will you be booking a new cruise yet.

[norm2002]

On 7/11/2020 at 5:51 AM, hamrag said:

Indeed, and yesterday the USA recorded the highest number of daily new cases which any country has had since the pandemic began....72,000 new cases, which will result in many more deaths as the virus continues to spiral out of control due to many ignoring appropriate safeguards.....unbelievable!

 

And yet Seabourn has still not cancelled the October Sojourn cruise from LA to Miami, in two of the worst affected states for the virus, via Mexico, one of the worst affect countries!

[cruisr]

22 hours ago, robertmartha said:

RKA  - curious  on your comment  about the timing on the vaccine if one by chance is out in the fall - 

do you feel it would be rushed and approved to quickly without proper testing and could have side effects that may only come to light after the fact ? I for one keep saying I’ll be first in line ..... but my wife keeps saying not so fast !

My brother is an MD and he was telling me all the protocols that are being rushed or pushed aside.  he said its a race to be first by these 100 plus companies that are trying to develop a vaccine.  It will be worth billions.  Who knows what short cuts may be taken?  He will not have the vaccine when it first comes out nor will I.  God knows what side effects are not evident which may rear their ugly head a year or so after the vaccine.  Sometimes I read that many equate a vaccine with a panacea and its not.  I hope he is wrong, but I don’t think so.

[rkacruiser]

22 hours ago, robertmartha said:

RKA  - curious  on your comment  about the timing on the vaccine if one by chance is out in the fall - 

do you feel it would be rushed and approved to quickly without proper testing and could have side effects that may only come to light after the fact ? I for one keep saying I’ll be first in line ..... but my wife keeps saying not so fast !

 

Please read the following post where I will hopefully be able to show the quote from cruisr.

[rkacruiser]

23 minutes ago, cruisr said:

My brother is an MD and he was telling me all the protocols that are being rushed or pushed aside.  he said its a race to be first by these 100 plus companies that are trying to develop a vaccine.  It will be worth billions.  Who knows what short cuts may be taken?  He will not have the vaccine when it first comes out nor will I.  God knows what side effects are not evident which may rear their ugly head a year or so after the vaccine.  Sometimes I read that many equate a vaccine with a panacea and its not.  I hope he is wrong, but I don’t think so.

 

This is my view as well.  The Federal Government (and undoubtedly other governments) are throwing billions into companies--some of which have yet to have a marketable product to sell--to develop a vaccine, or at least, a medical way to alleviate the suffering and death that is associated with Covid-19.

 

Scientific research is such that one does not walk into the lab on a Monday morning and by the end of the work week, one has discovered the next "best thing to sliced bread".  

 

God knows:  we ALL hope for the development of a vaccine and/or remedies that will make this pandemic part of our world's unpleasant history.  Will such a remedy happen?  Will a vaccine be developed that will be effective and safe?  One can only pray that such will happen.  And, happen sooner than later.  

[robertmartha]

Thank you cruisr and rka for your insight.

Deep down I share your concerns and opinions as well - its just my hope for a vaccine clouds my better judgement - just want to return to some sense of the "old" normal at home and in the workplace....this "new normal" while working in the tri-state of the US - has not been as strictly followed by other parts of the US who are now paying the price...and I know its inevitable that we are headed for another round in the fall. I think I have hit that proverbial wall with all this. 

[SLSD]

2 hours ago, robertmartha said:

Thank you cruisr and rka for your insight.

Deep down I share your concerns and opinions as well - its just my hope for a vaccine clouds my better judgement - just want to return to some sense of the "old" normal at home and in the workplace....this "new normal" while working in the tri-state of the US - has not been as strictly followed by other parts of the US who are now paying the price...and I know its inevitable that we are headed for another round in the fall. I think I have hit that proverbial wall with all this. 

The really sad thing is that in the states that have not followed guidelines, MANY of the residents HAVE followed the guidelines---but with so many others not following them, all of our efforts have almost gone for naught.  I am an optimist though--and have high hopes of a normal life again--which will include cruising.  I think the key is leadership.  

[rkacruiser]

22 hours ago, robertmartha said:

my hope for a vaccine clouds my better judgement - just want to return to some sense of the "old" normal at home and in the workplace...

 

I understand fully the desire to return to a sense of normality.  At my most depressed, I ask myself why am I having to endure this experience at this stage of my life after everything else that I have endured.

 

22 hours ago, robertmartha said:

19 hours ago, SLSD said:

I think the key is leadership.  

 

Leadership with a consistent message that is based upon science and not on someone's "gut feelings".  Then, a citizenry that will follow that leadership and make the sacrifices that individuals may need to make for the betterment of their society.  

 

I am more hopeful for my first sentence to be realized, eventually.  I am less hopeful for my second sentence to be realized.  The American people have forgotten--and I am truly convinced too many millions never learned or understood--how the sacrifices that are grand-parents and parents made contributed to the United States being able to win WW II.  

[SLSD]

14 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

 

 

I am more hopeful for my first sentence to be realized, eventually.  I am less hopeful for my second sentence to be realized.  The American people have forgotten--and I am truly convinced too many millions never learned or understood--how the sacrifices that are grand-parents and parents made contributed to the United States being able to win WW II.  

Your statement makes me so sad because I fear that it is true.  While many of us have been making sacrifices in dealing with the pandemic--others have not--and the whole country is paying the price.  Yes, we need consistent leadership based on science.  And yes I know--this is a novel (new) virus and the understanding of it may change over time as more is learned.  That is no reason to not follow the best scientific guidance that we have right now.  

[hamrag]

12 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

....The American people have forgotten--and I am truly convinced too many millions never learned or understood--how the sacrifices that are grand-parents and parents made contributed to the United States being able to win WW II.  

 

Reading this, my first thought was 'how true'....then I read the final 8 words, and realised you never learned or understood the facts that it was allied troops who won WW 2.....!

[rkacruiser]

11 hours ago, hamrag said:

 

Reading this, my first thought was 'how true'....then I read the final 8 words, and realised you never learned or understood the facts that it was allied troops who won WW 2.....!

 

My post was not meant to discount the sacrifices that were made by Allied troops.  I do realize and understand and most surely appreciate what those men and women did to preserve our way of life. 

 

The last part of my statement was referring to what those on the home front had to sacrifice in order to provide the resources and supplies that the Allied troops required to win the war.  Rationing of all sorts of commodities, i.e. gasoline, rubber, sugar, food, etc., the planting of Victory gardens, the buying of War Bonds, etc., these are the sacrifices that those on the Home Front contributed to the war effort.  We were all in this effort together from 1941-1945.  

 

Covid-19 crisis of today:  We, in the United States of America, are clearly not in this effort together.  

 

hamrag, I hope this post will provide a better understanding of my thinking.

[wesport]

Living in Florida, I am starting to think a cruise might be safer than living in this state. 

[SLSD]

5 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

My post was not meant to discount the sacrifices that were made by Allied troops.  I do realize and understand and most surely appreciate what those men and women did to preserve our way of life. 

 

The last part of my statement was referring to what those on the home front had to sacrifice in order to provide the resources and supplies that the Allied troops required to win the war.  Rationing of all sorts of commodities, i.e. gasoline, rubber, sugar, food, etc., the planting of Victory gardens, the buying of War Bonds, etc., these are the sacrifices that those on the Home Front contributed to the war effort.  We were all in this effort together from 1941-1945.  

 

Covid-19 crisis of today:  We, in the United States of America, are clearly not in this effort together.  

 

hamrag, I hope this post will provide a better understanding of my thinking.

I understand what you were trying to say---it was concern about the current attitude of Americans--and not a comment on the allied partnership that was required to win World War II.  

[markham]

... which is why it's never a good idea to generalize about a people, nation, race or whatever. Who needs to create misunderstandngs among those groups?

 

The US, if you don't mind me saying, is an extremely diverse group of people, in every way, demographically. Some are vociferous and make make the most sense to their own cohort of listeners. That is the "why" as to how there happens to be so much division and even rancor there when certain politicians and pundits make their provocative points. Childish, embarrassing, exclusionary or whatever. Which means that what they do may well not travel well to other countries and peoples at all.

 

This America first stuff will pass with all its ridiculousness, and I am sure of that, and start waning in the lead up to the November elections there, in only several short weeks. Unless, of course, those that think otherwise refuse to concede that we live in a global world where people demand to be treated respectfully, fairly and tolerantly. Their loss- as America and Americans  move on.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

[tv24]

I too have been thinking of this issue daily.  When we return to cruising it will probably be on a transatlantic crossing either on Seabourn or the Queen Mary.  And I have been thinking about that for Fall, 2021.  I would also consider an extravagantly long time on Seabourn, but have not found anything inspiring in their current offerings.

 

But we have nothing booked.  I won't go on a ship until there is an effective and widespread vaccine.  And I also await the cruise lines' new systems to ensure the low risk of virus transmission.  Finally there is the issue of crossing borders.  Right now US citizens (like me) are banned or quarantined in so many places and I don't expect that to change as the pandemic is far from contained in the States.  So for these reasons, I don't anticipate making a booking for a long time.  Alas.

[Mauzac]

Totally agree TV24.  (And do hope you have had luck with your refund now?  I felt for you, such a long time to wait)

 

Personally, I won't be booking until SB have had quite a few successful cruises under their belt and I feel reassured.  I would say it won't be until a vaccine, but I read so much on this, I'm not sure there will ever be one.  

 

I just hope that we can cruise next year, but we will be doing a last minute booking if there is still availability.

 

Interestingly, our TA has sent us details of World Cruise 2022, departing 11 January, and asking for a £500 deposit to secure.  We would love to do that to make up for our 30 day cruise we've just missed but it's just too early to make a commitment yet. 

Edited July 16, 2020 by Mauzac

[SLSD]

Just for the record, the CDC (Center for Disease Control) in the United States HAS extended the ban on cruising:https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/cdc-extends-u-s-ban-on-cruise-ships-through-september?fbclid=IwAR3yIMhpqkoxmfVz5iIpJpHwB_F74lh4AV9s2Yp5vdu-tcY933edLvYUwtE

 

 

Edited July 16, 2020 by SLSD

[MaggyCan1]

On 7/11/2020 at 3:51 PM, robertmartha said:

I should caveat my earlier posting about enhanced cleaning and sanitizing was in no way critical to Seabourn - we thought our sailing on the Odyssey in January was perfection - we found the ship to spotless and we had no issues with cleanliness at all - it was meant to combat the germs and or virus' that may be brought on board by other passengers.

 

One thing I would love to see (but I know would never happen) would be a day between sailings....where a ship would be disembarked by noon - thoroughly cleaned over a 24 hr period and then new passengers on boarded the following day. For those sailing on a B to B it would be an overnight in the port (not a bad thing) and would add another day to their B to B - would just have to figure out the pricing of that "extra day" for them. Always feel that those turn-around days must be dreaded by the crew for the amount of work they need to do in such a short amount of time.

 

 

I really like your idea for the day between sailings, although I also agree that it is unlikely to happen due to the effect it would have on the cruise line's bottom line.   And the crew would absolutely love it as well.   

[saminina]

On 7/14/2020 at 11:20 PM, markham said:

This America first stuff will pass with all its ridiculousness, and I am sure of that, and start waning in the lead up to the November elections there, in only several short weeks. Unless, of course, those that think otherwise refuse to concede that we live in a global world where people demand to be treated respectfully, fairly and tolerantly. Their loss- as America and Americans  move on.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

 

I agree,  lets concede to the China first policy and we can all live in harmony.

[markham]

Saminia,

Is that how you see the difficult state of international relations now?

If so, then maybe it’s best to leave the difficult issues and nuanced policy decisions to those who are skillful. Everyone wins. See?

Happy and healthy sailing!
 

[SLSD]

As things get worse and worse where I live (Texas), cruising looks far far away.  I would just settle for  our yearly trip to Santa Fe, NM right now, never mind the cruise itinerary we had in mind.  One thing we DO know is that the virus is a real problem that has affected every one of our lives and most lives all around the world.  Deciding whether we will cruise will not just be our decision to make.  Countries all over the world will have to be on board (so to speak) and willing to allow passengers from many different countries to come on their shores and mingle with their citizens.  This speaks to the reality of a global world ( and this, just looking at cruising) that none of us can escape.  Surely, the hubris of the America First issue has been a bit tarnished by our embarrassing response to this virus as compared to almost every response around the world. Yes, I am really sad.  

[norm2002]

3 hours ago, SLSD said:

This speaks to the reality of a global world ( and this, just looking at cruising) that none of us can escape.

 

This is what really depresses me. Maybe I've watched too many disaster movies in previous years. In most of those where the world is threatened by a worldwide catastrophe, meteors, floods or whatever, governments throughout the world soon realise they have to work together and co-operate to meet the crisis. I should have realised they are fantasy movies. Now we hear claims, true or not doesn't matter, that Russia and China are trying to hack and steal and even interfere with vaccine development in the West and the US president decides to buy up the entire stock of remdesivir for at least the next three months so that no other country can have access to it.

 

As the UN Secretary General keeps trying to remind us - We are all in this together!

 

What kind of a world are we living in? Latest figures say nearly 15 million cases worldwide and over 600,000 dead with potentially millions to be at risk of starvation. What on earth are we doing?

 

 

Sorry, I don't want to upset or depress anyone and probably this isn't the place for such a rant but I feel rather strongly about this.

[SLSD]

46 minutes ago, norm2002 said:

 

 

 

As the UN Secretary General keeps trying to remind us - We are all in this together!

 

What kind of a world are we living in? Latest figures say nearly 15 million cases worldwide and over 600,000 dead with potentially millions to be at risk of starvation. What on earth are we doing?

 

 

Sorry, I don't want to upset or depress anyone and probably this isn't the place for such a rant but I feel rather strongly about this.

We ARE all in this together and I think it is much better to work together.  It is a tough tough time.  

[rkacruiser]

On 7/19/2020 at 1:54 PM, SLSD said:

I would just settle for  our yearly trip to Santa Fe, NM right now, never mind the cruise itinerary we had in mind.

 

Once it was a yearly trip for me:  Virginia Beach.  Loved it; best beach and environs on our East Coast in my opinion.  I was hoping for a repeat in the Fall.  Not going to happen and any idea that I had for another Holiday cruise has been dashed.  It will be the first time in several years that I "welcome" a New Year as I sit in my living room and watch (maybe) the Ball to drop at Times Square.  

[Covepointcruiser]

Hope RKA is still all right.   Virginia Beach is a current hot spot but if you get through the next 14 days you are probably okay.   If I were you I would be safe and get tested.

 

[SLSD]

14 hours ago, Covepointcruiser said:

Hope RKA is still all right.   Virginia Beach is a current hot spot but if you get through the next 14 days you are probably okay.   If I were you I would be safe and get tested.

 

RKA said that his trip to Virginia Beach was not going to happen this year.