Urgent - Ruby Princess 3 people infected - Urgent Tracking of Passengers

[woodscruise]

I also think it should be an inquiry, however I think it should be done by the Federal Police. If it is by NSW police, it would be like a NSW government department investigating another NSW government dept.

[lyndarra]

14 hours ago, dizzy1948 said:

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing. If they'd tested everybody at the time, it may have shown up, different outcome.   I remember way back in 2009? being tested- temperature - in Hong Kong, then Singapore - don't know why. (ignorance is bliss - or is it??) they wouldn't let us off the ship until we were all tested, completed the forms - and then we were allowed off in both places. We all had to form an orderly queue. Didn't take long. 

The only way now is forward and see what the outcome is. 

The ship could not test for Corona virus, they can only test for flu on board. They can do swabs for testing later in port but, in this case, we saw what happened there.

[MicCanberra]

temperature testing is a lot different to taking swabs for Covid 19 testing as well.

[Pushka]

Three more deaths in NSW today from Ruby. That's 10 deaths. It's been 15 days now. Please let it stop. 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Pushka

[Aus ATC]

From MSN News (AAP):

 

Sky News says it's aware of tapes of phone calls from Carnival Australia and the Ruby Princess to the NSW Ports Authority where the ship made it clear it didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 on board before it was given permission to dock.

The Sunday Telegraph reported a decision by the Port Authority of NSW to not to allow the Ruby Princess to dock in Sydney was overturned by the corporation after a call from a senior Carnival Australia official,

 

Would certainly be interesting to see those transcripts...

 

Seems quite a leap from an email reporting passengers with "flu like symptoms, but testing negative for influenza" (surely the alarm bells would ring with this preliminary assessment) to "didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 onboard".

 

Time will tell (maybe - truth will likely be another casualty here).

[NSWP]

1 hour ago, woodscruise said:

I also think it should be an inquiry, however I think it should be done by the Federal Police. If it is by NSW police, it would be like a NSW government department investigating another NSW government dept.

Could end up with a Criminal Negligence brief on person(s) unknown at this stage.  Time will tell.  A senior interstate investigator would be fine. I reserve my judgement on the AFP.

[NSWP]

10 minutes ago, Aus ATC said:

From MSN News (AAP):

 

Sky News says it's aware of tapes of phone calls from Carnival Australia and the Ruby Princess to the NSW Ports Authority where the ship made it clear it didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 on board before it was given permission to dock.

The Sunday Telegraph reported a decision by the Port Authority of NSW to not to allow the Ruby Princess to dock in Sydney was overturned by the corporation after a call from a senior Carnival Australia official,

 

Would certainly be interesting to see those transcripts...

 

Seems quite a leap from an email reporting passengers with "flu like symptoms, but testing negative for influenza" (surely the alarm bells would ring with this preliminary assessment) to "didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 onboard".

 

Time will tell (maybe - truth will likely be another casualty here).

The plot thickens, becoming bigger than 'Ben Hur.'

[Porky55]

38 minutes ago, Aus ATC said:

Sky News says it's aware of tapes of phone calls from Carnival Australia and the Ruby Princess to the NSW Ports Authority where the ship made it clear it didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 on board before it was given permission to dock.

The Sunday Telegraph reported a decision by the Port Authority of NSW to not to allow the Ruby Princess to dock in Sydney was overturned by the corporation after a call from a senior Carnival Australia official,

 

This report that you have quoted varies greatly from this one from  AusTraveller who alway shares information:

On Friday, Carnival supplied the Premier with copies of the emails and copies of biohazard documents from the ship proving that they followed all protocols.

 

The text of an email from the ship's doctor to NSW Health 9.39am March 18th (the day before docking):

PLEASE be aware, we have collected viral swabs for a few cases of "febrile, Influenza test negative" individuals, and have kept the guests isolated. Please advise on how to proceed on these guests, and whether you will be processing these tests tomorrow.

 

Email in reply from NSW Health to Ruby Princess, 5.07pm on March 18th, seven hours after being informed that the ship had sickpassengers on board:

The NSW Health expert panel has assessed the Ruby Princess as NOT requiring on board health assessment in Sydney. We would however ask you to send the 15 samples to our lab for COVID testing.. You are free to disembark tomorrow, however according to the new Australiangovernment guidance, all passengers must go into self-isolation for 14 days.

 

The ship also advised NSW Health that ambulances were required to urgently transport two ill passengers to hospital.

 

Later on Friday (after the emails had been supplied), the Premier said "I don't think it helps to point fingers and play the blame game ... it's unfair to blame anyone". That is OK now, but so far, no-one has apologised publicly for calling the captain of the Ruby Princess a liar. 
 

So which source do we believe???

 

Though I am sure Sky News would prefer the more sensational headline of Carnival over riding NSW Health as that is the storyline they have been pushing relentlessly.

Edited April 5, 2020 by Porky55

[Pushka]

 

6 minutes ago, Porky55 said:

So which source do we believe???

Today there are reports of Telephone calls being made which seem to contradict the emails posted yesterday. I'm presuming the calls were recorded. It's a new development. 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Pushka

[Aus Traveller]

6 minutes ago, Porky55 said:

 

This report that you have quoted varies greatly from this one from  AusTraveller who alway shares information:

On Friday, Carnival supplied the Premier with copies of the emails and copies of biohazard documents from the ship proving that they followed all protocols.

 

The text of an email from the ship's doctor to NSW Health 9.39am March 18th (the day before docking):

PLEASE be aware, we have collected viral swabs for a few cases of "febrile, Influenza test negative" individuals, and have kept the guests isolated. Please advise on how to proceed on these guests, and whether you will be processing these tests tomorrow.

 

Email in reply from NSW Health to Ruby Princess, 5.07pm on March 18th, seven hours after being informed that the ship had sickpassengers on board:

The NSW Health expert panel has assessed the Ruby Princess as NOT requiring on board health assessment in Sydney. We would however ask you to send the 15 samples to our lab for COVID testing.. You are free to disembark tomorrow, however according to the new Australiangovernment guidance, all passengers must go into self-isolation for 14 days.

 

The ship also advised NSW Health that ambulances were required to urgently transport two ill passengers to hospital.

 

Later on Friday (after the emails had been supplied), the Premier said "I don't think it helps to point fingers and play the blame game ... it's unfair to blame anyone". That is OK now, but so far, no-one has apologised publicly for calling the captain of the Ruby Princess a liar. 
 

So which source do we believe???

My source was The Weekend Australian.

[Porky55]

Just now, Aus Traveller said:

My source was The Weekend Australian.

Thanks Aus Traveller - your post also contains a lot more detail. And also gels with the procedures we both went through when we were returning on our cruise on Ruby on the 7th March.
Don’t see why the Captain would do anything different 12 days later, do you?  It seems the variation is with NSW Health IMHO??

[Aus Traveller]

1 minute ago, Pushka said:

 

Today there are reports of Telephone calls being made which seem to contradict the emails posted yesterday. I'm presuming the calls were recorded. It's a new development. 

Are the phone calls a contradiction, or just additional information?

 

The earlier post by Aus ATC refers to phone calls:

Sky News says it's aware of tapes of phone calls from Carnival Australia and the Ruby Princess to the NSW Ports Authority where the ship made it clear it didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 on board before it was given permission to dock.

 

The medical team on the Ruby Princess could not have known that there were cases of COVID on board: they didn't have test kits. Tests were done in Wellington a few days earlier, presumably as a precaution. They were negative. Given that result, maybe the senior doctor on the ship could have told the Ports Authority that they were unsure if they had cases of COVID on board, but they said they didn't believe there were any. That is probably true: they didn't believe they had any cases. The report of the phone call does not say that the doctor said that they had NO cases on board.

[Aus Traveller]

2 minutes ago, Porky55 said:

Thanks Aus Traveller - your post also contains a lot more detail. And also gels with the procedures we both went through when we were returning on our cruise on Ruby on the 7th March.
Don’t see why the Captain would do anything different 12 days later, do you?  It seems the variation is with NSW Health IMHO??

I think it all comes back to NSW Health. The swabs that the ship's medical centre took from ill passengers were tested, so NSW Health clearly knew people were ill. Two pax were taken to hospital by ambulance at 2.30am, so the request would have been urgent.

 

The problem is that NSW Health didn't request that the pax remain on the ship until the tests results were available. This sensible precaution was taken when the Golden Princess docked in Melbourne. Now they are trying to shift the blame.

[Porky55]

Again -  

I am sure Sky News would prefer the more sensational headline of Carnival over riding NSW Health as that is the storyline they (SKY NEWS and most of the media) have been pushing relentlessly and will stay with!!

 

The old saying - “don’t let the truth get in the way of a good story” - looks the only winner here.

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Porky55

[Aus Traveller]

1 minute ago, Porky55 said:

Again -  

I am sure Sky News would prefer the more sensational headline of Carnival over riding NSW Health as that is the storyline they (SKY NEWS and most of the media) have been pushing relentlessly and will stay with!!

The old saying - “don’t let the truth get in the way of a good story” - looks the winner here.

 

I think that old saying is going to be true with the Channel 7 special tonight!

[DiamondFour]

I have just written to my state and federal members expressing my concerns about the incompetence and abuse of power by the government to cover up their mistakes and deflect blame.

 

Primarily my main concern is why a ship which arrived here in October last year to the safety of Australia far away from the virus in mainland china was infected with the virus. I would like to know why our government failed in its duty of care to protect Australian citizens by not adequately and sufficiently screening international entry points for the virus given there was a world wide outbreak. This failure led to a cruise ship in the safe waters of Australia and New Zealand being infected despite a ban on people from mainland china entering our country.

 

My next concern was the abuse of power, corruption and lies of the NSW government in blaming Princess Cruises for this. I feel there should be a full investigation into the NSW health minister.

 

Lastly I have no confidence in the NSW police force. They have demonstrated that they lack the professionalism, integrity and impartiality to investigate this case and anything they do would be at the behest of the NSW government which we have seen is hell bent on deflecting blame, lying and destroying the cruise industry at all costs. I have no respect for the NSW police force or what they represent after seeing their disgraceful actions in relation to the Pacific Explorer and now their reprehensible and most likely corrupt and narrow scope investigation into the Ruby Princess.

[Pushka]

59 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

Are the phone calls a contradiction, or just additional information?

 

The earlier post by Aus ATC refers to phone calls:

Sky News says it's aware of tapes of phone calls from Carnival Australia and the Ruby Princess to the NSW Ports Authority where the ship made it clear it didn't believe there were cases of COVID-19 on board before it was given permission to dock.

 

The medical team on the Ruby Princess could not have known that there were cases of COVID on board: they didn't have test kits. Tests were done in Wellington a few days earlier, presumably as a precaution. They were negative. Given that result, maybe the senior doctor on the ship could have told the Ports Authority that they were unsure if they had cases of COVID on board, but they said they didn't believe there were any. That is probably true: they didn't believe they had any cases. The report of the phone call does not say that the doctor said that they had NO cases on board.

It may well come down to "reasonable medical suspicion". In the current pandemic, fever, respiratory symptoms and overseas travel is a red flag. It sounded as though the medical officer thought there was enough evidence to suspect Covid - but the telephone comms didn't follow through with that. And is not waiting for test results an easy way out to say "we didn't know"?
 

All conjecture and the enquiry will hopefully find the truth. 

[rickays]

55 minutes ago, DiamondFour said:

I have just written to my state and federal members expressing my concerns about the incompetence and abuse of power by the government to cover up their mistakes and deflect blame.

 

 

 

Give it a rest - everyone is trying to do their best in these times!

[NSWP]

1 hour ago, DiamondFour said:

I have just written to my state and federal members expressing my concerns about the incompetence and abuse of power by the government to cover up their mistakes and deflect blame.

 

Primarily my main concern is why a ship which arrived here in October last year to the safety of Australia far away from the virus in mainland china was infected with the virus. I would like to know why our government failed in its duty of care to protect Australian citizens by not adequately and sufficiently screening international entry points for the virus given there was a world wide outbreak. This failure led to a cruise ship in the safe waters of Australia and New Zealand being infected despite a ban on people from mainland china entering our country.

 

My next concern was the abuse of power, corruption and lies of the NSW government in blaming Princess Cruises for this. I feel there should be a full investigation into the NSW health minister.

 

Lastly I have no confidence in the NSW police force. They have demonstrated that they lack the professionalism, integrity and impartiality to investigate this case and anything they do would be at the behest of the NSW government which we have seen is hell bent on deflecting blame, lying and destroying the cruise industry at all costs. I have no respect for the NSW police force or what they represent after seeing their disgraceful actions in relation to the Pacific Explorer and now their reprehensible and most likely corrupt and narrow scope investigation into the Ruby Princess.

Be very careful the Commissioner and Mnisters of Police & Health do not sue you personally for 'verballing' them Sutho.

Edited April 5, 2020 by NSWP

[Aus Traveller]

3 minutes ago, Pushka said:

It may well come down to "reasonable medical suspicion". In the current pandemic, fever, respiratory symptoms and overseas travel is a red flag. It sounded as though the medical officer thought there was enough evidence to suspect Covid - but the telephone comms didn't follow through with that. And is not waiting for test results an easy way out to say "we didn't know"?
 

All conjecture and the enquiry will hopefully find the truth. 

This is a difficult situation. When the NSW government department had given authority for the passengers to disembark, I suppose the Captain of the Ruby could have over-ridden that, and kept them on board until the end of the day when the tests would be returned. He would have had to arrange for the shore-side staff (Customs and Border Force) to wait around for the rest of the day. Hopefully they wouldn't have said "We have done our shift and we are going home." I suppose there was also the problem of passengers' booked flights. Would the Captain have thought that there was sufficient justification to keep the passengers on board for the rest of the day, just a a precaution. In retrospect, the answer is a resounding "Yes", but at the time, I don't know.

[MicCanberra]

It seems the NSW health officials have blown it here.

[MicCanberra]

18 minutes ago, NSWP said:

Be very careful Sutho.

LOL, yet another version / reincarnation you think?

[DiamondFour]

28 minutes ago, NSWP said:

Be very careful the Commissioner and Mnisters of Police & Health do not sue you personally for 'verballing' them Sutho.

They are not that effective you know. Was it last year it took a couple of men with a chair and milk create to apprehend a murderer with a knife of what would have taken the police 48 hours worth of hostage negotiation in full riot gear with snipers at the ready and the entire CBD closed. They could not even deal with a madman putting on his best poker face holding our city to ransom a few years ago in a cafe. It is little surprise that I have no confidence in their ability to investigate the failures of NSW government departments over their failings regarding the Ruby Princess. Much like Putin putting the FSB (KGB) in charge of the Salisbury investigation don't you think?

[Pushka]

18 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

It seems the NSW health officials have blown it here.

There is too much conflicting info now. Yesterday I’d have agreed. Not today. 

[BRANDEE]

12 minutes ago, Pushka said:

There is too much conflicting info now. Yesterday I’d have agreed. Not today. 

 

Is there a link you can send me to see what what was on your Sunday night show.  Interested in what else is being said.  Thanks