Oceania v Azamara (and a shout out to MSC Yacht Club)

[hamrag]

Posted identical on Oceania Board.

 

Background....we are a couple mid-60s with 54 cruises on 16 different cruiselines. We have found the 'mass' cruiselines to have declined substantially in the quality of MDR food offerings in the past decade or so, less so with Cunard which has declined only a little.....YMMV. A couple of years pre-Covid we decided to explore potential better experiences on the two so called premium lines, and also began dipping our toes in a couple of luxury lines/experiences also. Most cruisers on these boards recognise that the post-Covid return has and continues to present many challenges, and having cruised now 5 times post-Covid we accord with such opinion.

 

We recently returned from our first Oceania cruise following two Covid cancellations, on Insignia, which we thoroughly enjoyed. We have sailed once on two B2B cruises with Azamara December 2019 on Journey. Both ships we understand to be 'R' class vessels and they are definitely identical in structure and most of layout. Insignia was 're-inspired & refreshed' 2018, and it's decor is stunning and still fresh because it is essentially only 18 months old due to the Covid cruising shutdown.

 

The Oceania food experience is everything they claim, from buffet to MDR and the included specialty restaurants, the 'best culinary experience at sea'. We had 4 superb evening meals in the MDR, and one which was average. We ate once in each of the included Specialty restaurants which were a step up even from the MDR. The menus are extensive, imaginative, and the food exceptionally well presented. The quality of buffet food for breakfast and lunches was the best we have ever experienced at sea. In marketing terms, the food and service are its USP.

 

We did not find the Azamara food experience to be as good as many claim it to be, it wasn't much different from most other cruiselines and not quite as good as Cunard. On each of our 7 night cruises we were fortunate to purchase a 3 meal package (very fairly priced) in the specialty restaurants which were excellent. MDR fare is certainly a notch below Oceania, and it was the specialty restaurants and the White Night which made the overall culinary experience tolerable. Azamara White Night is spectacular, and not to be missed, both in presentation and quality and this is when the senior officers really come to the fore and personally serve a high quality buffet on deck. Most cruiselines have a white night, we have walked through them all and departed after 15 minutes because they are awful. Azamara also have an Azamazing evening off ship on most cruises, not ours unfortunately, and by all accounts that too is a night to remember. In marketing terms White Night and Azamazing evenings are its USP,

 

Everything else is broadly similar e.g. show lounge entertainment is limited and average at best. The pianists rolled out in bar areas are fine, and is done by 10.30 to 10.45pm as are most passengers! Stringed instrumentalists on both lines are good, but have a limited audience.

 

We met an American couple on Oceania who have also sailed with Azamara. They told us that a long serving Hotel Director, who has helped develop and personally lived and breathed the Azamara ethos for the past two decades or thereabouts has recently resigned, having now experienced the post-takeover way ahead for them. We believe this is most certainly the same lady who was HD on our Azamara cruises and, by some distance, she was the most engaging, enthusiastic and highly competent senior officer we ever had the pleasure of sailing with. Apparently other senior officers have already or are seriously considering, moving on for the same reasons which are mainly that the new owners are diminishing on-board authority and opportunity to display initiative and express individual personalities on the product offering. They said they have sailed roughly equal cruises on both lines, and enjoyed both for different reasons, but are now moving solely to Oceania based on their most recent Azamara experience.

 

A final shout to MSC Yacht Club, which we have discovered to be excellent. We have cruised 6 times in Yacht Club ,and our next booked cruise too. It is an enclave of 200-250 passengers, with an exclusive pool deck, huge bar & lounge and restaurant. The YC restaurant is comparable to Oceania MDR, above Azamara, but not quite speciality restaurant quality. The USP, for us at least, is that you have Yacht Club but also the rest of the ship when you want it. Entertainment is waaaay better than both Oceania and Azamara, and there is always live music performers in the 4 deck Atrium areas. The biggest downside is that MSC sail the same old, same old, routes so eventually I'd see us moving away from them for better itineraries. Please note, we would NOT recommend MSC outwith the Yacht Club experience.

 

If Oceania were to do something similar to Azamara in terms of a White Night, they would blow Azamara out of the water....pun intended! We would definitely sail Oceania again, and probably Azamara as it is itinerary that is of principal interest to us. Within reason, the cruiseline is secondary if the itinerary is right for us.

[Beamafar]

Hi G.  We’re trying Az for the first time in a little over 2 weeks’ time, then giving X another chance 2 weeks later (did an SS on Millie in 2016 and thought we’d never sail X again!).    For us, the YC experience has been seriously downgraded;  food on our 23 night NY-Canada-NY-Miami in Oct-Nov 2019 sailing was atrocious (and I’m happy once there’s something on the menu I can eat).
 

In fact, we’ve really turned off MSC after all the problems we had with them last year.  We have the Abu Dhabi-Genoa repo on Europa booked for next March;  for some reason we couldn’t book YC, but we did book Aurea before that Experience got downgraded.  We’re very keen to find out how Az (and the Retreat on X) compares. 

[hamrag]

6 minutes ago, Beamafar said:

Hi G.  We’re trying Az for the first time in a little over 2 weeks’ time, then giving X another chance 2 weeks later (did an SS on Millie in 2016 and thought we’d never sail X again!).    For us, the YC experience has been seriously downgraded;  food on our 23 night NY-Canada-NY-Miami in Oct-Nov 2019 sailing was atrocious (and I’m happy once there’s something on the menu I can eat).
 

In fact, we’ve really turned off MSC after all the problems we had with them last year.  We have the Abu Dhabi-Genoa repo on Europa booked for next March;  for some reason we couldn’t book YC, but we did book Aurea before that Experience got downgraded.  We’re very keen to find out how Az (and the Retreat on X) compares. 

Great to hear from you Bea, I guess that's why you've been missing from the MSC boards!

 

We sailed YC Nov/Dec 2021, repo on Seaview for 18 nights Barcelona to Caribbean and it was fabulous. Also April past we had our retirement family cruise 7 nights Grandiosa YC, which was same and also the 5 nights we stayed on for after the kids and grandkids headed home!

 

Every cruiseline has cut back, but nothing so far in YC which matters to us. Highly recommend them still, we haven't had any bad experiences in YC.....Virtuosa last September, outwith YC, was another story and the cruise which crystalised our decision never to do MSC outwith YC.

 

Highly recommend Oceania also, have you sailed with them?

 

Hope you are both well, take good care. 

[Beamafar]

Oceania’s a bit too rich for our blood, G.  😆

 

We had Seashore booked for last March out of Miami, but, unfortunately, I got a bad attack of vertigo and had to cancel.  Was soooo looking forward to it as we’d been on her in the Med last October and were looking forward to seeing some of the fantastic crew who would still be onboard.  Plus, there were lots of CCers doing that one, some we’d met before and others I’d been hoping to meet. 

[curmudgeon98]

We did a couple of 10-12 day cruises on Oceania Riviera and Marina pre-covid.  I wasn't all that impressed with the specialty restaurants; overly elaborate service with decent but bland food.  Buffet and MDR were fine, definitely better than the mass market lines.  Felt like the drinks were over-priced.  Entertainment and music was better than what we've had on Azamara (other than White Night/Azamazing event).  Riviera and Marina both felt a bit geriatric to me, like the HAL caricatures.  Haven't done an R-class Oceania yet. 

 

Oceania and Azamara both currently sit at the top of our preference list, with price and itinerary being the differentiator.  Azamara is a slight preference to us for the ambiance and passenger attitudes, but they are far more similar than different.  We've got a Seabourn coming up next, but I'm not convinced we will find it as good a fit for us, and we aren't really interested in trying lines with more formality like Silversea and Regent.  I really appreciate that different lines have different priorities and styles, as that lets cruisers pick ones that fits them better.

[annapolitan369]

We have sailed Oceania, Azamara and Regent.  We have not found Regent to be formal, I don't take a jacket or tie with me on any of these lines.  We just finished a Greek intensive on Journey and were not very impressed as there were things missing that we previous had on past Azamara cruises.  We have always found the staff on Azamara to be friendlier than on Oceania but the ships of Oceania are done in a way that seems more upscale to us.  With the right itinerary, I don't think you can go wrong with any of these three.  However, Regent in many ways is superior to either of the others, so one needs to price them up with equivalent options if there are identical itineraries.

[cruiseerf]

While I appreciate everybody's cruise and dining experiences, the one piece of the puzzle nobody brought up is the chefs!  There are chefs who can make anything taste good and there are chefs who are just poor.   Cooking on ships adds a whole new dimension to this equation and then on top of that factor in supply chain disruptions and labour shortages.  Many of the better cruise chefs took hotel jobs at home and were recognized as highly competent in their craft and offered well paying positions at home, not requiring the long times away.   Thus, Many cruise lines have had to hire junior chefs to be trained to be senior chefs and from what I have heard this is quite problematic.   From what I have experienced on one of my more recent cruises (will not say line) is that when I complained about the mediocrity of the food, they told us to just eat in the specialty restaurants and everything would be comped off, which it was.  Cruise lines know about these problems however they are doing whatever they can to 1) Keep the cruises and restaurants all operational and 2) work with a plethora of Cost Cutting Initiatives that all the cruise lines lines have rolled out.   Cruising today has changed and we try not to compare it to pre covid times.  More and more where I used to see continuity with the "Brands" now it is hit or miss depending on the ship.  luck of the draw.  Irregardless we are still enjoying our cruising and try to make the best of all our situations.  Safe sails to all.  

[excitedofharpenden]

9 hours ago, annapolitan369 said:

We have sailed Oceania, Azamara and Regent.  We have not found Regent to be formal, I don't take a jacket or tie with me on any of these lines.  We just finished a Greek intensive on Journey and were not very impressed as there were things missing that we previous had on past Azamara cruises.  We have always found the staff on Azamara to be friendlier than on Oceania but the ships of Oceania are done in a way that seems more upscale to us.  With the right itinerary, I don't think you can go wrong with any of these three.  However, Regent in many ways is superior to either of the others, so one needs to price them up with equivalent options if there are identical itineraries.

Interested to know what you thought was missing on Journey that you've enjoyed before?  I'm on Journey for a Greek Intensive in September. 

 

Phil 

 

 

[marinaro44]

9 hours ago, annapolitan369 said:

We have sailed Oceania, Azamara and Regent.  We have not found Regent to be formal, I don't take a jacket or tie with me on any of these lines.  We just finished a Greek intensive on Journey and were not very impressed as there were things missing that we previous had on past Azamara cruises.  We have always found the staff on Azamara to be friendlier than on Oceania but the ships of Oceania are done in a way that seems more upscale to us.  With the right itinerary, I don't think you can go wrong with any of these three.  However, Regent in many ways is superior to either of the others, so one needs to price them up with equivalent options if there are identical itineraries.

Have spent seven weeks on Regent ships and won't go back.  Cold and impersonal service.  Perfect cruise line for those who "don't want to fraternize with the help."  [Yes, someone did write that once here on the Azamara board.]

[boxman52]

We have two cruises booked with Azamara upcoming so it will be interesting to compare.

No-one here has mentioned Viking, we have been on them and found the ships great, food very good and the overall inclusive package excellent.

If Azamara is as good we will be very happy.

Of the main lines we like RCL for a very different holiday but get their unlimited dining package that elevates the food offer. We don't go on expecting an exclusive experience but we get other things from them that we don't get on the smaller lines

[hamrag]

4 hours ago, cruiseerf said:

While I appreciate everybody's cruise and dining experiences, the one piece of the puzzle nobody brought up is the chefs!  There are chefs who can make anything taste good and there are chefs who are just poor.   Cooking on ships adds a whole new dimension to this equation and then on top of that factor in supply chain disruptions and labour shortages.  Many of the better cruise chefs took hotel jobs at home and were recognized as highly competent in their craft and offered well paying positions at home, not requiring the long times away.   Thus, Many cruise lines have had to hire junior chefs to be trained to be senior chefs and from what I have heard this is quite problematic...

That's a good point, and will include aspects other than dining. Our experience with Azamara was pre-Covid, but with Oceania it was 'post-Covid' so perhaps the gap between Az and Oceania food is even greater than we first thought as this seems to be the case according to other posts I've read across various Az threads.

[lisiamc]

1 hour ago, boxman52 said:

We have two cruises booked with Azamara upcoming so it will be interesting to compare.

No-one here has mentioned Viking, we have been on them and found the ships great, food very good and the overall inclusive package excellent.

If Azamara is as good we will be very happy.

Of the main lines we like RCL for a very different holiday but get their unlimited dining package that elevates the food offer. We don't go on expecting an exclusive experience but we get other things from them that we don't get on the smaller lines

I love Viking as much as Azamara, but for different reasons. Viking is very smooth, and very good at getting the details right. Their ships are calm, cool, beautiful, and very, very uniform. Azamara ships are a bit more quirky in furnishings and artwork, and the service is a little bit more personal.The food on both can be extremely good, or sometimes less so. I like Viking’s inclusion of the speciality restaurants in the base price, but I like Azamara’s included drinks selection better. Azamara has more trivia - a very minor point, but it appeals to me. I adore Viking’s Torshavn late-night venue, but I’m also a big fan of Onward’s Atlas bar, for similar reasons, although there is no room for live music.

Edited July 20, 2022 by lisiamc

[federalexpress]

1 hour ago, hamrag said:

That's a good point, and will include aspects other than dining. Our experience with Azamara was pre-Covid, but with Oceania it was 'post-Covid' so perhaps the gap between Az and Oceania food is even greater than we first thought as this seems to be the case according to other posts I've read across various Az threads.

I do not have your experience of cruising, only one previous cruise with HAL 8 years ago, because I've never really regarded it as my kind of holiday, so have sailed with neither Azamara or Oceania, but for my forthcoming S America voyage, both were the main candidates along with Viking. The latter was my favourite but their air package is hopeless and provides little flexibility. I quite liked the look of Oceania, especially its reputation for food, but the problem was, a similar cabin was roughly 50% more on a like for like basis compared to Azamara. Maybe the latter was offering an especially good deal.

 

I guess my advantage here is I won't know if Oceania is better, but I will know if Azamara is better than HAL, which I imagine it will be, and I enjoyed the cruising on the latter more than I expected to (I was really mainly focussed on the destinations, as I am for this cruise, albeit it's nice to travel in comfort)

[asnaleah]

“Have spent seven weeks on Regent ships and won't go back.  Cold and impersonal service.  Perfect cruise line for those who "don't want to fraternize with the help."  [Yes, someone did write that once here on the Azamara board.]”

 

This was not our experience on Voyager last month. We had very friendly service and as for personal, when I had to quarantine due to C-19, our butler called several times a day to see if he could do anything for me. Also, the restaurant manager called daily to see what I felt like eating. The medical staff was warm and caring. 
 

Can’t wait to sail on Regent again!

[boxman52]

1 hour ago, lisiamc said:

I love Viking as much as Azamara, but for different reasons. Viking is very smooth, and very good at getting the details right. Their ships are calm, cool, beautiful, and very, very uniform. Azamara ships are a bit more quirky in furnishings and artwork, and the service is a little bit more personal.The food on both can be extremely good, or sometimes less so. I like Viking’s inclusion of the speciality restaurants in the base price, but I like Azamara’s included drinks selection better. Azamara has more trivia - a very minor point, but it appeals to me. I adore Viking’s Torshavn late-night venue, but I’m also a big fan of Onward’s Atlas bar, for similar reasons, although there is no room for live music.

I agree the Torshavn is a great venue with a really good feel to it. I hope the Atlas bar will be similar although as you say its a real shame there is no live music

[AllisonJames]

We love AZ, but if I was going on a crossing or a World Cruise I would probably choose Viking. The ships are so gorgeous and have more facilities (especially pools indoor and outdoor) than AZ. We sailed Viking in the Med in December and it was perfect for slightly chilly weather with the heated outdoor infinity pool and the indoor pool/sauna/snow room facilities open to all guests (not just those with spa appts). But I agree with others that we found the service and guests less friendly than on AZ. 

[Host Jazzbeau]

41 minutes ago, AllisonJames said:

We love AZ, but if I was going on a crossing or a World Cruise I would probably choose Viking. The ships are so gorgeous and have more facilities (especially pools indoor and outdoor) than AZ. We sailed Viking in the Med in December and it was perfect for slightly chilly weather with the heated outdoor infinity pool and the indoor pool/sauna/snow room facilities open to all guests (not just those with spa appts). But I agree with others that we found the service and guests less friendly than on AZ. 

I agree, although I might choose one of Oceania's new-gen ships over Viking because of the food.  OTOH Viking has great enrichment lecturers and their ships are stunning.  My priorities are:  (1) itinerary [Azamara wins]; (2) food [Oceania wins]; (3) my cabin as my retreat [Oceania and Viking win because Azamara requires booking a CW at great expense]; (4) visibility and friendliness of officers [Azamara used to win, but so many of the great ones have left...]

[hamrag]

7 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

I agree, although I might choose one of Oceania's new-gen ships over Viking because of the food.  OTOH Viking has great enrichment lecturers and their ships are stunning.  My priorities are:  (1) itinerary [Azamara wins]; (2) food [Oceania wins]; (3) my cabin as my retreat [Oceania and Viking win because Azamara requires booking a CW at great expense]; (4) visibility and friendliness of officers [Azamara used to win, but so many of the great ones have left...]

Your number (4) is something I didn't touch on, because it honestly makes little difference to us. On both Oceania and Yacht Club there is minimal visibility of senior officers, and on MSC they are often somewhat surly!