Carnival’s CEO states that they will not require vaccinations

[BlerkOne]

5 minutes ago, bitemyfly said:

Was that before the WHO tweet on 1/14 ‘Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in #Wuhan, #China🇨🇳.“

 

It's a slippery slope. Was that before the dismantling of the US pandemic response team in 2018?

[BlerkOne]

Back when common sense was more common and no nonsense from Benjamin Franklin on the Internet.

 

[harkinmr]

3 hours ago, cruiseracer said:

Makes complete sense. Masks should be optional, not control-mechanisms.

Arnold Donald was talking about vaccines not being mandated.  He did, however, speak to other health protocols including testing, masking, social distancing, etc. being in place as protection measures as opposed to a vaccine mandate.  His comments on personal freedom and liberty did not extend to those measures.  You can fully expect that masks will be required, not optional.

[mredandchis]

45 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

Arnold Donald was talking about vaccines not being mandated.  He did, however, speak to other health protocols including testing, masking, social distancing, etc. being in place as protection measures as opposed to a vaccine mandate.  His comments on personal freedom and liberty did not extend to those measures.  You can fully expect that masks will be required, not optional.

I am not sure what to actually 'expect' on my next cruise.  It does appear that a lot of water will go under the bridge until that happens for any of us.  But one day will we know what to expect and anything said on the boards won't really matter.

 

The only thing that is clear to me is no matter what the outcome of the next few months are, and no matter what is decided on, there will be people who will not like it.  Also there will be some infighting going on during these cruises because some will push the rules and others will be incensed.  

[BlerkOne]

Hopefully those who can't follow simple rules on Carnival Cruise Lines will get extended shore excursions like they did on Costa...

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2020/10/22/cruise-passenger-violates-covid-19-rules-denied-boarding-carnival-corp-ship/3725199001/

[SNJCruisers]

1 hour ago, BlerkOne said:

Hopefully those who can't follow simple rules on Carnival Cruise Lines will get extended shore excursions like they did on Costa...

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2020/10/22/cruise-passenger-violates-covid-19-rules-denied-boarding-carnival-corp-ship/3725199001/

Thanks for the link.  There of course will be idiots who will break the bubble if this policy is indeed implemented on Carnival once cruising resumes.

By the way, it was AIDA, not Costa.

[BlerkOne]

8 minutes ago, SNJCruisers said:

 

By the way, it was AIDA, not Costa.

Yep. Aida is also flagged in Italy.

 

MSC and Tui, too.

https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/5678/

 

 

[Radiioman46]

On 4/16/2021 at 8:12 AM, Jobeth66 said:

 

George Washington forced his troops to be vaccinated against smallpox.  What did Franklin have to say about that?  Or could you be misunderstanding his words and they're being taken sorely out of context?

 

 

You realize of course that members of the military lose their rights and fall under the Military Code of Justice. So, this is not an accurate example. This is a complex issue for sure though.

[BlerkOne]

13 minutes ago, Radiioman46 said:

You realize of course that members of the military lose their rights and fall under the Military Code of Justice. So, this is not an accurate example. This is a complex issue for sure though.

The one that dates way back to 1951?

[hurricane0226]

Articles of war prior to that

 

[BlerkOne]

30 minutes ago, hurricane0226 said:

Articles of war prior to that

 

[Stallion]

I think both sides of this debate should understand that the factual battleground of this debate is rapidly evolving. When the new stats come out tomorrow morning more than 50% of Americans over 18 will have had at least a single vaccination. Everyday about 3.3 million vaccinations add to those numbers.  At this pace the US can have 250,000,000 more vaccinations by just July 4th. The projected dates of herd immunity (hopefully at between 70%-85% full vaccinations) have substantially moved closer in just the last few weeks.

 

Currently, the United States is projected to hit 70% full vaccinations by about July 9 and 85% by August 5. The hypothesis will start to be tested within the next 1 1/2-2 months as several states reach the projected threshold of herd immunity.

 

If the herd immunity projections are correct this debate may resolve sooner than expected. Reality check: the numbers don't lie- there are 13 philosophically conservative states that are lagging behind the rest of the country and face a longer herd immunity projection because of poor vaccination performance

Source: (see 3rd-4th charts)

COVID-19 Vaccine Tracker: How Many People Have Been Vaccinated In The U.S.? : Shots - Health News : NPR

Edited April 18, 2021 by Stallion

[mredandchis]

4 minutes ago, Stallion said:

I think both sides of this debate should understand that the factual battleground of this debate is rapidly evolving. When the new stats come out tomorrow morning more than 50% of Americans over 18 will have had at least a single vaccination. Everyday about 3.3 million vaccinations add to those numbers. The projected dates of herd immunity (hopefully at between 70%-85% full vaccinations) have substantially moved closer in just the last few weeks.

 

Currently, the United States is projected to hit 70% by about July 9 and 85% by August 5. The hypothesis will start to be tested within the next 1 1/2-2 months as several states reach the projected threshold of herd immunity.

 

If the herd immunity projections are correct this debate may resolve sooner than expected. Reality check: the numbers don't lie- there are 13 philosophically conservative states that are lagging behind the rest of the country and face a longer herd immunity projection because of poor vaccination performance

You got that right but don't forget the herd immunity is 2 fold and also includes recoveries.  How well protected recovered people are and for how long is still in study.  But normally after catching a virus there is resistance to the virus for some time.  There are more recoveries than recorded as some people didnt know they had it or decided just not to report it.  But it all helps all of us as this unfolds.  A number of states will reach the threshold in early may, by June 1 we will see the results .It will take till end of July to establish a solid in the U>S.  

Now we need to also worry about all our neighbors and the rest of the planet.  

[Cruisin 4 Ever]

This makes me very nervous. I hope to be vaccinated soon but what if I'm on a cruise and there is an outbreak because of unvaccinated people. Wouldn't that mean everyone gets stuck in their cabin?

[cruises42]

9 minutes ago, Cruisin 4 Ever said:

This makes me very nervous. I hope to be vaccinated soon but what if I'm on a cruise and there is an outbreak because of unvaccinated people. Wouldn't that mean everyone gets stuck in their cabin?

Yes, probably. That is one of the reasons why the decision to not mandate all be vaccinated is not an intelligent decision.

[lobster1313]

20 minutes ago, Cruisin 4 Ever said:

This makes me very nervous. I hope to be vaccinated soon but what if I'm on a cruise and there is an outbreak because of unvaccinated people. Wouldn't that mean everyone gets stuck in their cabin?

No. It would be similiar to what has happend on the cruises that have already resumed the person that tested positive would be isolated

and then evacuated.

Edited April 18, 2021 by regoodwinjr

[BlerkOne]

21 minutes ago, Cruisin 4 Ever said:

This makes me very nervous. I hope to be vaccinated soon but what if I'm on a cruise and there is an outbreak because of unvaccinated people. Wouldn't that mean everyone gets stuck in their cabin?

Perhaps only the people who were in close contact with anyone who tested positive. Maybe the cruise lines will have available one of the tests that would show if you had been exposed to covid in the past few hours 

[mredandchis]

21 minutes ago, Cruisin 4 Ever said:

This makes me very nervous. I hope to be vaccinated soon but what if I'm on a cruise and there is an outbreak because of unvaccinated people. Wouldn't that mean everyone gets stuck in their cabin?

I am vaccinated and I hope a lot of people get the shot, but there will be 3 groups of people on board, vaccinated , recovered and  unprotected.  But the idea is that the unprotected would be so few that they wouldnt have to much of a chance of catching it.  If anyone does test positive vaccinated or not they would be quarantined, I would suppose.  We will find out later on how they will handle it.    Glad you are getting the shot. 

[BlerkOne]

1 hour ago, Stallion said:

 

Currently, the United States is projected to hit 70% full vaccinations by about July 9 and 85% by August 5. The hypothesis will start to be tested within the next 1 1/2-2 months as several states reach the projected threshold of herd immunity.

 

70 isn't a magic number and even that might be tough to hit if too many people refuse the vaccine.

[Tippyton]

9 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

70 isn't a magic number and even that might be tough to hit if too many people refuse the vaccine.

Not refusing, but asking for the science behind vaccinating people who have already had a disease.  The science supports my position.  In fact, they're finding that the blood clots have a higher presence for those who already have had Covid.  Before you ask me to prove it, look at Dr. John Campbell on Youtube from either yesterday or the day before.

[BlerkOne]

1 minute ago, Tippyton said:

Not refusing, but asking for the science behind vaccinating people who have already had a disease.  The science supports my position.  In fact, they're finding that the blood clots have a higher presence for those who already have had Covid.  Before you ask me to prove it, look at Dr. John Campbell on Youtube from either yesterday or the day before.

Covid itself can lead to blood clots. This was known before there were vaccines. The science supports risk of blood clots is much higher from covid compared to the vaccine.

[mredandchis]

3 minutes ago, Tippyton said:

Not refusing, but asking for the science behind vaccinating people who have already had a disease.  The science supports my position.  In fact, they're finding that the blood clots have a higher presence for those who already have had Covid.  Before you ask me to prove it, look at Dr. John Campbell on Youtube from either yesterday or the day before.

You have a point, in fact my daughters boss just recently got over a significant case of Covid and has been advised to wait a while before getting a vaccine.  I am not sure if there is a science behind getting the job after recovery.  I believe there is a lot of uncertainty as how long and how much protection you may have.  And again you do have a valid concern. 

[SNJCruisers]

22 minutes ago, mredandchis said:

...there will be 3 groups of people on board, vaccinated , recovered and  unprotected.  But the idea is that the unprotected would be so few that they wouldnt have to much of a chance of catching it.  

But the problem happens if Carnival is the only main stream line based out of the US that will not require adults to be vaccinated. This would increase the number of unprotected exponentially because Carnival would be their only option besides possibly MSC.

[hurricane0226]

what about if you have been vaccinated, and then get covid then there is an outbreak even

though everyone was vaccinated, then what, quarantine the ship? 

[Tippyton]

6 minutes ago, mredandchis said:

You have a point, in fact my daughters boss just recently got over a significant case of Covid and has been advised to wait a while before getting a vaccine.  I am not sure if there is a science behind getting the job after recovery.  I believe there is a lot of uncertainty as how long and how much protection you may have.  And again you do have a valid concern. 

here's the link.  He even discusses the fact that the vaccines were never tested on recovered people.

 

https://youtu.be/_jFYrpAkQwA