Advice will pretty much be obsolete when we sail again

[ontheweb]

Just now, clo said:

Oh right. We were going to do a Norwegian coastal in early April IIRC and they closed the country down. That was a doozy cause that cruise was just one part of a trip that had 16 different components, i.e., tickets to events, flights, hotels, trains, you name it. It was a royal pain to then take it apart piece by piece.

Ours was easy to cancel because as well as the cruise the flights were with Princess EZ Air. And our hotel in London allowed cancellation up to the day we were supposed to arrive.

[clo]

1 minute ago, ontheweb said:

Ours was easy to cancel because as well as the cruise the flights were with Princess EZ Air. And our hotel in London allowed cancellation up to the day we were supposed to arrive.

Lucky you. My husband finally helped with a couple of things that were driving me crazy. And there was an airbnb host in Paris who wasn't going to refund us even though France had closed its border. Airbnb took care of that one at least. Aw, man, it makes me nuts just thinking about that trip. Ugh.

[ontheweb]

1 minute ago, clo said:

Lucky you. My husband finally helped with a couple of things that were driving me crazy. And there was an airbnb host in Paris who wasn't going to refund us even though France had closed its border. Airbnb took care of that one at least. Aw, man, it makes me nuts just thinking about that trip. Ugh.

Well, now that it almost Thanksgiving, be thankful that you got through that and managed to remain somewhat sane. 😃

[clo]

1 minute ago, ontheweb said:

Well, now that it almost Thanksgiving, be thankful that you got through that and managed to remain somewhat sane. 😃

"Somewhat" being the operative word anyway 🙂

[Markanddonna]

I read some of those postings from late February. I wonder how many of those who were determined to sail ended up on a COVID ridden ship. 

 

We were on an MSC cruise ship in mid February that was like a plague ship by the end of the cruise.  So many sick people whose mother never taught them to cover a cough or cold.  I wanted to wrap myself in bubble wrap and go home. The last day was miserable, and my DH ended up getting the virus that was going around.  He might be carrying COVID antibodies (lots of Italians on that ship!)  Our doctor told us the antibody test wasn't reliable enough to act upon, so he hasn't had one.

[Hlitner]

On 11/22/2020 at 8:15 PM, Markanddonna said:

I read some of those postings from late February. I wonder how many of those who were determined to sail ended up on a COVID ridden ship. 

 

We were on an MSC cruise ship in mid February that was like a plague ship by the end of the cruise.  So many sick people whose mother never taught them to cover a cough or cold.  I wanted to wrap myself in bubble wrap and go home. The last day was miserable, and my DH ended up getting the virus that was going around.  He might be carrying COVID antibodies (lots of Italians on that ship!)  Our doctor told us the antibody test wasn't reliable enough to act upon, so he hasn't had one.

The entire issue of testing (for COVID or antibodies) has become a popular distraction.  Folks wait for hours in queues to be tested...and for what?  If you have symptoms you stay at home, quarantine yourself, and pay close attention to your symptoms.  It things get worse you go to a hospital.  If you get better you continue to live your life just like when you have any other bug.  Whether you had COVID might interest authorities (for statistics) but is not relevant for treatment unless things get nasty. 

 

As to antibodies I am wondering why it matters.  We already know that antibodies from COVID are a temporary thing and will gradually fade away.  So what does getting tested for antibodies prove?  At best is shows you had COVID and still have some protection (which will likely disappear within a few months).  We have a very good friend who is a retired scientist and who thinks he had COVID at an early date during the epidemic.  Like many he can not be sure because he simply stayed home, got better, and went on with his life.  But curiosity caused him to ask his physician about an antibody test so he could find out if he had COVID.  His own physician poo pooed the idea saying that the test was not that accurate and it would serve no real purpose.

 

Hank

[clo]

1 minute ago, Hlitner said:

If you have symptoms you stay at home, quarantine yourself, and pay close attention to your symptoms. 

Actually I have some symptoms and am quarantining. I got a test yesterday but a negative means really nothing. I mainly got it in case it's positive...assuming I'm contagious. But honestly this started over the holiday weekend and I've been in touch with my PCP at the beginning. I'll call them tomorrow and ask for advice. There are no easy answers.

[Hlitner]

11 minutes ago, clo said:

Actually I have some symptoms and am quarantining. I got a test yesterday but a negative means really nothing. I mainly got it in case it's positive...assuming I'm contagious. But honestly this started over the holiday weekend and I've been in touch with my PCP at the beginning. I'll call them tomorrow and ask for advice. There are no easy answers.

I did see your other post about being ill and I hope you quickly get better and back to normal.   I had already ask my own PCP about what to do if I get sick and his answer was just treat it like the flu, stay home, drink plenty of fluids, take Tylenol if you want, and go to the hospital if you start getting serious symptoms like breathing problems.  If folks call their PCP what can they say other then just that.  You can drag yourself to a testing center (no fun if you are feeling sick) and what does that prove.  Even if you have COVID the treatment is no different then any other virus unless the symptoms become problematic. 

 

Where we live it is not even easy to get a COVID test unless it is ordered by a physician.  CVS and Rite Aid do handle PCR testing, but it is difficult to get an appointment unless it is ordered by a physician.  Our nearest hospital has excellent testing facilities (PCR test results within a day) but will only test those referred by a physician.   So folks might want to consider that "positivity rates" are a joke since the denominator (total tests) are primarily reserved to folks who are already sick.  So if only 5% test positive that is effectively 5% of folks who already think they are sick....not 5% of the total population.

 

Hank

[clo]

1 minute ago, Hlitner said:

You can drag yourself to a testing center (no fun if you are feeling sick) and what does that prove.

Reno has a super system. I got an appointment for their drive-thru within two days. The appt was for 10 and we got there at 945 and we were done before 10! Regardless of the result I'll be quarantining for probably up to 14 days. And having done it for a few days already it's a PITA. I'm in my house or yard or car. Nothing else. Social distancing was a walk in the park compared to this. But I'm committed to protecting others. BTW my 'symptoms' are all external things, mostly skin (see "COVID toes") so I feel fine really. It's an interesting process.

[cruisemom42]

38 minutes ago, clo said:

And having done it for a few days already it's a PITA. I'm in my house or yard or car. Nothing else. Social distancing was a walk in the park compared to this.

 

That's been my world, more or less, since March. To protect myself, to be clear, not others...

 

Since I returned from Naples in late February, 10 months ago:

• I've used less than one tank of gas.
• I've had one telemedicine consult but no appointments with doctor or dentist.
• I've had one haircut. No manicures or pedicures.
• I've met in person with others one time (two friends only) -- and that was just a week ago, in a park.
• I use Uber Eats, DoorDash and InstaCart for food and grocery delivery.
• The only stores I've been inside have been (briefly) the grocery store, drug store, and Trader Joe's. Each only a handful of times.
• Once to my car dealership for a mandatory recall.
• Once to my office (no one else on my entire floor was there, so no contact).
• And once to the post office.
• No travel, not even a drive out of the city.
• No face-to-face with any family except my son who has delayed moving out since March as well. I haven't entered a single retail store other than as named above.
• I've not eaten in a restaurant (indoors or outdoors) since the end of February, just before the first "lockdown". 
• Only two "non-bubble" people have entered my home -- for a furnace check-up and to install a new television.

And I'm not yet flinging poo at the walls or talking gibberish. Fingers crossed.

 

[clo]

4 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

Fingers crossed.

Wow. And sending you all the positive energy possible. If anyone believes this isn't real, I truly want to slap them silly(er).

[ilikeanswers]

38 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

That's been my world, more or less, since March. To protect myself, to be clear, not others...

 

Since I returned from Naples in late February, 10 months ago:

• I've used less than one tank of gas.
• I've had one telemedicine consult but no appointments with doctor or dentist.
• I've had one haircut. No manicures or pedicures.
• I've met in person with others one time (two friends only) -- and that was just a week ago, in a park.
• I use Uber Eats, DoorDash and InstaCart for food and grocery delivery.
• The only stores I've been inside have been (briefly) the grocery store, drug store, and Trader Joe's. Each only a handful of times.
• Once to my car dealership for a mandatory recall.
• Once to my office (no one else on my entire floor was there, so no contact).
• And once to the post office.
• No travel, not even a drive out of the city.
• No face-to-face with any family except my son who has delayed moving out since March as well. I haven't entered a single retail store other than as named above.
• I've not eaten in a restaurant (indoors or outdoors) since the end of February, just before the first "lockdown". 
• Only two "non-bubble" people have entered my home -- for a furnace check-up and to install a new television.

And I'm not yet flinging poo at the walls or talking gibberish. Fingers crossed.

 

I read accounts like yours and I think I got really lucky with the country I am in during 2020😳. I just visited pharmacy today and they even pulled down the perspex barriers. I really hope things are getting better in your part of the world 🤞

Edited November 30, 2020 by ilikeanswers

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, clo said:

Reno has a super system. I got an appointment for their drive-thru within two days. The appt was for 10 and we got there at 945 and we were done before 10! Regardless of the result I'll be quarantining for probably up to 14 days. And having done it for a few days already it's a PITA. I'm in my house or yard or car. Nothing else. Social distancing was a walk in the park compared to this. But I'm committed to protecting others. BTW my 'symptoms' are all external things, mostly skin (see "COVID toes") so I feel fine really. It's an interesting process.

COVID toes.  Argh.  Tis a strange virus with so many different symptoms.  The problem with testing is that even if you were to get a negative COVID result (we can all hope) then you have to figure it is a false negative and quarantine anyway.  I do think that protecting others is an obligation (many others disagree).  DW and I are soon off on an 8 day trip (to the Florida Keys) where we can easily social distance except when dealing with the airport and flight.  But we planned this trip so we would be home exactly 2 weeks before we plan on spending time with DD and our Grandchildren (all of whom are also isolating themselves).   I would agree with those who say the safest thing is to isolate in one's own home but we are determined to live our lives with COVID to the extent it is reasonable.  If we mess up it is on us and there is nobody to blame but ourselves.

 

The positive news regarding vaccines is encouraging.   Hard to believe that about half the population is reluctant to get vaccinated and that is going to be a real nightmare for the public health folks.  I still remember when I was a kid and how we all rushed to get the Salk vaccine.  No such thing as an anti-vaxer in those days (seeing a picture of a child on an iron lung was enough for most folks).  We live in strange times.

 

Hank

[ontheweb]

Since we are now talking about testing, I thought this article is relevant.

 

If athletes can get coronavirus tests, nurses ask, why not us? - The Washington Post

 

College and professional athletes are tested constantly while an emergency room nurse who is often exposed to the virus cannot get a test. Think about that. 

 

And it occurs to me that no matter what the government says the priorities will be for getting the vaccine, I would not be surprised if the same screwed up situation occurs where the available resources go to these same athletes.

[Markanddonna]

We actually downsized, sold our big house, and moved into a wonderful condo this summer during COVID. Fortunately, we had a quick sale with only a few days of showings, but I was so glad we did this. We moved into an area that is remarkably more efficient and safer than the big city environment of our former home. People around my new area wear masks and seem to take the COVID situation more seriously.

The stress was all worth it, but I wouldn't do it now with the explosion of COVID in our region. Now, we are in a situation where we can more easily travel and not worry about house/yard/snow maintenance!

[Markanddonna]

4 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

 

 

College and professional athletes are tested constantly while an emergency room nurse who is often exposed to the virus cannot get a test. Think about that. 

 

And it occurs to me that no matter what the government says the priorities will be for getting the vaccine, I would not be surprised if the same screwed up situation occurs where the available resources go to these same athletes.

I think you are probably right. The healthy, young athletes will likely be deemed more essential than anyone over 65 or with comorbidities. 

[ontheweb]

1 minute ago, Markanddonna said:

I think you are probably right. The healthy, young athletes will likely be deemed more essential than anyone over 65 or with comorbidities. 

And let's not forget that the 2020 Summer Olympics are now scheduled for the summer of 2021. I'm sure NBC who paid scads of money for the rights to broadcast those games will not let the opportunity pass because there are people who need the vaccine much more than those young healthy athletes.

[Markanddonna]

I wonder if Japan will reopen their borders for the games. Maybe not. 

[SelectSys]

5 hours ago, ontheweb said:

Since we are now talking about testing, I thought this article is relevant.

 

If athletes can get coronavirus tests, nurses ask, why not us? - The Washington Post

 

College and professional athletes are tested constantly while an emergency room nurse who is often exposed to the virus cannot get a test. Think about that. 

 

And it occurs to me that no matter what the government says the priorities will be for getting the vaccine, I would not be surprised if the same screwed up situation occurs where the available resources go to these same athletes.

 

I assume this doesn't really surprise you in any way?  Societies set priorities based on what is important to them - socially, commercially, etc.  I am also expecting that all of those who are rich and/or have other forms of influence (mainly political) will be able to get a "fast track" vaccine.  

 

The only good news I can tell you with respect to athletes is that unlike testing, it is more or less of a once and done situation except for perhaps an annual booster.

 

5 hours ago, Markanddonna said:

I wonder if Japan will reopen their borders for the games. Maybe not. 

 

Depends on how far the vaccine goes as the Olympics is largely a TV event.  Athletes and teams will be certainly present.  Perhaps fans as well if they have a valid vaccination record.

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, SelectSys said:

 

I assume this doesn't really surprise you in any way?  Societies set priorities based on what is important to them - socially, commercially, etc.  I am also expecting that all of those who are rich and/or have other forms of influence (mainly political) will be able to get a "fast track" vaccine.  

 

The only good news I can tell you with respect to athletes is that unlike testing, it is more or less of a once and done situation except for perhaps an annual booster.

 

 

 

No, it does not surprise me. But nowhere do I see anyone in power acknowledging that this will happen. Do they dare say that overpaid athletes are a priority group?

[ilikeanswers]

10 hours ago, Markanddonna said:

I wonder if Japan will reopen their borders for the games. Maybe not. 

 

Japan didn't want to let go of the Olympics this year. It took a mass boycott by athletes to pressure Japan to postpone the games to 2021. Japan has sunk a lot of money into the Olympics (they were hoping for a record in visitor numbers) so they will want to try and get something back at least break even if nothing else. 

Edited December 1, 2020 by ilikeanswers

[Markanddonna]

1 minute ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Japan didn't want to let go of the Olympics this year. It took a mass boycott by athletes to pressure Japan to postpone the games to 2021. Japan has sunk a lot of money into the Olympics so they will want to try and get something back at least break even if nothing else. 

I read today that Japan is committed to keep it going. The have plans, but the best laid plans of mice and men are pretty flawed during a pandemic.

[SelectSys]

18 hours ago, ontheweb said:

No, it does not surprise me. But nowhere do I see anyone in power acknowledging that this will happen. Do they dare say that overpaid athletes are a priority group?

 

Because those same individuals will also go to the front of the line for themselves, their families and cronies.

[clo]

22 hours ago, SelectSys said:

I assume this doesn't really surprise you in any way?  Societies set priorities based on what is important to them - socially, commercially, etc.  I am also expecting that all of those who are rich and/or have other forms of influence (mainly political) will be able to get a "fast track" vaccine.  

 

Aw, come on, folks. Who among us is " rich and/or have other forms of influence (mainly political)" but we still likely know somebody who knows somebody. And we're likely articulate enough to be persuasive in presenting our case. At the far bottom of this spectrum are the POC, poor, uneducated, etc., etc., etc. who have no clout whatsoever. My point is that whining about athletes getting preference is just plain silly.

[SelectSys]

1 minute ago, clo said:

Aw, come on, folks... My point is that whining about athletes getting preference is just plain silly.

 

I am not whining  about it.  That's why I asked OTW if he was surprised.