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Tom47

Crew working hours/salary

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See    https://www.businessinsider.com/cruise-ship-workers-describe-grueling-conditions-job-2019-11?fbclid=IwAR0AdYNceIv-BKre6mIxD3IzXfX_X706xnvh9tVGALoOOObJX_dblZMshg8

 

We have only been on 1 RCI cruise and have 2 more booked.  We have also cruised on Celebrity(8 times) and Azamara(4 times).  Azamara has the best service of all 3 with 400 crew for 690 pax, about 60% ratio.  We choose based on itinerary.  We have never cruised on any of the other cruise lines mentioned, but were considering HAL and Princess.   Any thoughts?

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What does ur cruise have to do with the stupid link you provided?  Seems purely a political post.  
 

Sigh

 

jc

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I think you get what you pay for ...

Tip more get more 

Yep the crew go home at the end of the day :classic_unsure:

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Crew to passenger rations have no bearing on pay or working hours. 

 

I was in Guatemala yesterday.  It was claimed by a local resident and our guide that the minimum wage is $250 per month and the the typical or average income is $400 per month.  Most people work two or three jobs working longer and more hours than cruise line crew on a ship.  

 

So what's the point of the story?  Yes people around the world in developing nations don't have the income that many people in developed nations do regardless if they work on a ship or in their home country.  Most crew come back year after year and many go on to have long terms of service.  They aren't forced to come back, they chose to.  In some cases because there are no or few jobs at home.  

 

Our guide after he finished his day with us went to his other job working in a call center.  That's his life at home - very long days, every day and weekend.

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Stareroom stewards: 22 cabins to serve,  $ 3,75 per day per pax, With 2 pax per cabin = $ 165/week + tip, a little more in suites, but fewer cabins to serve.And they pay a fee to the agency who hired them to RCI.

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Crew pay, tips, working conditions and home conditions have been beat to death here, many, many times. 

 

 

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Not sure I understand the point of you post.  The link you provide has no clear relevance to the content of your comments. (Relative to that, please understand that any employment service by the cruise line staff is completely voluntary).  First you just list your cruise line history. You then provide data that I guess just by crew to passenger ratio is intended to support your perception of service relative to one line, but then you indicate that you base your cruises on itinerary.  Finally, without defining any specific criteria of interest, you ask for input on two additional cruise lines.  Sorry, I just don't get what you are looking for with this - IMO just seems like random commentary.  Please clarify.

Edited by leaveitallbehind

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I’m with the others. What are you asking and what does crew salary have to do with anything?

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Clkarification:

We choose based on itinerary, service and no smoking inside ship.  Azamara evidently pays crew more(price includes tips & drinks).  On  our last cruise I said to our waiter"See you tomorrow."  He said tomorrow was his day off.  Their retention rate is in the 90s compared with 80% quoted in the article.  I heard an Azamara lecturer say something similar:  "Azamara pays better than the mass market lines and gives the crew more time off because they have such a high crew to pax ratio.  Mass market lines work their crew like dogs."

I was hoping for civilized responses not  the rude one from the obnoxious jerk, which is why I didn't elaborate.

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3 hours ago, sbtagent said:

Stareroom stewards: 22 cabins to serve,  $ 3,75 per day per pax, With 2 pax per cabin = $ 165/week + tip, a little more in suites, but fewer cabins to serve.And they pay a fee to the agency who hired them to RCI.

We've cruised on Hurtigruten and their staff is Norwegian (I see that's where you live).  Are you talking about Norwegian wages or US$  Norway is quite expensive and from talking to some locals it seems people get paid quite well.  Could you clarify please?

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Just in case you may not be aware, Azamara, is a subsidiary of RCI, which owns RCCL, Celebrity, Azamara, and has a majority share interest in Silversea.  (Other stakeholder interests include TUI and Pulllmantur).  While operating independently, they all fall under the same overall corporate management.  As with any publicly traded company, they likely all have similar operations guidelines and revenue goals to satisfy their shareholders, which would certainly include labor overhead.

 

All crew on all lines have time off during the week and are under contract for several months at a time, depending on crew or staff position. They all work hard, even with a higher crew to passenger ratio. And just because a higher fare may include beverages and gratuities does not mean that the crew is paid more - only that you don't pay separately for those items.  "Working them like dogs" is a bit of a strong stereotype statement that if true would IMO probably result in far greater turnover than the 20% you suggest with the mass market lines.  

 

And as mentioned before, all crew and staff positions are voluntary, so the work must not be that terrible if 80% of the employees are retained contract to contract.

 

And to your point about your selection criteria, of the lines you mention, only Celebrity and Azamara have a policy restricting indoor smoking and allowing it only on certain designated outside decks and areas.  The others still have designated indoor as well as outdoor smoking areas, most typically the casinos.  However Princess allows it in certain bars as well. 

 

Hope this helps.

Edited by leaveitallbehind

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I'm still not understanding the point of your thread, other than that one of your favored cruise lines pays their crew more than the mass market lines do. If this is important to you, and you find the service on mass market lines unacceptable, then by all means continue to sail Azamara. But as others have pointed out, employment on all cruise ships is voluntary and for a defined period. If pay and working conditions were that bad, you wouldn't see crew continuing to work for the same lines year after year. I wouldn't be surprised to see a higher pay scale on the luxury lines, any more than I would be surprised to see higher pay for a server at a Michelin star restaurant compared to one at Cracker Barrel.

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21 minutes ago, clo said:

We've cruised on Hurtigruten and their staff is Norwegian (I see that's where you live).  Are you talking about Norwegian wages or US$  Norway is quite expensive and from talking to some locals it seems people get paid quite well.  Could you clarify please?

Royal Caribbean ships of course, as this tread is linked to that company, and the onboard currency is us $

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3 minutes ago, sbtagent said:

Royal Caribbean ships of course, as this tread is linked to that company, and the onboard currency is us $

Sorry.  I thought it was a general convo about ships crews.

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1 minute ago, clo said:

Sorry.  I thought it was a general convo about ships crews.

Oh, I see the tread has been moved from royal caribbean board to ,ask a cruise question,.

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14 hours ago, Tom47 said:

 We have never cruised on any of the other cruise lines mentioned, but were considering HAL and Princess.   Any thoughts?

try them  & make your opinions

What works for others may not work for you

 

 

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Crew hours of work are highly regulated by the Maritime Labour Convention (MLC) of 2006 and the various subsequent amendments. The requirements of this Convention must be implemented by Flag States that are signatory to the convention.

 

With respect to the linked article, I didn't read it, as I find that most of them are inaccurate and the quoted crew members are not normally representative of the thousands of crew happily working on cruise ships and other vessels. The definition of a day off for a mariner is also significantly different than for those working ashore.

 

When I worked cruise ships my work/rest ratio was 4 months on/ 2 months off. How many landlubbers get 2 continuous 2 month breaks every year on full pay? During my 4 months aboard I had no landlubber type days off, as I worked a continuous 4 hr on, 8 hr off shift, with additional hours, as required. I note some contracts are now 10-12 wks on/ 10-12 wks off. When in port, when not on watch we could go ashore. The ratings & hotel crew may not have enjoyed the same ratio, but they still received at least a full month off between contracts. Some Lines now offer ratings 6 month contracts.

 

In addition to hours of work, all non-watchkeeping crew have In Port Manning (IPM) duties. Even alongside, the Master is required to maintain an adequate shipboard response. Therefore, each department has a number of IPM cards, which are distributed every time in port. The frequency depends on number of staff in any given department, but will be 1 day aboard about every 3 - 6 ports. The Premium/Luxury crews should have a better IMP ratio than mega ships. 

 

During time aboard, my commute to/from work was 10 to 15 seconds, while the ratings may require a few minutes. No 1 or 2 hour drives to/from work. All meals are also prepared, so no meal preparation or clean up time.

 

Cruise Lines are no different to shore side employers in that some are no doubt better than others. Some meet the minimum requirements of MLC 2006, while others provide better terms & conditions, to enhance employee retention and levels of service. While I am no longer privy to remuneration levels and contracts, I do believe that the Premium/Luxury brands, such as Azamara  probably have better terms & conditions of employment than some mega ships.

 

However, even with the continuous increase in the number of operational cruise ships and their ever increasing size, there is no shortage of crew members, many of whom return year after year. Why do they keep returning - in my experience of working and latterly cruising, many crew maintain an excellent standard of living in their home countries, well above what they could expect from local employment. 

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Back home do you choose which Restaurants you eat in based on staff wages? I don't think what anyone earns is any of yours or anyone else's business.

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16 hours ago, Tom47 said:

We have never cruised on any of the other cruise lines mentioned, but were considering HAL and Princess.   Any thoughts?

Anyone who wishes can tip extra to supplement the crew wage.  

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2 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Anyone who wishes can tip extra to supplement the crew wage.  

We do tip extra.

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OP, do you work for IRS or National Enquirer? Why are you so fixated on what other people make or their choice of employment? 

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6 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

Crew pay, tips, working conditions and home conditions have been beat to death here, many, many times. 

 

 

And not my concern or interest. We've never asked. 

Edited by davekathy

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Why anyone would ask crew what they make is far beyond me. I’m not sure what’s worse - asking crew their salaries or the topic of this thread - which still doesn’t make a lot of sense. 

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I suppose that crew members work very long hours. We always tip extra cause we feel for the crew.  Many of us realize that they sacrifice being g away from family which sucks . I never asked how much they make but obviously it is more than they can make at home

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22 minutes ago, Cruzaholic41 said:

Why anyone would ask crew what they make is far beyond me. I’m not sure what’s worse - asking crew their salaries or the topic of this thread - which still doesn’t make a lot of sense. 

I agree

I wonder if these people ask their local restaurant staff or supermarket employees how much they make ??

boggles the mind 🤔

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