New vaccine

[ace2542]

49 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

How can there be vaccinations next week when it hasn't even been approved?

Perhaps approval will be announced next week. Or maybe money is talking and they are just doing it anyway without it being approved. There is some talk these tv shows in America are doing that you know.

Edited November 28, 2020 by ace2542

[cruisenewbie1976]

53 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

How can there be vaccinations next week when it hasn't even been approved?

The vaccinations won't go ahead if approval isn't received in time. They'll be rearranged for the following week. I guess they're trying to get everything ready, just in case. 

[yorkshirephil]

It seems likely that HMRA may give emergency approval, which under the circumstances seems logical.

[Dermotsgirl]

17 hours ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

My partner has booked his today too. He's NHS. They had appointments available from Monday next week, so I can only presume that approval is very imminent. There was a caveat when he booked it, that it might be cancelled at short notice. He's booked in for Tuesday. He said a lot of his colleagues are reluctant to have it though. It definitely gives a bit of hope for the future, just need enough people to have it. 

Just wondering about the logistics of this

Where will he go for the appointment?

Also wondering when the vaccines are being delivered and if there’s storage facilities.

 

I’m all for the vaccine, but I understand why your partners colleagues feel a bit reluctant at this point, it must be difficult to be ‘the first’. 

[cruisenewbie1976]

Just now, Dermotsgirl said:

Just wondering about the logistics of this

Where will he go for the appointment?

Also wondering when the vaccines are being delivered and if there’s storage facilities.

 

I’m all for the vaccine, but I understand why your partners colleagues feel a bit reluctant at this point, it must be difficult to be ‘the first’. 

For his appointment, the vaccinations are taking place at Leicester racecourse. Presumably, they've been busy hiring and setting up these vaccination centres over the last few weeks. No idea on the other logistics of delivery and storage etc. 

They've been told that if it doesn't get approval this week, they'll be prioritised for the following week so they're clearly not 100% yet about it happening this week. 

[Dinglebert]

15 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

Just wondering about the logistics of this

Where will he go for the appointment?

Also wondering when the vaccines are being delivered and if there’s storage facilities.

 

I’m all for the vaccine, but I understand why your partners colleagues feel a bit reluctant at this point, it must be difficult to be ‘the first’. 

That would be true if they were the first but they are not.  Many thousands have been through the trials.  The logistics have been worked on for weeks.  I know many people complain about what they see as the pencil pushers in the NHS but they also have an important role to play.

[cruisenewbie1976]

10 minutes ago, Dinglebert said:

That would be true if they were the first but they are not.  Many thousands have been through the trials.  The logistics have been worked on for weeks.  I know many people complain about what they see as the pencil pushers in the NHS but they also have an important role to play.

I'm all for the vaccine, if it gets us back to normal. But I totally understand people being reluctant to have it. We're only taking tens of thousands of people in the trials. And the long term outcome is unknown! 

[Dermotsgirl]

31 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

For his appointment, the vaccinations are taking place at Leicester racecourse. Presumably, they've been busy hiring and setting up these vaccination centres over the last few weeks. No idea on the other logistics of delivery and storage etc. 

They've been told that if it doesn't get approval this week, they'll be prioritised for the following week so they're clearly not 100% yet about it happening this week. 

Thank you👍

[Dermotsgirl]

19 minutes ago, Dinglebert said:

That would be true if they were the first but they are not.  Many thousands have been through the trials.  The logistics have been worked on for weeks.  I know many people complain about what they see as the pencil pushers in the NHS but they also have an important role to play.

It’s why I put ‘the first’ in inverted commas. 
 

we know there’s been trials, but many people will physiologically feel as if they are going first. 

 

 

[Dinglebert]

13 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I'm all for the vaccine, if it gets us back to normal. But I totally understand people being reluctant to have it. We're only taking tens of thousands of people in the trials. And the long term outcome is unknown! 

What would you call long term?  If you wait for years to take the vaccine then its not the solution.

[AndyMichelle]

When you have a vulnerable person at home but need to do all you can to put food on the table, then any sign of help would be appreciated. 

I would take that chance immediately. 

Don't shoot me for it, it suits my circumstances but not everybody's... 

Andy 

[zap99]

14 hours ago, Snow Hill said:

The BioNTech & Pfizer vaccine was joint German - US cooperative venture, the European stock is being manufactured in Belgium. I suspect the No 10 Moran had the Oxford vaccine announced earlier than they want as the US & Germany were stealing the limelight. 

What's a No10 Moran?.

[amajaa]

15 hours ago, ace2542 said:

I don't think Boris wants to shout the virtues of the American vaccines from the rooftops does he? He would much rather be cheering for ours.

Well the Government has just ordered more of the Moderna vaccine so doesn’t seem like bias to me.
 

But surely if a country has developed a vaccine they would rather use their own, it makes sense to me. Plus the Oxford vaccine is easier to store and each dose cost a lost less, makes sense to me. 

[cruisenewbie1976]

18 minutes ago, Dinglebert said:

What would you call long term?  If you wait for years to take the vaccine then its not the solution.

No, I totally agree with you. I'd take it today if it was offered to me. I was just trying to say that I can understand people's concerns. There's been a lot of anti vaccine info out there. 

[zap99]

9 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

When you have a vulnerable person at home but need to do all you can to put food on the table, then any sign of help would be appreciated. 

I would take that chance immediately. 

Don't shoot me for it, it suits my circumstances but not everybody's... 

Andy 

Andy. No 1 consideration for having the jab in our house  isn't can I go one a cruise, go out to dinner, go to a hotel etc. It's can we avoid dying, or giving this virus to someone else. We will go to have it in the first day offered. If you are in front , no shots, only jealousy.🤣

[jeanlyon]

Totally agree with you there.  The person a page or two back talking about herd immunity is talking garbage.  Herd immunity only comes when a large percentage of people are vaccinated.  Then there is no spread. 

[pete14]

29 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I'm all for the vaccine, if it gets us back to normal. But I totally understand people being reluctant to have it. We're only taking tens of thousands of people in the trials. And the long term outcome is unknown! 

Throughout all levels of trials in many countries, some selected because they have high infection rates, over all the producers there are hundreds of thousands of people who have been injected with a vaccine, not tens of thousands. The fact they have even reached level 3, never mind being authorised for mass use, is testimony to their safety. Even if the vaccines don’t work, or maybe only offer temporary protection, trials have shown they are safe. 

[amajaa]

2 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Andy. No 1 consideration for having the jab in our house  isn't can I go one a cruise, go out to dinner, go to a hotel etc. It's can we avoid dying, or giving this virus to someone else. We will go to have it in the first day offered. If you are in front , no shots, only jealousy.🤣

Also for me it would be can I go and see my Children and Grandchildren without them worrying they might give us the virus. We have only seen them from a distance or on video link since lockdown.

[kalos]

3 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

When you have a vulnerable person at home but need to do all you can to put food on the table, then any sign of help would be appreciated. 

I would take that chance immediately. 

Don't shoot me for it, it suits my circumstances but not everybody's... 

Andy 

Same here Andy , everyone has a choice ,that is a personal choice .

I am coming up now to 14 months with my life on hold .

Given half a chance to get my life back to even half of what it was ,

via a vaccine then I will grasp it with both hands at the first chance

I get of having it . I am same as Michelle ,the vaccine can only help 

in our situation ,we will still be left with our medical problems.

Unless people walk in our shoes ..

Good luck and I wish you and Michelle all the very best with it .

[cruisenewbie1976]

1 minute ago, pete14 said:

Throughout all levels of trials in many countries, some selected because they have high infection rates, over all the producers there are hundreds of thousands of people who have been injected with a vaccine, not tens of thousands. The fact they have even reached level 3, never mind being authorised for mass use, is testimony to their safety. Even if the vaccines don’t work, or maybe only offer temporary protection, trials have shown they are safe. 

I totally agree. I was just playing devil's advocate. Some people won't necessarily have done much research though and may have seen anti vaccine info etc and take that as truth.

As I've said, I'd have it today if I could. I saw a scientist say last week that any serious reaction to a vaccine almost always happens within 2 weeks. So I'm confident that they're safe. 

[zap99]

4 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I totally agree. I was just playing devil's advocate. Some people won't necessarily have done much research though and may have seen anti vaccine info etc and take that as truth.

As I've said, I'd have it today if I could. I saw a scientist say last week that any serious reaction to a vaccine almost always happens within 2 weeks. So I'm confident that they're safe. 

The past few weeks I have had Jabs to prevent flu , shingles and pain at the dentist. Questions I didn't ask were what brand ?, What promises of no side effects. What efficacy rate. My main criteria were. Sharp needles and my eyes closed.

[pete14]

2 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I totally agree. I was just playing devil's advocate. Some people won't necessarily have done much research though and may have seen anti vaccine info etc and take that as truth.

As I've said, I'd have it today if I could. I saw a scientist say last week that any serious reaction to a vaccine almost always happens within 2 weeks. So I'm confident that they're safe. 

Please don’t think I am ‘having a go’ but playing devils advocate about something so serious and contentious to a few ‘weak minded’ people, doesn’t help others to follow the only correct path here. As many know, I have played devil’s advocate on here in the past, but not about something so important. What those who say they won’t take the vaccine don’t seem to realise is that not taking it puts others at risk; taking it protects not only the individual but others as well. Quoting that herd immunity will be reached if 70% have immunity whether through having had the virus or by being vaccinated is reckless. Anything less than 100% and the risk remains, especially if immunity is temporary and booster vaccinations are required to top it up. 

[cruisenewbie1976]

9 minutes ago, pete14 said:

Please don’t think I am ‘having a go’ but playing devils advocate about something so serious and contentious to a few ‘weak minded’ people, doesn’t help others to follow the only correct path here. As many know, I have played devil’s advocate on here in the past, but not about something so important. What those who say they won’t take the vaccine don’t seem to realise is that not taking it puts others at risk; taking it protects not only the individual but others as well. Quoting that herd immunity will be reached if 70% have immunity whether through having had the virus or by being vaccinated is reckless. Anything less than 100% and the risk remains, especially if immunity is temporary and booster vaccinations are required to top it up. 

I've never quoted anything about herd immunity being reached at 70%.

And I would argue that these people aren't weak minded. I was referring to NHS staff, on the front line, seeing the effects of covid first hand and still refusing to take the vaccine 

To just brush them off as weak minded and in the minority is very naive. 

But hopefully, as the vaccine is rolled out and people see that there are no ill effects, hopefully that will change. 

As I've said, I'll take it as and when it's offered. My partner and my family are happy to have it too. But I'm not sure we do anyone any favours by dismissing the concerns of those reluctant to take it. 

[cruisenewbie1976]

17 minutes ago, zap99 said:

The past few weeks I have had Jabs to prevent flu , shingles and pain at the dentist. Questions I didn't ask were what brand ?, What promises of no side effects. What efficacy rate. My main criteria were. Sharp needles and my eyes closed.

I said exactly this to my partner yesterday. I asked him how many of his colleagues researched the flu vaccine before they took it. Some do apparently, but the vast majority just have it without a second thought. 

I think nowadays we're just bombarded with too much information. Especially on social media. 

[ace2542]

12 hours ago, KnowTheScore said:

Ace2542 Said:

Vaccine is the only way to protect those remaining and keep the numbers as low as possible

 

No it isn't the only way.  Herd immunity is the only way we ever get back to any kind of normality and it will come from a combination of the millions and millions of people who now have natural immunity and from the few others that decide to take a vaccine.   The vaccines, all of them, are not going to be 100% effective and efficacy will vary with each individual.  We need herd immunity to be able to get over the situation.   An Oxford study suggests we already have that herd immunity because of the millions that have now already had Covid and because of the way Covid works.  They have realised that we actually only need around 20% or so people immune to see very significant reduction in spread.   All very good news.  The relatively smaller number of vulnerable people can get the vaccine shots , the rest of us can make our decisions.   I won't be taking any vaccine personally.

 

 

Ace2542 Said:

and it will be insisted upon.

You keep peddling this idea but it's a nonsense I'm afraid as I have already explained.  Those who have had Covid will have better immunity than you with your vaccine shot.  Especially if its the Oxford vaccine (70% efficacy !).

 

Cruise lines would stand to lose masses of customers if they started introducing Bolshy conditions like mandating vaccines.  Not gonna happen.  They will simply continue to test every passenger before boarding to ensure no-one steps on-board carrying Covid.   That is far more of a thorough and effective step than asking for silly vaccination papers which won't be worth the paper they are written on.    As a cruise passenger I wouldn't give a fig whether anyone was vaccinated.  I'd simply want to be sure no-one came on board with Covid, or for that matter Flu or Norovirus.

 

It's been interesting reading these kind of posts on various forums over the past months.  I find it funny how so many sanctimonious people berate youngsters for mingling or not wearing masks or want to demonise people who won't take vaccines yet these same people have for years been happily getting on cruise ships full of colds Flu and ILI's putting vulnerable people at risk, possibly killing them inadvertently, never once wearing a mask to stop the spread of their germs nor socially distancing themselves.   Go figure.  All very hypocritical imo.

 

Covid vaccines should not be mandated anywhere, it must always be a personal choice and people should not be discriminated against.  Those that believe they are effective and want to take the risks associated with them can do so.  They should not be fussed what anyone else does for if they believe in the vaccines then they are surely protected.  If they are not protected then why take the vaccine?? 

 

Ace2542 Said:

And also what illness claims from person who got coronavirus onboard because people weren't vaccinated. They will be protecting against that too. Hard to prove but I am sure these accident companies will try it on

 

They've never bothered about people spreading Flu or Norovirus or a myriad of other bugs that surely end up with weak vulnerable people dying.  I've had plenty of bugs on cruises as a result of other passengers spreading their germs.  It's life.  I take my health seriously so am always prepared for it and thus never suffer any serious symptoms or complications.   If you're worried about such things then maybe cruising isn't for you TBH.   If you want to live your life in a sterile bubble a cruise ship is definitely not the place.

 

The have never tried for to sue for Noro on a cruise ship to be honest but they do with these all inclusive hotel resorts in Egypt.

 

It seems likely that  a lot of airlines will make you have the vaccine so you won't fly anywhere.

 

The decision for the vaccine might be taken out of the cruiselines hands. I can see a number of countries and by extension a number of cruise ports requiring you to have the vaccine. The lines will likely get fined if they don't enforce that regulations the same way they get fined for allowing passengers onboard without an ESTA. 

 

And finally won't they lose more money if have to lockdown for 14 days and cancel entire sailings if they get an outbreak. And you are assuming testing can be done at the port. Do you have any idea how long it might take to test 3000 people? I don't but may be so long as to overstay their port time and get hit with fines and more port taxes?

 

And i will say it again you will never set foot on a cruise ship again.

Edited November 29, 2020 by ace2542