Extra tipping

[wowzz]

21 minutes ago, sparks1093 said:

I agree that there is no need for an additional tip but the service charge is taking the place of the tip, so you are still tipping and the UK hasn't really left it behind.

But the service charge is not compulsory, you do not have to pay it.

[mammajamma2013]

7 minutes ago, clo said:

I didn't have the impression that the employees get that money in the beginning but rather the end.  No?

That was my understanding as well. 

[Toofarfromthesea]

23 hours ago, c-boy said:

huh , I would think motivation or promotions would be based on annual evaluations. 

 

The only union job I ever held was as a public school teacher, and once you are tenured (which now takes a ridiculously short time - I became tenured on the first day of my third school year) short of doing something stupid to get fired, pay and benefits are the same for everyone at your seniority and graduate credits level.  You *could* take courses to up your graduate units, to a point, to bump into a higher pay column but, at least in the district I worked in, they didn;'t have to relate to anything you were teaching.  You could be a math teacher and take a class on Jane Austen for personal enrichment, and those graduate units would count towards a column move.  NOTHING actually was based on our (bi)annual observations and evaluations once you were tenured.

It is a crazy way to run a railroad, but there it is.

[c-boy]

thanks Toofar, I'm in the corrections industry or as I call it adult daycare and health spa. 😏   Our contract involves evals annually, core courses, and if one has a degree that can go along way toward promotion. I have informed many a deputy that corrective action on their behalf would help in their carrier should they wish to advance.   

[sparks1093]

1 hour ago, wowzz said:

But the service charge is not compulsory, you do not have to pay it.

That strengthens my point that the UK has not abandoned tipping as some like to assert.

[Toofarfromthesea]

4 hours ago, 2wheelin said:

Good point. Where does that then put prepaying tips (charges) before even on the ship?. No service rendered. Not advocating either way. Just pointing out that absolute, black and white statements (of others) don’t hold water. Words—-Hmmmmm.

 

The distinctions I would draw is that while the "standard" grat IS (or can be) paid in advance, 

 

a) the crew members don't get it in advance and don't necessarily know if the standard amount will actually be paid, for any given pax,

b) while ostensibly a gratuity - and that has real tax implications for some crew - the reality is that it is a fee for service.  It is a standard amount for a standard level of service.  It is built into the wage structure.

That is a far cry from giving a bartender $20 on the first day in the hope of getting priority service and better pours.

[Toofarfromthesea]

3 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Yep. Here's a quote from the website www.visitlondon.com, the first thing that came up when I googled "is tipping normal in the UK":

It is customary to leave 10 to 15% of the bill when eating out. However, restaurants often add on a service charge (usually 12.5%), especially if you're in a large group, so it's worth checking your bill if you don't want to tip twice. It's not customary to pay a tip for fast food, self-service or takeaway meals.

 

(I will add that if the service charge is automatically added [which may be what the previous poster meant by "the price is inclusive"] one is still providing a tip, it is just not a voluntary thing at that point.)

 

I will add that when a service charge is added, to me that's it.  Even if I would normally tip more, I would need some exceptional over the top service before I would even consider anything more.  I believe the culture of wherever you are should control tipping, not ones home culture. 

If I visit a place where tipping is not part of the culture I don't tip.  If I go somewhere where there is no pay and workers depend entirely on tips I would tip, and tip lavishly.  If I go somewhere like the US and it is a position where the person is paid a less than market wage in the expectation that tips will make up the difference then of course I tip, usually pretty generously. 

What I wouldn't do is criticize the culture of the place I'm in, and use that as an excuse to screw the poor waiter or waitress who had nothing to do with how that culture came to be, in the interests of showing disdain for the culture.  I'm from xxx and we don't tip, is a poor excuse, IMO.  You might not like the tipping culture but using that excuse not to tip in a tipping culture just makes someone an ugly-xxxer.  When in Rome . . .

Edited July 13, 2020 by Toofarfromthesea

[Toofarfromthesea]

3 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

A lot of shore based establishments pool tips and the fact is that once you've left the tip you have absolutely no control over what happens to it- it will be distributed as the establishment/staff require. And if you think about it this is really no different if the tips are included in the fare because the good and the bad staff get paid the same (eventually under either system the bad staff will be winnowed out).

 

And whether tips are included in the fare or paid separately you still have the ability, if you choose, to pay cash tips to those you feel deserve extra.

[Roger88]

I always tip. I remember the time when I was working as a pizza driver and tips were making around 70% of my total income. I totally understand these young people. Its not only about appreciation of their work but also a kind of support they need. Please, people, tip those who serve you and give you services. One day you might be in their shoes and you will understand 

[clo]

11 minutes ago, Roger88 said:

I always tip. I remember the time when I was working as a pizza driver and tips were making around 70% of my total income. I totally understand these young people. Its not only about appreciation of their work but also a kind of support they need. Please, people, tip those who serve you and give you services. One day you might be in their shoes and you will understand 

When we travel to other countries I always check to see how it's handled there. You can actually be looked down upon if you tip when you shouldn't.

[sparks1093]

1 hour ago, clo said:

When we travel to other countries I always check to see how it's handled there. You can actually be looked down upon if you tip when you shouldn't.

That's probably true, but they probably wouldn't be in a hurry to give you your money back, either.😉

[ldubs]

12 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

I'm sure convenience is a big factor to some, I personally wouldn't pay that much more for it if it meant that I would be paying for a lot of stuff that I have no interest in and would therefore receive little value for. 

 

I feel the same way.  I sometimes don't understand the nickel and dime complaints.