Saga Rose Greenland Voyager August 2007

[bcscot]

Referring to the previous discussion on differences in language, years ago I went to Club Med on Bora Bora and one day attended a body painting competition. Contestants were paired off and an American girl had an Australian fellow painting her. There was a time limit imposed and the Australian fellow was doing very well until his partner screamed to him to paint a target on her 'fanny'. This term in Australia has almost the exact diametrically opposed meaning to that in the States and the memory of the look of shock and confusion on the Aussie's face remains with me to this day.

Wayne

 

I had to laugh at that one Wayne. When we moved to Canada, & went skiing, my wife could not believe that what we called a 'bum bag,' was called a 'fanny pack'! She still goes bright red when anyone uses that term.

 

By the way, I think that Ruby is finished her 'saga' now!

 

Graham.

[bcscot]

Ross: Last night I was watching episode one of Brideshead, with the commentary on. The actor who played Anthony Blanche was talking about the different response to celebrities in the States; the British being more reserved while the Americans tend to be more forward.

 

While in America, one lady came up to him & said: 'Are you who I think you are?' He replied: 'Who do you think I am?' Answer: 'Anthony Blanche.' 'Yes,' he replied. She then said: 'Oh gee!....My husband just loves you!' Whereupon he broke into his 'very camp' Anthony Blanche voice & said: 'Wwwwwell my ddddear, you must tttttell your husband to cccccome out of the ccccccloset!' I thought it was brilliant.:D

 

Donald: Thats the one. I am glad you have recorded it. I have asked my wife to record it but her track record with the VCR is not too good! Sounds like it might be an interestng look at QM2.

 

Graham.

[Saga Ruby]

Ruby, I am thoroughly enjoying the report of your trip and look forward to the remaining episodes.Wayne

 

The Saga cruise diary has closed its final chapter. However, I do have an assignment for you in Oz - please work on getting the Daylight Savings time clocks straightened out in your country. It is such a bother with the time change of 30 mins. from Sydney to Brisbane, then the rest of the hour change to Cairns. Onboard Nautica, we changed our clocks in a 90-minute integral at one point in the Indian Ocean - argh!

 

I was in Lisbon a few years ago and had a great day tour with a wonderful driver. As we came back from Sintra, we drove the coastline and yes, I agree that the local "Golden Gate" was quite strange to see out of place, as it were. As we worked our way back to the ship, the various impressive statutes to Portuguese explorers and sailors along the coast made one feel as if one were in a statuary museum.

On that same cruise, we made a stop in the Madeira Islands and I'm a big fan. If memory serves, I discussed this subject in the tangle of earlier posts on this thread - or not. That pedestrian intersection in the heart of the tourist area was a fine place have a drink and to watch the world go by while the locals were quite nice to us tourists.

 

Shot in the dark - has anyone stayed at Reef House in Palm Cove outside of Cairns? I really liked that low-profile, luxury boutique hotel. Has anyone been to Kakadu National Park outside Darwin and done the hike up to the vista? Or eaten one of the ants in the Park?

 

Ruby

[bcscot]

I saw that he, his wife, and children have moved back to England. Was it something we said?

Ruby

 

Ruby: Sometimes your humour puts a little smile on my face & I just chuckle softly all day.

 

...............:) :) :) !

 

Graham.

[Saga Ruby]

While we were viewing Scapa flow in the Orkneys, the guide talked about a subject that completely puzzled me.

 

He said that the steel plates from the scuttled German Navy were much sought after by salvagers because "they were not full of radiation" and that this particular steel was some of the last metal that did not "have radiation in them." What was the guide talking about?

 

He also said that, when a certain signal was given from the German admiral's boat, some ships were scuttled and some "opened their seacocks." Amazingly enough, no German lives were lost, although later on shore seven German sailors were shot to death in a regrettable incident.

 

I'm particularly interested in the "radiation" steel plates. Anyone know about that?

 

Ruby

[Druke I]

I certainly can't help on that "radiation" issue. I have never heard that before, and I have read some about the scuttling of the Imperial Fleet.

 

A more fascinating tale is how the German submarine got into Scapa in WW2, and raised so much havoc.

[CGTNORMANDIE]

GRAHAM!!! TOO FUNNY!!! LOL!!!...Anthony Blanche LOL!!!

 

Ross

[Kapricorn]

He also said that, when a certain signal was given from the German admiral's boat, some ships were scuttled and some "opened their seacocks." Amazingly enough, no German lives were lost, although later on shore seven German sailors were shot to death in a regrettable incident.

Ruby

 

I've heard about the scuttlings at Scapa Flow, but have never read anything about it. Today I checked the Wikipedia article about it, and it said:

 

Fifty-one ships sank with a loss of nine lives, the last casualties of the First World War.

 

The shootings were not mentioned in that article. Does anyone know the details of the shooting incident?

 

Donald.

[bcscot]

Ruby: I know that all living material has a much higher radiation content since the start of the nuclear age, our environment having been contaminated, & they can tell by testing bones if the person lived before or after the 'bomb'. I do not know how this relates to steel, but it may have something to do with it. I recently read an article in the Scots Magazine about the salvage operations at Scapa Flow, so when I get home, I will look it up to see if it says anything on the subject.

 

I have finally finished watching Brideshead & all the special features, so maybe I will 'shut up' about it for a while. Just two last comments though:

 

In the credits for 'Revisiting Brideshead',about the making of the series, they thanked the Henry Ransom Museum, University Of Texas. Do you know anything about this establishment Ruby? I wondered if they might be a source of information on Evelyn Waugh?

 

Ross: If you get the DVD series in time, you could watch it during your Atlantic crossing in November! That would add a little something extra to the transatlantic scenes filmed on the QE2, which were filmed during a storm on the Atlantic!

 

Michael: Not long now till your wonderful sounding trip. When is it that you leave again? Have you started to pack yet? You must be getting busy with preparations.

 

Graham.

[bcscot]

PS- Sorry, I know nothing of the shooting incident, but I will be interested in trying to find out.

 

Graham.

[bcscot]

A more fascinating tale is how the German submarine got into Scapa in WW2, and raised so much havoc.

 

Yes, that is why they built the 'Churchill Barriers', ordered by Churchill to prevent another such incident. Initially they were made of old shipwrecks strung between the islands & later they built causeways that you can drive over.

 

Graham.

[bcscot]

Try: www.worldwar1.co.uk/scuttle.html

 

Not the full story but interesting.

 

Graham.

[Druke I]

We leave for Surrey (Woking) on Thu 9-6-07, spend a week there, then pop over to Prague for a pre-cruise, embark on the river boat (scow) on the 19th, and float down the Danube.

 

Thanks for asking.

 

Yes - I thought it was called the Churchill Barrier. That U-boat Captain (Otto Kretschmer?) was highly decorated for his stunning feat!

 

Although my father was in the British Army in WWI, I am far more interested in (and fascinated by) WW2 history.

[Druke I]

delete - machine hiccuped (duplicate post)

[Saga Ruby]

In the credits for 'Revisiting Brideshead',about the making of the series, they thanked the Henry Ransom Museum, University Of Texas. Do you know anything about this establishment Ruby? I wondered if they might be a source of information on Evelyn Waugh?Graham.

 

The Harry Ransom Library has become world-famous for their holdings in ink, art, and image. I know that occasionally when there are ferocious bidding wars for important art, the Ransom Library puts in the winning bid and whisks the piece off to its holdings of large collections. The Ransom Library has also been the beneficiary of important papers donated by living legends and is the sight of the LBJ Presidential Library. I've often admired how they have "grown the business" into a major force in the world of important historical acquisitions.

 

Graham, I am fascinated with your comments about materials showing radiation after The Bomb. It makes sense. I know that Bikini Atoll is eternally off-limits due to continuing massive radiation present.

 

D'maniac - I agree that more information would be appreciated about the shootings of the German sailors after the sinking of their fleet. Anyone?

 

Ruby

[bcscot]

Yes - I thought it was called the Churchill Barrier. That U-boat Captain (Otto Kretschmer?) was highly decorated for his stunning feat!

 

Gunther Prien, commander of U47, entered Scapa Flow on the night of October 13th 1939, six weeks into WWII, & sank HMS Royal Oak, a 29,000 ton Dreadnought, with the loss of 833 men.

 

Graham.

[Druke I]

Thanks for the correction on the name of the sub captain.

 

Nonetheless, it was a stunning feat, much heralded at the time by the German High Command.

[bcscot]

On 20th February 1941, Gunther Prien was killed when U-47 was sunk. Initially thought to have been sunk by HMS Wolverine, it is now speculated that U-47 was possibly sunk by one of her own circling torpedoes.This would be his second direct hit on a warship, all the others being defenceless merchant vessels. Not such a successful target for the U-boat ace!

 

Graham.

[Conte Di Savoia]

Report from Invergordon

Trip thus far has been fantastic. Saga Rose is in excellent condition. Food and service are, by and large, first rate. Weather, Ruby, has been ideal, sunny and cool for great touring and calm seas.

The latest rumors are that the ship will probably not become razor blades or paper clips after 2010. There are possible offers from Panamanian and Central American interests as well as the Chinese who might want to use her in the Far East. There is also speculation that a buyer might actually invest the money to bring her up to Solas 2010 standards. More to follow.

Conte

[Kapricorn]

Conte, that's great that you are enjoying yourself so far on the Saga Rose!

 

Michael, have a great time on the Danube!

 

There is a book published April 2007, "Grand Scuttle: Sinking of the German Fleet at Scapa Flow in 1919", written by Daniel Allen van der Vat. It surely would include an explanation of the shootings of nine Germans. I went to Chapters book store today, but it is not in stock. Sometime this week I will go to a used book store a few blocks from my home and see if there is a copy.

 

Donald.

[bcscot]

Eight ships of the German High Seas Fleet remain on the bottom of Scapa Flow.These ships constitute the world's largest & best reserve of non-radioactive steel. Since the metal that was used in the construction of these ships was forged before the advent of the nuclear age & has been sheltered by its watery grave, it does not contain radioactive isotopes. This is important in the construction of deep space probes & other sensitive mechanisms. Parts of the Kaiser's High Seas Fleet exist today in outer space!

 

Graham.

[bcscot]

Of the 74 German ships, 53 were sunk (400,000 tons worth), 17 were beached & 4 were saved undamaged (torpedo boats that did not have sea valves to open). Fast acting tugs managed to pull some of the ships to shallow water. Royal Navy & Royal Marine boarding parties tried to stop some of the other ships being scuttled. The crews attempted to stop their ships being boarded & in the ensuing action & confusion, 9 German sailors were killed & 8 wounded.

 

That is the most detailed account I can find. Some say there are 8 ships still down there & some say 7.

 

Graham.

[Saga Ruby]

Eight ships of the German High Seas Fleet remain on the bottom of Scapa Flow.These ships constitute the world's largest & best reserve of non-radioactive steel. Since the metal that was used in the construction of these ships was forged before the advent of the nuclear age & has been sheltered by its watery grave, it does not contain radioactive isotopes. This is important in the construction of deep space probes & other sensitive mechanisms. Parts of the Kaiser's High Seas Fleet exist today in outer space!Graham.

 

Graham - Thanks so much for this information. On the bus at Scapa Flow, I was having trouble understanding which war was which as the Flow played a part in WWI and WWII. One minute we were hearing about WWI, then the next words I heard were "Churchill Barriers" and I started wandering in the weeds.

 

And I didn't understand the guide's comment about the steel being so desirable as nonradioactive until you came up with this fine information.

 

My mind was ricocheting around like a pachinko ball and now the fog has lifted. Thanks.

 

Ruby

[bcscot]

Very interesting that Saga Ruby may not be scrapped. That would be wonderful if she found a good home. Does SOLAS not apply to the Chinese or the South Americans? To whom does it apply? Shame that she cannot just stay with Saga though.

 

I am glad to hear that Conte is having some decent weather in my native land. Today I am off on one of my regular 'crossings'. Oh, the excitement! No time to watch Brideshead on this one though Ross!

 

Graham.

[Saga Ruby]

Report from Invergordon. Trip thus far has been fantastic. Saga Rose is in excellent condition. Food and service are, by and large, first rate. Weather, Ruby, has been ideal, sunny and cool for great touring and calm seas.

 

The latest rumors are that the ship will probably not become razor blades or paper clips after 2010. There are possible offers from Panamanian and Central American interests as well as the Chinese who might want to use her in the Far East. There is also speculation that a buyer might actually invest the money to bring her up to Solas 2010 standards. More to follow.

Conte

 

I am on tenterhooks awaiting your return so we can discuss all things Saga. Thanks for passing along the current gossip about this ship. The rumours swirl round and round, the question is, "Whither goest?" for Saga Rose. I think only time will tell.

 

Needless to say, I'm thrilled to hear that the weather has been in your favour. We are holding a Reserved seat for you at the Admiral's Table on the Nostalgia Cruise and await your return.

 

All the best,

Ruby