Once sailing resumes, do you think an entire ship would be "quarantined" for a + and not allowed to come into home port?

[clo]

2 hours ago, K32682 said:

Among the ways long term care and seniors homes addressed an outbreak was to quarantine a ward/floor, put all the positive residents in it and restrict access.  As cruise ships share many of the same qualities as a long term care home a plan to do the same might be acceptable.  In this way the entire ship would not be quarantined only a portion of it. 

Interesting.

[clo]

29 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

Keep in mind we are talking about the EU here, and I would guess they are primarily thinking of their own member states' citizens. 

 

I didn't double check this so feel free to correct me but here's a list I found of the European countries that are NOT in the European Union. Any talk about that?

 

Which European countries are not part of the EU?

Not in European Union :Albania, Armenia. Belarus, Gibraltar, Iceland, Kosovo, Lechtenstein, Macedonia, Norway, Russian Federation, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, and Vatican City State (Holy See).

[navybankerteacher]

19 minutes ago, clo said:

I didn't double check this so feel free to correct me but here's a list I found of the European countries that are NOT in the European Union. Any talk about that?

 

Which European countries are not part of the EU?

Not in European Union :Albania, Armenia. Belarus, Gibraltar, Iceland, Kosovo, Lechtenstein, Macedonia, Norway, Russian Federation, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, and Vatican City State (Holy See).

Where was that list, and who made it?  How about the UK ?  Kind of big in the news lately about its leaving the EU.

[ldubs]

9 hours ago, ontheweb said:

And both of those have problems. For the EU plan, how will you get ports to agree to take on infected passengers. For the CDC plan, do they really expect there to be hospital ships trailing every cruise ship or maybe instead available at every port.

 

The CDC plan is responding to lock down mode.  I don't think it will be applicable in the future.   It will be modified as we manage the pandemic.  

 

I think we should forget about cruise guidelines.  To me the real answer to future cruising is to manage the pandemic.  Once we do that, we will be in a position to determine what guidelines are needed for safe cruises.  Talking only of the US, any cruising guidelines we develop right now are pretty much a waste of paper.   There is simply no way to have cruises happen safely in the middle of a pandemic.  

[cruisemom42]

44 minutes ago, clo said:

I didn't double check this so feel free to correct me but here's a list I found of the European countries that are NOT in the European Union. Any talk about that?

 

Which European countries are not part of the EU?

Not in European Union :Albania, Armenia. Belarus, Gibraltar, Iceland, Kosovo, Lechtenstein, Macedonia, Norway, Russian Federation, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, and Vatican City State (Holy See).

 

I'm not aware of any guidances that have been issued by individual countries not part of the EU at this time. Some probably have little or no vested interest in cruising returning. (Holy See, Armenia, anyone?)

 

This is strictly a guidance for EU member states -- and cruise lines who may operate at any ports in those states -- and as far as I know represents only interim recommendations/guidance for those entities.

 

From the introduction:  "The purpose of this document is to provide general guidance to EU/EEA member states and to cruise lines about options for measures on travel and tourism that could be applied after lifting the restrictive measures implemented in response to the COVID-19 pandemic." 

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, clo said:

I didn't double check this so feel free to correct me but here's a list I found of the European countries that are NOT in the European Union. Any talk about that?

 

Which European countries are not part of the EU?

Not in European Union :Albania, Armenia. Belarus, Gibraltar, Iceland, Kosovo, Lechtenstein, Macedonia, Norway, Russian Federation, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, and Vatican City State (Holy See).

However, the following nations are part of the EEA (European Economic Area) which the interim guidelines will also apply to:

Iceland, Lichtenstein, Macedonia, Norway, Switzerland, Turkey.  Armenia and Belarus have no seacoast.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, ldubs said:

Cooperation and agreement with gov't agencies seems the only way these things will ever happen.

47 minutes ago, ldubs said:

The CDC plan is responding to lock down mode.  I don't think it will be applicable in the future.   It will be modified as we manage the pandemic.  

The cruise lines were major contributors to the EU interim guidelines, so this is likely why there is better coordination and less onerous restrictions.  As for the US, we need to manage the pandemic, something we haven't done yet on a national basis, so any modification will be far down the road, and it likely will still be very restrictive, more so than the EU.

 

[K32682]

48 minutes ago, ldubs said:

 

The CDC plan is responding to lock down mode.  I don't think it will be applicable in the future.   It will be modified as we manage the pandemic.  

 

I think we should forget about cruise guidelines.  To me the real answer to future cruising is to manage the pandemic.  Once we do that, we will be in a position to determine what guidelines are needed for safe cruises.  Talking only of the US, any cruising guidelines we develop right now are pretty much a waste of paper.   There is simply no way to have cruises happen safely in the middle of a pandemic.  

 

Is there a reasonable prospect of the U.S. actually managing the pandemic?  15,300 new cases in Florida today with no respite in sight. Taking a cruise from one of the Florida ports is hardly an attractive prospect and having cruisers who land in Florida and spread throughout North America upon their return is equally unappealing. 

[Charles4515]

I didn't double check this so feel free to correct me but here's a list I found of the European countries that are NOT in the European Union. Any talk about that?
 
Which European countries are not part of the EU? Not in European Union :Albania, Armenia. Belarus, Gibraltar, Iceland, Kosovo, Lechtenstein, Macedonia, Norway, Russian Federation, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, and Vatican City State (Holy See).

Some of those countries are landlocked. Switzerland, Belarus, Kosovo, Liechtenstein, Macedonia and Vatican. Armenia is landlocked in Asia.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[ldubs]

3 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

Is there a reasonable prospect of the U.S. actually managing the pandemic?  15,300 new cases in Florida today with no respite in sight. Taking a cruise from one of the Florida ports is hardly an attractive prospect and having cruisers who land in Florida and spread throughout North America upon their return is equally unappealing. 

 

I think it is reasonable, but because of the denial experts, it won't happen without more suffering than should be.  

 

California had close to 12,000 new cases yesterday.  Mostly from spoiled brats in Southern California.  

 

 

 

[ldubs]

3 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

The cruise lines were major contributors to the EU interim guidelines, so this is likely why there is better coordination and less onerous restrictions.  As for the US, we need to manage the pandemic, something we haven't done yet on a national basis, so any modification will be far down the road, and it likely will still be very restrictive, more so than the EU.

 

 

Well said.   We have a long way to go before we can realistically discuss cruise guidelines in the US.  

[cbr663]

5 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Keep in mind we are talking about the EU here, and I would guess they are primarily thinking of their own member states' citizens. 

 

Repatriation means getting the person to their home country, whatever that country may be. There is not any other meaning.

 

Regarding health care costs, nationals that are part of the EU are entitled to medical care in any other EU country at the prevailing rate. For most EU countries, the cost would not be the major issue.

 

 

The EU has opened its borders to Canadians, and though I haven't investigated, I assume that means that Canadians can take EU cruises.

 

I had a brain fart on repatriation. lol   Thanks for that.  Though I still don't know how that would happen when I see stories regularly in the media of Canadians still trying to get back home without much success.  The devil is in the details with statements like these.

[cruisemom42]

1 hour ago, cbr663 said:

 

The EU has opened its borders to Canadians, and though I haven't investigated, I assume that means that Canadians can take EU cruises.

 

I had a brain fart on repatriation. lol   Thanks for that.  Though I still don't know how that would happen when I see stories regularly in the media of Canadians still trying to get back home without much success.  The devil is in the details with statements like these.

 

I don't know for sure, but given the title, I assume these are only intended to be interim measures while cruising gets up and going again. That would also mean (to me) that most of the early cruisers are going to come from Europe rather than further afield. Even though the EU has opened its borders to Canadians, isn't Canada's Foreign Office advice still to avoid all cruise ship travel at this time?  (As well as all non-essential travel outside Canada.)  https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories

 

Apparently AIDA cruise line, which is starting the ball rolling with 3-day cruises to nowhere, has said that their cruises will comply with these guidelines:   https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2020/07/09/aida-cruises-return-sea-august-without-port-calls/5404227002/

Edited July 13, 2020 by cruisemom42

[d9704011]

7 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

isn't Canada's Foreign Office advice still to avoid all cruise ship travel at this time?  (As well as all non-essential travel outside Canada.)  https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories

Yes, very much so.  There are flights from Canada to Europe but they’re limited.  One would have to be truly desperate for a three day cruise to go to the effort and/or ignore the travel advisories with the potential consequences attendant to that.  I suppose a B2B could make a difference.....

[K32682]

1 hour ago, d9704011 said:

Yes, very much so.  There are flights from Canada to Europe but they’re limited.  One would have to be truly desperate for a three day cruise to go to the effort and/or ignore the travel advisories with the potential consequences attendant to that.  I suppose a B2B could make a difference.....

 

You would also have to desperate enough to submit to a 14 day quarantine that applies to anyone entering Canada.  Travellers are required to provide a quarantine plan to the Canadian Border Services Agency upon arrival and should it be deemed unsuitable they will be sent directly to a government-approved facility.

 

The government takes the quarantine seriously. For two weeks, you can expect to be called to confirm you are where you are supposed to be, possibly visited by the authorities and your electronic devices tracked.  The only acceptable reason to leave your quarantine location is critical medical care. The maximum penalty for breaking quarantine is a $750,000 fine and 6 months in jail.

[cbr663]

10 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I don't know for sure, but given the title, I assume these are only intended to be interim measures while cruising gets up and going again. That would also mean (to me) that most of the early cruisers are going to come from Europe rather than further afield. Even though the EU has opened its borders to Canadians, isn't Canada's Foreign Office advice still to avoid all cruise ship travel at this time?  (As well as all non-essential travel outside Canada.)  https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories

 

Apparently AIDA cruise line, which is starting the ball rolling with 3-day cruises to nowhere, has said that their cruises will comply with these guidelines:   https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2020/07/09/aida-cruises-return-sea-august-without-port-calls/5404227002/

 

That is still very much the advice for all Canadians, to avoid cruise line travel and to avoid all non-essential travel, but sadly, that isn't stopping some from traveling.  One of the fundamental weakness of cruise travel during a pandemic is the fact that it attracts a global passenger, and without checking right now, I don't recall reading any plans of cruise lines restricting passengers from certain areas.

[cbr663]

3 hours ago, d9704011 said:

Yes, very much so.  There are flights from Canada to Europe but they’re limited.  One would have to be truly desperate for a three day cruise to go to the effort and/or ignore the travel advisories with the potential consequences attendant to that.  I suppose a B2B could make a difference.....

 

I agree with you and would add that anyone going on a cruise in this environment must be truly desperate.  Keep in mind though that someone from Canada could theoretically right now plan an extended land vacation to Europe and simply hop on a cruise while there.

[clo]

1 hour ago, cbr663 said:

I agree with you and would add that anyone going on a cruise in this environment must be truly desperate. 

And/or nuts.

[ontheweb]

8 hours ago, clo said:

And/or nuts.

Why nuts, the only cruises now (though none of us in the USA could go on them) seem to be very safe. There are the 3 day AIDA cruises in Germany with no ports plus the Norwegian line that starts with H doing coastal cruises with only Norwegians and Danes aboard.

 

You want nuts, how about when a state sets records 2 days in a row for new cases, you open Disney World to the public!  A week or two from now they better to a lot of contact checking when some of these people start showing symptoms.

 

 

[clo]

1 minute ago, ontheweb said:

Why nuts, the only cruises now (though none of us in the USA could go on them) seem to be very safe. There are the 3 day AIDA cruises in Germany with no ports plus the Norwegian line that starts with H doing coastal cruises with only Norwegians and Danes aboard.

 

You want nuts, how about when a state sets records 2 days in a row for new cases, you open Disney World to the public!  A week or two from now they better to a lot of contact checking when some of these people start showing symptoms.

 

 

Oh, lordy, I'm totally with you. Nevada is in the top six states with increases over 30% in one week so yeah, I know. I was pretending like someone would be allowed to cruise. And we've sailed twice on Hurtigruten and their Norwegian coast one seems quite safe. If anything happens we could be ashore in a flash. And IIRC there was only one day truly "at sea" so you had wonderful views constantly.