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Windsurfboy

Will QM2 still call at Hong Kong in Feb

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According to the head of the U.S. Center for Disease Control (CDC), there were approximately 80,000 deaths from the flu last year just in the United States. While this was an exceptionally high number (30,000 is more typical), it far exceeds 300~ worldwide deaths so far from the Coronavirus.  Are cruise ships going to stop coming to U.S. ports during the 6 month of flu season? No. 

Based on the numbers being reported out of China on this new coronavirus,  the death rate is about on par or slightly lower than with the flu. Of course, we really don’t know how accurate the Chinese government numbers are. I was in China in 2002 and 2003 during the SARS epidemic but before the government owed up to it. All of a sudden, literally overnight, there were hand sanitizer stations everywhere, with no explanation. Now it looks like the Chinese government is trying to get out in front of this new virus. Let’s hope so. 

With all this said, for sure there is a heightened danger of being in the closed environment of a cruise ship. We’ve all seen how rapidly a norovirus can spread on a ship. I see no down side to cruise lines, airlines and even governments being overly cautious other than perhaps a few thousand individuals having to rearrange travel plans. However, I think we should keep all this in perspective and keep in mind that the news media sometimes tends to hype things up. So far it seems that rumors and false information is spreading faster that the virus. I've yet to see anything from CDC, WHO or the UN documenting that the infectious rate is higher or even equal then the flu. Here in Chicago, where I live, there is a women who returned from Wuhan China and developed the virus. Now her husband has it. Initially the news media reported it was spread through human to human contact. Now the hospital is reporting that he also traveled to Wuhan on a separate trip. This is not to say that it can't be spread through human to human contact. In the words of Winston Churchill, "Keep calm and carry on."

 

Jack

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Jack- the best post I have read so far about this corona thing! So much hysterie- all blown up by the eager press! I posted similar to yours over at X- board! I totaly agree with Churchill´s words!

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5 hours ago, LittleFish1976 said:

Is that sort of cough accompanied by an elevated body temperature, though? Usually that's one of the key signs that you've got an active infection. I think it's good that the cruise lines are taking this seriously - both for the sake of passengers and crew but also out of consideration for the people living in the ports who have to come into contact with us passengers.

 

I'm sailing soon and I find it reassuring that they're taking precautionary measures.


I’m glad too. Very.
 

As for “the cough” yes it often develops into serious chest infections, with raised temperatures - it has happened to me twice, with multiple courses of antibiotics being required. I just worry this may complicate matters.

 

Personally, I feel all cruises in the area should be cancelled.

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Comparing deaths to confirmed/symptomatic cases 

 

2019-nCov death rate is running at 2%,

 

US flu death rates runs at around 0.1%-0.13%(Past 10 years peak 0.18% 2010-2011)

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html

 

two other corona virus

SARS ~10% 

MERS ~40% 

 

Both had much lower confirmed cases.

 

One concern that may be contributing to the containment measures is the possibility of asymptomatic person to person transmission.

 

Still early days only 1 month in,  SARS took 6 months to contain.

 

One factor for cruise ships is they probably tend to have a higher concentration of people with compromised immune systems.

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https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

This is from John Hopkins and up dated regularly.

Clearly it is early days but the spread is escalating and countries are constantly making changes to their policies around entry.

Airlines and cruise lines are also advising of changes to operations.

Travellers are in a potentially challenging situation.

Can only imagine the plight of people living with the reality in places locked down.

Hopefully a vaccine can be developed soon to assist.  

Meanwhile safe cruising. 

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I just read about the three cruise ships in limbo in this area. Has Cunard changed their plans?

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I see Cunard has announced QE's upcoming calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai have been cancelled. No alternate ports scheduled yet. This is from their Travel Health Advisories page.

 

"As previously announced, Queen Mary 2 will no longer call at Hong Kong on February 18/19, and will instead berth at Singapore on the same dates. We will be removing calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai for Queen Elizabeth's upcoming itineraries in the next two months, and alternative ports will be announced as soon as possible. We will continue to monitor the situation for future Cunard calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai, and amend itineraries as necessary."

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On 2/1/2020 at 1:25 AM, insidecabin said:

Comparing deaths to confirmed/symptomatic cases 

 

2019-nCov death rate is running at 2%,

 

US flu death rates runs at around 0.1%-0.13%(Past 10 years peak 0.18% 2010-2011)

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html

 

two other corona virus

SARS ~10% 

MERS ~40% 

Thanks for these figures, insidecabin.  One other factor to consider is that the deaths have mostly in Wuhan, where hospitals and healthcare workers were quickly overburdened.  Outside of the province that includes Wuhan the mortality rate is only 0.16%. 

 

It is too early to say, really, but I’m given confidence that this coronavirus is comparable to flu (although that is still bad news for a typical cruise ship population, as you point out).  My fingers are crossed that we will be able to go on our QE trip to Japan in April.

 

Another fact, of interest to data geeks like me - coronaviruses range in severity of infection and in fact cause approx 1/4 of all common colds.  

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10 hours ago, bluemarble said:

I see Cunard has announced QE's upcoming calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai have been cancelled. No alternate ports scheduled yet. This is from their Travel Health Advisories page.

 

"As previously announced, Queen Mary 2 will no longer call at Hong Kong on February 18/19, and will instead berth at Singapore on the same dates. We will be removing calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai for Queen Elizabeth's upcoming itineraries in the next two months, and alternative ports will be announced as soon as possible. We will continue to monitor the situation for future Cunard calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai, and amend itineraries as necessary."

RCI and NCL have banned all chinese born cruisers from their ships irrespective of what country they currently live in. Carnival can't be far behind with a similar ban. Maybe a good thing, maybe a bad thing. Time will tell if these policies make a difference in the spread of the infection or not.

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Very dear friends of mine are scheduled for the QE in April visiting Japan- no China Stopps. They are also very concerned. NCL has canceled their Asien cruises for the whole of the year! Only time will tell!

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Hoping things go well for QM2.    Crystal Symphony is currently headed for Singapore and the authorities there are getting a little less accommodating than they were just a day or 2 ago.

 

1 hour ago, ryndam said:

New announcement. In order to satisfy the Singapore health authorities, everyone onboard, guests and crew, will have our temperature taken and recorded twice a day until we reach Singapore.

 

Rob

Hope QM2 does not have any problems with her 2 calls to Singapore.

 

Roy

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5 hours ago, ace2542 said:

RCI and NCL have banned all chinese born cruisers from their ships irrespective of what country they currently live in. Carnival can't be far behind with a similar ban. Maybe a good thing, maybe a bad thing. Time will tell if these policies make a difference in the spread of the infection or not.

that is a terrible racist policy, talk about xenophobia

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9 hours ago, ace2542 said:

RCI and NCL have banned all chinese born cruisers from their ships irrespective of what country they currently live in. Carnival can't be far behind with a similar ban. Maybe a good thing, maybe a bad thing. Time will tell if these policies make a difference in the spread of the infection or not.

 

Good job these ships aren't registered in UK that would be not only racist but illegal. 

 

Banning anyone whose been to mainland China in 14 days irrespective of nationality is sensible and not racist  ,but  this action is to be condemned. 

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48 minutes ago, Windsurfboy said:

 

Good job these ships aren't registered in UK that would be not only racist but illegal. 

 

Banning anyone whose been to mainland China in 14 days irrespective of nationality is sensible and not racist  ,but  this action is to be condemned. 

If these ships were registered in UK very few people could afford the ticket price with paying with paying UK minimum wage to all staff.

 

The cruise industry may not survive this outbreak unless partial steps like this are taken and although they don't let on some of these lines are in brand even financial trouble. I hate to point this out to this board but QM2 is NOT always full despite what they say with that sign at the desk. We did the 14 night Soton to Quebec via NYC in August and NYC-Quebec leg was dead yet they had the sign up at the desk saying ship is sailing full. 

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23 hours ago, bluemarble said:

I see Cunard has announced QE's upcoming calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai have been cancelled. No alternate ports scheduled yet. This is from their Travel Health Advisories page.

 

"As previously announced, Queen Mary 2 will no longer call at Hong Kong on February 18/19, and will instead berth at Singapore on the same dates. We will be removing calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai for Queen Elizabeth's upcoming itineraries in the next two months, and alternative ports will be announced as soon as possible. We will continue to monitor the situation for future Cunard calls to Hong Kong and Shanghai, and amend itineraries as necessary."

Berthing at Singapore is a brave choice, given that a whole chalet of people in France has just been quarantined because one of their number who had recently been in Singapore has come down with Corona virus.

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It appears Royal Carribean has banned all those holding Chinese, Hong Kong and Macau passports. It hasn't banned all those born in China. So a person born in China and holding a non-Chinese passport isn't banned..

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But a person with a Chinese Passport who has lived in say UK or US for last few years is banned. This is racist.

 

 

All you need to do is check anyone with a Chinese Passport and look for entry stamps more than 14 days ago.

 

 

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I agree , QM2 should aviod South East Asia,  go straight for a extended Australasian cruise. But I expect until travel advice mentions a SE Asia this will cause problems,  eg who is going to pay for altered flights,  insurance companies won't unless there is FCO advice not to go somewhere. 

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Singapore Ministry of Health  has stepped up the Singapore risk assessment from yellow to amber.

We got an email this morning instructing all employees to work from home starting Monday until further notice.

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there has just been an announcement onboard by the captain saying that the QM2 is skipping Phuket, Port Kelang and Penang......

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As soon as Cunard inform us of the changes to our QE voyage, we’ll be cancelling.

 

I do feel for everyone - and for Cunard coordinating all this must be a nightmare, really I do, but I hope we hear soon, as our trip was for my husband's 70th so I need to arrange an alternative.

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14 hours ago, roscoe39 said:

that is a terrible racist policy, talk about xenophobia

I had to check for myself to find that it doesn't matter where you have been living and for how long it is the passport that matters. I am sure the companies involved thought long and hard before coming up with these rules, but the feelings of Asian people isn't imagined, it is there in black and white. I do hope Cunard give people the option of backing out of cruises if they feel unsafe, and those that feel they are over reacting might be able to get a deal.

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