Princess Cancels all Cruises through March 31, 2021

[bigrednole]

On 11/21/2020 at 1:41 PM, jtwind said:

I thought Fauci said that vaccinations would be rolled out for everyone by March/April.

For US, it should be a requirement to cruise. Moderna and Pfizer could have enough doses for nation wide vaccination by end of March. Now, whether people take it is a different story. Private and public industry can make it a requirement to work and/or enter (think schools, government buildings, airlines, cruises, etc). Moderna has 60M doses ready today. They just need EUA approval. I know 2 people on the Phase III trial. One thinks they have the real deal and the other thinks they have the placebo. The one that thinks it was real felt tired and something like a slight sinus infection for about a week. The other was himself as usual.

[2wheelin]

7 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

What “institution” has a supply - of a vaccine which has not yet been approved - much less distributed?

In case you haven’t been reading the news, millions of doses are awaiting distribution the minute it is approved. As an employee, I am not naming the institution on social media but I guarantee you have heard of it. And if all you want to do is argue, take it up with Dr Fauci. I don’t have an interest in your prattle.

[JRG]

5 hours ago, 2wheelin said:

In case you haven’t been reading the news, millions of doses are awaiting distribution the minute it is approved. As an employee, I am not naming the institution on social media but I guarantee you have heard of it.

 

I'm not following the news as closely as you.....

 

Will it be the Bruce Willis and the U.S. Army or Big Pharma that handles the US Distribution?

 

As a former employee,  I'm thinking Big Pharma.

 

 

[mammajamma2013]

1 hour ago, JRG said:

 

I'm not following the news as closely as you.....

 

Will it be the Bruce Willis and the U.S. Army or Big Pharma that handles the US Distribution?

 

As a former employee,  I'm thinking Big Pharma.

 

 

60 Minutes had a segment about two weeks ago discussing this. US Army is waiting FDA approval and is ready to start distributing the vaccine. So possibly one of (many? a few?) who are waiting approval.

 

Bruce Willis wasn't mentioned.

[cruiseryyc]

Yes vaccinations could start by the end of the year; HOWEVER you have to get buy in from the public to actually get vaccinated.  Then you have to wait for enough people to get it worldwide for it to actually start bringing number of cases down.

 

It appears hard enough to get people to get the regular flu shot, expecting them to get a brand new vaccination will be impossible.  Heck most of them won't even wear masks!

[SelectSys]

22 minutes ago, cruiseryyc said:

... Then you have to wait for enough people to get it worldwide for it to actually start bringing number of cases down.

 

It appears hard enough to get people to get the regular flu shot, expecting them to get a brand new vaccination will be impossible.  Heck most of them won't even wear masks!

 

It is an interesting question if travel will start while case loads are high, even for those who have been vaccinated.  My gut suggests that travel will start - assuming you can prove vaccination before the case rates are almost extinct.  We'll see.

 

Those that don't get vaccinated will be the last to resume travelling I would think.  I really like the QANTAS move to require vaccination for international travel which almost all cruising is. 

[marco]

And I guess they're not alone.  We were notified last week that our March 20 HAL cruise was canx. 

[2wheelin]

4 hours ago, cruiseryyc said:

Yes vaccinations could start by the end of the year; HOWEVER you have to get buy in from the public to actually get vaccinated.  Then you have to wait for enough people to get it worldwide for it to actually start bringing number of cases down.

 

It appears hard enough to get people to get the regular flu shot, expecting them to get a brand new vaccination will be impossible.  Heck most of them won't even wear masks!

Flu shots aren’t mandatory for any activities and they are not highly effective.

There is no reason the cruise lines would need to wait for worldwide vaccinations to start cruising with a vaccination requirement. They could potentially do that in Feb and those who are vaccinated could sign up. Those who are not could not sign up. 

[mom says]

30 minutes ago, 2wheelin said:

 

There is no reason the cruise lines would need to wait for worldwide vaccinations to start cruising with a vaccination requirement. They could potentially do that in Feb and those who are vaccinated could sign up. Those who are not could not sign up. 

In February? You're dreaming. Do you really think that the average person will just be able to walk into their nearest pharmacy and get a COVID vaccination? And remember that it's 2 shots several weeks apart. Perhaps the lucky few who are in the highest priority, or those who boast that they know how to work the system. And since cruising involves travel to other countries,  and by citizens of other countries,  then yes, consideration needs to be given to the prevalence of vaccinated people internationally.

 

And that presupposes that other countries will have opened their ports and borders.  If they are still worried about transmission, then I think that that is not a given. Let's remember that the vaccines have not yet proven that they prevent transmission.

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, 2wheelin said:

Flu shots aren’t mandatory for any activities and they are not highly effective.

There is no reason the cruise lines would need to wait for worldwide vaccinations to start cruising with a vaccination requirement. They could potentially do that in Feb and those who are vaccinated could sign up. Those who are not could not sign up. 

Flu shots are, on average, about 50% effective (it varies by year) and are probably closer to 90% effective in reducing the severity of those who do get the flu.  But your thought that folks will easily be able to get COVID vaccines in February is a pipe dream.  There will likely be some vaccine available to those in high risk groups but it will likely be well into the Spring before there is widespread availability for everyone  Also keep in mind we are likely talking about 2 shots several weeks apart and about a 28 day waiting period (after the first shot) for one's body to build up an effective immune response.   So it may well be that those who would require a vaccine (such as some airlines, countries and cruise lines) might require that customer have proof of being vaccinated at least 28 days prior to their scheduled arrival.

 

Hank

[SuiteTraveler]

1 hour ago, mom says said:

And that presupposes that other countries will have opened their ports and borders.  If they are still worried about transmission, then I think that that is not a given. Let's remember that the vaccines have not yet proven that they prevent transmission.

Stage 2 and 3 clinical trials DO determine if a vaccine is proven to prevent transmission.  That's what the efficacy percentages indicate.  Moderna is 94.5% effective at preventing transmission,  Astra Zeneca's vaccine is 95% effective at preventing transmission, Pfizer/Biontech is 95% effective at preventing transmission.  In Phase 2 trials these vaccines were tested on hundreds of people, in Phase 3 trials these vaccines were tested on tens of thousands of people usually 30,000 people or more for Phase 3.  So, yes it is known that the vaccines prevent transmission by the results of Stage 3 and, in the case of these vaccines, they prevent transmission very well when you compare it to other vaccines which only have an efficacy rate of 80-85%.

[SuiteTraveler]

The Johnson &. Johnson Covid-19 vaccine is currently under a stage 3 clinical trials (since late September 2020) with 60,000 people worldwide and it is expected to require only 1 shot.  Fingers crossed it works because that would really help eliminate Covid-19 faster than a 2 shot formulas as there would not be the uncertainty of patients having to return for a second injection 2 weeks later.  I expect like with the vaccines for measles and polio, that the vaccines for Covid-19 will improve over time and eventually all be 1 injection.  And...I suspect we will have to take them yearly like the flu shot.

[cruisemom42]

13 minutes ago, SuiteTraveler said:

Stage 2 and 3 clinical trials DO determine if a vaccine is proven to prevent transmission.  That's what the efficacy percentages indicate.  Moderna is 94.5% effective at preventing transmission,  Astra Zeneca's vaccine is 95% effective at preventing transmission, Pfizer/Biontech is 95% effective at preventing transmission.  In Phase 2 trials these vaccines were tested on hundreds of people, in Phase 3 trials these vaccines were tested on tens of thousands of people usually 30,000 people or more for Phase 3.  So, yes it is known that the vaccines prevent transmission by the results of Stage 3 and, in the case of these vaccines, they prevent transmission very well when you compare it to other vaccines which only have an efficacy rate of 80-85%.

 

I don't believe that is correct. The Phase 2 and Phase 3 studies are looking to determine whether the vaccines can "prevent virologically confirmed disease" not at whether it prevents transmission of the disease, which is a different endpoint.

 

They may well have an effect on transmission, but at this point in time it is still an unknown.

 

From The Lancet (Sept 21, 2020):

 

Multiple COVID-19 vaccines are currently in phase 3 trials with efficacy assessed as prevention of virologically confirmed disease.4 WHO recommends that successful vaccines should show disease risk reduction of at least 50%, with 95% CI that true vaccine efficacy exceeds 30%.5 However, the impact of these COVID-19 vaccines on infection and thus transmission is not being assessed. Even if vaccines were able to confer protection from disease, they might not reduce transmission similarly.

[mom says]

1 hour ago, SuiteTraveler said:

Stage 2 and 3 clinical trials DO determine if a vaccine is proven to prevent transmission.

That is incorrect. Efficacy means prevention of illness in the recipient. None of the trials to date have produced data on transmission because they weren't designed to collect that data. As Cruisemom noted in her post above.

 

While we would all like to see that the vaccines also prevent transmission, it is possible that vaccinated people could still be carriers,  passing the disease on to the unprotected. Data on this will no doubt be produced in the future.

[chengkp75]

On 11/23/2020 at 8:35 PM, mom says said:

That is incorrect. Efficacy means prevention of illness in the recipient. None of the trials to date have produced data on transmission because they weren't designed to collect that data. As Cruisemom noted in her post above.

 

While we would all like to see that the vaccines also prevent transmission, it is possible that vaccinated people could still be carriers,  passing the disease on to the unprotected. Data on this will no doubt be produced in the future.

This is correct.  Moderna's Chief Medical Officer stated that the trials were not designed to contact trace the test individuals to see if they possibly transmitted the virus to others.  Since the trials were not designed for this, no data was compiled.

[Luckiestmanonearth]

These threads kill me.  A lot of people with built up false hopes because they want to cruise again. I understand it.

 

But as many have said, this will not happen overnight .  More than likely end of 2021 would be a more likely scenario

[Love.II.Cruise]

On 11/26/2020 at 9:22 PM, Luckiestmanonearth said:

These threads kill me.  A lot of people with built up false hopes because they want to cruise again. I understand it.

 

But as many have said, this will not happen overnight .  More than likely end of 2021 would be a more likely scenario

 

I hear you.  What will be interesting to discover is how long the vaccines actually work before you need to get another one.