Bolette Stranded in Belfast

[tring]

Bolette spending her third night in Belfast.  The first night was on the itinerary, but the second two are because of a computer problem.

 

I hope Fred is on the case and trying to get to grips with managing ships which require modern computer systems, rather than his older ones, which presumably just needed the old, hands on approach.  

 

Edited September 3, 2021 by tring

[norn iron]

Thanks for the information re the IT issue.

We have elderly relatives onboard who we saw both Wednesday and Thursday. 

I was aware that the ship hadn't sailed as planned on Thursday evening and remained in Belfast on Friday and I put that down to the fact that the next stop (Bute) had been cancelled.

 

It seems to be a bit of a disaster cruise, Bute and the Isle of Man both cancelled, IT issues and few services issues as well. A lot of unhappy cruisers.

[tring]

27 minutes ago, norn iron said:

Thanks for the information re the IT issue.

We have elderly relatives onboard who we saw both Wednesday and Thursday. 

I was aware that the ship hadn't sailed as planned on Thursday evening and remained in Belfast on Friday and I put that down to the fact that the next stop (Bute) had been cancelled.

 

It seems to be a bit of a disaster cruise, Bute and the Isle of Man both cancelled, IT issues and few services issues as well. A lot of unhappy cruisers.

 

The good news at present is that they are just sailing out of Belfast docks now.  Straight to Orkney, I think I saw mentioned, but at least they were allowed ashore in Belfast again yesterday.  I hope your relatives enjoy the rest of their cruise

 

Yes, I had heard there were a number of changes to the itinerary.  Bute was cancelled because the covid numbers had gone sky high apparently (of course large rises in Scotland after schools returned), though not sure about the reason for the other changes, but I did think it was strange if the IOM was on the itinerary before they sailed as they have been very keen not to allow anyone on, but had been having extremely low numbers of covid cases.  Generally Fred is allowing people to go ashore independently now, which will at least be a lot better than July and August, when it was shore tours only.

 

We are on a Spanish cruise departing in September and got an 11 page email from Fred yesterday with details of protocols required for the cruises and how to arrange them.  Five pages were shore tours though.  WE have been told at present we would be able to go ashore independently at all ports, but could change, even last minute, so up to date details will be given by shore tours when on the ship (I am assuming there will be a notice board).  Everything is so fluid at present. 

[BigAl94]

Surprised they were allowed to do their own thing in Belfast where the covid numbers are far higher than Scotland.

[tring]

1 hour ago, BigAl94 said:

Surprised they were allowed to do their own thing in Belfast where the covid numbers are far higher than Scotland.

 

Depends on the port I think, of course Scotland only just allowing cruise ships.  It varies with the part of Scotland as well, they are off to Orkney now.

 

Last week three Spanish ports were.not allowing independent visits, whilst others were.  We have now been told we could go Into all our Spanish ports for a cruise leaving late Sept, at present, but can change up until the time we arrive.

Edited September 4, 2021 by tring

[Britboys]

On 9/3/2021 at 11:35 PM, tring said:

Bolette spending her third night in Belfast.  The first night was on the itinerary, but the second two are because of a computer problem.

 

I hope Fred is on the case and trying to get to grips with managing ships which require modern computer systems, rather than his older ones, which presumably just needed the old, hands on approach.  

 

Oh no! Do you know if it was the same computer issue that caused the Borealis cruise to be aborted?

[tring]

1 minute ago, Britboys said:

Oh no! Do you know if it was the same computer issue that caused the Borealis cruise to be aborted?

 

Do not know, but Fred having some computer issues.  I expect there is quite a difference from the older ships.  All sorted now anyway, but I had seen a comment saying software had to be downloaded from Italy and Borealis was also waiting for Italians to repair the Lido deck roof (one half would not retract in Aug, not sure if still the case now). 

 

Makes me wonder if the Carnival Corp owned shipyard in Italy, where the ships were built, will have to deal with all repair work.

 

Have you seen Fred's reduced prices for the cruises going out soon?  He appears desparate to sell more of cabins.

[Britboys]

8 minutes ago, tring said:

 

Do not know, but Fred having some computer issues.  I expect there is quite a difference from the older ships.  All sorted now anyway, but I had seen a comment saying software had to be downloaded from Italy and Borealis was also waiting for Italians to repair the Lido deck roof (one half would not retract in Aug, not sure if still the case now). 

 

Makes me wonder if the Carnival Corp owned shipyard in Italy, where the ships were built, will have to deal with all repair work.

 

Have you seen Fred's reduced prices for the cruises going out soon?  He appears desparate to sell more of cabins.

Oh, Italians involved. Say no more...😂

Yes, I have seen the recent deals. Much more affordable but I'm not inclined to book anything that goes overseas at the moment as the situation is so volatile that it is anyone's guess as to whether you will get the itinerary you have booked. Also, my priority is to get over to Spain to my apartment that I haven't visited for 17 months...

[rkacruiser]

2 hours ago, tring said:

Makes me wonder if the Carnival Corp owned shipyard in Italy,

 

Your comment raised my eyebrows as a Carnival Corporation shareholder.  Never heard that before.  I checked Wikipedia for Fincantieri.  From what I read, the Company is an independent Company, listed on the Milan Stock Exchange, and is a component of the FTSE Italia Mid Cap Index.  

[tring]

2 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Your comment raised my eyebrows as a Carnival Corporation shareholder.  Never heard that before.  I checked Wikipedia for Fincantieri.  From what I read, the Company is an independent Company, listed on the Milan Stock Exchange, and is a component of the FTSE Italia Mid Cap Index.  

 

Had a quick look and cannot find a clearer link other than numerous contracts to build ships. I was sure I had seen something in the past about Carnival acquiring a shipyard in Italy and I thought that was the one, but perhaps the information I had read was wrong.  Sorry if I have given the wrong information and must admit I cannot now even remember where I saw that mentioned, or exactly when it was (though I suspect it was about 5 years back, perhaps even longer).

 

We have Carnival shares, but do not usually take that much notice of the business, other than the most recent share benefit details and how much we would get if take a cruise.  Did take a bit more notice last year and begining of this year though, regards how they are coping with weathering the pandemic.

 

Barbara

 

 

Edited September 7, 2021 by tring

[rkacruiser]

1 hour ago, tring said:

numerous contracts to build ships.

 

There's no question that this Italian company has received many contracts to build ships for the CCL brands.  The only company other than them of which I am aware was the Japanese company that built the Diamond Princess and the Sapphire Princess.  (There is a story, if you are interested in how the "Diamond Princess" became the Sapphire Princess and the "Sapphire Princess" became the Diamond Princess during the building process of the "Diamond Princess".)  

 

The quality of workmanship on Fincantieri built vessels has been a concern for some of us for many years.  The "lowest price" often provides one a product that is of a lesser quality as I am sure you are aware.  CCL is guilty of that as far as I am concerned.  

 

I do follow CCL closely.  I have attended one of the Annual Shareholder Meetings in Miami and have nothing but good to say about the executives and Board Members whom I met.  Even as a small shareholder, I was welcomed and the "suits" were willing to engage in brief conversations.  

 

6 hours ago, tring said:

shipyard in Italy, where the ships were built, will have to deal with all repair work

 

Your question is an interesting one.  One would expect that other companies would be able to do whatever needs to be done to repair whatever that the Italian company made.  

[tring]

12 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

 

There's no question that this Italian company has received many contracts to build ships for the CCL brands.  The only company other than them of which I am aware was the Japanese company that built the Diamond Princess and the Sapphire Princess.  (There is a story, if you are interested in how the "Diamond Princess" became the Sapphire Princess and the "Sapphire Princess" became the Diamond Princess during the building process of the "Diamond Princess".)  

 

The quality of workmanship on Fincantieri built vessels has been a concern for some of us for many years.  The "lowest price" often provides one a product that is of a lesser quality as I am sure you are aware.  CCL is guilty of that as far as I am concerned.  

 

I do follow CCL closely.  I have attended one of the Annual Shareholder Meetings in Miami and have nothing but good to say about the executives and Board Members whom I met.  Even as a small shareholder, I was welcomed and the "suits" were willing to engage in brief conversations.  

 

 

Your question is an interesting one.  One would expect that other companies would be able to do whatever needs to be done to repair whatever that the Italian company made.  

 

I assume when you wrote CCL, you meant to refer to Carnival Corporation rather than Carnival Cruise Lines.

 

My husband was also of the opinion there was a close business connection, which we thought was ownership, though thinking about it that thought comes from something which must be nearer ten years ago, so not up to date anyway..  Neither of us can remember what we had heard/read regards that, so maybe a misunderstanding, but it would have been a fairly reliable source and not just chatter somewhere.  Or perhaps some shares were owned at the time, but we really do not know and no point trying to dig around now as we have no knowledge of Italian.

 

Neither of us have any business knowledge, though DH does have an understanding of some legal matters, including basic contract law, because of his work background and studies, but buisiness contracts will be a very specialised area.  As far as we understood, from a mention of the purchase of the Ex HAL ships on the Bonheur website, the “deal “ is over five years, with Fred paying in two equal instalments in the final two years of that.  Hence we assume there would be some sort of protection written into the contract for Carnival during that earlier stages.  I was also wondering if having to use that shipyards for certain repairs may be a part of that, or if is it possible that there was an original arrangement between Carnival and the shipyard which was passed over to Fred in the purchase contract.  It just seemed strange to me (though perhaps just a co- incidence) that Fred was reliant on an Italian company for both matters which seem quite different issues.  If I get the chance I may be able to question the reason for reliance on an Italian company.  It was a very senior officer who we asked about the lido roof and he did seem somewhat downhearted about the fact they are waiting for repair workers to come over from Italy.  Not easy travel in these times either, with the need for covid restrictions and international rules.

 

No matter really, though it is a bit concerning what you say about quality of the ships.  However with all newer productions of anything, quality seems to go down and Carnival obviously have no interest in ships which are getting older.  Safety is another matter though, so I hope that is not compromised.

Edited September 8, 2021 by tring

[rkacruiser]

9 hours ago, tring said:

I assume when you wrote CCL, you meant to refer to Carnival Corporation rather than Carnival Cruise Lines.

 

Yes, I did.   CCL is the stock symbol for Carnival Corporation on the NYSE.  

 

9 hours ago, tring said:

I was also wondering if having to use that shipyards for certain repairs may be a part of that, or if is it possible that there was an original arrangement between Carnival and the shipyard which was passed over to Fred in the purchase contract.  It just seemed strange to me (though perhaps just a co- incidence) that Fred was reliant on an Italian company for both matters which seem quite different issues. 

 

That is an interesting thought as to why Fincantieri was needed to do the repair.  No idea, but, it may simply be a case that there are few companies that have the expertise to make a repair of the dome's mechanism.  

 

9 hours ago, tring said:

it is a bit concerning what you say about quality of the ships. 

 

Quality of workmanship in the materials used and/or the work done by the contractors in finishing the ship has been my concern.  When I sailed on the 2 year old Veendam, the grouting around the bathtub was peeling away.  That should not happen on such a new ship.  Just an example based on my own observations.  The quality of the basic ship itself?  No concerns whatsoever.  I have sailed on both Rotterdam and Amsterdam in difficult sea conditions and both handled the seas well.  

 

9 hours ago, tring said:

Safety is another matter though, so I hope that is not compromised.

 

Never saw anything that made me question the ship's safety.  In fact, the maintenance of the safety equipment that I have observed was very reassuring.  

Edited September 8, 2021 by rkacruiser

[tring]

1 hour ago, rkacruiser said:

 

That is an interesting thought as to why Fincantieri was needed to do the repair.  No idea, but, it may simply be a case that there are few companies that have the expertise to make a repair of the dome's mechanism.  

 

 

I am not sure the issues were being dealt with by Fincantieri, but possibly the most likely if Italian.  Yes, I presume there could well be parts required as well as specific skills to deal with the Lido roof.  The first computer failure (on Borealis) was to do with a computer function which controlled what we were told are new cyclo-converters which control the propellers.  I do not know if the computer concerned was also new and I have no idea what the issue was with Bolette last week.

 

[rkacruiser]

17 minutes ago, tring said:

new cyclo-converters which control the propellers

 

And what may these devices be?  Why does modern society seem to keep insisting to change "what works" for something that is "new" that then becomes troublesome?  There's nothing wrong with the KISS philosophy as far as I am concerned.  

[Britboys]

I must say that purely as a passenger on a number of cruise ships built by a number of different shipbuilders, I have always felt that the interior build quality of Fincantieri was inferior to others,EG Meyer Werft. Fincantieri do seem to have built the majority of Carnival Corp ships in recent years though. I note that they have also built Silversea, Regent and Viking ships too, so maybe the interior build quality is set by the contract with the the cruise line...

[davecttr]

On 9/9/2021 at 12:03 AM, rkacruiser said:

 

And what may these devices be?  Why does modern society seem to keep insisting to change "what works" for something that is "new" that then becomes troublesome?  There's nothing wrong with the KISS philosophy as far as I am concerned.  

according to wiki devices that are used to control the frequency of high power AC electric motors. Basically you can start at full load and very low revs. ideal for ships etc. been around in various forms since the 1930,s