Jump to content
Cruise Critic Community

Suggestions RCL needs to do to get people cruising again

Kokomo91165
 Share

Recommended Posts

Hoopster95

Hoopster95

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, ThirstyCruiser said:

Much speculation on the Infection mortality rate because we don't have good data on who's been infected due to lack of adequate testing.....

 

What is adequate testing to get are arms around this lack of information? Truly random testing on a wide scale.

 

Great post.

 

Regarding infection mortality, I believe S. Korea probably has the one of the best examples of that = 0.6% the last I checked about 2 weeks ago.... and that's with very obedient lockdown, everyone wears masks, etc.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ThirstyCruiser

ThirstyCruiser

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Hoopster95 said:

Regarding infection mortality, I believe S. Korea probably has the one of the best examples of that = 0.6% the last I checked about 2 weeks ago.... and that's with very obedient lockdown, everyone wears masks, etc.

Using Wikipedia's numbers, S.Korea is at about a 0.2% rate.

 

If you could get the same rate of testing across all countries you would see a variety in infection mortality rates because different countries have a different level of average health. That also probably contributes to S.Korea's lower mortality rate - on average, they are a healthier population to begin with. The healthier you are, the stronger your immune system, the more likely you are to fend off the more serious complications of COVID19. I wonder how they rank in average age, and protecting their older demographic with more stringent social distancing,

 

Compare Korea's average age / average health to that of a typical cruise ship. On a spectrum you can place these on opposite ends. Yeah, yeah, take a deep breath. There are very unhealthy Koreans I'm sure, just as there are super healthy cruisers. On average I'm saying. This is what RCL has to deal with, averages. Law of large numbers.  Its not a vendetta against older people.

 

It sucks, but its true. Certain activities will come back to normal faster vs others. Playing golf vs a concert in an indoor arena. These both won't return to normal at the same rate. Vacationing in a National Park versus vactioning on a cruise ship. A 30 year old returning to work, to shopping, to cruising versus a 75 year old. Its not personal.

 

I will tell you this, I'd sooner go on a cruise ship than go to a movie theater. People all around me. Especially behind and slightly above me. Guffawing a huge belly laugh or screaming in fright, all their breathe gently raining down on my head. You think cruise lines have it bad? I think movie theaters are worse off.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
rimmit Great Review Rare

rimmit

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, ThirstyCruiser said:

It sucks, but its true. Certain activities will come back to normal faster vs others. Playing golf vs a concert in an indoor arena. These both won't return to normal at the same rate. Vacationing in a National Park versus vactioning on a cruise ship. A 30 year old returning to work, to shopping, to cruising versus a 75 year old. Its not personal.

 

I will tell you this, I'd sooner go on a cruise ship than go to a movie theater. People all around me. Especially behind and slightly above me. Guffawing a huge belly laugh or screaming in fright, all their breathe gently raining down on my head. You think cruise lines have it bad? I think movie theaters are worse off.


Golf never went away for us in KY.  You’ve always been ok to golf here. Our state parks never closed.  We go there at least twice a week.  Not sure of our NP, Mammoth Caves, but I know the more heavily trafficked NPs In other states did finally have to have restrictions down.  
 

Movie theaters I see as one of the easiest to social distance.  Our movie theaters have assigned seats.   They just require your party to pick seats X amount of seats away from the nearest party and theN only allow every other row or three rows to be booked.  They could make more aisles by removing the seats they don’t need and only allow seating with aisle access as well so you never have to jump over anyone.  


Is it ideal, definitely not, but there are no choke points.  Cruises have elevators, and tight hallways, etc.   They have soooo many choke points on a ship that due to the sheer number on board would take forever to do anything maintaining social distance at a choke point.  We’d be waiting an eternity for an elevator to yourself on a cruise ship.  

Edited by rimmit
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ThirstyCruiser

ThirstyCruiser

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, rimmit said:

Movie theaters I see as one of the easiest to social distance.  Our movie theaters have assigned seats.   They just require your party to pick seats X amount of seats away from the nearest party and theN only allow every other row or three rows to be booked.  They could make more aisles by removing the seats they don’t need and only allow seating with aisle access as well so you never have to jump over anyone.  


Is it ideal, definitely not, but there are no choke points.  Cruises have elevators, and tight hallways, etc.   They have soooo many choke points on a ship that due to the sheer number on board would take forever to do anything maintaining social distance at a choke point.  We’d be waiting an eternity for an elevator to yourself on a cruise ship.  

I agree with all that.

 

Will a movie theater, whose only reason for existence is to make money, continue to operate if >50% of their capacity is off limits? Would they lose less just leaving their doors shut? Maybe they'll play the long game and will operate at a loss until things get back to normal. Might be years. I wonder if Hollywood will step up and subsidize the theaters during this period, or will they finally accept the inevitable and release blockbusters straight to streaming.

 

Back to cruising, perhaps they too will have to operate at a loss while playing the long game. I wonder what % full they have to sail where they lose less than letting the anchored ship collect barnacles.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
MaritimeR&R

MaritimeR&R

Posted
Posted
20 hours ago, hazence said:

Here ‘s another issue with banning by age.  What age?

 

i have neighbors who are retired and in their 50’s...who have underlying conditions...or are undergoing chemo...or have asthma.
 

I also have neighbors in their 70s that are part of the advanced hiking group, that are in the cycling club, and that vigorously work out daily. 

 

The current Surgeon General Jerome Adams is 46 and aside from having asthma and having carried an inhaler that he has never had to use in the past 20+years is in perfect health.  With these new rules, he would not be able to cruise. 

I have asthma that is under control as well and starting in January of 2021 will not be able to cruise under these new rules.  Not happy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
hazence

hazence

Posted
Posted (edited)

Actually in truth, besides a through cleaning, I don’t think Royal needs to do anything.

 

I think WE each need to do something. We need to manage our fear just as we did before this virus.

 

We drove in cars to get to the ship despite the high number of car accidents and deaths. 
 

imageproxy.php?img=&key=6ee4bfcebcfde1cbIn 2019, an estimated 38,800 people lost their lives to car crashes – a 2% decline from 2018 (39,404 deaths) and a 4% decline from 2017 (40,231 deaths). About 4.4 million people were injured seriously enough to require medical attention in crashes last year – also a 2% decrease over 2018 figures.


We flew on planes, despite the rare but possible occurrence  of a crash. We took off our shoes and got patted down because the threat of terror attacks is still a possibility according to our government agencies.

 

We cruised in hurricane season, crossed the North Atlantic in the winter. Our government agencies and Rccl’s experts sometimes goofed on these forecasts...but off we went anyway, knowing this and absorbing that risk.
 

We read about the Costa Concordia and still we cruised.

 

We read stories about mass viral outbreaks of various kinds onboard, murders in the islands, bus robberies, malfunctioning zip line deaths. Honeymooners and drunks going overboard. A daughter missing, never found.
 

Any of these things might have, COULD HAVE...happened to any of us. But we dealt with our fears, pushed them down...and almost all of the time...had a great time. We convinced ourselves that these things were outliers, wouldn’t happen to us.

 

Maybe we will start having an awareness that most of our media is headquartered in NYC. Naturally this influences their reporting.  Maybe we will stop clicking on the daily multiple MULTIPLE diet of fear and tragedy that feeds our anxiety. I’m talking the emotional pieces...”I only had mild symptoms then I almost  died.” “Worst pain of my life!” “Couldn’t say goodbye!” “ “Virus can be carried for a mile.” “Virus lives for weeks on EtcEtc.” 

 

Is that really INFORMATION? We NEED around 5 articles per media agency a day???

 

Instead check  the number in yr State. Some of us can check our zipcode. Ask a physician friend what the status is in your local hospital. Today chatted with friend at VA Hospital in ASheville...only one COVID admittance. Our physician daughter has only ONE admittance in her large SC regional hospital. Not one positive case since this started...as of yesterday...in my zip code. The deaths in SC are far below the deaths in the winter flu season of 2017-2029.

 

https://www.scdhec.gov/sites/default/files/media/document/SC_2017-18_End_of_Season_Flu_Report.

 

 

The 2017-2018 flu season in SC killed 289 residents statewide. Business remained opened. People went church,had income from their jobs, spent time with friends, shopped wherever they wished. Hospitals were open for all surgeries and all diagnostic evaluations.

 

The 2020 COVID19 virus has killed 124 statewide as of April 20

 

https://www.thestate.com/news/coronavirus/article241381891.html

This is not a one size fits all. If you are living in my zip code and have a NYC level of anxiety...that’s your choice. 
 

Nothing RCCL, or the government, or either party will do...will be perfect. Don’t expect any of them to assuage your anxieties.  Look at the statistics WHERE YOU LIVE. Turn off the “Fear-feeds-ratings” media. Didn’t Chris Cuomo’s ridiculous fake reappearance from his basement yesterday teach you anything...he was swanning around on EasterSunday...infected (CNN says) ...no mask...with his kids and family.  Breaking the very protocols he and Gov Cuomo require us to follow.  There’s a police report.
 

But Fear is a ratings winner these days So on with the SHOOOW! 

 

If we want life back to some semblance of normal...That’s my job...Thats your job. 
 

Assess our own risks...medically, geographically..and logically. 


Those who do...will be enjoying life...all aspects of it...sooner than later

 

 

 

 

 


 

 

 

Edited by hazence
  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
BSocial

BSocial

Posted
Posted
On 4/20/2020 at 2:56 PM, Kokomo91165 said:

1.  Share detailed plan of hygiene protocol for cabins, public areas and cruise terminal 

 

2.  Share detailed plan of screening procedures for guest and crew. 
 

3.  Limit crowded lounges to 50% capacity - such as diamond lounge/concierge lounge, schooner bar, theater, studio B.

 

4.  Reduce 200% single supplement to 150% for 2020 sailings 

 

Please add more suggestions. 


Process the Refund $ owed to cruisers.    I won’t book another cruise until after I receive my refund.  Why would I give them even more money?
 

.   

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
adidas5676

adidas5676

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, hazence said:

Actually in truth, besides a through cleaning, I don’t think Royal needs to do anything.

 

I think WE each need to do something. We need to manage our fear just as we did before this virus.

 

We drove in cars to get to the ship despite the high number of car accidents and deaths. 
 

imageproxy.php?img=&key=6ee4bfcebcfde1cbIn 2019, an estimated 38,800 people lost their lives to car crashes – a 2% decline from 2018 (39,404 deaths) and a 4% decline from 2017 (40,231 deaths). About 4.4 million people were injured seriously enough to require medical attention in crashes last year – also a 2% decrease over 2018 figures.

More people have died in the U.S. in 2 months from Covid 19 than died in the entire YEAR of 2019 in car accidents.  There is a HUGE difference between a daily potential risk of a environmental accident (like a car crash) and an INFECTIOUS disease, which we know very little about still.

 

I have a feeling this disease is going to work it's way through the people who think this is some sort of big governmental conspiracy or some political agenda, rather than what it actually is which is a new, very contagious, disease....unfortunately.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
hazence

hazence

Posted
Posted (edited)

I never said it was a government conspiracy. I never wished death or illness on anyone. I gave you links to the statistics where I live. I shared some information from physicians about the sparsity of  COVID-19 patients in their hospital facilities. At the same time, patients are denied elective and some diagnostic surgeries which could, in some cases, lead to fatalities for them.

 

Close a breast clinic, women with potential cancers must wait...till when....till a vaccine?!  Our daughter in one week...found three highly aggressively tumors in young women. There’s ONE COVID patient ALL THIS TIME...in the hospital! 

In my COVID FREE zip code, Walmart and the grocery stores have been packed every day. Our Walmart had no cart wipes at the entry last week..but no one was deterred. Most people, unmasked. But our numbers haven’t changed.
 

But we do have people beginning to suffer from loss os a paycheck. Must they suffer till a vaccine is created when they live in an area so unaffected??

 

If this virus is so very, very contagious...how to you account for areas like mine? What magic is here that has protected us both before and after the lockdown?

 

 

 

 

Edited by hazence
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
adidas5676

adidas5676

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, hazence said:

I never said it was a government conspiracy. I never wished death or illness on anyone. I gave you links to the statistics where I live. I shared some information from physicians about the sparsity of  COVID-19 patients in their hospital facilities. At the same time, patients are denied elective and some diagnostic surgeries which could, in some cases, lead to fatalities for them.

 

Close a breast clinic, women with potential cancers must wait...till when....till a vaccine?!  Our daughter in one week...found three highly aggressively tumors in young women. There’s ONE COVID patient ALL THIS TIME...in the hospital! 

In my COVID FREE zip code, Walmart and the grocery stores have been packed every day. Our Walmart has no wipes at the entry last week. Most people, unmasked. But our numbers haven’t changed. But we do have people begin to suffer from loss os a paycheck.

 

If this virus is so very, very contagious...how to you account for areas like mine? What magic is here that has protected us both before and after the lockdown?

 

I'm highly skeptical that you have zero cases in your area.  Every single county in my state has at least 1 case, and there is tons of sparsely populated farm country here.  If you truly have zero cases, backed up by scientific data, then you are the exception and not the rule.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
hazence

hazence

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, adidas5676 said:

I'm highly skeptical that you have zero cases in your area.  Every single county in my state has at least 1 case, and there is tons of sparsely populated farm country here.  If you truly have zero cases, backed up by scientific data, then you are the exception and not the rule.

In SC, Gov McMaster mandated that our Covid19 statistics  be reported by zipcode. We can check daily, the number of positive cases and the number of deaths in each zip code.
 

You don’t have to take my word for it. Google “SC Covid19 by zip code.”   Hit some of the zips in the pale (low number) counties

 

As of yesterday we are still at zero.

Edited by hazence
Link to comment
Share on other sites
adidas5676

adidas5676

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, hazence said:

Here I’ll help.

 

https://scdhec.gov/sites/default/files/media/document/Covid Zip Analysis 4_3_2020 No Estimates_0.pdf

Here you go. Up to date as of yesterday afternoon. Every single one of your counties has cases.

https://www.scdhec.gov/infectious-diseases/viruses/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19/sc-testing-data-projections-covid-19

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
hazence

hazence

Posted
Posted (edited)

I said ZIP CODE.

 

lets start.

 

20014. 29018 29031..29039...20037...29074...29081...29082...that’s just the top of the list to get you started.

Keep going down the list...and check out other numbers under say...5 or 6.

 In my county, there have been no deaths, and physician neighbors say no hospitalizations. 

Edited by hazence
Link to comment
Share on other sites
adidas5676

adidas5676

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, hazence said:

I said ZIP CODE.

 

lets start.

 

20014. 29018 29031..29039...20037...29074...29081...29082...that’s just the top of the list to get you started.
 

 In my county, there have been no deaths, and physician neighbors say no hospitalizations. 

Fair enough in regards to zip code.  Testing is still not widely available.  And it does note that they estimate people in their communities are positive but have not been tested by a laboratory and therefore not a confirmed case, however they also note that the estimate the number of cases per zip code based on surrounding areas' confirmed cases and looks like every zip code has cases estimated but not officially tested.  Let's revisit what this chart looks like in 2 weeks.

image.thumb.png.c67e8e94e59441e78e15c73f52674a60.png

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
hazence

hazence

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, adidas5676 said:

You are proving my point.  Every single one of your counties has cases of Covid.

Also check out the zip code ap. See all the light blue or clear spaces...under 5 or NO cases.

 

Now why are so many areas so under effected by this highly infectious virus?!  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
rimmit Great Review Rare

rimmit

Posted
Posted (edited)

My county in KY has 28 cases and hasn’t had a new case in 4 days.   We have done over 800 tests in our area with a total of 28 positive. We are the most populous county east of Lexington KY (which is about half the counties in our state) Not bad so far.  There are still many counties in KY with zero cases. I am sure some of that is accredited to testing, and lack of access but those counties are pretty poor with no major healthcare providers.   
 

The only reason we ended up with cases is one of our pulmonologists (Patient zéro for our area) went to NYC end of Feb. and infected his whole office staff and several physicians.  Thankfully, we stopped it pretty quick,  but with contact tracing we were able to prevent it from blowing up.  
 

If you live in a rural area (and we are pretty rural) and people are poor and don’t have the means to travel,  there is a really low penetrance.  I always knew when this started it would start with a physician in our area as they are the only ones that travel.

 

Below is an update Ky map updated to today.  Still several with no reported cases.  (Likely undertesring but still impressive none the less.)

 

https://www.wlky.com/app/covid-19-maps-of-kentucky-indiana-latest-coronavirus-cases-by-county/31902201

Edited by rimmit
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing
  • Forum Jump
    • Categories
      • Welcome to Cruise Critic
      • ANNOUNCEMENT: Set Sail Beyond the Ordinary with Oceania Cruises
      • ANNOUNCEMENT: The Widest View in the Whole Wide World
      • New Cruisers
      • Cruise Lines “A – O”
      • Cruise Lines “P – Z”
      • River Cruising
      • ROLL CALLS
      • Cruise Critic News & Features
      • Digital Photography & Cruise Technology
      • Special Interest Cruising
      • Cruise Discussion Topics
      • UK Cruising
      • Australia & New Zealand Cruisers
      • Canadian Cruisers
      • North American Homeports
      • Ports of Call
      • Cruise Conversations
×
×
  • Create New...