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8 hours ago, ontheweb said:

Were there other ships that sailed without any cases during that time period?

 

If it was so evident, why did the passengers not know? Or did they willingly take on the risk if they did know?

 

Those are also questions that could very well be asked.  Hindsight tells us those ships should not have sailed, but obviously no one had all the information we now have. Even now we are told scientists are still learning more about this virus.

The cruise lines, even today are not exactly open with the number of COVID-19 cases.  They have routinely hidden behind "flu like symptoms" and have tested for COVID only when forced.  If it wasn't for the land based authorities is Japan, Australia and the US getting involved we would not have known the extent of the illness of those three ships.

 

You have crew on the ships, that are still testing positive when they arrive in their home country, and where they are not being tested by their cruise line, unless forced as part of the repatriation process.

 

The discovery process on what was known and what instructions were given to the ships in the early days of the outbreak will be quite interesting.

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The chartering entity cancelled our cruise on March 11, 2 days prior to HAL and the rest of the cruise industry suspending cruises on March 13. 

 

By mid-February it was apparent that Covid-19 was being spread person-to-person in Asia - including on ships with Americans on board - and anyone who remembers SARS in 2002-2003 or even thinks logically about rapid disease spread by trans-oceanic airline flights, could foresee that continuing to cruise would result in serious outbreaks on-board.  A regimen of taking temperatures or filling out health questionnaire or checking passports for recent travel to China, then performing lots of cleaning on-board would not be adequate to contain the virus.

 

The discovery process will take its course through the legal system, but it is apparent to me that the risk was certainly widely known in medical circles (and Carnival has a medical department for a reason) by the week of March 2, which was when I decided NOT to buy an airline ticket to the port because the cruise was too risky.  I had not insured the cruise, and "no refunds from HAL on a charter," but I preferred to let $6,000 go down the drain rather than risk Covid-19 on the ship. 

 

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I'm just not sure most of us realized the seriousness of the virus early in March. Who would have thought it could spread so quickly. I didn't have a cruise booked, but was spending the winter in a rented Florida condo. We made the decision to leave a month and a half early only because our old hometown city in New York was the epicenter and we knew first hand how fast the infection was spreading. I think it was a toss of the dice for the cruise lines. They did know what was happening and sailed with fingers crossed. How many of us, with a cruise planned, would have canceled at that time? I think the passengers have a case, JMHO.

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I don't think the average passenger who is not a medical professional would have realized the seriousness of Covid-19.  In fact,  Dr. Fauci said something to the effect of "If you are young and healthy without risk factors, you can probably go ahead and cruise, though I can't imagine why you would want to do that" (I am paraphrasing of course); he recommended that older adults and people with risk factors NOT cruise.  But the cruise line leadership and medical departments were aware of how dangerous the virus could be, but decided to cruise anyway.

 

That is my personal opinion and I am not a lawyer. 

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Posted (edited)
46 minutes ago, doctork said:

But the cruise line leadership and medical departments were aware of how dangerous the virus could be, but decided to cruise anyway.

 

 

I agree. The virus was declared a global health emergency at the end of January, and Diamond Princess was quarantined more than a month prior to Zaandam's sailing. No one on this board needs reminding that Princess and HAL are both under the Carnival umbrella and as such, HAL officials must have been QUITE aware of the issues and the danger. And they had already skated close to the edge with Westerdam finally allowed to disembark passengers in Cambodia -- also a month earlier than the Zaandam sailing.

 

Not to mention that there have been a number of interviews of both staff and passengers aboard which paint a pretty clear picture of no additional precautions being taken.

 

Whether they were grossly negligent or just negligent in a non-legal sense, I do not feel they handled it well.

Edited by cruisemom42

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Posted (edited)
49 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I agree. The virus was declared a global health emergency at the end of January, and Diamond Princess was quarantined more than a month prior to Zaandam's sailing. No one on this board needs reminding that Princess and HAL are both under the Carnival umbrella and as such, HAL officials must have been QUITE aware of the issues and the danger. And they had already skated close to the edge with Westerdam finally allowed to disembark passengers in Cambodia -- also a month earlier than the Zaandam sailing.

 

Not to mention that there have been a number of interviews of both staff and passengers aboard which paint a pretty clear picture of no additional precautions being taken.

 

Whether they were grossly negligent or just negligent in a non-legal sense, I do not feel they handled it well.

If you read some of the testimony of Princess personnel in the Australian  hearings about the Ruby their competence seems in doubt.  Though it might be that they would rather appear incompetent than appearing that they intentionally obscured information.

Edited by npcl

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I would think that the absolute last thing that Carnival Corp or HAL wants is to undergo the  discovery process and for the details of that discovery to reach the general public.

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