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Who thinks they should stop closing borders


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On the current Queensland situation - a cleaner at a quarantine hotel became infected with the UK variant of COVID. For this reason, there was extra concern. When this variant was diagnosed, a three day lockdown was imposed on the Greater Brisbane area, not the whole state. We have come out of that period, but now there are restrictions (social distancing and wearing masks). Today the health authorities found that a group of people in the quarantine hotel are also infected. There is concern how this happened.

 

Everyone has been moved from the hotel. I don't think it would be a good idea to let them lose in the community to self-quarantine at home. That hasn't worked in the past as many people think it is OK to go out - maybe they think no-one would notice. I wouldn't like to have to spend another 14 days in quarantine after spending some time already in quarantine, but there probably isn't much of an alternative. BTW, the people don't have to pay for the days already spend in the quarantine hotel.

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Just now, SinbadThePorter said:

 

What often gets left out is that a let it rip approach would also devastate the economy since people would have no faith that their workplaces, shops, sporting events or holiday spots would safe enough to attend.

 

You can have a government imposed restriction on the economy which gets lifted when the virus is suppressed or you can have a covid imposed restriction on the economy which never gets lifted.

'Let it rip' didn't work well in other countries e.g. Sweden and, to some extent, USA.

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13 minutes ago, SinbadThePorter said:

 

There has been plenty of finger pointing coming from Gladys and her mates. In fact it would be fair to say they they've been the most consistent and persistent finger pointers. At everyone from WA to Vic, but especially Qld. But rarely SA or Tas for some reason.

 

If Gladys would just shut up for a while about other states and get on with the job of looking after her own state, everyone would be better off.

 

If we want to stop quarantine breakouts in cities, first step is to get quarantine out of the cities.

I think almost all premiers are unfortunately finger pointing and wagging and it's getting very tiresome and not helping anybody, except their own election chances in some cases. I guess it's all a matter of perspective, or which state you live in. Still not sure why so much heat on NSW when NSW takes the greatest share of inbound arrivals and likely freight. It would be great to get quarantine out of the cities, but I can see that this is easier said than done. For a start, we would need to get a whole lot of those "essential workers" out to the remote area to service the Q facility. And then, are they allowed to return to the city to see their families? And which state exactly would host this remote facility? 

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1 minute ago, ELep said:

I think almost all premiers are unfortunately finger pointing and wagging and it's getting very tiresome and not helping anybody, except their own election chances in some cases. I guess it's all a matter of perspective, or which state you live in. Still not sure why so much heat on NSW when NSW takes the greatest share of inbound arrivals and likely freight. It would be great to get quarantine out of the cities, but I can see that this is easier said than done. For a start, we would need to get a whole lot of those "essential workers" out to the remote area to service the Q facility. And then, are they allowed to return to the city to see their families? And which state exactly would host this remote facility? 

I live in Queensland. I don't hear or see criticism of NSW or of Gladys. The main criticisms I have heard are of Anna P for closing the state borders and similar criticism of WA's Mark McGowan.

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9 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

On the current Queensland situation - a cleaner at a quarantine hotel became infected with the UK variant of COVID. For this reason, there was extra concern. When this variant was diagnosed, a three day lockdown was imposed on the Greater Brisbane area, not the whole state. We have come out of that period, but now there are restrictions (social distancing and wearing masks). Today the health authorities found that a group of people in the quarantine hotel are also infected. There is concern how this happened.

 

Everyone has been moved from the hotel. I don't think it would be a good idea to let them lose in the community to self-quarantine at home. That hasn't worked in the past as many people think it is OK to go out - maybe they think no-one would notice. I wouldn't like to have to spend another 14 days in quarantine after spending some time already in quarantine, but there probably isn't much of an alternative. BTW, the people don't have to pay for the days already spend in the quarantine hotel.

Yes, thanks. This is my understanding. I had a snigger at Anna saying the "guests"  would not be charged for their quarantine and repeat quarantine. I was not sure that that would be much of a consolation. 😞 How many of these people are paying for their quarantine anyway??? Are they supposed to lay their funds on the counter prior to check in? What's the alternative? You just let me go home? Perhaps the returnees have to pay for their quarantine prior to boarding the plane to fly to AU. Anybody know?

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1 minute ago, ELep said:

I guess it's all a matter of perspective, or which state you live in. Still not sure why so much heat on NSW

 

I'm still not sure what heat is coming at NSW from Queensland? All I see is Gladys or one of her minions whinging about Qld border closures at every opportunity and then the Qld CHO saying that's it's not their business. You should see the Murdoch papers up here running Gladys' lines for her if you want to see heat.

 

5 minutes ago, ELep said:

It would be great to get quarantine out of the cities, but I can see that this is easier said than done.

 

It should have been part of Federal planning 12 months ago.

 

5 minutes ago, ELep said:

And which state exactly would host this remote facility?

 

NT. The Feds control it despite is being sort of self governing. There is currently a large facility in use for quarantine at Howard Springs outside Darwin. It would have cost a lot less to build two or three more of those than to put up with the ongoing economic damage that the quarantine failures have cost so far.

 

7 minutes ago, ELep said:

For a start, we would need to get a whole lot of those "essential workers" out to the remote area to service the Q facility.

 

We've been doing it for mines in even remoter areas for years. If you pay people enough they will happily do the job.

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A lot of people are saying the feds should step in re state borders.

 

They don’t have the power too do so.

 

S.51 and 52 of the Constitution set out their powers.

 

They can however control quarantine and could use their money grants to pressure the States.

 

 

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8 hours ago, ELep said:

I think almost all premiers are unfortunately finger pointing and wagging and it's getting very tiresome and not helping anybody, except their own election chances in some cases. I guess it's all a matter of perspective, or which state you live in. Still not sure why so much heat on NSW when NSW takes the greatest share of inbound arrivals and likely freight. It would be great to get quarantine out of the cities, but I can see that this is easier said than done. For a start, we would need to get a whole lot of those "essential workers" out to the remote area to service the Q facility. And then, are they allowed to return to the city to see their families? And which state exactly would host this remote facility? 

Cruise ships can be quarantine ships, kept fairly close to the city and yet socially distanced.

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2 hours ago, GUT2407 said:

A lot of people are saying the feds should step in re state borders.

 

They don’t have the power too do so.

 

S.51 and 52 of the Constitution set out their powers.

 

They can however control quarantine and could use their money grants to pressure the States.

 

 

The Constitution can be changed Gut.

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19 hours ago, SinbadThePorter said:

Get returnees out of the cities into purpose built quarantine facilities outside the cities,

There are reports that the Queensland Government is considering this proposal. Already happening with Howard Springs in NT. Where is there an equivalent for NSW and VIC?

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2 hours ago, MicCanberra said:

Cruise ships can be quarantine ships, kept fairly close to the city and yet socially distanced.

Using cruise ships as quarantine 'hotels' would be an excellent idea, but maybe the cost and the political 'look' of the idea would be drawbacks.

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1 minute ago, Aus Traveller said:

Using cruise ships as quarantine 'hotels' would be an excellent idea, but maybe the cost and the political 'look' of the idea would be drawbacks.

I agree, I don't think the proposal to use cruise ships will float.

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Maybe even use the cruise ships to repatriate stranded Aussies in Europe and Asia.  They are facing extortionate flight prices and cancelled seats.  It is not the most comfortable way, but I am sure it takes more than 14 days to sail from UK/Europe to Australia so if they don't have any port stops and they stay in their cabins, they could arrive already served their quarantine.  They would have to stay in their cabins and have meal delivered contactless style.  It they test negative on boarding and negative on arrival and various tests enroute, I don't see why they couldn't disembark and go home.  Fares could be based on cabin location but even inside cabins would be preferable to $12,000 airfares, cancelled flights, having to rebook over and over and then doing hotel quarantine 14 days.

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1 hour ago, NSWP said:

The Constitution can be changed Gut.


To change the constitution we need a bill to pass both houses of federal parliament.

 

Then there has to be a national referendum which has to have approval of the majority of voters and the majority of states.

 

Good luck with that.

 

Just to back up our legal scholar there was a high court challenge to border closures brought against WA. Initiated by Clive, and originally supported by Fed Gov. High Court said states can close their borders for such major health purposes.

 

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11 hours ago, ELep said:

Agree, I already don't like Anna P, so admit I am biased. She looks and sounds to me like the catty Queen Bee school girl who wants to run the school yard. I have serious reservations about how this is being handled in QLD and I am watching with interest. It looks like they did not think it would happen to them, had nothing much prepared and are now panicking. It seems very heartless to put people who have already quarantined back into another 14 days quarantine. Couldn't they go home and be heavily monitored whilst self isolating? After all there is only 129 people that are being moved. Surely QLD can manage the 129 for their last few days at home? A % of those 129 are probably residents of other states anyway. 

 

The first two weeks of this year has descended into a shambles. States looking like they are panicking and making up the rules as they go, including locking out their own residents and requiring them to get a passport style "permit" to come and go from their state. Threatening them with a $5000 fine for turning up without the permit. Instructing people to suddenly drive for many hours and rush home, then sit for hours in the middle of the night on the road without facilities. (what happened to "stop, revive, survive?):. Shutting down for only 3 days whilst they basically worked out what on earth was going on. Lecturing others to just squash COVID whilst taking far less oseas travelers themselves and having a far smaller population over a wider area. (accepted the fire fighting help from NSW anyway) I fear that serious fatigue will set in and next "outbreak" (there will be one) will result in a bit of revolt from the general community in many areas, making it harder to manage the next outbreak at the local level. 

Your rant appears to me to be guided by strong anti Qld bias or personal dislike of AP rather than considering the facts.

The problem QLD has is one of containing a more virulent strain of the where it has been shown there have be breaches of isolation among the 'detainees' e.g. passing items between themselves from balconies thereby possibly passing on contamination.

Also, the fact that home isolation has been shown to have been breached many times where people have not remained in their homes or have had contact visits from others. What do you expect "heavily monitored" to be? An armed guard on their doorstep or the occasional phone call to check on their whereabouts? Much better to contain any possible infections until proven otherwise.

I don't care much personally for any of the state premiers regardless of political leaning but I have to trust the quality of the advice of their advisors and that they are accepting of it rather than condemn, rightly or wrongly,  premiers for playing political games.

I would not want their job.

Your reference to firefighting and the help states give other states is totally out of order and again showing a bias political or otherwise.

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2 hours ago, NSWP said:

The Constitution can be changed Gut.

Yes it can, but it isn’t easy to do and doesn’t solve the current situation. If the Cth wanted to pressure the states they could have used job keeper etc to do so, I’d only given to States with their borders open.

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16 minutes ago, Docker123 said:


To change the constitution we need a bill to pass both houses of federal parliament.

 

Then there has to be a national referendum which has to have approval of the majority of voters and the majority of states.

 

Good luck with that.

 

Just to back up our legal scholar there was a high court challenge to border closures brought against WA. Initiated by Clive, and originally supported by Fed Gov. High Court said states can close their borders for such major health purposes.

 

They actually said that some years ago Adrian, as I read the High Court even that is subject to these pandemic situations.

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Instead of constantly bickering with each other and pointing fingers, the Premiers should be working together to develop consistent protocols to handle outbreaks and to share knowledge with each other. Despite the so-called National Council they really aren't doing anything really constructive to help the whole of Australia cope with the pandemic. But the leadership and co-ordination should be coming from Federal level and that does not appear to be happening at all. 

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Oh, I so miss cruising & 'discussions' about all the things we love to do when cruising & minor irritations we encounter - smokers, bad tippers, seat hogs etc etc.

I already promised to not say anything further about borders & politics & I will stick to my guns on that, even when I am tempted to comment about some of the current discussions on here. I feel that I should just not visit my friends here on the Aus/NZ board until talk about cruising resumes. Our little group is a subset of the Australasian population, and based on what has been posted it seems we are headed down the path of the UUSA (Ununited United States of America).

Stay safe all

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6 minutes ago, mr walker said:

Oh, I so miss cruising & 'discussions' about all the things we love to do when cruising & minor irritations we encounter - smokers, bad tippers, seat hogs etc etc.

I already promised to not say anything further about borders & politics & I will stick to my guns on that, even when I am tempted to comment about some of the current discussions on here. I feel that I should just not visit my friends here on the Aus/NZ board until talk about cruising resumes. Our little group is a subset of the Australasian population, and based on what has been posted it seems we are headed down the path of the UUSA (Ununited United States of America).

Stay safe all

Is USA and oxymoron?😈

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32 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

Instead of constantly bickering with each other and pointing fingers, the Premiers should be working together to develop consistent protocols to handle outbreaks and to share knowledge with each other.  

The trouble is have you ever seen a politician pass up a chance to denigrate {polite word for laying shirt on) the opposition.

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To the best of my knowledge in WA we've not had a case of community transmission since mid March - https://covidlive.com.au/wa.  Shutting our borders has clearly worked and has certainly been to the benefit of Western Australians.   In general conversation with a variety of people over the last 10 months or so, I've only met one person who disagreed with our Premier and thought the borders should be totally opened.  This person is a died in the wool conservative and would rather burn their own eyes out that support any Labor policy.  So, their opinion is hard to take seriously especially as they use pejorative language and  lack facts to back up any argument.  Like it or not,  our lives are progressing as normal here.  While we we're travelling OS or cruising and apart from requested social distancing and signing into certain businesses, we don't have any other social restrictions on events, restaurants, beaches etc etc etc. 

 

I for one, look at the current situation and restrictions on my fellow Australians and it just breaks my heart to see so much misery and confusion.  Grandparents who don't see grandchildren, parents who don't see kids etc etc, this is beyond sad.  However, the situations in Britain and the US are much sadder.  

 

Long before anyone'd ever heard of COVID-19, Mark McGowan was elected to look after our physical and financial welfare and that's exactly what he's done.  

 

 

 

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