There's No Point to Temperature Checks for Cruising - They are Useless

[TNcruising02]

10 minutes ago, mayleeman said:

I am sure all of you "personal responsibility" would then feel it is perfectly ok for someone quaratined in their cabin for noro to wander around the ship. After all, anyone who catches it assumed the risk..Nope, not the fault of the carrier.

 

 

I absolutely think it's wrong for anyone with a contagious disease to knowingly expose other people.  I also think it's wrong for someone worried about catching the virus to put themselves in a position where the odds are greater that they can catch it.  Going to an event where you are not able to social distance puts a person at risk and they are choosing to take that risk.  In the end, everyone should accept that only they can protect themselves.  Relying on someone else to do it will give them a false sense of security. 

Anyone who attended a BBQ should have known that they could very likely be exposed to the virus if they got too close to someone.  That's common sense.  It continues to amaze me that people do things like this. 

Edited July 6, 2020 by TNcruising02

[slidergirl]

16 hours ago, ldubs said:

 

I'm going to guess you have never been near TSA checkpoint when someone had a handgun or other weapon in their check-in bag.   

 

Outside of the handgun brought by the wife of a couple we were traveling with (she is a federal LEO), I wouldn't know because TSA can't seem to find them, anyway.  They have a horrible score in their random "secret shopper" tests where someone deliberately takes a weapon through to see if it is detected.  But, I have been sent to secondary check for having a bra with an underwire on my body and I had a smurf attempt to confiscate my heirloom tomatoes because "the juice is a liquid".  I am one who is very assertive in my dealings with TSA - opting out of the nude-o-scope (it's your right), demanding a glove change, demanding my bag NEVER leaves my sight.  If they are being paid to "keep us safe", I will do my part to be sure they at are trying to follow their procedures.  

 

As far as the testing with no symptoms:  it depends on the situation.  Everyone in my neighborhood was asked the other month to get tested as some "essential workers" living in the area became sick and tested positive. We were considered a potential hotspot, so the county health dept wanted to jump on it and keep an eye on the neighborhood.  Yes, it was a snapshot of the neighborhood over a couple of days, but it was used as a data point on a possible community spread.  

[ATC cruiser]

Just to let you know, the TSA found over 4400 handguns in passengers luggage last year. Most of them loaded. 

[navybankerteacher]

58 minutes ago, slidergirl said:

 

Outside of the handgun brought by the wife of a couple we were traveling with (she is a federal LEO), I wouldn't know because TSA can't seem to find them, anyway.  They have a horrible score in their random "secret shopper" tests where someone deliberately takes a weapon through to see if it is detected.  But, I have been sent to secondary check for having a bra with an underwire on my body and I had a smurf attempt to confiscate my heirloom tomatoes because "the juice is a liquid".  I am one who is very assertive in my dealings with TSA - opting out of the nude-o-scope (it's your right), demanding a glove change, demanding my bag NEVER leaves my sight.  If they are being paid to "keep us safe", I will do my part to be sure they at are trying to follow their procedures.  

 

As far as the testing with no symptoms:  it depends on the situation.  Everyone in my neighborhood was asked the other month to get tested as some "essential workers" living in the area became sick and tested positive. We were considered a potential hotspot, so the county health dept wanted to jump on it and keep an eye on the neighborhood.  Yes, it was a snapshot of the neighborhood over a couple of days, but it was used as a data point on a possible community spread.  

Agreed - if there has been possible exposure or apparent symptoms, testing serves a purpose.   Absent these, while it might offer comfort and “data”, such testing on a one-time-only basis seems questionable.  If you felt it important to get tested last week “just because” , and showed negative — shouldn’t you logically also want to get tested this week as well —- and every week , until the thing goes away?

[slidergirl]

28 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

Agreed - if there has been possible exposure or apparent symptoms, testing serves a purpose.   Absent these, while it might offer comfort and “data”, such testing on a one-time-only basis seems questionable.  If you felt it important to get tested last week “just because” , and showed negative — shouldn’t you logically also want to get tested this week as well —- and every week , until the thing goes away?

True.  I keep track of where I have been (not many places), so I don't feel the need to test.  I mean, I wear a mask and social distance instead of requiring myself and those who want to see me get tested everyday.  

Now, once a RELIABLE antibody test shows up, I do want that one.  If I did have COVID-19 last Winter before they were testing for it (all they'd do was test for flu, and if negative, tell you to suck it up and go home), I would like to know.  I want to know that what I had was maybe just the worst case of bronchitis I ever had AND, if I did have it, I would want to donate plasma when we have our bloodmobile visit at the end of the month.  

 

On temps - when you were a kid, did you ever put the thermometer up to the light bulb to "get a fever" so you didn't have to go to school that day?   Gotta be careful with that - don't want to freak Mom out with a 106 temp!!!   Or, put the thermometer in water to drop it so you could to go that school dance?  

 

[navybankerteacher]

1 hour ago, slidergirl said:

...

 

On temps - when you were a kid, did you ever put the thermometer up to the light bulb to "get a fever" so you didn't have to go to school that day?   ...

 

Who didn’t? 

[ontheweb]

5 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Some things are only effective if people work together. There is such a thing as social responsibilty and being aware there are people in you community who are vulnerable so maybe we should look out for them instead of telling them too bad so sad I'll do whatever I want and you will just have to suck it up. When did kindness end😔?

I think it is called "the Golden Rule".

[lenquixote66]

2 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

Who didn’t? 

I never did.I loved school and had perfect attendance.

[ldubs]

9 hours ago, slidergirl said:

 

Outside of the handgun brought by the wife of a couple we were traveling with (she is a federal LEO), I wouldn't know because TSA can't seem to find them, anyway.  They have a horrible score in their random "secret shopper" tests where someone deliberately takes a weapon through to see if it is detected.  But, I have been sent to secondary check for having a bra with an underwire on my body and I had a smurf attempt to confiscate my heirloom tomatoes because "the juice is a liquid".  I am one who is very assertive in my dealings with TSA - opting out of the nude-o-scope (it's your right), demanding a glove change, demanding my bag NEVER leaves my sight.  If they are being paid to "keep us safe", I will do my part to be sure they at are trying to follow their procedures.  

 

As far as the testing with no symptoms:  it depends on the situation.  Everyone in my neighborhood was asked the other month to get tested as some "essential workers" living in the area became sick and tested positive. We were considered a potential hotspot, so the county health dept wanted to jump on it and keep an eye on the neighborhood.  Yes, it was a snapshot of the neighborhood over a couple of days, but it was used as a data point on a possible community spread.  

 

I'm guessing TSA did something to you that you didn't like to warrant the contempt.  I personally cooperate as much as possible because they need to focus on catching bad guys instead of me wasting their time.     See ATC cruiser's comment about the number of real firearms found by TSA.  They average about 11 per day.  90% are  loaded & 33% have a round chambered.   So this isn't just window dressing.  The potential danger is real.  I was unlucky enough to be there when some nut tried to get a pistol through security.  The response was incredibly swift and that person was surrounded and escorted out in a blink.  My niece was at LAX terminal 3 when the shooting happened and a TSA agent was killed.     

 

  

 

.  

[ldubs]

On 7/5/2020 at 9:03 AM, mayleeman said:

 

A guy in California who tested positive had no symptoms so, like you, he thought he could not infect anyone. So he went to a BBQ party without telling anyone and infected 12 people. AND KILLED ONE OF HIS FRIENDS.

 

The virus spreads through breathing. And the risk is killing someone. This is not hard.

 

https://www.the-sun.com/news/us-news/1072204/truck-driver-covid-party/

 

Sadly  this is not an isolated incident.   

[ldubs]

14 hours ago, TNcruising02 said:

If someone attends an event with 12 other people, that is the person's choice to possibly expose themselves to a virus.  It's up to each person to decide for themselves and keep their distance.  If that person contracts the virus, it was because of their own  actions.  Nobody else is responsible for killing them.  People need to accept personal responsibility and social distancing.

If my dad attends a party and contracts the virus, it would not be anyone else's fault.

 

Sorry TNCruising.  I saw an earlier post and see that I misread this one.  So I've deleted my reply.  

 

Oops!     

Edited July 7, 2020 by ldubs

[ldubs]

This from one of our neighboring state's public health dept.  Pretty good explanation of why testing of people who don't show symptoms is valuable.   Please follow what your public health officials say, not what you read on an internet forum.  Otherwise, we will never be able to get the upper hand on this pandemic.   

 

"COVID-19 data and test results that include people who don’t show symptoms (“asymptomatic”) can provide a more accurate understanding of how the virus is spreading. Identifying asymptomatic cases will provide a better understanding of the virus’s impacts on the community. Expanding testing plays a major part in influencing the state’s continuous adjustment of prevention and control measures. Additional testing can also lead to a larger number of Nevadans being made aware of their conditions, knowledge that could contribute to focused social distancing and further slowing community transmissions."

 

 

Edited July 7, 2020 by ldubs

[mayleeman]

Son is TSA. Everyone thinking it is only window dressing isn't involved in processing thousands of people a day. The abuse they get is unforgivable. Following the guidelines, like wearing masks, is not tough.

 

The convolutions people go through trying to justify their outrage over masks, or TSA, or being asked to socially distance, or being tested... 

[sanger727]

22 hours ago, mayleeman said:

I am sure all of you "personal responsibility" would then feel it is perfectly ok for someone quaratined in their cabin for noro to wander around the ship. After all, anyone who catches it assumed the risk..Nope, not the fault of the carrier.

 

 

 

I'm a personal responsibility person... but common sense is applied of course... If you are diagnosed with a contagious disease, you need to quarantine. If someone goes to a BBQ after being diagnosed because they weren't symptomatic, they were dead wrong.  However, If you choose to go to a family BBQ without realizing that it's possible that an asymptomatic/presymptomatic person who hasn't been tested may be there spreading it, you are fooling yourself. If you choose to go to a public gathering or into a public space you have to accept the possibility that someone who is unknowingly infected may be there spreading it. 

Edited July 7, 2020 by sanger727

[TNcruising02]

I think testing is great, but unless someone is continuously tested they will never know day to day.  Social distancing is really the best way to prevent contracting the virus, in my opinion.  I just assume anyone can have the virus and keep my distance.  It's crazy to me that people are going to parties, events, and marches without keeping their distance.  But it's their choice and they will have to deal with any consequences of their own actions.

[mayleeman]

29 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

It's crazy to me that people are going to parties, events, and marches without keeping their distance.  But it's their choice and they will have to deal with any consequences of their own actions.

 

I agree it is crazy what people are doing. I think the biggest problem is caused by them assuming that they themselves will be the ones bearing the risk. If they unknowingly contract the virus, they may well pass it on to others despite those people taking numerous precautions. 

 

Everyone here agrees that we cannot live in bubbles and insulate ourselves from all possibilities of exposure. So it makes sense to act as responsibly as possible so others don't have to live in bubbles either. 

[TNcruising02]

I agree, Mayleeman.  In the end, I am the only person who can protect myself by my own actions.  By protecting myself, I also protect the relatives who I shop for and bring groceries.  I can't risk my health by hoping that other people will behave in a certain way.  That's a risk I will never take, so I assume everyone could be a carrier.

To me, choosing to go to a BBQ with a lot of people is choosing to accept the risk of being exposed to Covid-19.

Edited July 7, 2020 by TNcruising02

[mammajamma2013]

On 7/6/2020 at 4:45 PM, lenquixote66 said:

I never did.I loved school and had perfect attendance.

I never did, either. I hated school and didn't have perfect attendance, though.

[lenquixote66]

2 hours ago, mammajamma2013 said:

I never did, either. I hated school and didn't have perfect attendance, though.

I walked 3 miles every day in every kind of weather to get to school and I have perfect attendance certificates.

[Joebucks]

On 7/6/2020 at 11:54 PM, ldubs said:

This from one of our neighboring state's public health dept.  Pretty good explanation of why testing of people who don't show symptoms is valuable.   Please follow what your public health officials say, not what you read on an internet forum.  Otherwise, we will never be able to get the upper hand on this pandemic.   

 

"COVID-19 data and test results that include people who don’t show symptoms (“asymptomatic”) can provide a more accurate understanding of how the virus is spreading. Identifying asymptomatic cases will provide a better understanding of the virus’s impacts on the community. Expanding testing plays a major part in influencing the state’s continuous adjustment of prevention and control measures. Additional testing can also lead to a larger number of Nevadans being made aware of their conditions, knowledge that could contribute to focused social distancing and further slowing community transmissions."

 

 

 

In which every day, the data becomes clearer and clear that it was more contagious than we initially thought and less deadly.

[chipmaster]

2 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

In which every day, the data becomes clearer and clear that it was more contagious than we initially thought and less deadly.

 

But still deadly enough, are you suggesting we should just let the economy go and open up all schools?

 

[ldubs]

6 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

In which every day, the data becomes clearer and clear that it was more contagious than we initially thought and less deadly.

 

Whatever the data might show, my point and the point of our public health officials, is we won't know what is happening unless we do a lot more testing.  The notion that you could have valid rates of positives, or mortality rates, by limiting testing to those with symptoms is mind boggling.  

Edited July 9, 2020 by ldubs

[Joebucks]

You could very well be right.

 

I'm just curious what data we're looking for that we don't already have in a half of a year. Seems like just more panic than anything. People are losing their mind because we are finding more people positive as compared to times when we had little to no testing. All the while we're finding people were asymptomatic and have been all of this time and no more people are dying.

[2wheelin]

41 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

You could very well be right.

 

I'm just curious what data we're looking for that we don't already have in a half of a year. Seems like just more panic than anything. People are losing their mind because we are finding more people positive as compared to times when we had little to no testing. All the while we're finding people were asymptomatic and have been all of this time and no more people are dying.

Right. In my state, number of positive tests has increased while hospitalizations and ICU use and deaths have decreased. (Even after allowing for lag time from increased positives). In spite of this my city just mandated mask wearing in all public buildings regardless of social distancing. Employees of a business may remove masks in private areas if distancing is observed but anyone in the public area must wear a mask. This applies even if you are the only person in say, a church or arena etc. So that means you cannot read on the second floor of the library if the only other person in the building is on the first floor. This is why people object to masks—ridiculous interpretation of recommendations.

[Hlitner]

On 7/9/2020 at 11:25 AM, Joebucks said:

 

In which every day, the data becomes clearer and clear that it was more contagious than we initially thought and less deadly.

There is also a huge issue related to morbidity.  While COVID-19 may not be as deadly as originally thought, there are several serious health after effects that are still the subject of much research.  While folks may recover, they may have continuing issues such as permanent lung damage, loss of taste/smell, clotting disorders, serious damage to multiple organs (such as the kidneys), etc.  Some of these recent developments are troubling and not fully understood.

 

Hank