Cruises that do not go to ports.

[Ashland]

2 hours ago, Germancruiser said:

LOL- you almost got me! Great humor!

No....I saw it on the news last night...sorry I didn't have a link but I see someone provided it.

[chengkp75]

6 minutes ago, twangster said:

Not that I think the cruise lines would ever pursue my wine induced idea, but...

 

I did find reference to the Ensenada issue in the federal register.  In that case it was a PVSA violation as opposed to a crew visa issue.  In particular since three cruise ships are authorized for coastwise trade in Hawaii it was determined that Ensenada was used by non-coastwise vessels visiting Hawaii from the mainland for the purpose of evading the PVSA .  Ensenada is currently now a port to keep certain California cruises legal as long as Hawaii isn't involved so it's not like Ensenada was the issue by itself, it was only when Ensenada was involved on closed loop Hawaii cruises from the mainland that the violation was deemed to have occurred.  Basically Norwegian who owns the authorized coastwise vessels in Hawaii objected so when they looked into it they determined it was a violation.

 

In my made up concept, there doesn't appear to be same PVSA violation as no US port is visited as a port of call on the concept closed loop cruise AND there is no coastwise authorized ship(s) that is impacted.   Perhaps this is partially why CBP hasn't been directed to consider Victoria as a PVSA evasion tactic.  If there was an authorized coastwise vessel operating this route it might be a different story.   

 

It's not like the cruise lines would ever do this, it was the wine posting it on my behalf.

 

The issue with Ensenada was that the cruise lines were calling there at midnight, and only stopping for an hour or two to get the ship cleared, no passenger was allowed to disembark at the port, so this became a "technical stop".  This use of the Ensenada port stop was considered to violate the "intent" of the PVSA, while meeting the "letter" of the law.

 

If the cruise advertises Victoria as a port of call, and does allow passengers off the ship, then it really isn't a "technical stop", but someone like the Alaska Marine Highway and the Washington State Ferry would have a lot to say about your concept, as they would be impacted.

[twangster]

4 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

The issue with Ensenada was that the cruise lines were calling there at midnight, and only stopping for an hour or two to get the ship cleared, no passenger was allowed to disembark at the port, so this became a "technical stop".  This use of the Ensenada port stop was considered to violate the "intent" of the PVSA, while meeting the "letter" of the law.

 

If the cruise advertises Victoria as a port of call, and does allow passengers off the ship, then it really isn't a "technical stop", but someone like the Alaska Marine Highway and the Washington State Ferry would have a lot to say about your concept, as they would be impacted.

 

Thank you for the clarification.  I am sure there are many more rulings from many other violations beyond the one example I found.

 

I was thinking more for my concept in the Caribbean with no US port of call as a stop.  Leave Miami, dock in Cozumel, return to Miami sort of thing.  A cruise not to nowhere, but the next best thing so that we could cruise during this pandemic (assuming the CDC approved) while minimizing exposure opportunity on the cruise.

Edited September 19, 2020 by twangster

[John&LaLa]

1 hour ago, twangster said:

How about this as a concept cruise to almost somewhere... "Party on the Pier!".

 

Sail off to some willing foreign port with a pier for a 4 or 5 night cruise where the ship docks.  Passenger visit the pier where they have tables and chairs set apart appropriately with food and beverage service from the ship (included in dining and beverage packages if you bought one). 

 

Locals on boats slowly floating by play live music paid for as part of the cruise fare.   After 3 or 4 hours passengers reboard and depart for fun filled days at sea.  Guests never leave the pier so the island and guests are safe from cross contamination.  

 

You are processed by local immigration officials normally so the ship has an official country visited therefore overcoming the cruise to nowhere label.

 

 

Doesn't sound all that much different from Coco Cay

[twangster]

Just now, John&LaLa said:

 

Doesn't sound all that much different from Coco Cay

 

PDCC employees hundreds of locals which introduces the fear for Bahamians they could get it while working.  

 

Plus the Gov't of the Bahamas has already said they don't want ships just going to their private islands, they want them coming to Nassau as well.  

[John&LaLa]

5 minutes ago, twangster said:

 

PDCC employees hundreds of locals which introduces the fear for Bahamians they could get it while working.  

 

Plus the Gov't of the Bahamas has already said they don't want ships just going to their private islands, they want them coming to Nassau as well.  

 

It doesn't have to.  Go back to the days when ships staff worked the venues. Close the water park for the interim. I'll bet a skeleton crew could run the docking

 

Plus, it's only temporary 

Edited September 19, 2020 by John&LaLa

[Qextor]

6 hours ago, twangster said:

So far these calls into Victoria haven't been deemed violations so no reason to think they will be when guests are actually debarking the ship and enjoying local cultural events.  

 

That is because Victoria is a 'deemed foreign port' as there is no other way for Alaskan cruises to meet the requirements otherwise.

[chengkp75]

38 minutes ago, Qextor said:

 

That is because Victoria is a 'deemed foreign port' as there is no other way for Alaskan cruises to meet the requirements otherwise.

Ensenada is a foreign port as well, but because, in the past, it was never advertised as a port of call on the Hawaii cruises, and because it happened late at night, and no passengers were allowed to go ashore, it was deemed a "technical stop" and a violation of the "intent" of the PVSA.  So, now, Hawaii cruises from the West Coast (closed loop) still use Ensenada, but it is advertised as a port of call, and passengers are allowed to go ashore.  What is being debated about Victoria is that Royal is starting service to Alaska, and only stopping in Victoria for 3-4 hours, in the evening, which could be considered a "technical stop", and they would be forced to increase the time in Victoria, and likely bring it forward to the daytime.

[GUT2407]

They are pretty common here in Australia but usually only a few days, personally I love them and usually cheaper for a two or three night cruise to nowhere then a night or two in a hotel, meals and a show. Last one we did was on Celebrity for Mrs Gut’s birthday, were planning on doing similar this year, but oh well....

[Qextor]

Princess cruises from Seattle normally spend about 5 hours in port (7pm-11:59pm) in Victoria, so that length of time seems to be long enough for it to count as a proper port stop.   Perhaps if Royal does the same, they will be fine as well.

[little britain]

OT but...www.cnn.com/travel/amp/flights-to-nowhere-qantas/index.html

[A&L_Ont]

Before a lot of debate is wasted on Victoria keep your fingers crossed that the border is open with Canada. Currently closed until October 24th.  Just read an article which states behinds the scenes sources mentioning Christmas as a possible opening date.
 

All a wait and see but Keep your fingers crossed, Alaska cruises might happen next year. 

[Milwaukee Eight]

50 minutes ago, A&L_Ont said:

Before a lot of debate is wasted on Victoria keep your fingers crossed that the border is open with Canada. Currently closed until October 24th.  Just read an article which states behinds the scenes sources mentioning Christmas as a possible opening date.
 

All a wait and see but Keep your fingers crossed, Alaska cruises might happen next year. 

That will really hurt our Canadian snowbirds who generally are here (Daytona Beach area)  in early October and for Biketoberfest. 
 

M8

[A&L_Ont]

Mom is already missing the idea of no Sarasota from January to March.  Plans can change but for now she is gonna have to suck it up. 😂

Edited September 19, 2020 by A&L_Ont

[mugtech]

Singapore Airlines is now offering flights to no where.  Take off in Singapore, fly for three hours, land in Singapore.  Think it is a way to allow people to use their airline credits before they expire.  Meanwhile in the Philippines the president has declared that the covid-19 state of calamity is extended until September of 2021.

[Germancruiser]

As much as i understand the desire to cruise again- I don´t see any lure for a flight to nowhere- with no purpose at all. Sitting in my - if flying coach- narrow chair- just for the fun of flying? Each his own I suppose. IMO there is a big difference between a three hour flight and 7 night cruise to nowhere- which is similar to a Transatlantic cruise- without reaching a different country.

[John&LaLa]

On 9/19/2020 at 1:28 PM, mugtech said:

Singapore Airlines is now offering flights to no where.  Take off in Singapore, fly for three hours, land in Singapore.  Think it is a way to allow people to use their airline credits before they expire.  Meanwhile in the Philippines the president has declared that the covid-19 state of calamity is extended until September of 2021.

 

State of Calamity. I like the sound of that 

[Dennis#1]

On 9/19/2020 at 1:28 PM, mugtech said:

Singapore Airlines is now offering flights to no where.  Take off in Singapore, fly for three hours, land in Singapore.  Think it is a way to allow people to use their airline credits before they expire.  Meanwhile in the Philippines the president has declared that the covid-19 state of calamity is extended until September of 2021.

Could this be a picture of what Singapore Airlines is using?🍻

[Germancruiser]

1 hour ago, Dennis#1 said:

Could this be a picture of what Singapore Airlines is using?🍻

Oh thats how they do it. Amazing. They could have taken a X- or Cunard- or RCG - ship-  that one looks a lot like Costa- Ship - sorry then i must decline- no Costa anymore for me- one cruise with them was quite enough!

I would recommend a bit longer a flight then 3 hours though. Just think- you have to get settled in you cabin- ready for dinner- not to forget the muster drill- in the flight version - of course- then there is still the matter of some Martinis to get down- one has to make use for the OBC or drinking package!