Missed Port - Insurance Compensation

[Son of Anarchy]

30 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

There is also the complication of when is a missed port not a missed port, and how will an insurer deal with it. As several ports are now restricting cruise ships for various reasons will insurers pay out, two examples that spring to mind are Amsterdam and Majorca where people were expecting to cruise there but now are not, is that really a missed port in the eyes of an insurer?

 

We've been with Staysure for the last couple of years.  Whilst with them we've missed several ports for several reasons:

Weather

Port pilots on strike 

Valencia Marathon!

 

Paid out on each occasion.  Although P & O must have been aware of the Valencia marathon at some point prior to departing Soton, we weren't advised of the change of port call (went to Malaga instead) until embarkation.  Hence the payout.  Presumably, had P&O notified us of the change of port call prior to departure, we wouldn't have been paid.

 

We will be switching to the Nationwide Flex account for next year.  Total annual fee of £156 plus the cruise cover, pre med conditions and an extension for our Worldie, comes in at how much we paid for our Staysure policy last year which only covered travel for up to 60 days.  Also, as others have mentioned, AA cover - cover comparable to my RAC cover (£250 last year!! 😡).  Also, Staysure only payout £75pp for missed port calls.  

 

 

[Son of Anarchy]

50 minutes ago, yorkshirephil said:

There is also the complication of when is a missed port not a missed port, and how will an insurer deal with it. As several ports are now restricting cruise ships for various reasons will insurers pay out, two examples that spring to mind are Amsterdam and Majorca where people were expecting to cruise there but now are not, is that really a missed port in the eyes of an insurer?

 

It would be interesting to know what happened on Arcadia's 2020 Worldie.  If memory serves me right they had over 30 sea days in a row due to we know what.

[yorkshirephil]

50 minutes ago, Son of Anarchy said:

It would be interesting to know what happened on Arcadia's 2020 Worldie.  If memory serves me right they had over 30 sea days in a row due to we know what.

We had friends on that cruise, she said she was happy with here compensation from P&O, she never said how much it was but it paid for a 24 night cruise to Canada in a balcony cabin.

[9265359]

13 hours ago, Selbourne said:

On our recent Britannia cruise we missed a port call (Skagen). It seems that we miss a port on around 1 in every 3 cruises. 

 

I was on the same cruise, and this is the first time ever out of many cruises that I have missed a port. Either I am lucky or I choose cruises where weather isn't an issue.

 

13 hours ago, Selbourne said:

We have an annual travel insurance policy with Aviva, which is excellent value at £166 

 

My insurance is also with Aviva but it is a free policy that comes with the HSBC Premier current account. There are no fees but there is either a minimum income requirement or a minimum amount of investments you need to hold with them.

 

13 hours ago, Selbourne said:

but I am also aware that some of these policies, especially for people with pre-existing medical conditions, can be very expensive. 

 

Yes, I looked at the Nationwide Flexplus account but the cost to add existing medical conditions was exorbitant. Whereas the HSBC account has a long and wide ranging list of medical conditions that are accepted with no additional fee.

 

13 hours ago, Selbourne said:

cruise specific policies provide compensation for missed ports and this is the one thing that our Aviva policy doesn’t cover

 

Same with my Aviva policy - but as it covers any non-recoverable costs for missed ports and I have managed to avoid any missed ports other than this one, then I can live with that.

 

2 hours ago, Selbourne said:

We weren’t particularly bothered about missing Skagen as we had been there before and knew that we wouldn’t have been ashore for much more than an hour.

 

I was disappointed because I have been watching the Danish TV drama 'Seaside Hotel' (streaming on the Channel 4 catch up service All4) that is set just along the coast and where the guests go when they want to go to the 'big town for the nightlife' and wanted to see it!

 

Edited July 28, 2023 by 9265359

[kruzseeka]

2 hours ago, yorkshirephil said:

There is also the complication of when is a missed port not a missed port, and how will an insurer deal with it. As several ports are now restricting cruise ships for various reasons will insurers pay out, two examples that spring to mind are Amsterdam and Majorca where people were expecting to cruise there but now are not, is that really a missed port in the eyes of an insurer?

 

Flexplus would not accept a missed port that was know about before departure for whatever reason - 'operational' or otherwise.  It only kicks in after the cruise has departed but would cover weather, mechanical or operational whether that is down to P&O or the port. 

 

We had a cabin confinement claim last year - 6 days for me and 5 for OH and that was paid @ £150 p.p/ day within days.  Very easy and straight forward on scanning the letters of confirmation from P&O

[elmsliebev]

We took out the cruise cover element (£40 for a year) of our Nationwide Flexplus account last year as we were on Cunard for 29 nights and were more concerned about covid - the confined to cabin element rather than missed ports. As it was, we both had covid and were in the cabin for 6 nights. Nationwide paid up £1800 very quickly, so we booked another cruise! We both have minor medical conditions (a mix of mild asthma, depression, IBS, gout, benign lump) and this year, weren't charged any extra for those conditions. Previously my asthma, gout and lump weren't charged extra but OH was. We've renewed the cruise cover element this year. 

[wakey]

On 7/28/2023 at 8:13 AM, cruising.mark.uk said:

This is what worries me about the 'gift horse' that is missed port insurance payments.  We too have it on our Admiral policy, but have never claimed for it.  It seems to me that missing ports is not a rare occurrence and that many on here who cruise regularly could well find themselves in the same position as you where a missed port claim would result in a payment far above their annual premium.  And that might be the case year after year if people are cruising 50, 60, 70 or more days per year and will, therefore, by the law of averages miss 2 or 3 or 4 ports per year.  The risk is that these payments will become economically non-viable for the insurers and, therefore, that they will do one or more of: removing payments for missed ports altogether or lowering the amount paid; requiring those insured to prove that they are out of pocket because of a missed port (e.g. because they were due to go on a non-ship excursion which has not been refunded); or increasing premiums either for travel insurance in general, for cruise cover as an extra or for missed ports as an extra add on.

 

Personally, I think it would be entirely fair for them to adopt the second of those options and insist that travellers demonstrate that they have made a financial loss because of the missed port and then recompense that loss.  We've never claimed because we've never been in a position where missing a port has 'cost' us anything and would, therefore, feel uneasy about asking for recompense.

 

I would argue taking leave from work,  to achieve a lifetime ambition to visit an area at great cost,  and end up bobbing away on the seas, finding you have missed 70% of your stops in your country of choice does reasonable require compensation.  It is like attending a high end restaurant, being served mcdonalds and getting told that you had a good taxi journey and got fed so why worry!

[cruising.mark.uk]

8 hours ago, wakey said:

I would argue taking leave from work,  to achieve a lifetime ambition to visit an area at great cost,  and end up bobbing away on the seas, finding you have missed 70% of your stops in your country of choice does reasonable require compensation.  It is like attending a high end restaurant, being served mcdonalds and getting told that you had a good taxi journey and got fed so why worry!

You are entitled to your view, but I don't think you are comparing like with like.

What this situation is actually like is having an intent to visit a high-end restaurant, but not a guaranteed reservation, and then bad weather, or mechanical malfunction or a medical emergency preventing you getting there.  My opinion remains that, in such circumstances, if an individual hasn't made a financial loss as a result, no compensation is due, certainly not from the cruise line.  If insurers consider this an insurable risk, as many do, then those who have taken out insurance may be paid.  However, the point I was trying to make in my original post was that insurance payouts for missed ports, while they appear to be good value for the individual cruiser, are probably not tenable in the long-run, because the payout for one missed port will often exceed the insurance premium paid.  I'm no actuary, but it seems to me that's a loophole many insurance companies will seek to address if ports continue to be missed with the regularity that seems to be pretty normal.

[fruitmachine]

58 minutes ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

I'm no actuary, but it seems to me that's a loophole many insurance companies will seek to address if ports continue to be missed with the regularity that seems to be pretty normal.

There is one thing that is certain, and that's that an actuary will have looked at this in detail and they will know exactly what 'normal' is.  They reprice on an ongoing basis, and with almost all policies being no more than a year before renewal, they have already had ample opportunity to react to any change in experience. 

If they were losing money on this, you'd have seen prices rise years ago until they didn't!

[wakey]

15 hours ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

You are entitled to your view, but I don't think you are comparing like with like.

What this situation is actually like is having an intent to visit a high-end restaurant, but not a guaranteed reservation, and then bad weather, or mechanical malfunction or a medical emergency preventing you getting there.  My opinion remains that, in such circumstances, if an individual hasn't made a financial loss as a result, no compensation is due, certainly not from the cruise line.  If insurers consider this an insurable risk, as many do, then those who have taken out insurance may be paid.  However, the point I was trying to make in my original post was that insurance payouts for missed ports, while they appear to be good value for the individual cruiser, are probably not tenable in the long-run, because the payout for one missed port will often exceed the insurance premium paid.  I'm no actuary, but it seems to me that's a loophole many insurance companies will seek to address if ports continue to be missed with the regularity that seems to be pretty normal.

Thanks,  i agree that the cruise line is not liable to pay compensation, they are clear on the no guarantee. However neither should they take unilateral action to 'offer' something which invalidates an insurance claim. That is taking action which directly has a negative impact on their customers.  Interestingly,  i also agree with you that missed port insurance is likely not tenable and maybe should be withdrawn (or redraughted to directly link to losses) , however while it is sold and charged for,  it is not unreasonable to expect to be paid out