With the suspension of the Passenger Vessel Services Act (PVSA) is a passport still required for Alaska cruises?

[Smokeyham]

With the suspension of the Passenger Vessel Services Act for cruises going to Alaska from Seattle I am wondering if a passport is still required by the various cruise lines that are providing these cruises?   I am wondering if a 'Real ID" would be sufficient, similar to the way that such an ID is sufficient for airline travel.

 

 

[Flatbush Flyer]

1 minute ago, Smokeyham said:

With the suspension of the Passenger Vessel Services Act for cruises going to Alaska from Seattle I am wondering if a passport is still required by the various cruise lines that are providing these cruises?   I am wondering if a 'Real ID" would be sufficient, similar to the way that such an ID is sufficient for airline travel.

 

 

That would depend in large part on the cruise line you choose. Some require all passengers on all itineraries to present (and often surrender) their passport at embarkation.

[chengkp75]

This is something that CBP is working on, I'm sure, since Congress did not question them regarding this bill, as it places each cruise in two different situations.  One, the passengers are not "deemed" to have visited a foreign country, since the passenger manifest is not submitted to any other nation, while at the same time the crew are "deemed" to have exited the US and entered Canada, simply by the submission of a crew list to Canada's CBSA, whether CBSA accepts the crew list or not.  This is to get around the crew visa issue.  Quite sure this is causing CBP a lot of heartache on how to treat the cruises.

 

My feeling is that they will treat these cruises as any other closed loop cruise, and require a WHTI compliant document, of which a "Real ID" is not.  Passport, Enhanced DL, or DL and birth certificate.

Edited June 28, 2021 by chengkp75

[navybankerteacher]

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

...

 

My feeling is that they will treat these cruises as any other closed loop cruise, and require a WHTI compliant document, of which a "Real ID" is not.  Passport, Enhanced DL, or DL and birth certificate.

Logical -- if it deemed to be a closed loop, the usual closed loop requirements should apply.  No reason to find a substitute for WHTI standard.

[njhorseman]

5 hours ago, Smokeyham said:

With the suspension of the Passenger Vessel Services Act for cruises going to Alaska from Seattle I am wondering if a passport is still required by the various cruise lines that are providing these cruises?   I am wondering if a 'Real ID" would be sufficient, similar to the way that such an ID is sufficient for airline travel.

 

 

First, a passport was never required for US citizens on these closed loop cruises unless your cruise line required it. Passports were required in in order to take certain shore excursions that entered Canada from Alaska, but not for the cruise itself. Any type of WHTI-compliant document or a government-issued photo ID and birth certificate were sufficient.

 

Since no foreign countries are visited off the top of my head I can't see why any government-issued photo ID would not suffice for these cruises just as they suffice for NCL's POA Hawaii cruises, I suppose DHS could always ay otherwise and again the cruise lines could also say otherwise.

 

BTW, REAL ID is still not required for air travel as the effective date was postponed again, this time until May 3, 2023, and in any event a REAL ID license does not provide proof of citizenship. People often confuse REAL ID with enhanced drivers licenses, which do provide proof of citizenship.

[njhorseman]

4 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

Logical -- if it deemed to be a closed loop, the usual closed loop requirements should apply.  No reason to find a substitute for WHTI standard.

But why shouldn't they be treated like an NCL POA Hawaii cruises since no foreign country is visited? No proof of citizenship is needed for those cruises, only a photo ID.

[chengkp75]

37 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

But why shouldn't they be treated like an NCL POA Hawaii cruises since no foreign country is visited? No proof of citizenship is needed for those cruises, only a photo ID.

Likely because of the "dual" nature of the cruise.  With passengers on a "domestic" voyage and crew on a "foreign" voyage, CBP has a dilemma, and I think they will opt for the more restrictive requirements.

 

With the "deeming" of the voyages, instead of actual legally defined voyages, I think this is uncharted territory for CBP.

Edited June 28, 2021 by chengkp75

[njhorseman]

11 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Likely because of the "dual" nature of the cruise.  With passengers on a "domestic" voyage and crew on a "foreign" voyage, CBP has a dilemma, and I think they will opt for the more restrictive requirements.

 

With the "deeming" of the voyages, instead of actual legally defined voyages, I think this is uncharted territory for CBP.

Perhaps, but in reading the bill I think that's overcomplicating the problem. It could be deemed a foreign voyage for purposes of skirting the crew visa issue but CBP could say it's simply a domestic voyage for passengers.

On the other hand what is government here for if not to overcomplicate our lives ? 😄

[sparks1093]

24 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Likely because of the "dual" nature of the cruise.  With passengers on a "domestic" voyage and crew on a "foreign" voyage, CBP has a dilemma, and I think they will opt for the more restrictive requirements.

 

With the "deeming" of the voyages, instead of actual legally defined voyages, I think this is uncharted territory for CBP.

Will the passengers need to clear Customs upon their return to the US? If yes, then WHTI would likely apply. If no, then it would likely be treated like a POA cruise where only a government issued ID is needed. I am guessing that Customs won't be necessary since no one if bringing foreign goods back into the US.

[navybankerteacher]

1 hour ago, njhorseman said:

But why shouldn't they be treated like an NCL POA Hawaii cruises since no foreign country is visited? No proof of citizenship is needed for those cruises, only a photo ID.

Aren’t those crewed by US citizens/residents, while the Alaska itineraries are not?

[njhorseman]

36 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

Aren’t those crewed by US citizens/residents, while the Alaska itineraries are not?

Yes, but the crewing issue is addressed by the Alaska legislation. 

 

Perhaps even a better example than a POA Hawaii cruise is a cruise to nowhere on a foreign-flagged ship, which is legal under CBP rules. Passengers don't need anything more than a government-issued ID. The cruises were discontinued because of a visa issue for the international crew, the same issue that is addressed in the Alaska legislation. If the same waiver was enacted for cruises to nowhere would passengers suddenly need proof of citizenship? I think not.

[njhorseman]

46 minutes ago, sparks1093 said:

Will the passengers need to clear Customs upon their return to the US? If yes, then WHTI would likely apply. If no, then it would likely be treated like a POA cruise where only a government issued ID is needed. I am guessing that Customs won't be necessary since no one if bringing foreign goods back into the US.

 There should be no need for the passengers to clear customs and immigration upon completion of these cruises. They are solely domestic itineraries, really no different than taking a ferry across the Hudson river from NJ to NY .

[Sea Hag]

This is one thing I'm just not going to worry about. We'll be taking our passports when we cruise in August. 

[chengkp75]

2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Will the passengers need to clear Customs upon their return to the US? If yes, then WHTI would likely apply. If no, then it would likely be treated like a POA cruise where only a government issued ID is needed. I am guessing that Customs won't be necessary since no one if bringing foreign goods back into the US.

Again, I disagree with njhorseman, as the bill specifically "deems" the voyage to be foreign, so I would think that customs and immigration would need to be cleared, and the WHTI documents would be required.  As for customs for duty free items (that would be the only purchases that would be considered), the bill also says that the voyage "is not" foreign for taxes and duties, so it makes me question whether the shops will be open onboard, certainly not the duty free, and anything that is sold in the shops that came from overseas "in bond" won't be available.   Liquor bought "in bond" will not be available, just like on the POA.

[Underwatr]

11 hours ago, njhorseman said:

 There should be no need for the passengers to clear customs and immigration upon completion of these cruises. They are solely domestic itineraries, really no different than taking a ferry across the Hudson river from NJ to NY .

Having taken a roundtrip Alaska cruise from Seattle, I'll mention that the post-cruise customs formalities (for US citizens, granted) were about as informal as you can imagine. Retrieve your baggage and exit the baggage hall past three or four Customs/Immigration officers. No inspection of documents, etc.

[Ferry_Watcher]

Passengers sailing to Alaska from Seattle  this season still need to travel with WHTI level ID documents, as well as proof of their Covid vaccine.  Passenger manifests will still be submitted to the gov't, and they still want to know who is sailing.

[Smokeyham]

Interesting responses.   

I was asking the question with the thought that some people, who do not possess a passport, might now be interested in taking an Alaskan cruise from Seattle and would (for the duration of the waiver of the Passenger Vessel Services Act) would be able to take such a cruise without a passport.

 

 

 

 

[njhorseman]

24 minutes ago, Smokeyham said:

Interesting responses.   

I was asking the question with the thought that some people, who do not possess a passport, might now be interested in taking an Alaskan cruise from Seattle and would (for the duration of the waiver of the Passenger Vessel Services Act) would be able to take such a cruise without a passport.

 

 

 

 

A passport was never required of US citizens for these round trip closed loop cruises. As little as a birth certificate and government-issued photo ID would suffice, as would any WHTI-compliant document, such as a passport card or enhanced drivers license . 

 

Some high-end cruise lines do require a passport for all passengers on all cruises regardless of government requirements.

 

Some shore excursions that venture from Alaska into Canada and back require a passport, passport book or EDL, but not the cruise itself.

I previously posted this information on June 28 in post #5 in response to your original question.

There is no debate over the accuracy of the above.

 

The only debate thereafter was whether anything more than a government-issued photo ID was even required for these special itineraries that do not make a foreign port call. 

[Smokeyham]

1 minute ago, njhorseman said:

The only debate thereafter was whether anything more than a government-issued photo ID was even required for these special itineraries that do not make a foreign port call. 

Apologies..... I was under the impression that, since the out and back cruises to/from Seattle stopped in Canada in order to comply with the PVSA, passengers were required to have a passport. 

 

From your statement it sounds like, despite this stop in a foreign port, that passengers were not required to have a passport?

[njhorseman]

7 minutes ago, Smokeyham said:

Apologies..... I was under the impression that, since the out and back cruises to/from Seattle stopped in Canada in order to comply with the PVSA, passengers were required to have a passport. 

 

From your statement it sounds like, despite this stop in a foreign port, that passengers were not required to have a passport?

It's been no different than the requirements for US citizens taking a closed loop cruise calling on Mexico, almost everywhere in  the Caribbean, Atlantic Canada, the Bahamas or Bermuda. No passport is required for any of those cruises unless your cruise line (mostly high-end lines) imposes a passport requirement.

Edited July 11, 2021 by njhorseman

[dolittle]

On 6/28/2021 at 2:21 AM, Flatbush Flyer said:

That would depend in large part on the cruise line you choose. Some require all passengers on all itineraries to present (and often surrender) their passport at embarkation.

Have hit many non U.S, ports have only ha to surrender our passport once in Turkey.

[Flatbush Flyer]

7 minutes ago, dolittle said:

Have hit many non U.S, ports have only ha to surrender our passport once in Turkey.

Perhaps you misunderstood my post.

Most of the premium/luxury lines require that all passengers on all itineraries bring their valid passport to embarkation.
More often than not, you will then be required to turn your passport over to the Purser who will keep them secure until the end of the cruise (unless a particular port requires the you carry it ashore).

This is very very convenient for passengers since, for most ports, passengers do not have to get up at the crack of dawn to show their passports to the local authorities (unless, of course, they require a face-to-face meeting).

Moreover, should a passenger “miss the ship” at a particular port’s takeoff time, the purser does not have to search for your passport and can immediately turn it over to the ship’s port agent (who will become very important to you if you are left “high and dry.”

[Ferry_Watcher]

Passengers leaving Seattle on an Alaska bound cruise during this non-typical 2021 season must provide the same level (WHTI) of proof citizenship as in past years that the ships stopped in Canada.

 

For US citizens typically this includes:

Passport (non-expired)

Passport card

Birth certificate (gov't issued, not hospital 'foot print') w/photo ID if 16 or older

Enhanced Driver's License - which is only  available from the following states: Michigan; Minnesota; New York; Vermont; & Washington State.  These are specialized licenses issued after providing vetted proof of US citizenship, (and other info)  and paying an additional fee.

(There are other accepted documents like US Birth Abroad, Naturalization Certificate,  Alien Resident Card, etc, but the above list is what is most commonly used).

 

Important - Real ID does not mean/equal Enhanced Driver's License.  I can not stress this enough.

 

Cruise passengers showing up without the proper travel documents at both Pier 66 & 91 have been a significant issue.  Passengers are receiving incorrect information from a variety of sources, or assume that since the ship does stop in Canada that they don't need any traveling ID except their regular driver's license.  Alaska Cruise passengers must have WHTI approved proof of citizenship.

 

WHTI - Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative

https://www.cbp.gov/travel/us-citizens/western-hemisphere-travel-initiative

 

If you show up for your Alaska cruise without the proper (WHTI) level of proof of citizenship, the first question you will be asked is if there is someone back home who can get a copy of your (US)  birth certificate sent electronically to the pier.   In the meantime, you will have to think which family member, friend or neighbor you will ask to go to your house and rummage around in your dresser looking for your birth certificate .  If it's in your safe deposit box, you are probably out of luck.  Or if your mom still has it, she will have to figure out how to send a perfect photo of it to the pier.  If you can't get a copy of your US birth certificate,  you will be denied boarding.

 

So please - bring your (non-expired) Passport; or Passport Card; or US Gov't issued Birth Certificate or Enhanced Driver's License (specialized driver's license from MI; MN; NY; VT & WA).

 

Please!

Edited July 25, 2021 by Ferry_Watcher