Schengen 90/180 rule implication for European Cruises

[davidgv]

Since the UK left the EU we are a 'third country' which means UK citizens can only spend up to 90 days in any 180 days in the Schengen area.  If I as a UK citizen go on a 14 day European cruise from the UK which. say, ports in 8 Schengen area ports, assuming I disembark in all the ports will I be deemed to have spent 14 days or 8 days in the Schengen area?  Assuming I only disembark in 6 of the ports and remain on board at 2 ports will I be deemed to have spent 14 days or 8 days or 6 days in the Schengen area?  This is important to me because as well as a cruise I want to be able to spend as much time as possible in the Schengen area.

[gerryuk]

I don't think it matters if you get off the ship or stay on, when in ports of another country. Officials board the ship in each country you visit and stamp your passport. If your cruise is around Europe for 14 days then you will have spent 14 days out of your 90. Don't think getting on or off the ship matters.

[hallasm]

7 minutes ago, gerryuk said:

don't think it matters if you get off the ship or stay on, when in ports of another country. Officials board the ship in each country you visit and stamp your passport. If your cruise is around Europe for 14 days then you will have spent 14 days out of your 90. Don't think getting on or off the ship matters.

Correct - if all ports are in Schengen Area you’ll be in Schengen for the entire cruise.

[Heidi13]

On our cruises, DW who only has a Canadian passport, is considered entering at the first port and it continues counting days until the last Schengen port. It includes partial days, as well as full days.

 

Doesn't matter if you go ashore, or not.

[wowzz]

11 hours ago, gerryuk said:

Officials board the ship in each country you visit and stamp your passport

Does that really happen these days? 

[hallasm]

30 minutes ago, wowzz said:

Does that really happen these days? 

No passport stamps - we will see a new system put in place for travelers who currently do not require a visa to enter Europe - The European Travel Information and Authorization System (ETIAS) is being implemented by the European Union - scheduled to become available late 2022. 
Also passport must be valid for at least 6 months when entering the Schengen area.

[chengkp75]

2 hours ago, wowzz said:

Does that really happen these days? 

No, the passport is not stamped, but the passport number, and information is entered into the immigration database, recording your entry and exit from the country.

[wowzz]

19 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

No, the passport is not stamped, but the passport number, and information is entered into the immigration database, recording your entry and exit from the country.

That was my understanding, hence my question about the prevalence of passports being stamped at every port. The only time I have experienced it was when non-US passport holders had to pass through US immigration on a cruise visit to St Thomas ( from memory)  

[John Bull]

I think you'll find that the clock starts with the ship's first Schengen port and stops when it leaves the last one. (If there's a non-Schengen port in the middle I'll guess that pauses the clock).

As per Chengkp's post, the ship's purser will have had access to your passports and I'm fairly sure that whether you go ashore in the ports is pretty irrelevant - you will have entered territorial waters.

 

90 days in 180 is pretty generous - if you're so concerned about one or two days you might be risking some grief. A bout of illness or a travel foul-up or a dozen other scenarios could see you out-staying those 90 days. Yes, your passport's OK, but do you really want to face a grilling about the reason for over-staying and the risk of a black mark?

 

JB 🙂

[gerryuk]

Done a couple of cruises from Barcelona to Buenas Aires. Handed my British passport in on day one and when i recieved my passport at the end of the cruise it was stamped by the Brazilian authorities and the Argintinian authorites. 

Have done Barcelona to Rio, there were a few stops in Brazil, the first was Raceffe and that is when the passport was first stamped. So for us Brits that dont need a visa to enter Brazil, Raceffe was day 1 out of 90 that you are allowed to stay in Brazil. The fact that the ship spent a couple of days at sea before Rio does not matter, those days count and it will be the same for Brits cruising around Europe.  

[ovccruiser]

Don't forget, 90 days in 180 days is effectively 6 months per annum but not all at once. My daughter lives in the EU and I don't foresee any problems visiting as well as cruising into other parts of the EU.

[wowzz]

5 hours ago, ovccruiser said:

Don't forget, 90 days in 180 days is effectively 6 months per annum but not all at once. My daughter lives in the EU and I don't foresee any problems visiting as well as cruising into other parts of the EU.

Indeed, it is 90 days in a rolling 180 day period,  so not that easy to enforce.  Not really an issue for the majority of tourists, but a significant issue for expats who lived under the radar in Spain, Portugal etc, never paying taxes. Can't say I have much sympathy for them.

[davidgv]

We have a second home in Spain - we want to spend as much time there as possible especially in the winter - if we take a winter Med cruise for 10 days that might well mean 10 days less in our house as we don't want to break the law.

 

[Hlitner]

I told JB, many years ago, that the UK built the Chunnel in the wrong direction :).

 

Hank

[gerryuk]

12 hours ago, davidgv said:

We have a second home in Spain - we want to spend as much time there as possible especially in the winter - if we take a winter Med cruise for 10 days that might well mean 10 days less in our house as we don't want to break the law.

 

I am lucky, i applied for residency before 1st January, so can stay. Depending on your situation you can apply for a long term visa that will allow you to stay over the 90 days. There are different long term visas available in Spain, check on the net, depending on your situation you might find one that is applicable to you, good luck.

[Ride-The-Waves]

On 2/26/2021 at 5:26 PM, davidgv said:

We have a second home in Spain - we want to spend as much time there as possible especially in the winter - if we take a winter Med cruise for 10 days that might well mean 10 days less in our house as we don't want to break the law.

 

Should have thought of this before Brexit!  /s/

 

Likely with all these "rules" extensions will be easy to apply for and obtain.  

[wowzz]

1 hour ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

Should have thought of this before Brexit!  /s/

 

Likely with all these "rules" extensions will be easy to apply for and obtain.  

You have obviously never lived in Spain!

We lived there for 10 years, got residencia,  registered on the padron, got fiscal status,  signed on to the Spanish health system etc.

Not difficult, but it all takes time and money.

I don't see any problem with having a second home in Spain. You just have to  work out how to allocate your time in Spain versus the UK. If it comes to it, become a Spanish resident,  and visit the UK each year. 

   

[Ride-The-Waves]

2 hours ago, wowzz said:

You have obviously never lived in Spain!

We lived there for 10 years, got residencia,  registered on the padron, got fiscal status,  signed on to the Spanish health system etc.

Not difficult, but it all takes time and money.

I don't see any problem with having a second home in Spain. You just have to  work out how to allocate your time in Spain versus the UK. If it comes to it, become a Spanish resident,  and visit the UK each year. 

   

Never had residence in Spain.  Did grow up in Switzerland and attended the International School of Geneva.  Do understand international residencies and requirements (Permit de Sejour and Permit de Travail).  It does take "time and money" to get through the legal processes.  Bon chance!

[Aulanis]

My guess is there will soon be an evisa for  "short stay tourism"  for europe

and  similar for tourists to the UK  as Australia and US have.

Anyone having joint residency will have the 90 days in 180

[hallasm]

1 hour ago, Aulanis said:

My guess is there will soon be an evisa for  "short stay tourism"  for europe

Post #6 “we will see a new system put in place for travelers who currently do not require a visa to enter Europe - The European Travel Information and Authorization System (ETIAS) is being implemented by the European Union - scheduled to become available late 2022. ”

[mayleeman]

What happens if you exceed the 90 days? A fine? Restriction on future visits?

[hallasm]

58 minutes ago, mayleeman said:

What happens if you exceed the 90 days?

Those who overstay this period of 90/180 days – intentionally or unintentionally – may face penalties, including deportation and entry bans

[TourGypsy]

This is my question.  I know that if I leave the Schengen area for however many days, that time in non-Schengen areas doesn't count.  But what about a sea day that is between a Schengen and a non-Schengen country.   ie: sailing from Spain to England.  Are the sea days Schengen or non-Schengen?

[hallasm]

Should be non-Schengen. Personally, I would be wary of planning stays too close to the 90/180 day rule when cruising.

Sea days between two Schengen ports are included as stays in the Schengen area, while sea days before and after Schengen ports do not count.

According to the Schengen Borders Code, "The travel documents of third-country nationals shall be systematically stamped on entry and exit."  and “Checks on ships shall be carried out at the port of arrival or departure”.

When the ship actually 'stamps passports' may very well vary in relation to arrival / exit from the Schengen area.
 

 

[TourGypsy]

12 minutes ago, hallasm said:

Should be non-Schengen. Personally, I would be wary of planning stays too close to the 90/180 day rule when cruising.

Sea days between two Schengen ports are included as stays in the Schengen area, while sea days before and after Schengen ports do not count.

According to the Schengen Borders Code, "The travel documents of third-country nationals shall be systematically stamped on entry and exit."  and “Checks on ships shall be carried out at the port of arrival or departure”.

When the ship actually 'stamps passports' may very well vary in relation to arrival / exit from the Schengen area.
 

 

OK, that gives a few more options.  I was thinking I was at 87, but considering the above, it would be 82.  Thank you.

Edited September 25, 2021 by TourGypsy