Majority of EU states back suspension of air travel refunds

[Host Jazzbeau]

There has been skepticism about Ponant's claim that a change in French law allows them to refuse refunds.  [Which, since they didn't offer any citation, I shared.]

 

This Reuters story, however, gives some credence to the claim as France seems to be the leader to changing EU laws regarding airline refunds:

Majority of EU states back suspension of air travel refunds, France says

 

[jland]

Flying and cruising cannot be compared in terms of costs. When I pay $14000 as a deposit with a final payment of $42000 I expect and demand a refund when the cruise is cancelled. I do not expect and will not accept the terms and conditions changing after I have booked. If French people are happy for changes to their terms and conditions to allow refunds only, good luck to them, I am not.

[resistk]

16 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

There has been skepticism about Ponant's claim that a change in French law allows them to refuse refunds.  [Which, since they didn't offer any citation, I shared.]

 

 

The article says just the opposite:

 

"The European Commission, which is set to issue guidelines on how the broader transport industry could gradually restart, has said so far that airlines must follow EU rules and provide refunds for cancelled flights."

 

As noted already French flagged ships also are operating under EU rules outside France; Ponant owes a refund under EU law which supercedes French law according to the French Tourism Code.  The French no refund rule might apply if a cruise was solely operating in French waters.

 

The EU is not going to change fundamental consumer law without all its members agreeing.

 

Ponant to my knowledge has never cited the specific section of the French Tourism Code on it website or anywhere else.  Ponant has provided no notice to anyone.  It is also clear the EU law supercedes in the case of international passenger ships.

Edited May 3, 2020 by resistk

[Host Jazzbeau]

1 hour ago, resistk said:

 

The article says just the opposite:

 

"The European Commission, which is set to issue guidelines on how the broader transport industry could gradually restart, has said so far that airlines must follow EU rules and provide refunds for cancelled flights."

 

The article does not say the opposite of my headline or my implication.  The first paragraph of the article says: "Germany, Italy and Spain have joined a call by 12 European Union governments for the EU’s executive body to suspend rules forcing crisis-hit airlines to offer full cash refunds for cancelled flights, France said in a statement on Saturday."

 

Which means: Yes, the EU rules still say you must get a refund BUT [this is the news] 15 European Union countries have asked that the EU rule be changed.

 

The relevance of this article here is that France is reacting to this crisis, and that suggests to me that Ponant's claim regarding a change in French domestic law could be true.

 

I would also note that many things that seem set in concrete in EU laws have been bent or broken in the financial crisis ["We will do whatever it takes"].  Apparently, just like the US Constitution, the EU "is not a suicide pact."

[resistk]

EU law is French law, that is what the Brexit was about, the UK did not like EU laws. So while  domestically France can block refunds, outside its borders it cannot.  And it certainly cannot do so when the entity paid was a Delaware company, Ponant USA LLC.

[Host Jazzbeau]

8 minutes ago, resistk said:

EU law is French law, that is what the Brexit was about, the UK did not like EU laws. So while  domestically France can block refunds, outside its borders it cannot.  And it certainly cannot do so when the entity paid was a Delaware company, Ponant USA LLC.

 

We clearly have different interpretations of how the law works in practice, and there seems to be no likelihood of a meeting of the minds.  So this thread is now closed.