passengers and where they drink, eat and spend their discretionary dollars. 

 

The comment about the staff positions was meant to show how Celebrity can track onboard spending and maybe get useful information about which officers are the most profitable for the cruise line.  This is a financial data analysis vs. a marketing analysis and is totally off topic, but sometimes I write in a stream of consciousness.  If Captain/CD/Hotel Director/F&B Director Y is consistently generating a higher per capita in onboard spending than Captain/CD/Hotel Director/F&B Director Z on comparable cruises, is there a best practice that Officers Y are implementing that could be adopted across all ships.  Celebrity could also use this as one metric when reviewing performance and likely are for the revenue producing departments.

 

 

 

 

I can't remember when ANY ship officer or staff member has ever influenced whether I would order a drink.  Perhaps a particularly entertaining group would keep us in the bar longer so that would be worth analyzing, but the officers?  Don't even see them, unless they're around the Martini Bar on special evenings talking to each other and ignoring passengers for the most part.

[goofysmom99]

19 minutes ago, Fogfog said:

Can someone show WHERE it reads that it is $14 pp pd IF one choses the classic as a "perk"?

 

 

Go back to the second post, click on the flyer link, go all the way to the bottom, and it begins on line 8 of the fine print at the bottom.  Doesn't specifically say $14, just increase if you choose classic beverage package, based on length of the cruise.  Usually lots of annoying little details can be found in X's fine print.

Edited September 30, 2019 by goofysmom99

[davekathy]

10 minutes ago, Fogfog said:

Can someone show WHERE it reads that it is $14 pp pd IF one choses the classic as a "perk"?

The perks always raised the cruisefare as they were bundled/discounted

 

I am reading that the bev package will raise the cruisefare--but thats always been the case

 

I thought this flyer meant there was an additional $200 obc per stateroom if booked between certain dates and sailing between certain dates

 

All other terms/conditions seemed the same as before, some refundable, some non refundables,  2 or 4 perks...which always raises the cruisefare.

 

As for "serious" drinkers--the bev package can be a deal If you drink a variety of drinks such as specialty coffees (espressos or cappuchinos several times a day), vitamin waters, pelligrino, etc, smoothies, fresh juices at breakfast, then a drink before dinner, wine pairing with dinner... and so on

So it is not about consuming large amounts of alcohol that makes the bev package a value

YMMV

Agree, others have posted for purchasing the BPs the $14.00 a day increase but nothing that says the $14.00 a day will be added to the bundled BP perk.  

[Oceangoer2]

35 minutes ago, wpgcycler said:

 

wallie5446 who seems to have not posted here for some time came up with what he called his "RUFF" run down of a day with the Premium Beverage Package. His post is at least 5 years old - the drink prices have surely increased since then. Here is a copy of his original post:

 

Here is my "RUFF" run down of a day with a drink pkg on another thread:

 

For us at least, the package was not just about 'grog' that would make us not remember the cruise! It was everything else that the pkg includes.

 

A speciality coffee each on the balcony while the wifester is putting on her face, $5 ea.

 

Evian or San Pellegrino with fresh squeezed juice with that second coffee at breakfast, $15 ea.

 

Grab a bottle water on the way to stake out a deck chair, $4 ea.

$24 each before any mind altering liquid is consumed.

 

A beer or the drink of the day by the pool, $6 ea

Then off to lunch, maybe a soda, or another San Pellegrino $5 ea

The sun is hot hot hot! A cold beer or drink of the day is in order, $6 ea

The burger at the Mast Grill is calling our names, it does not go down with out some liquid assistance, $5 ea, then it is time to meet friends to watch the sun set from the Sunset Bar, $6 ea. Afternoon total $28.

And the evening fun has yet to begin.

San Pellegrino and a couple of glasses of wine with dinner, and another speciality coffee with desert, $26 ea

Now it is time for some mind altering sampling to happen, or not A cocktail with friends at one of the watering holes on ship $7 ea, or 2 if we are letting our hair down!

One more bottle water on the way back to the cabin just in case we get thirsty during the night, $4. Evening total, $44.

Morning, $24, day, $28, evening $44, total $96.00 each useing the low end of the cost scale and not much mind altering substance.

Some evening's we will grab another coffee ( or worse) and go and sit on deck 5 to unwind, listen to the swoosh of the waves gently breaking down the side of the ship before heading to the cabin.

 

We upgraded to the Premium on the Reflection last Nov as most of the wine the wifester drank was at a higher price point, as were my selections from the Craft beer menu.

 

 

I love this OP's sense of humour....thanks for the post...DH can crank out the abacus and do the math for comparison.

[Fogfog]

Just now, goofysmom99 said:

Go back to the second post, click on the flyer link, go all the way to the bottom, and it begins on line 8 of the fine print at the bottom.  Doesn't specifically say $14, just increase if you choose classic beverage package, based on length of the cruise.  Usually lots of annoying little details can be found in X's fine print.

Thanks

I read that. Think is we always choose the bev package and either grats or OBC depending on bang for the buck. The fare is always higher as he perks are never free.

I don't see $14 anywhere. 

If they are charging JUST $14 a day for the bev as a perk thats a deal over the retail cost. Even with BOGO or the 50% off sales..its never that cheap

 

Is there an additional $200 per stateroom OBC? Or do I misunderstand that?

 

[bikerunner]

We will find out how it affects things in a few days on pricing, cant keep looking at what ifs etc.  Until it is live, most likely not working correctly based on Celebrity's IT prowess cant say how it will affect things completely. 

[Fogfog]

4 minutes ago, oceangoer2 said:

I love this OP's sense of humour....thanks for the post...DH can crank out the abacus and do the math for comparison.

Great post

We ran similar numbers and if one has 1 martini-thats $14...

The Prem package works for us from sun up coffees, to end of the day Pellergino in the room

Also the non alcoholic beers-- the better ones are on prem only

Edited September 30, 2019 by Fogfog

[wrk2cruise]

23 minutes ago, Fogfog said:

I thought this flyer meant there was an additional $200 obc per stateroom if booked between certain dates and sailing between certain dates

 

The current promo:

 

Suites save $500

 

New Promo

 

Suites get $800 OBC

 

 

So it's not really additional OBC, at least for regular cabins, they have changed from a "discount" of $400 to providing you $400 of OBC.   Remember OBC $$$ cost them much less than 1:1.  I much prefer to save the money upfront and maybe not spend it on my vacation than to have them "give" me something I have to spend.  Net more $$ out of my pocket.

 

I will say that it seems to have been the consensus over the last few years that the CBP was generally considered more valuable than the other 3 choices.  I personally have never selected it a as a perk but understand I'm probably in a very small minority.

 

 

Edited September 30, 2019 by wrk2cruise

[Toftwood]

2 minutes ago, oceangoer2 said:

I can't remember when ANY ship officer or staff member has ever influenced whether I would order a drink.  Perhaps a particularly entertaining group would keep us in the bar longer so that would be worth analyzing, but the officers?  Don't even see them, unless they're around the Martini Bar on special evenings talking to each other and ignoring passengers for the most part.

I do think that some officers and senior staff can significantly change the vibe on a ship. If they create a good feel not only amongst their passengers but even more importantly amongst their crew, you will feel you are on a different cruise. You may stay in a bar longer or stay up later (both equal more money spent).

 

I have been on cruises where the CD, HD and others have helped create such a good atmosphere that some of the bands and musicians would play late into the evening long beyond their allotted time because their audiences were having such a good time.

[miched]

How can they lose money on a bev pack.   Easy the same way that the auto companies have billions in profits but lost money.   They lost money because they didn’t make as much profit as they projected they would.

 

At the daily rate of $59 for the Classic and then the 20% gratuity that pays for the employees there is no way anyone can drink that amount of anything per day.

 

You can at the inflated prices that they charge but considering the actual cost no way

 

A premium case of beer is around $34 and that is for 24 bottles.   Does anyone drink a case a day?  

 

A better than bottom shelf  bottle of liquor is $40 to 50.  Does anyone drink a whole bottle a day?

 

Water.  Can get about 48 bottles for $3

 

And these are retail prices, not wholesale or duty free.

 

Happy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅

[Spif Barwunkel]

I'm going to sit back, have a Bluefish Martini, and contemplate this interesting and enjoyable discussion. As I see it this price increase, add-on, additional fee, (call it what you will) is no different than with any other product or service. If it happens (and it might not) we all will choose what works best for us. Personally, I see no reason for consternation or indignation. In fact I'm going to have another chilled libation. Business is business, fun is fun and in many cases the two are tied together by the strong desire and need for $$$. Perhaps increasing the cost of a very popular perk or offering is better than doing away with it altogether. You be the judge.

 

Cheers!  

[MightyMike]

No measurement is perfect, and everyone is entitled to placing their own value on each perk, but for a 7-day cruise in a standard stateroom, here are the prices one would pay to purchase each perk on their own:

 

$150 per person to spend onboard For Two      $300.00

Prepaid Tips For Two                                          $203.00

Unlimited Internet For Two                                 $358.00

Classic Beverage Package For Two                   $991.20

 

Even after taking into account higher markups for alcohol, one of those options really sticks out. I don't like the price increase, but I do understand it.

[rimmit]

1 hour ago, MightyMike said:

No measurement is perfect, and everyone is entitled to placing their own value on each perk, but for a 7-day cruise in a standard stateroom, here are the prices one would pay to purchase each perk on their own:

 

$150 per person to spend onboard For Two      $300.00

Prepaid Tips For Two                                          $203.00

Unlimited Internet For Two                                 $358.00

Classic Beverage Package For Two                   $991.20

 

Even after taking into account higher markups for alcohol, one of those options really sticks out. I don't like the price increase, but I do understand it.

 

I think the bigger question is which perk has the actual highest true cost to X. Not what they publish it is worth.

 

$300 OBC-  In all honesty, in terms of true cost this is the most highly variable.  If someone used their OBC and bought a bunch of stuff from the onboard retailers, the true cost to them could be as low as $25-50 dollars based on what people are buying from their onboard stores.  If they are buying duty free alcohol, probably more in the $100-150 range of true cost.  I am not sure of this as I do not go to the casino, but if this can just be converted at the casino with only a surcharge, then that would be the most expensive as that would nearly $300 cash out, assuming you just cashed it out and did not lose it in the casino.

 

Prepaid tips for two - Given that I am not sure the exact reimbursement model of x to their employees, I am betting this is also a little pricey. Especially since this is straight up $203 for 7 nights or $406 nights.  This varies the most by sailing, but assuming they truly give this to their employees, IMO this has the potential to be the MOST EXPENSIVE perk to Celebrity as it is straight up money that you likely would have spent otherwise that they now have to foot the bill for.  It's a straight $1=$1 conversion. 

 

Unlimited Internet - Not sure what X pays their internet provider, so I am not sure the exact cost of this to X, but I am betting it is nowhere near $358 dollars for two people for a week.  This is likely the cheapest perk for them to give out.

 

CBP for 2 - Now this is IMO is likely one of the cheapest perks in all honesty.  Let's just take a bottle of Absolut.  Those are sold in the onboard duty free shops for like 4 for $50 or something crazy cheap like that.  I don't remember the exact price as I buy Grey Goose now, but at one point they were as low as 4 for $40, but I am assuming that the price has risen.  That is 4L of vodka.  or 89 shots.  Now most people are not drinking absolut straight, and not everyone drinks vodka, but I am just ball parking it here. So for $50 dollars at the Duty free shop you can get 89 shots of vodka.  The cruise line likely marks that up at least 30% if not more.  So let's conservatively say they mark it up 25%.  So those 89 drinks cost them about 32 dollars.  Or about 36 cents a shot.  You would be hard pressed to find someone that can drink 89 shots of vodka in a week.  There is also the cost of the mixers which varies, but lets's say that costs 20-40 cents based on the mixer.  You are looking at on the high end maybe 76 cents per mixed drink.  Now you are looking at labor costs, I am not sure what that would be, but I don't think they have hired any extra bar staff since the instigation of the BP's. I would argue it has been cut back a little, so their labor cost is the same as it always has been. 

 

Assuming the average person only has 6 mixed drinks/beer (and we will average up a lot here for easier math, plus there is the straw cost (0.01 cent), napkin cost (.02-.03)) at 1.00 a drink, maybe 3 pops at .30 cents a can, 3 bottled waters at .10 cent a bottle, and a specialty coffee at maybe 1.00 in cost.  We are at 7.30 cents for the actual cost of the items being consumed.    So grand total.....$7.30 plus labor costs.  I am not sure how X reimburses their wait staff, but I doubt it's a per drink basis.  There is increased dishwashing if not using disposable cups, but I can't imagine that adds but a couple cents per drink max.

 

So at $7.30x7 for a 7 night cruise you are at  $51.10 or $102.20 for two people. Again this is a BALLPARK and I am just calculating based on some assumptions. And this is assuming a sea day. These numbers go down drastically when in port.  The cruise lines hate the port days.  Kills their bottom line, but with the BP's they at least have something to look forward too.  

 

They value the BP so high because people want to drink on vacation and they know it. They have a monopoly and they can exploit it. Is it actually that expensive??  There is no way ANY HUMAN CAN DRINK 495.60 of alcohol at wholesale prices on the brands available on the CBP in a week and survive.  X makes money on these BP's NO MATTER WHAT.  To them it's the Opportunity cost that is costing them.  The question is how much would these people have spent without the BP?  Would we make more if we didn't have it at all?  Or would people drink less than 59.99+grats/day?  There is no way they lose money.  Just can't happen.  

Edited September 30, 2019 by rimmit

[hcat]

4 hours ago, oceangoer2 said:

It seems to me the most important data would be breaking down the number of drinks per passenger by age group.  Not a generalization in any way, but past cruisers majority may have been of a more senior generation (who MAY have been less inclined to take advantage of the BP), but since the BP perk has encouraged a younger demographic the # of drinks MAY have increased per passenger.  So....IMO...the older generation may now be supplementing the younger one.  Not sure what this has to do with marketing, pricing, etc....sort "by who the Captain, Hotel Director, Cruise Director or F&B Director was"

Sorry but I disagree... The bev packages encouraged  more  drinkers to come over to X as soon as they were introduced.  ...not age defined.  

[RichYak]

3 hours ago, miched said:

At the daily rate of $59 for the Classic and then the 20% gratuity that pays for the employees there is no way anyone can drink that amount of anything per day.

Challenge accepted 😎

[Iamcruzin]

7 hours ago, Fouremco said:

So I ask again, why would you buy one if you know you can't get your money's worth?

 

BTW, your contention that no-one could drink that much booze a day is far from factual. If you factor in the specialty coffees, water, juice, soft drinks, dinner wine, etc., it's very easy for even a reasonable drinker to exceed the daily cost of the package.

I agree but that’s only because the drinks A la carte are so expensive to begin with. I purchased the refreshment package on Royal Caribbean for $18 a day. $8.25 for fresh OJ and blended coffee $4.50. That was  $12.75 just at breakfast.

Edited October 1, 2019 by Iamcruzin