Attention Over 70 Year Old Cruisers

[dag144]

I have read that the lines are considering prohibiting old geezers over 70 like me from cruising without a doctor's OK.  I know the lines don't want to do this, but it may be the only way to satisfy CDC concerns.  Freighters that sail without a doctor do impose age limits so there is precedent.  I'll wait to see how this plays out before I book my next cruise.  What about you seniors, ahem!  

[dave_k58]

No Physician in his right mind is going to guarantee in writing that anyone is fit to sail, or fit for any activity - no matter what their age. It may even be against HIPPA laws.

 

[Btimmer]

FYI, I have to have a doctor's note to get European Motorcycle insurance.  It's required for age 65 and above for the carrier I use.  My doctor has no problem providing it.

 

[DFD1]

This would be the final nail in the coffin for HAL and, perhaps, for some of the long range cruise lines.

I can't imagine it happening, but....who knows?

[VMax1700]

At 70 years of age we must get a doctors certificate to renew our driving licences which is valid for only 3 years instead of the usual 10 years.  If a doctor will certify you fit to drive, then I see no problem in being certified as fit to cruise/travel.

[Hflors]

I just booked a 32 day cruise for myself and dh who is 76.  Hal said nothing to me.  If this becomes the rule I think world cruises and grand voyages will become a thing of the past!

[Mary229]

I am not 70 but in my 60s. I  went for my physical yesterday and I am a very fit person.  I asked my doctor and his view was until this coronavirus is a thing of the past - most definitely not!  He was rather emphatic and he is not subject to bouts of hyperbole. 

[ski ww]

We're both over 70 and healthy, I'm sure our doctor would not have a problem saying we're OK to cruise. If this becomes a fact for future cruises I think we'll see a big change in who cruises.

[Roz]

I don't like it, but I don't see it as violating HIPPA.  You're either fit to travel or you're not.  No disclosing of specific illnesses or disabilities. 

[YXU AC*SE]

Princess last night pushed an email to me overnight (source: https://em.princess.com/pub/sf/ResponseForm?_ri_=X0Gzc2X%3DYQpglLjHJlTQGjzg698sClzaov567lm2PTasvLuMHG1LJAX774BC2qoWvhDldzb7fcTmpL2VXMtX%3DYQpglLjHJlTQGjzg698sClzaov567lm2PTasyzaLe11m6fuAE7RgjzgSwOKA4mNEoYda1EB5&_ei_=En_toCXco5meUc1jdQbP7p0r4BQi8OA2hg&_di_=21ho1ntmgebvkulk866mjfrfk2d17l58glrnssoqag9a1a5f9nvg) 

 

with the attached mention in it.

(source: https://www.princess.com/downloads/pdf/plan/Health-Advisory-and-Travel-Safety-Procedures.pdf?cid=dm_email_info_internal_newsletter_others_pf0ms080_200421_weekly_KPI2FPNQY6EJGP2LSJ6ICSI7ME&eccn=KPI2FPNQY6EJGP2LSJ6ICSI7ME&rrid=8602129929&mi_u=8602129929)

 

B. Travel Restrictions: Guests and crew members meeting certain criteria
will be unable to sail. Guests who are unable to sail because of a failure to
meet the following criteria will be issued a full cruise credit or refund: 

I. If you have been in contact with a suspected or confirmed case of
COVID-19, or a person under monitoring for COVID-19.
II. If you are suffering from a fever or flu-like symptoms prior to
embarkation.
III. If you have an underlying severe chronic medical condition.

 

The above requirements apply to all guests, crew members, service staff
and visitors. 

 

I wonder what constitutes severe and how it may be determined at embarkation?     Scott.  

Edited April 22, 2020 by YXU AC*SE

[BigGreenFan]

5 hours ago, dave_k58 said:

No Physician in his right mind is going to guarantee in writing that anyone is fit to sail, or fit for any activity - no matter what their age. It may even be against HIPPA laws.

 

Not a HIPPA violation since you are consenting to the release of information

[Krazy Kruizers]

I don't see our doctor taking the time to check we older people out (and he has a lot of older travelers) and then writing letters.  Many doctors have an overload of patients in our area.

[Roz]

37 minutes ago, YXU AC*SE said:

I wonder what constitutes severe and how it may be determined at embarkation?       

 

The cruise line has no way of determining your health at embarkation which is why they're asking for documentation from your physician. 

 

10 minutes ago, Krazy Kruizers said:

I don't see our doctor taking the time to check we older people out (and he has a lot of older travelers) and then writing letters.  

 

I could be wrong about this, but I don't think your physician has to compose a letter.  I think it's more of a form they sign.

 

Again, I don't agree with this, but based on accounts posted here on CC, some passengers aren't able to discern on their own that they're not up to prolonged travel.  

[cbr663]

2 hours ago, YXU AC*SE said:

Princess last night pushed an email to me overnight (source: https://em.princess.com/pub/sf/ResponseForm?_ri_=X0Gzc2X%3DYQpglLjHJlTQGjzg698sClzaov567lm2PTasvLuMHG1LJAX774BC2qoWvhDldzb7fcTmpL2VXMtX%3DYQpglLjHJlTQGjzg698sClzaov567lm2PTasyzaLe11m6fuAE7RgjzgSwOKA4mNEoYda1EB5&_ei_=En_toCXco5meUc1jdQbP7p0r4BQi8OA2hg&_di_=21ho1ntmgebvkulk866mjfrfk2d17l58glrnssoqag9a1a5f9nvg) 

 

with the attached mention in it.

(source: https://www.princess.com/downloads/pdf/plan/Health-Advisory-and-Travel-Safety-Procedures.pdf?cid=dm_email_info_internal_newsletter_others_pf0ms080_200421_weekly_KPI2FPNQY6EJGP2LSJ6ICSI7ME&eccn=KPI2FPNQY6EJGP2LSJ6ICSI7ME&rrid=8602129929&mi_u=8602129929)

 

B. Travel Restrictions: Guests and crew members meeting certain criteria
will be unable to sail. Guests who are unable to sail because of a failure to
meet the following criteria will be issued a full cruise credit or refund: 

I. If you have been in contact with a suspected or confirmed case of
COVID-19, or a person under monitoring for COVID-19.
II. If you are suffering from a fever or flu-like symptoms prior to
embarkation.
III. If you have an underlying severe chronic medical condition.

 

The above requirements apply to all guests, crew members, service staff
and visitors. 

 

I wonder what constitutes severe and how it may be determined at embarkation?     Scott.  

 

Thanks for the info and the link.

 

Your question on what constitutes severe is a good one.  There are great sources of info like the CDC that provides an overview of severe chronic conditions.  (https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/underlying-conditions.html).  Other sources expand the list to include conditions such as Parkinsons and ALS (https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/16/health/underlying-condition-coronavirus-list-wellness/index.html).  The problem is that Princess doesn't provide much clarity around what it considers as a severe chronic condition.

 

My other concern after reading the update is that Princess is still relying on the honour system and for passengers to voluntarily disclose.  There is significant risk to this approach.  Personally, I would feel much better if ALL passengers were required to submit a medical screen signed off by a certified doctor prior to being able to sail.

 

As is, it just seems like more of the same to me.  

 

To add:  The link also states that enhanced screening for certain guests and crew and that certain individuals will only be permitted to board based on secondary screening results.  Secondary screening will be conducted by medical staff in the terminal prior to embarkation.  Yet it provides no indication of who may be subject to this and what you may expect during a secondary screening.

[BJzink]

I am 77 yrs, have no underlying health issues, but last year I had 2 surgeries.  For both of them I was required to visit my PCP for Anesthesia clearance.  This is pretty much normal for any surgery that requires anesthesia beyond locals.  My PCP did a basic exam, ordered a EKG, routine blood work, reviewed my medications, and gave me a green light for the surgeries and the anesthesia required.  I would be willing to do whatever was needed for the criteria that the cruise industry decides in order to sail.  I certainly understand that there will be people who might not meet the criteria, but given the longer cruises that are offered, it would be increasing the problem for caring for passengers who become ill.

[bobcan]

8 hours ago, dag144 said:

I have read that the lines are considering prohibiting old geezers over 70 like me from cruising without a doctor's OK.  I know the lines don't want to do this, but it may be the only way to satisfy CDC concerns.  Freighters that sail without a doctor do impose age limits so there is precedent.  I'll wait to see how this plays out before I book my next cruise.  What about you seniors, ahem!  

I have no problem with the doctor's okay provided everyone is required to get it not just 70 and over. I am turning 70 this year and on past cruises have joticed that many people younger than myself are in far worse health than myself and even worse than some in their 80's and 90's. Picking 70 is a form of age discrimination and I think could result in the cruise lines being subject to legal action for requiring this.

[SilvertoGold]

35 minutes ago, BJzink said:

I am 77 yrs, have no underlying health issues, but last year I had 2 surgeries.  For both of them I was required to visit my PCP for Anesthesia clearance.  This is pretty much normal for any surgery that requires anesthesia beyond locals.  My PCP did a basic exam, ordered a EKG, routine blood work, reviewed my medications, and gave me a green light for the surgeries and the anesthesia required.  I would be willing to do whatever was needed for the criteria that the cruise industry decides in order to sail.  I certainly understand that there will be people who might not meet the criteria, but given the longer cruises that are offered, it would be increasing the problem for caring for passengers who become ill.

 

This post says it all. Thanks!!!

 

The doctor's OK has been discussed on this board for many days lately.  It is mostly about chronic conditions that can make for complications should one get Covid-19.  Lung, heart, kidney, liver conditions are the most mentioned problems that can increase susceptibility to serious complications, life-threatening ones.  This is for the good of the individual  pax.

Edited April 22, 2020 by SilvertoGold

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

4 hours ago, VMax1700 said:

At 70 years of age we must get a doctors certificate to renew our driving licences which is valid for only 3 years instead of the usual 10 years.  If a doctor will certify you fit to drive, then I see no problem in being certified as fit to cruise/travel.

I agree with you.

[PROCRUISE]

I guess all we "older" folks, myself included, will simply have to wait and see what plays out. Was talking to my TA several days ago and after a discussion call she had with Celebrity, she was told the physicians note will be required by anyone 60yrs of age or older!  However, I'm guessing no one really knows.

 

Guess my primary question remains, when and even if the cruise ships will even be operating again before going financially under. Deflation is a nasty thing.

[cruisemom42]

Some adventure cruises already require a similar form with medical okay to sail with them.

[realnurse2]

If you have health insurance which clearly asks about medical history (at least in Canada) I don't see why anything else would be required. I also don't think most MD's would want to sign a form guaranteeing  " healthy to sail". You could die tomorrow hit by a car. I don't think life comes with a guarantee.

[sansterre]

I have seen some people on cruises who IMO should not sail alone.  However, with an attentive companion

(a spouse, sibling, or child for example) it works nicely.

I've also seen some people cruising alone who are on a trip they probably should not be on.

So, it might be helpful to have an option for doctors to check - travel approved if with a companion. 

[conwakr]

I think they are going to have to get very specific about which diagnoses would fall into underlying conditions that make one  "unfit to travel"....the lawyers will have a field day with this one as "underlying condition" is just too vague and would trap quite a few people who have conditions that may contribute to death (think the severely obese) and can be considered an underlying condition but may not disqualify them from cruise travel. Most doctors probably would not give any of it a second thought with "known" patients, but those that don't see a doctor regularly could get caught with a doctor who might practice the better safe than sorry in signing such a document.  The cruiselines might be able to just arbitrarily use an age - but even that isn't a great indicator.  A family member of mine is in their early 90s, swims two miles a day year round, drives a car still and takes not medication and is normal weight.  They don't travel alone anymore, but could travel and they have  no known underlying conditions...but at 92 they could certainly unexpectedly die from some unexpected thing.  I know people in their 50s that have issues that might prevent them from ever seeing even 70 so I suspect they will have to get more specific than age.  We'll just have to wait and see. My guess it would be like the "sports" physicals that young kids have to go through before they join public high school sports programs and alot of us get physicals every year anyway so I don't see this has a huge hurdle. 

[thyme2go]

Sooooooo, the purpose of all these health hurdles is what?    It seems it is a major CYA for the cruise industry........and it would remove some of the responsibility that the cruise industry should have......it is the cost of doing business.   

SARS-Covid 19 is an opportunity virus.......even though it hits some people harder than others--including those that are overweight!  Are cruise lines not going to allow overweight travelers if you take medical info seriously?    The reality is that any cruise ship could have had this infection on it and it was only the fact that some people were vulnerable that made it obvious.    

I see this as simply a moving of responsibility.........noro, covid, etc...... the bigger problem for the cruise industry is that you are contained to a relatively small area and cannot 'escape' at any point---yet can depart and return after port calls but that is a potential transmission source.   Transmission of covid.......or any communicable disease is an issue the industry needs to address in many more ways than asking travelers to "prove" they can travel on the day the trip starts.

[SilvertoGold]

I do think the purpose of the Doctor's letter/OK to travel/whatever that MAY be required is to point out that a person with certain underlying conditions (whatever those are deemed to be) could be in  a lot of trouble should they cruise/fly/travel and get Covid-19.  Their underlying conditions could make them (more) susceptible to very serious complications.

 

So, with a serious complication like pneumonia, would you prefer to be home, with your own doctor, your own nearby hospital or on a cruise ship somewhere, on a plane to somewhere or on a road trip to somewhere?   Your choice, your gamble.