What's up with October 2020?

[TNcruising02]

2 hours ago, xDisconnections said:

A short 3 day trip can quickly turn into a long, unplanned 17+ day trip.

That's assuming an entire ship would be quarantined.  I don't think that will happen.  I think they will work it out to move any positive cases to a certain area.  The virus has already made its way around the world.  Quaratining a ship would only make sense if the point was to not infect anyone where the ship ports. The virus is already in the US.  I can see the ship being prevented from porting at a place with no cases.  But Florida already has cases.  They just need to work out containment. 

Keeping those ships from porting was a huge mistake, in my opinion.  Testing is so good now that they could test everyone before they get off of the ship if they needed to and get results in 15 minutes.  There are so many new developments in testing that I believe making a ship stay out to sea for two weeks won't happen again.

Edited June 23, 2020 by TNcruising02

[TNcruising02]

1 hour ago, Lottacruises said:

 

Quick 3 day trips mean alot more people passing through the terminals and the ships, exposing workers to double (more or less) the amount of people in one 6 day trip. 

 

Pandemic-wise  the six or seven day trips or longer are much more logical to reduce exposure.

 

The profitability of the longer ones, like everything else here, can be argued.

But amusement parks have a huge number of visitors.  Many will visit for only a day or two.  Same with casinos.  If an amusement park can work it out, then anyone can.  Talk about a very high risk place!  Unless those rides are sanitized between every single person, there is a big risk.  

When I cruised in March, they were constantly cleaning.  If they can actually disinfect places with sprays, that will help.  Hotels have the same issue because they have different guests nearly every night.  If other places can do it, I think cruise ships can too.

 

[Lottacruises]

1 hour ago, TNcruising02 said:

But amusement parks have a huge number of visitors.  Many will visit for only a day or two.  Same with casinos.  If an amusement park can work it out, then anyone can.  Talk about a very high risk place!  Unless those rides are sanitized between every single person, there is a big risk.  

When I cruised in March, they were constantly cleaning.  If they can actually disinfect places with sprays, that will help.  Hotels have the same issue because they have different guests nearly every night.  If other places can do it, I think cruise ships can too.

 

 

I'm only speaking of cruise ships and comparing a short cruise to a long cruise and giving my reason as to why it doesn't make sense to me to  intentionally sail short cruises because of the pandemic. I dont own carnival though, they will do what they want.

 

[Lottacruises]

1 hour ago, TNcruising02 said:

That's assuming an entire ship would be quarantined.  I don't think that will happen.  I think they will work it out to move any positive cases to a certain area.  The virus has already made its way around the world.  Quaratining a ship would only make sense if the point was to not infect anyone where the ship ports. The virus is already in the US.  I can see the ship being prevented from porting at a place with no cases.  But Florida already has cases.  They just need to work out containment. 

Keeping those ships from porting was a huge mistake, in my opinion.  Testing is so good now that they could test everyone before they get off of the ship if they needed to and get results in 15 minutes.  There are so many new developments in testing that I believe making a ship stay out to sea for two weeks won't happen again.

 

What considerations would there be for foreign passengers who cannot legally stay in the country they are able to port in? 

[TNcruising02]

5 minutes ago, Lottacruises said:

 

What considerations would there be for foreign passengers who cannot legally stay in the country they are able to port in? 

What considerations are made now if a foreign passenger gets a severe case of the flu?

[TNcruising02]

9 minutes ago, Lottacruises said:

 

I'm only speaking of cruise ships and comparing a short cruise to a long cruise and giving my reason as to why it doesn't make sense to me to  intentionally sail short cruises because of the pandemic. I dont own carnival though, they will do what they want.

 

Because the shorter amount of time a person stays in the same place, the less likelihood that the place will have to deal with a severe illness.  The odds of someone going from testing negative to being admitted to the hospital are most likely more than three days.

[Lottacruises]

31 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

What considerations are made now if a foreign passenger gets a severe case of the flu?

 

Couldnt tell you, but under normal circumstances they would fly home and not overstay their permission.

[Lottacruises]

31 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

Because the shorter amount of time a person stays in the same place, the less likelihood that the place will have to deal with a severe illness.  The odds of someone going from testing negative to being admitted to the hospital are most likely more than three days.

So, I am more likely to  catch the virus by staying at home for weeks on end with the same people as opposed to traveling from house to house coming in contact with more and more people. Got it. Cruisers will be in the port they visit a few short hours meaning no risk at all to the locals. Understood now. Thanks for clearing that up. I hope carnival is smart enough to do just that, for all of our safety.

[wesorbeth]

52 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

Because the shorter amount of time a person stays in the same place, the less likelihood that the place will have to deal with a severe illness.  The odds of someone going from testing negative to being admitted to the hospital are most likely more than three days.

Yes but a ship turning over every 3-5 days could potentially infect more people.

 

[wesorbeth]

4 hours ago, Lottacruises said:

 

Quick 3 day trips mean alot more people passing through the terminals and the ships, exposing workers to double (more or less) the amount of people in one 6 day trip. 

 

Pandemic-wise  the six or seven day trips or longer are much more logical to reduce exposure.

 

The profitability of the longer ones, like everything else here, can be argued.

So true/.

[TNcruising02]

24 minutes ago, Lottacruises said:

So, I am more likely to  catch the virus by staying at home for weeks on end with the same people as opposed to traveling from house to house coming in contact with more and more people. Got it. Cruisers will be in the port they visit a few short hours meaning no risk at all to the locals. Understood now. Thanks for clearing that up. I hope carnival is smart enough to do just that, for all of our safety.

Testing everyone for the virus is proactive and a reasonable precaution.  There are contagious diseases and people have to learn to live with them.  If an amusement park can open, every place should be able to open. I guess you believe that every business should open, but nobody should ever go on a cruise until (or if) there is a vaccine.  That's fine.  However, I am more open to reasonable precautions.  

I assume that high risk people will not be cruising and high risk people in port cities will not expose themselves to countless tourists.  People should protect themselves and those willing to live life should be able to do so.  People will, at some point, be able to fly in to port cities.  Same thing.  Same exact thing as people from a cruise ship getting off of the ship. A cruise ship that has tested people before boarding is a lot less likely to expose people in port cities to the virus as someone flying in.

Edited June 23, 2020 by TNcruising02

[JerseyGirlJen]

On 6/22/2020 at 4:06 PM, K&RCurt said:

We are booked on a cruise 10/25 out of Baltimore on the Pride, 7 days.  It is gone also.  As the OP stated only 3, 4 & 5 day cruises show availible.

 

My personal opinion is that they are planning to start off with shorter cruises first.  I am failry certain the 6+ day cruises in October will be cancelled.  My big hope is that if they are going to to that, they do it before my final payment date of July 27th.

It could be that it sold out.  With all the cancelled cruises people were booking into the fall and winter.  I'm booked on the Breeze in early December and ours is gone too, but I know that it has been teetering on the verge of being sold out for a while.  They also rescheduled a big poker tournament to our cruise too, apparently.  Keeping fingers crossed that you can sail in October.

[TNcruising02]

15 minutes ago, wesorbeth said:

Yes but a ship turning over every 3-5 days could potentially infect more people.

 

On the flip side, if someone felt fine when they boarded the ship but had the virus, then three days later when they are exiting the ship they are less likely to expose as many people than if they had been on a longer cruise.  Especially someone with no symptoms.

Edited June 23, 2020 by TNcruising02

[Lottacruises]

10 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

I guess you believe that every business should open, but nobody should ever go on a cruise until (or if) there is a vaccine.  That's fine.  However, I am more open to reasonable precautions

 

You would guess wrong. How you came up with this by comparing a 3 day versus a 6 day cruise is beyond me. 

[Lottacruises]

13 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

I assume that high risk people will not be cruising and high risk people in port cities will not expose themselves to countless tourists

 

Lol, how many cruises have you been on?

[Lottacruises]

16 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

People should protect themselves and those willing to live life should be able to do so.

 

 I thought you were suggesting 3 day cruises because you felt they would be safer. Now I'm seeing cruising should just be for those unafraid to live life. I guess those people like the 3 day cruises and not longer ones. Is that the reason you suggested carnival may do the short ones?

[Cruisesfun65]

41 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

I assume that high risk people will not be cruising and high risk people in port cities will not expose themselves to countless tourists.  People should protect themselves and those willing to live life should be able to do so.  People will, at some point, be able to fly in to port cities.  Same thing.  Same exact thing as people from a cruise ship getting off of the ship. A cruise ship that has tested people before boarding is a lot less likely to expose people in port cities to the virus as someone flying in.

 

This is incorrect on many levels. At the moment countless Caribbean islands are requiring incoming passengers (by AIR) to quarantaine for 14 days.

Can't do that with cruise passengers. 

Having a ship stopping at various destinations means increasing exposure for both parties. The guest can get infected locally, the locals can get infected by a guest that's been exposed to the virus on any of the previous ports.

Having been tested prior to the cruise is no guarantee that you won't get infected DURING the cruise.

[TNcruising02]

47 minutes ago, Cruisesfun65 said:

 

This is incorrect on many levels. At the moment countless Caribbean islands are requiring incoming passengers (by AIR) to quarantaine for 14 days.

Can't do that with cruise passengers. 

Having a ship stopping at various destinations means increasing exposure for both parties. The guest can get infected locally, the locals can get infected by a guest that's been exposed to the virus on any of the previous ports.

Having been tested prior to the cruise is no guarantee that you won't get infected DURING the cruise.

It appears that various places are phasing in allowing people to fly into their countries.  Bermuda will require testing before arrival and the  after arrival.  However, the test results upon arrival will take less than 24 hours.  So that is the length of time they will need to quarantine.  It is possible that at a later date, rapid results tests will become available.  It appears that the 14 day quarantine may go away and be replaced with testing upon arrival and only quarantining while waiting for results.

It's possible that if cruise lines would test passengers before boarding, ports would allow them to stop.

Bermuda

Phase 1 – Pre-departure 

• Passengers responsible for the following
  Obtaining a certified PCR COVID 19 test that is negative and taken within 72hrs of departure
• Ensuring they have appropriate health insurance
• Wearing face masks for the entirety of their journey including to the departure airport and at all terminal building whilst also observing social distancing
• Traveler screening forms must also be completed
• Transporter must also carry out contactless temperature checks on all passengers prior to embarking, together with a verbal health check  
• Phase 2 – In Flight
• During the flight all passengers must wear face masks and observe social distancing as much as possible
• Interaction between passengers and flight crew should be minimal
• Aircraft should be disinfected

• Phase 3 – Upon Arrival

• Passengers must continue to wear their face masks and observe social distancing
• Customs and Immigration Officials will be wearing necessary levels of PPE and shielding
• Luggage will be sanitized
• As part of safety protocols ‘health checks’ to be conducted upon arrival
• As soon as possible after arrival every passenger must undergo COVID 19 testing either at the airport or at their accommodations
• Test results are expected to be received within 24 hrs 
• Passengers must quarantine at accommodations until test results are received 
• Phase 4 – On Island
• Upon exiting the airport face masks must still be worn
• Standard requirement for physical distancing face masks and sanitizing apply to ground transportation.
• Guest should physically distance and quarantine in their room until test results are received 
• Throughout the stay temperatures should be taken twice a day and the results recorded
• Enhanced guidelines to follow should a COVID test return positive

https://www.universalweather.com/blog/caribbean-coronavirus-covid-19-impact-on-business-aviation/

 

Edited June 24, 2020 by TNcruising02

[Cruisesfun65]

Bermuda is just one of many Caribbean ports of call and not a good example as it is not one of the most frequently visited. 

The point I'm trying to make  - are the cruise lines going to test their guests after each port of call? Because it only takes 1 guest to get infected on shore to give it to crew members and other passengers on the ship.

Local authorities are in deliberations with the cruise lines in order to reach a decision on when to reopen for cruises.

So, it's not only the CDC advice that will dictate when cruising will resume, it's also based on when the ports of call are open to passenger ships again.

[wesorbeth]

1 hour ago, JerseyGirlJen said:

It could be that it sold out.  With all the cancelled cruises people were booking into the fall and winter.  I'm booked on the Breeze in early December and ours is gone too, but I know that it has been teetering on the verge of being sold out for a while.  They also rescheduled a big poker tournament to our cruise too, apparently.  Keeping fingers crossed that you can sail in October.

It's kind of hard to believe EVERY 7 day cruise has sold out. 

[HaveWeMetYet]

52 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

It appears that various places are phasing in allowing people to fly into their countries.  Bermuda will require testing before arrival and the  after arrival.  However, the test results upon arrival will take less than 24 hours.  So that is the length of time they will need to quarantine.  It is possible that at a later date, rapid results tests will become available.  It appears that the 14 day quarantine may go away and be replaced with testing upon arrival and only quarantining while waiting for results.

It's possible that if cruise lines would test passengers before boarding, ports would allow them to stop.

Bermuda

Phase 1 – Pre-departure 

• Passengers responsible for the following
  Obtaining a certified PCR COVID 19 test that is negative and taken within 72hrs of departure
• Ensuring they have appropriate health insurance
• Wearing face masks for the entirety of their journey including to the departure airport and at all terminal building whilst also observing social distancing
• Traveler screening forms must also be completed
• Transporter must also carry out contactless temperature checks on all passengers prior to embarking, together with a verbal health check  
• Phase 2 – In Flight
• During the flight all passengers must wear face masks and observe social distancing as much as possible
• Interaction between passengers and flight crew should be minimal
• Aircraft should be disinfected

• Phase 3 – Upon Arrival

• Passengers must continue to wear their face masks and observe social distancing
• Customs and Immigration Officials will be wearing necessary levels of PPE and shielding
• Luggage will be sanitized
• As part of safety protocols ‘health checks’ to be conducted upon arrival
• As soon as possible after arrival every passenger must undergo COVID 19 testing either at the airport or at their accommodations
• Test results are expected to be received within 24 hrs 
• Passengers must quarantine at accommodations until test results are received 
• Phase 4 – On Island
• Upon exiting the airport face masks must still be worn
• Standard requirement for physical distancing face masks and sanitizing apply to ground transportation.
• Guest should physically distance and quarantine in their room until test results are received 
• Throughout the stay temperatures should be taken twice a day and the results recorded
• Enhanced guidelines to follow should a COVID test return positive

https://www.universalweather.com/blog/caribbean-coronavirus-covid-19-impact-on-business-aviation/

 

Those rules sound like one miserable nauseating way to spend a vacation.

 

Cruise lines do not want to take on testing people because of the liability if things go wrong.

 

If a country is requiring a mask to be worn inside its borders a cruise ship will not be arriving.

Edited June 24, 2020 by HaveWeMetYet

[TNcruising02]

The alternative to testing is taking temperatures and that's just not a good way to screen people for the virus, in my opinion.  I think they should test before boarding and at least attempt to have a covid-free ship upon sailing.  If they don't, then I think there will be people with the virus who will board unless the virus dies out. Just like people with the virus will eat at restaurants, fly on planes, go to amusement parks, beaches, and even to the grocery store.  The cruise ships could have passengers sign liability waivers and agree to the test as a requirement for cruising.  I'm not sure what the liability would be if they signed a waiver agreeing to the test.  Anyway, that's just an option that I think would work.

[HaveWeMetYet]

17 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

The alternative to testing is taking temperatures and that's just not a good way to screen people for the virus, in my opinion.  I think they should test before boarding and at least attempt to have a covid-free ship upon sailing.  If they don't, then I think there will be people with the virus who will board unless the virus dies out. Just like people with the virus will eat at restaurants, fly on planes, go to amusement parks, beaches, and even to the grocery store.  The cruise ships could have passengers sign liability waivers and agree to the test as a requirement for cruising.  I'm not sure what the liability would be if they signed a waiver agreeing to the test.  Anyway, that's just an option that I think would work.

The legal liability occurs when a passenger is tested positive and is denied boarding or forced into quarantine when they later are proved to be negative, or, a passenger tests negative, when they are actually positive and infect other passengers.

In the US, airline screening falls on a government agency, not the airlines

[Lottacruises]

25 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

The alternative to testing is taking temperatures and that's just not a good way to screen people for the virus, in my opinion.  I think they should test before boarding and at least attempt to have a covid-free ship upon sailing.  If they don't, then I think there will be people with the virus who will board unless the virus dies out. Just like people with the virus will eat at restaurants, fly on planes, go to amusement parks, beaches, and even to the grocery store.  The cruise ships could have passengers sign liability waivers and agree to the test as a requirement for cruising.  I'm not sure what the liability would be if they signed a waiver agreeing to the test.  Anyway, that's just an option that I think would work.

 

Lol, that's not the path to return to cruising. 

[TXCruisers1007]

On 6/22/2020 at 1:24 PM, Cruisesfun65 said:

We all know now that the official cruise pause is until Sept 30th.

But why are all the 6+ sailings suddenly unavailable for October???

Only 3, 4 and 5 day cruises open for booking.

Please don't say it's a reduced capacity issue, as that is a myth. No cruise line introduced reduced capacity sailing yet and every time a sailing has disappeared online it's been canceled shortly after. 

Having 2 short October cruises booked, I'm confused as to why these are still available. 

Well, think about it this way...

October cruises not canceled as final payment is due soon.  Carnival is expecting folks to pay that final payment.  If cruise canceled, no final payment made, Carnival does not receive those funds.  So, why would they cancel?

Talked to the PVP, per that conversation:

Those booked for October and November cruises cannot make changes without incurring a penalty.

Does not matter the date of the booked cruise, if booked for October or November.

If the penalty is removed, allowing those booked for a cruise in either of those months, then any funds paid would be a future cruise credit and cannot be used as a deposit for a future cruise.

 

So, it appears that if you want to keep your deposit, one must make the final payment regardless of whether the cruise will happen or not.

 

If the penalty is removed, one is allowed to reschedule, an additional deposit would be required.

 

There are no deposit to deposit transfers allowed.

 

Regardless, Carnival is requiring additional funds, by either making final payment or requiring additional deposit in order to retain the deposit already paid.

 

Therefore, one has to make the decision as to whether they are willing to lose the deposit already paid or investing more funds in a cruise that probably won’t happen.

 

Considering the current state of affairs, a deposit to deposit transfer should be allowed.