Hundreds of sellers are offering false and stolen Covid-19 vaccine cards

[cruisemom42]

1 hour ago, broberts said:

There is no system that won't be hacked or faked.  There is nothing that someone will not lie about. It seems to me that spending any amount of time or treasure catering to the dishonest is a waste.

 

If a simple signed declaration is not enough I guess we will all have to wait for the Nirvana of herd immunity.

 

I think this is a somewhat pessimistic view. Sure, any system COULD be hacked or faked, but that doesn't mean that at least some minimum steps to foil those attempts shouldn't be made.

 

I have just received my first "jab" and the card received would be quite easy to fake. Seems to me that a secured federal (or even global) database would be more desirable in terms of both ability to fake the data and also keeping up with one's results (e.g., not having to remember to carry a card or a photo of card on your phone which, to me, isn't necessarily something that will be accepted, any more than a phone scan of your passport is accepted.)

 

Given today's technologies, I would be surprised if this pandemic/crisis doesn't spur on the development of such a database, one that could ultimately be electronically linked to your passport perhaps. Or maybe our whole passport/vaccination/id begins to live in the cloud, accessed by our devices.

 

[broberts]

13 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I think this is a somewhat pessimistic view. Sure, any system COULD be hacked or faked, but that doesn't mean that at least some minimum steps to foil those attempts shouldn't be made.

 

I have just received my first "jab" and the card received would be quite easy to fake. Seems to me that a secured federal (or even global) database would be more desirable in terms of both ability to fake the data and also keeping up with one's results (e.g., not having to remember to carry a card or a photo of card on your phone which, to me, isn't necessarily something that will be accepted, any more than a phone scan of your passport is accepted.)

 

Given today's technologies, I would be surprised if this pandemic/crisis doesn't spur on the development of such a database, one that could ultimately be electronically linked to your passport perhaps. Or maybe our whole passport/vaccination/id begins to live in the cloud, accessed by our devices.

 

 

While I'm generally trusting of authority I would never approve of a national database used to affect travel. A global database gives me the willies. A very slippery slope I think.

[Denny01]

9 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

While I'm generally trusting of authority I would never approve of a national database used to affect travel. A global database gives me the willies. A very slippery slope I think.

You understand a passport is a ‘national and international databases’ and state driver licences and IDs required for any flights within US are on databases accessible to all govts including national authorities. 
 

no idea what slippery slopes some are so worried about. A bit too late for this type of database concern.  You realize your name is checked against travel restriction ‘databases’ for the past 20yrs or so. 
 

den

Edited April 10, 2021 by Denny01

[cruisemom42]

13 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

While I'm generally trusting of authority I would never approve of a national database used to affect travel. A global database gives me the willies. A very slippery slope I think.

 

It's the future. ETIAS is already with us.

 

https://www.thalesgroup.com/en/markets/digital-identity-and-security/government/eborder/future-of-travel

 

[Fouremco]

1 minute ago, broberts said:

 

While I'm generally trusting of authority I would never approve of a national database used to affect travel. A global database gives me the willies. A very slippery slope I think.

So, you don't hold a Canadian passport? All of your passport application information is stored away in a national database that most certainly affects travel.

 

There are a number of other Canadian national databases that affect travel, several of which are shared with one or more of our international partners. For example, the "No Fly List" created under the Secure Air Travel Act. Or the Canadian Police Information Centre. When a person attempts to enter the States, US Customs and Border Patrol (CBP) officers have the authority to conduct a CPIC check via the US National Crime Information Centre, using the person’s name and date of birth.

[cruiselvr04]

Medical records are protected in the US by HIPPA.  No one has a right to see our medical information unless we give consent.  To violate that without ones consent would be very disturbing.

 

Our state encourages a state vaccination register and has for a long time.  It is however optional.  We are not part of that but our medical system does have record of our recent vaccinations.  Because not everyone will have anything but their cards I think to go farther then that is asking too much.  A lot of things come down to personal responsibility.  I would hope that most unvaccinated people would not lie about something so important.  Those that would could be charged with fraud if discovered. 

[KWW88]

1 minute ago, cruiselvr04 said:

Medical records are protected in the US by HIPPA.  No one has a right to see our medical information unless we give consent.  To violate that without ones consent would be very disturbing.

 

Our state encourages a state vaccination register and has for a long time.  It is however optional.  We are not part of that but our medical system does have record of our recent vaccinations.  Because not everyone will have anything but their cards I think to go farther then that is asking too much.  A lot of things come down to personal responsibility.  I would hope that most unvaccinated people would not lie about something so important.  Those that would could be charged with fraud if discovered. 

I support a US national registry for those of us who have been vaccinated, but I think it should be voluntary NOT mandatory.

[LadyBerard]

19 hours ago, PTC DAWG said:

Who would put something that on social media?  People use no common sense...not everything needs to be laid bare to the world..

The same people that answer all those questions on facebook, such as:  what is the name of the street you grew up on, what is your favorite vacation place, what is the name of your elementary school, etc. etc.  Lots of times, these are the answers to questions to confirm your login information for many sites.  Some people are NOT too bright!!

 

[broberts]

27 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

So, you don't hold a Canadian passport? All of your passport application information is stored away in a national database that most certainly affects travel.

 

There are a number of other Canadian national databases that affect travel, several of which are shared with one or more of our international partners. For example, the "No Fly List" created under the Secure Air Travel Act. Or the Canadian Police Information Centre. When a person attempts to enter the States, US Customs and Border Patrol (CBP) officers have the authority to conduct a CPIC check via the US National Crime Information Centre, using the person’s name and date of birth.

 

Passports only prove citizenship. They only affect travel in the broadest sense. Everything on my application except references and a tax account number is publicly available.

 

Just because there are other affecting databases does not mean I agree with their existence. No Fly lists are a good example.

 

Countries are free to set entry requirements and would be derelict in not using any resource available to verify these requirements. This last point is why I'm opposed to national and global databases that contain what I consider private information without my consent. 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by broberts

[maryann2]

4 hours ago, drakes2 said:

@Fouremcowhat about a QR code or perhaps your vaccination details embedded in your passport? Would this deter anti vaxxers?

In BC I was given a card with a QR code.

[Denny01]

Most are all for travel databases of those that authorities are concerned are terrorist threats but haven’t committed any crime, just suspect. But we are against ‘databases’ of people who can continue to spread a pandemic and assist the little buggers to evolve into new variants?  Got it. 
 

den

[Fouremco]

4 minutes ago, broberts said:

Countries are free to set entry requirements and would be derelict in not using any resource available to verify these requirements.

Agreed. Which is why your stance against a database that simply says you've been vaccinated puzzles me. 

[broberts]

Just now, Fouremco said:

Agreed. Which is why your stance against a database that simply says you've been vaccinated puzzles me. 

 

Slippery slope.

[Fouremco]

4 minutes ago, maryann2 said:

In BC I was given a card with a QR code.

I'm hoping that Ontario will do the same. QR codes, whether printed on a card or provided electronically, are a good approach.

[KWW88]

4 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

Slippery slope.

what if it were 100% voluntary?

[Fouremco]

2 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

Slippery slope.

Well, I guess it's a slippery slope from the time a child is born and the birth registered in the provincial database, to be used and abused for God only knows what dastardly purposes. Personally, I don't subscribe to gloom and doom conspiracy theories of what could happen should evil entities take control of legitimate, useful databases.  YMMV 

[Denny01]

6 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

Passports only prove citizenship. They only affect travel in the broadest sense. Everything on my application except references and a tax account number is publicly available.

 

Just because there are other affecting databases does not mean I agree with their existence. No Fly lists are a good example.

 

Countries are free to set entry requirements and would be derelict in not using any resource available to verify these requirements. This last point is why I'm opposed to national and global databases that contain what I consider private information without my consent. 

 

 

 

I get your general thrust, but isn’t your age private info, your photo your general description your place of birth. All on your passport. And passports go well beyond proving citizenship. It lists your travel history, the dastardly database lists reasons for travel when you are asked that at entry.  
 

A vaccine passport of some type isn’t listing your health issues and status. Private information? Not to me.  Just another opinion that doesn’t carry any weight. 
 

den

[Denny01]

Oops. 

Edited April 10, 2021 by Denny01

[Denny01]

1 minute ago, Denny01 said:

The ‘slippery slope’ is another way of saying ‘it’s a good idea and I have no legit point specifically against it except.....think what theoretically could be done!’     
 

den

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by Denny01

[KWW88]

2 minutes ago, Denny01 said:

I get your general thrust, but isn’t your age private info, your photo your general description your place of birth. All on your passport. And passports go well beyond proving citizenship. It lists your travel history, the dastardly database lists reasons for travel when you are asked that at entry.  
 

A vaccine passport of some type isn’t listing your health issues and status. Private information? Not to me.  Just another opinion that doesn’t carry any weight. 
 

den

 

7 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

Well, I guess it's a slippery slope from the time a child is born and the birth registered in the provincial database, to be used and abused for God only knows what dastardly purposes. Personally, I don't subscribe to gloom and doom conspiracy theories of what could happen should evil entities take control of legitimate, useful databases.  YMMV 

Well it seems to me that broberts is speaking for himself as to why he feels this way, he has his own valid reasons.  I support voluntary registration but no amount of professorial back and forth in telling someone that he/she is wrong and needs to see it my way, will change that persons mind.

[Denny01]

2 minutes ago, KWW88 said:

 

Well it seems to me that broberts is speaking for himself as to why he feels this way, he has his own valid reasons.  I support voluntary registration but no amount of professorial back and forth in telling someone that he/she is wrong and needs to see it my way, will change that persons mind.

I resent you calling my posts ‘professional’. I’m a rank amateur here!
 

den

[broberts]

18 minutes ago, KWW88 said:

what if it were 100% voluntary?

 

It would only be voluntary if I could still travel and present a non database proof of vaccination. Otherwise it is required to travel.

 

10 minutes ago, Denny01 said:

I get your general thrust, but isn’t your age private info, your photo your general description your place of birth. All on your passport. And passports go well beyond proving citizenship. It lists your travel history, the dastardly database lists reasons for travel when you are asked that at entry.  
 

A vaccine passport of some type isn’t listing your health issues and status. Private information? Not to me.  Just another opinion that doesn’t carry any weight. 
 

den

 

Birth records as far as I know are not confidential. So age and birthplace are publicly available.

 

As soon as one appears in public ones appearance is no longer private.

[cruisemom42]

26 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

Slippery slope.

 

An argument that could be used for virtually anything....

 

I would be fine with a voluntary database but suspect that in order to travel outside one's country registration may be required.

 

We live in an increasingly complex world. Solutions that worked when people lived on farms or rural towns, rarely moved throughout their lives and did not travel much beyond adjacent towns/cities is over.  If this global pandemic has shown us nothing else, it has demonstrated how quickly a virus or disease can spread globally and how much more likely we would've gotten an earlier handle on the infection had we been able to do appropriate levels of contact tracing.

[Charles4515]

1 minute ago, broberts said:

 

It would only be voluntary if I could still travel and present a non database proof of vaccination. Otherwise it is required to travel.

 

 

If you got the vaccination it is in a database. 

[DirtyDawg]

22 hours ago, MarkWiltonM said:

This article in the New York Times today is the reason we need a better system to document/verify who has had Covid-19 vaccinations. I don't want to board a cruise ship with anti-vaxxers who have bought a bogus CDC vaccination card online just so they can cruise. 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/08/technology/vaccine-card-scam.html?searchResultPosition=4

Fake Covid-19 vax cards for $20 - $60.

That's highway robbery!

 

Mine cost only a couple of pennies for the ink. 

 

 

😁

 

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by DirtyDawg