Round 1: FDR

[Flatbush Flyer]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article252863233.html

 

[Turned text into hyperlink – Host Jazzbeau]

[Jancruz]

So Interesting.. 

Jancruz1

[shepherd really]

Which means Florida appeals en banc to the full appellate court. 

[Host Jazzbeau]

The article quotes the CDC argument that this is essentially an international business and therefore a Federal, not a State, matter.  That would also apply to the suit against the Florida 'vaccine ban.'  Since the cruise lines have figured out how to deal with the CDC restrictions [especially after they have been softened], this could lay the groundwork for a double win for 100% vaxxed Florida cruising.  Good news for FDR [and me and mine].

[susiesan]

 Doesn't the CSO prohibit cruises longer than 7 days? Aren't most of the O cruises from Miami this winter longer cruises? 

[Host Jazzbeau]

5 minutes ago, susiesan said:

 Doesn't the CSO prohibit cruises longer than 7 days? Aren't most of the O cruises from Miami this winter longer cruises? 

There hasn't been a CDC announcement, but the language about the 7 day limit has disappeared and cruise lines are now offering b2b and >7 day cruises as if it no longer applies.  [Note that they did not make changes relying on the District Court decision, so this must be based on their understanding of the latest version of the CSO.]

[susiesan]

Just now, Host Jazzbeau said:

There hasn't been a CDC announcement, but the language about the 7 day limit has disappeared and cruise lines are now offering b2b and >7 day cruises as if it no longer applies.  [Note that they did not make changes relying on the District Court decision, so this must be based on their understanding of the latest version of the CSO.]

This was all before the latest news on the lawsuit. Longer cruises started being sold for post Nov. 1 when the CSO is set to expire. I Hhave a feeling it won't, the CDC will not relinquish control of the cruise industry. 

[Flatbush Flyer]

3 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

There hasn't been a CDC announcement, but the language about the 7 day limit has disappeared and cruise lines are now offering b2b and >7 day cruises as if it no longer applies.  [Note that they did not make changes relying on the District Court decision, so this must be based on their understanding of the latest version of the CSO.]

In fact, even when the CSO was in effect, a cruise line could petition for an exemption.

 

Right now, I think that cruises like O’s MIA-MIA Riviera itineraries in Dec. ‘22-Jan. ‘23 (some are 14 days) are going to be A-OK to cruise with the requirement for proof of 100% FDA approved two shot vaccination (passengers and crew). 
Of course, by then, I also expect the mask requirement will be added because of the increasing variants threat. And I expect that O will refuse boarding/continuing to anyone not in compliance.

Too much at stake here for O to be wishy-washy in its commitments or enforcement.

[Host Jazzbeau]

9 minutes ago, susiesan said:

This was all before the latest news on the lawsuit. Longer cruises started being sold for post Nov. 1 when the CSO is set to expire. I Hhave a feeling it won't, the CDC will not relinquish control of the cruise industry. 

Then you should cancel and stop worrying. 

[jagoffee]

45 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

The article quotes the CDC argument that this is essentially an international business and therefore a Federal, not a State, matter.  That would also apply to the suit against the Florida 'vaccine ban.'  Since the cruise lines have figured out how to deal with the CDC restrictions [especially after they have been softened], this could lay the groundwork for a double win for 100% vaxxed Florida cruising.  Good news for FDR [and me and mine].

Why would you say there is a Florida “vaccine ban”?  As you know, there is no such thing.  You certainly are sending a terrible message by making such a incorrect characterization. Millions of people in Florida are being vaccinated.

 Shouldn’t you also follow our guidelines and try not to insert your political opinion into this discussion?

 

  

[Host Jazzbeau]

2 minutes ago, jagoffee said:

Why would you say there is a Florida “vaccine ban”?  As you know, there is no such thing.  You certainly are sending a terrible message by making such a incorrect characterization. Millions of people in Florida are being vaccinated.

 Shouldn’t you also follow our guidelines and try not to insert your political opinion into this discussion?

I didn't mean it as political in any way, just a shorthand to refer to the Florida position that no business can demand to know a person's vaccination status.  I put it in quotes to indicate that it was shorthand.  Sorry if that didn't communicate.  I would be happy to learn a better way to state it in two words or less. 

[marieps]

6 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

I didn't mean it as political in any way, just a shorthand to refer to the Florida position that no business can demand to know a person's vaccination status.  I put it in quotes to indicate that it was shorthand.  Sorry if that didn't communicate.  I would be happy to learn a better way to state it in two words or less. 

Vaccine documentation ban

[susiesan]

11 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

Then you should cancel and stop worrying. 

My 11 day  O cruise next April is not from the US, it is from Barcelona and is entirely in Europe where none of this applies. Too soon to cancel the one. 

[Flatbush Flyer]

8 minutes ago, susiesan said:

My 11 day  O cruise next April is not from the US, it is from Barcelona and is entirely in Europe where none of this applies. Too soon to cancel the one. 

“None of this”?

 

If you are on ANY Oceania ship, you will be required to have been vaccinated (though, sadly, you are correct that the vaccine specifics outside of the US may not meet US CDC standards). 

And there still remains the uncertain mask situation with each new day bringing increasingly bad news about the spread of variants. If this continues (which it will) hopefully (and expectedly), O will not hesitate to change their current indoor “close contact” mask recommendation to a requirement including disembarking anyone who chooses to defy it in even the slightest way.
 

[Host Jazzbeau]

2 hours ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

“None of this”?

 

If you are on ANY Oceania ship, you will be required to have been vaccinated (though, sadly, you are correct that the vaccine specifics outside of the US may not meet US CDC standards). 

And there still remains the uncertain mask situation with each new day bringing increasingly bad news about the spread of variants. If this continues (which it will) hopefully (and expectedly), O will not hesitate to change their current indoor “close contact” mask recommendation to a requirement including disembarking anyone who chooses to defy it in even the slightest way.
 

And the possibility that some ports may require passengers to stay in a 'bubble' with ship's excursions only.  Those who want to find reasons to cancel will always be able to find some issue.

[basor]

4 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

And the possibility that some ports may require passengers to stay in a 'bubble' with ship's excursions only.  Those who want to find reasons to cancel will always be able to find some issue.

and those that want to find reaons to wring hands and nash teeth will always be able to find some "new" issue

[cotto22]

Will passengers be tested after a shore excursion? And if so, what is the protocol if a vaccinated passenger tests positive? 

[Jancruz]

17 minutes ago, basor said:

and those that want to find reaons to wring hands and nash teeth will always be able to find some "new" issue

I will definitely continue my wait and see attitude and keep my fingers crossed..

Jancruz1

[LHT28]

2 minutes ago, cotto22 said:

Will passengers be tested after a shore excursion? And if so, what is the protocol if a vaccinated passenger tests positive? 

Maybe locked in the cabin or medical centre until they can quietly throw them overboard  😉

 

I am sure they have a plan in place

[Jancruz]

1 minute ago, cotto22 said:

Will passengers be tested after a shore excursion? And if so, what is the protocol if a vaccinated passenger tests positive? 

Unfortunately at this time no one can answer your questions..

Jancruz1

[basor]

Just now, cotto22 said:

Will passengers be tested after a shore excursion? And if so, what is the protocol if a vaccinated passenger tests positive? 

On the current sailings, every guest submits a salavia test every night and get results next morning,.  they had 1 vaccinated person test positive on the Viking SKy last week and that person and companion were immediately quarantined and all people that had been in close contact with that person were restested (non were postive).  The rest of the passengers continued with normal activities on the ship.  The guests disembarked last Saturday and the new guests embarked and they are currently enjoying their cruise.  We have close friends onboard right now so this is first hand knowledge.

[RJB]

16 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

The article quotes the CDC argument that this is essentially an international business and therefore a Federal, not a State, matter.  That would also apply to the suit against the Florida 'vaccine ban.'  Since the cruise lines have figured out how to deal with the CDC restrictions [especially after they have been softened], this could lay the groundwork for a double win for 100% vaxxed Florida cruising.  Good news for FDR [and me and mine].

Good news for all of us.  Will let us cruise and to stay as safe as possible.  Nothing is 100% but the vaccine gives all of us the best chance. 

[Jancruz]

46 minutes ago, RJB said:

Good news for all of us.  Will let us cruise and to stay as safe as possible.  Nothing is 100% but the vaccine gives all of us the best chance. 

Plus 1

Jancruz1

[cotto22]

3 hours ago, LHT28 said:

Maybe locked in the cabin or medical centre until they can quietly throw them overboard  😉

 

I am sure they have a plan in place

I am not so much concerned about what the cruise line would do, but what the country would do if the test were a rapid results and done before boarding. I think I could probably muddle through time in my cabin with room service and a balcony with books to read, cards, etc., but don't like the idea of being quarantined in a pricey hotel in Morocco for 2 weeks.

[floridatravelersforlife]

Since Florida AG is appealing the Appelate Court decision to the Supreme Court, all this is conjecture.  Since O screwed me when they announced the delay in restart of the R Ships, I have cancelled all my cruises with O until July 2022.  I don't need to get whipsawed by the bureacrats and O.  Instead we are doing two land based vacations.