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sailthesea

Why isn't NCL cancelling due to coronavirus? Other cruise lines are.

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6 hours ago, caterpa said:

It is in fact a cold. Sorry to break it to you. 
 

Now it’s one with a high mortality rate in the chronically ill admittedly. but those numbers will get better too as we learn what’s working and what isn’t.  This isn’t gonna be static Elwood. 

little reading for you. 
 

https://www.jwatch.org/fw116437/2020/03/10/covid-19-can-look-common-cold-researchers-say?query=pfw&jwd=000012143608&jspc=

 

 

Thank you for an info hub to legit peer reviewed papers.  What are your thoughts of the adequacy of hospital facilities, resources & medical staff in this country vs the Italy scenario, given the lower number of hospital beds per capita?

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1 hour ago, hamrag said:

 

Following is a copy and paste directly from the NCL website! 😏

 

100% Cruise Credit

You will receive a 100% future cruise credit for sailings that embark through December 31, 2022.

 

 

See attached screenshot. Pretty sure this is illegal in some countries/states, maybe not all, but either way it is deceptive and misleading. 

Screenshot_20200307-065023.png

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48 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

 

You think every business should have funds on hand to be completely shut down for a period of months?

 

Every business should have a plan. There is business interruption insurance. During Hurricane Sandy, I know many businesses that had it and didnt lose a penny or were made close to whole, and others that didnt have it, no savings, no plan, and either went out of business immediately or soon thereafter. It is the prudent thing for any business owner to have a plan, understand risks, continuity of business/resilience, how to transfer risks (i.e. insurance), and yes, businesses shouldnt be going month-to-month to survive, just like people, they should have 3-6 months cushion! Why should everyone be bailed out for poor planning? If I was an executive of a cruise company, I would have planned for this exact scenario AND tested my plan.

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Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, BillDz said:

 

The letter from Harry Sommer, CEO of NCL dated March 7 said:

 

"Anyone choosing to cancel will receive a full refund in the form of a future cruise credit . . . "

 

So he's calling it a refund while actually offering a credit. He's lying.

 

This is the worst possible time for a CEO to be intentionally lying to the public. It's very troubling.

CORONAVIRUS LETTER.pdf 78.73 kB · 1 download

 

Exactly. I have seen his personal email responses. Its a disgrace. Poor leadership and opening the company up to additional risks. My personal opinion, put it in writing that you want a "full refund" not "credit" before the cruise, don't accept a credit, don't show up, file complaints with your attorney general, FTC, etc, and let see if they dont go bankrupt. You might get your money back or you might lose it. In my case/argument, there is no interest in ever going on a Norwegian cruise in the future so we can care less about a credit.

 

To add to my above comment, its not only about how they handled it, but because they were/are blatantly putting lives at risk, making people uncomfortable, pressuring them. I read several posts online, saw pictures, etc, that the preboarding was not being taken seriously (at least originally) and they simply put out some Purell. No taking temps, no questioning, etc. Maybe now they are more stringent? Also, if they were checking passports for stamps from prohibited countries, that does little as one can always request not to have their passport stamped (at least in many countries). They were putting up a mere security theater. If someone had coronavirus and they really wanted to board, they probably could (and still can). Many are asymptomatic but can spread it. There are meds one can take to hide temperature and symptoms. Etc. Basically no cruise line has the ability to guarantee passenger's safety at this point. If you go, you ARE taking a risk. Best part is some of their call staff were admitting that and denying cancellations last week. And apparently some were lying and acting negligently. 

Edited by mysteryz

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14 hours ago, sailthesea said:

I shudder to think of all the passengers returning, not doing self-quarantine, and passing it on to vulnerable populations. People are DYING because of this. It's not the time to go on a cheap cruise.

$$$$$$$........Denial.....Wait for criminal charges and Lawsuits from stricken passengers families.....

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

 

Nowhere is a "refund" defined as being cash. That's why we have the phrase "cash refund". If all refunds were cash, that phrase would be redundant... 

 

you are incorrect.

Edited by mysteryz

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54 minutes ago, BillDz said:

 

The letter from Harry Sommer, CEO of NCL dated March 7 said:

 

"Anyone choosing to cancel will receive a full refund in the form of a future cruise credit . . . "

 

So he's calling it a refund while actually offering a credit. He's lying.

 

This is the worst possible time for a CEO to be intentionally lying to the public. It's very troubling.

CORONAVIRUS LETTER.pdf 78.73 kB · 2 downloads

 

Maybe it's not okay to call a future cruise credit a refund but he said it in the same sentence so what is the problem?

 

If someone only read the beginning of the sentence they may think that the refund was the cash back but if the whole sentence is read it's very clear that it's a future cruise credit, I think.

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Just now, sverigecruiser said:

 

Maybe it's not okay to call a future cruise credit a refund but he said it in the same sentence so what is the problem?

 

If someone only read the beginning of the sentence they may think that the refund was the cash back but if the whole sentence is read it's very clear that it's a future cruise credit, I think.

 

Look at my screenshot.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, mysteryz said:

 

Look at my screenshot.

 

 

 

In which #?

Edited by sverigecruiser

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

That is what I did.

 

"Cancel anytime up to 48 hours before sailing for a full refund"

 

Not for a "credit"

 

but for a "full refund"

 

and notice how its been changed after several days to say "Cancel up to 48 hours prior to sailing and receive a full cruise credit"

 

They goofed. They know they did. They even fixed it days later. They owe "full refunds" to all past bookings in which the original wording was effective for. My guess is they are freaking out now they dont have the cash on hand to do that. Hence the huge $$$$$$ loan they took out.

 

Attached is the current language

Screenshot_20200313-083223.png

Edited by mysteryz

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3 hours ago, hamrag said:

Please post your education credentials enabling this 'educated guess'... 

 I practice Emergency Medicine in a busy urban hospital. For 19 years.   Lived through H1N1, Ebola, 9/11, anthrax etc. now these are not the same but ID people are and have always been alarmists. It’s what they do.  If you were in the business you’d understand. 

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I wasn’t on these boards in 2009 when H1N1 went pandemic.  Does anyone have any recall about what was happening then?  Did they have an opportunity to learn from mistakes?  I was taking my cruise up until 2 days ago.  I’m holding on to my 48 hours and will cancel next Wednesday.  Hoping for NCL to follow suit of Princess. Too much has been happening in my state and specifically the county I’m in. I won’t risk it.  Not for me or not for anyone else on my cruise.  My guess is NCL is waiting until everything is aligned for them financially before they cancel cruises 

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Perhaps trying to pocket more $ before canceling.... and with loss of profits and now with all the future FCC trips; who’s to say a cruise company won’t file bankruptcy before the FCC’s kick in. It would be their cheapest option.  The FCC’s credits will be useless. No care for customers. 

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52 minutes ago, caterpa said:

......If you were in the business you’d understand. 

 

Mmmm........🤣

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If ship if docking out of an area that has banned gatherings such as large groups, wouldn’t the cruise line have to cancel? I.e. California and NYC. 

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6 minutes ago, Beachmomm said:

If ship if docking out of an area that has banned gatherings such as large groups, wouldn’t the cruise line have to cancel? I.e. California and NYC. 

 

The bans on large gatherings don't apply to transportation. The airports, subway stations, bus terminals, etc. are all still up and running. It's "congregation" spaces like large theaters, banquet halls, sports arenas, etc. that are restricted.

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7 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

 

The bans on large gatherings don't apply to transportation. The airports, subway stations, bus terminals, etc. are all still up and running. It's "congregation" spaces like large theaters, banquet halls, sports arenas, etc. that are restricted.

 

If you've ever been in the Manhattan Cruise terminal, weaving thru the rope barriers, you damn well know you are within feet (sometimes inches) of other people.  The very reason why the "congregation" spaces were restricted, to keep a safe social distance from other people.  

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17 hours ago, sailthesea said:

Do those of you who are cruising plan to quarantine yourselves after the cruise, before returning to work and community? Disneyland is closing, Viking and Princess have canceled cruises, sporting events are being cancelled - and you think *yay!* great time for a cruise? That's just being stupid and selfish, people.

 

You would think flying commercially would pose more of a threat than cruising. But what do I know.

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4 hours ago, Farts said:

 

@elwood_98034 already admitted that he made a minor mistake in calculation. Cut him some slack. Physicians aren't the greatest at math. That's why the stereotype of so many of us going into financial ruin is so prevalent and kind of founded.

 

But in his defense, the statistics are skewed. We can discuss about how the denominator doesn't reflect the true amount of total infected or how the numerator isn't truly capturing all deaths and etc.

 

And @njhorseman, I am a physician who does research and sees patients. If you want to dig into the nitty gritty, there is one big bias that we are all making. There is an issue of generalizability. The population around the world looks very different than the population we have in the states in regard to obesity, diabetes, etc. So our mortality rate may actually be higher. Who knows?

 

Working in medicine is a calling. And I admire my colleagues who have high risk conditions who go into work everyday to care for patients. I am a young doctor, so my chances of dying are low (if you believe the statistics, lol!).

Hopefully, this will be my last post on the subject. 

 

The problem isn't so much a calculation error, it's using bad underlying assumptions.

 

I suggest that everyone who is interested in what scientists who are researching and modeling the potential worst-case impact of this pandemic in the US have come up with to date read this article published in today's New York Times:

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/13/us/coronavirus-deaths-estimate.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage

 

One thing to keep in mind when reading the article is that actual knowledge and hard data are scarce at this stage in the pandemic. The models used rely largely on estimates, assumptions and knowledge gained about other illnesses. As actual data about this pandemic become better known and more reliable the estimates will change and the range of potential results will undoubtedly narrow.

 

To give you a one sentence summary, this worst-case scenario modeling suggests up to 200,000 to 1.7 million people in the US could die from COVID-19 . One well-known expert, Dr. James Lawler, "conservatively" estimates 480,000 deaths.

Note the huge spread in the estimates. That tells you we are still dealing with a lot of unknowns requiring a variety of assumptions in the models.

 

 As horrible as those numbers are, they'e nowhere near what some posters on this thread have stated. 

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I know everyone feels very strongly about what's going on and what will happen and won't happen, but I read a very interesting article this morning online about travel cancellations for cruising, hotels, flights, etc.

 

I won't bore you with the entire article, but the point of it was for everyone in our situation to remember who is going to treat us well and who doesn't when it comes to OUR decision to cancel.  After all, we'll all be re-booking a vacation at some point.  The question is, will we re-book with the same airline, hotel, cruise line, etc.?? 🤨

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, jennmaybe said:

I know everyone feels very strongly about what's going on and what will happen and won't happen, but I read a very interesting article this morning online about travel cancellations for cruising, hotels, flights, etc.

 

I won't bore you with the entire article, but the point of it was for everyone in our situation to remember who is going to treat us well and who doesn't when it comes to OUR decision to cancel.  After all, we'll all be re-booking a vacation at some point.  The question is, will we re-book with the same airline, hotel, cruise line, etc.?? 🤨

 

 

 

 

 

 

BINGO!

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15 hours ago, vinotinto said:

Well, Disney has now closed all of its parks worldwide, including Disneyland and Walt Disney World, and Disney Cruise Line. Kudos to Disney for “flattening the curve.”

 

My DH is a healthcare worker and if he were faced with the position that Italian health care workers are facing - deciding who to give that last ventilator that is available - I know that would destroy him.

 

I am at the Magic Kingdom at Disney World today, 3/13. Last day of our extended family vacation. Lots of hand washing going on and no rail touching for our gang. Will we regret this week? As the saying goes: ‘we regretThe things we don’t do more than the things we do.’

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