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Is tipping getting out of hand??


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The Cruise lines could end it all to tips, and have Buffet style in the dining rooms, sheets supplied for the entire week in cabin with a vacumm (henry one of course) icon7.gif, no pool servers or any drink servers in showrooms, etc. as far as that goes, (get um yourself at the bar and if you wanna tip the bartender so be it). That would elimate much of the personnell on the ship that have these tipping jobs, and the pax can waste their time doing the extra's on the ship with no LUXURY's! icon10.gif

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I wasn't going to post on this thread. I got blasted by someone on another thread because of my views, but -----here I go.

 

I think RCCL should add tips to the cruise price. Not say they are tips, just raise the price. Make the line no tipping. If people want to complain about a waiter/cabin steward etc. they can do so and his/her salary will be reduced. The money from the reductions can be used to give the ones with the best reviews by passengers get to divide the losses. It would be important for everyone to fill out the comment cards as many times I have seen "rewards" given to people who filled them out.

 

This would solve the problem of people who don't want to/can't afford to/etc.

See, this is where I know I will be flamed. I am an overweight old lady, and they sell 2 piece bathing suits in my size,. Just because they make them, doesn't mean I should buy them. That analogy goes along with, just because you can afford to cruise, doesn't mean you should. OK, I am ready-- please be gentle.

 

Anyway, enjoy your cruise and do what you feel is best.

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I don't care how people tip.....as long as they do it. You know before your cruise who you have to tip. To stiff them is just disgusting.

 

However, getting away from the people we know we have to tip prior to going on a cruise.......

 

My problem is the people RCI has working for them on Labadee. I understand the economic situation of the locals, but I wish RCI would pay them a decent salary so the guys helping me park my jet-ski don't make me feel like I have to tip them. I'm not one to take cash on a jet-ski excursion on a private island. Heck, last time I didn't even take cash ashore.

 

This goes for the guys who insist on setting up your chairs also. This is where tipping gets out of hand. I don't want to feel as though I need to throw cash at every employee who hassles me......when I never asked for their help to begin with.

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I wasn't going to post on this thread. I got blasted by someone on another thread because of my views, but -----here I go.

 

I think RCCL should add tips to the cruise price. Not say they are tips, just raise the price. Make the line no tipping. If people want to complain about a waiter/cabin steward etc. they can do so and his/her salary will be reduced. The money from the reductions can be used to give the ones with the best reviews by passengers get to divide the losses. It would be important for everyone to fill out the comment cards as many times I have seen "rewards" given to people who filled them out.

 

This would solve the problem of people who don't want to/can't afford to/etc.

See, this is where I know I will be flamed. I am an overweight old lady, and they sell 2 piece bathing suits in my size,. Just because they make them, doesn't mean I should buy them. That analogy goes along with, just because you can afford to cruise, doesn't mean you should. OK, I am ready-- please be gentle.

 

Anyway, enjoy your cruise and do what you feel is best.

 

I agree partly. I don´t want to see them going no tipping, as I believe it´s not improving the service, however I would like them to raise the cruise fare by the recommended tip and pay a decent salary to the service crew. From there we can start of with real tipping for above and beyond service instead of "tipping" to pay the salary of the service crew.

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The more cruises I've been on--the higher I tip----

 

if anyone doubts the value to the service rendered-----spend a sunday morning getting breakfast at any IHOP---then stiff the waitress and see if you get out of the building without wearing the coffee pot

 

cruise staff earn their tips and then some

 

jmho

Paul

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Being married to someone that works on the ships, I can tell you they also work on average 70 hrs per week. are away from home for at least 5 months at a time, sometimes longer, do not get days off until the end of their contract, do not get paid vacation, have to buy their own plane ticket to work, and on most of the International flagged ships make a whopping 50 dollars a week and some only make 50 a month. They also have to pay to have their cabins cleaned, and after they get off from working from early morning to late at night, if they have an inspection the next day, they have to get that area into order, meaning they might have to work the rest of the night for a morning inspection. They do not make extra for overtime on most lines, they do not get benefits and so many other things.

 

Now my husband used to work for RCI but now is with NCLA, and he makes much better but it is a US flagged ship so he gets OT after 40 hrs a week. He does not make a lot in tips, because tipping is put on your account at the end of the week and they use that to pay their salaries. He is union, so has to pay union dues, he also has to pay for his shoes and many other things.

 

I never begrudge anyone their tips because I know how hard they work. I know what they go thru daily and think they earn every dime. I also do not tip extra at the beginning of the week, never needed to. I get extra service without doing so because I treat them well, so they do the same for me. At the end of the week, I usually give more than the minimum. I also usually tip 20 percent when I go out locally.

 

I know this is a hot topic on here, but I live the other side. I have seen the paychecks without any tips, and am glad he is on a US flagged ship for now. It makes a big difference. He still gets tipped but he is good at what he does.

 

Another thing to remember about the cabin stewards, is first, they have an assistant they share the money with, also with all on the ship, believe it or not, there are many folks that do not tip. It happens more than you know.

 

One more thing, based on the numbers given

 

175 per day - lets say they give 75 of that to their assistant. That now makes 100 a day right?

 

so take 100 a day and figure they work 7 days, so 700 a week, with an average of 70 hours a week, is only 10 dollars an hour, since they do not get OT pay.

 

A lot of these folks are supporting families back home, some are just saving to buy a house, or go to college, or start a business, and some are doing it just to work, because back home, things are not that good.

 

My husband is from Turkey, he just got back from a few weeks visit, the average beer in a club cost 12 dollars US, equiv. he was telling me. He filled the car up 4 times, 150 dollars, 175 dollars, etc, US equiv. So really if someone is from Turkey, working on one of these ships, making 700 a week, it wont go far back home but yes it is better than they would make there.

 

I know it is a different story for each person working on the ships but I would not do some of those jobs for what they make and have to depend on people tipping me to live. I admire them for what they do, because they make my vacation so much nicer.

 

You know, I understand what you're trying to say, but I also cannot stand this logic. Your husband, and others, have chosen this line of work. Everyone has job-related expenses. I pay $120 in gas a week to commute - I'm sure every single person here can list what they pay and what benefits they get or don't get, etc., etc. A tip is just that - a tip. It is supposed to be something extra as a show of gratitude for services renderred. Now it is just expected and THAT is what, in my opinion, the other poster has a problem with.

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The quality of service would deteriorate under your system...

 

Tipping is a business model that works well in the service industry... it ties the earning power of the employee to the level of service they produce... The product of the service industry is service... the best way to insure good service and to encourage over-the-top service is to use the tipping method... A flat wage given to service industry employees guarantees a certain level of service - average...

 

Think about it this way... You are a waiter who makes a flat wage, say $500 per week... Where is your incentive to go above and beyond??

 

This business model has worked for eons...

 

I would venture to say that those who object to the tipping model or simply refuse to tip, are people who have never done this sort of work for a living before... I have always believed that teenagers and young adults should spend some time in the service industry... it builds character and teaches you how to behave in a civilized society...

 

Those of us who serve for a living see some of the worst that humanity has to offer...

Amen!!

The best tippers I know are former waiters/waitresses. Personally, I get a lot of satisfaction out of presenting an envelope with a good tip to someone who's added significantly to my cruise experience.

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You know, I understand what you're trying to say, but I also cannot stand this logic. Your husband, and others, have chosen this line of work. Everyone has job-related expenses. I pay $120 in gas a week to commute - I'm sure every single person here can list what they pay and what benefits they get or don't get, etc., etc. A tip is just that - a tip. It is supposed to be something extra as a show of gratitude for services renderred. Now it is just expected and THAT is what, in my opinion, the other poster has a problem with.

 

 

I think your reasoning is flawed. You work for a wage, a server or cabin attendant onboard a ship works for tips. Even in the US, food servers work for tips, definitely not their wages (which is far less than minimum wage, by the way). A tip for a server or attendant is not extra, it is the reason they are working onboard a ship.

 

If you think the ship is paying them a living wage, try working it out, 70 hours per week, $50 per month, that would come to around 17 cents an hour.

 

While I understand many peoples thought that these people should be paid a living wage and it should be tacked onto the cruise fare, I think that would be lovely. Then I could tip as a gift, given in the true spirit of a gratuity or gift.

 

I have absolutely no idea how anyone can justify not tipping these people. Can you imagine breaking your back all week and your employer not paying you? Or, paying you 17 cents an hour? That it is not included in the cruise fare is traditional, nothing new. The only difference is that you are paying it out of your pocket directly to the person, rather than it being tacked onto your account onboard. Although, that is now a possibility, along with pre-paying along with your booking.

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But then this theory should go with ALL jobs. I am a teacher and make a flat rate. Why should I stay after and help my students? I do because I care and that's MY job. What about a nurse? An auto mechanic? You do a good job because it's YOUR job.

If the cruise fare was raised and they all made a higher flat rate, they should, like everyone else, do their best job.

 

that's a nice theory but the service industry is a different type of job than being a teacher in SEVERAL ways... they are similar in a few ways but very different...

 

1.)A teacher's job does not involve a monetary profit, a server's employer expects their business to profit and a server's primary job is to increase sales in order for the business to be profitable...

 

2.)Serving the public in such a personal fashion is NOT easy work and believe me, you see some really crappy stuff... Teachers see crappy stuff too, don't get me wrong... But when you are talking about serving people with regards to feeding, personal image, hygiene... WOW!!! Each individual has a different standard of service and level of maintenance...

 

3.)Tipping is the best motivational tool out there for the service industry... It does exactly what business owners want it to do... It ties the earning power of the server to their service performance... Business owners want people to serve customers in such a way that the business will profit and grow... There is a vast difference in the service you receive from a flat-wage-paid server and someone who is working for tips...

 

Think about it... Where is the incentive for your steward to go above and beyond for you unless they are going to receive something in return??? It is a job and they are there to make a living... Yes, they care about what they do, but if they were getting paid the same salary no matter what service they deliver.... well, that's how you end up with average employees instead of the ones you want - the ones who will go above and beyond...

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I believe the suggested amount is entirely appropriate, but like so many others, I'd appreciate a more streamlined system, and not just for cruising. The way I see it, a McDonald's employee is supposed to give me good service without a tip, and so should a waitress. I'd love to see service personel getting paid a fair wage and tipping being phased out. Isn't that how it's done in Europe?

 

Most people who serve for a living do so because the money is good... Heck, I know servers who are pulling down 6 figures... A fellow server friend of mine left his chemical engineering job because he was making better money waiting tables!!

 

Yes, a McDonald's employee should give you good counter service... I have yet to find a McDonald's where I can sit down and be served... I sure as heck haven't found one where an employee places my napkin on my lap.

 

The service standard in Europe is much different... Very, very few Americans would be able to tolerate it... Americans are self-centered, loud, and rude in a way that no other culture can compare to... we are much more demanding and high maintenance...

 

Tipping is about business folks, it's about making money... Cruiselines are in business to make money... If you don't like their business model, rent a condo somewhere and do all the cooking, serving, and cleaning yourself!

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Americans are self-centered, loud, and rude in a way that no other culture can compare to... we are much more demanding and high maintenance...

 

I am an American. How can you say this propaganda?? It is my way or no way. what is wrong with that. I pay taxes and so it will be all about me. DO YOU HEAR ME?? AGAIN DO YOU HEAR ME? So take your comments and put it where the sun don't shine baby!!

Just kidding!!:p

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Amen!!

The best tippers I know are former waiters/waitresses. Personally, I get a lot of satisfaction out of presenting an envelope with a good tip to someone who's added significantly to my cruise experience.

 

Good point!!

 

Our youngest son finally converted my DH to full tipping. He was always cheap and complaining about it until our son became a busboy and shamed him into tipping more. Now, he's much better.

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I just wanted to say that I see both sides of this. I DEFINITELY think that tipping is a must and they deserve it, I used to serve at a restaurant so I know what it's like "behind the scenes" in a sense.

 

But as a previous poster said I think, it does ruin it when someone you're giving a tip complains about the amount.

 

I went on the Majesty last month with my Aunt and cousin and my Aunt took care of all the tips. Our stateroom attendant had been very nice throughout our cruise and she did a great job. Well when my aunt was giving her the tip I guess she read the recommended tip amount wrong and she gave her a little bit less than what RCCL recommends. The stateroom attendent came back up to me and my cousin (my aunt was in her room) after looking at the amount asking where the rest of it and saying it wasn't enough was but me or my cousin didn't know my aunt had made this mistake so we must have just looked confused. She then stormed off into the next room. When we told my aunt what happened she realized she made a mistake and of course gave her the additional money that she had deserved throughout the trip, but it just seemed kind of weird.

 

I totally understand they are working hard for their tips and I usually tip above the recommendation as many of you do as well, but for her to come back basically yelling at us while other passengers walked by didn't seem appropriate at all. It made it feel like her whole persona through the week was just fake to get our money.

 

Anyways, I just wanted to share my experience for those who haven't had situations like this. Please don't flame me! :p

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I just wanted to say that I see both sides of this. I DEFINITELY think that tipping is a must and they deserve it, I used to serve at a restaurant so I know what it's like "behind the scenes" in a sense.

 

But as a previous poster said I think, it does ruin it when someone you're giving a tip complains about the amount.

 

I went on the Majesty last month with my Aunt and cousin and my Aunt took care of all the tips. Our stateroom attendant had been very nice throughout our cruise and she did a great job. Well when my aunt was giving her the tip I guess she read the recommended tip amount wrong and she gave her a little bit less than what RCCL recommends. The stateroom attendent came back up to me and my cousin (my aunt was in her room) after looking at the amount asking where the rest of it and saying it wasn't enough was but me or my cousin didn't know my aunt had made this mistake so we must have just looked confused. She then stormed off into the next room. When we told my aunt what happened she realized she made a mistake and of course gave her the additional money that she had deserved throughout the trip, but it just seemed kind of weird.

 

Asking for a higher tip? Sorry. Even if I had meant to give a higher tip in the first place, and had made an error in my calculations, this behavior would have prompted me NOT to correct the mistake.

It would have been different if she had come to you and said, "I thought I gave you good service this cruise. Did you mean to give me this amount, or was it a mistake?" In that case, I would have corrected the error.

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Asking for a higher tip? Sorry. Even if I had meant to give a higher tip in the first place, and had made an error in my calculations, this behavior would have prompted me NOT to correct the mistake.

It would have been different if she had come to you and said, "I thought I gave you good service this cruise. Did you mean to give me this amount, or was it a mistake?" In that case, I would have corrected the error.

Ditto!!

 

BTW, did you see the fireworks in Narberth? A little wet, but they were still good.:)

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This (and other) tipping threads reminds me of an incident that happened to my DD a while back.

 

She was working at a clothing store that is named after a very well known, very expensive clothing designer, and of course only sells that designers clothing.

 

One day a middle aged gentleman came in and was looking at all kinds of clothing for his daughter who was suposedly the same age as my DD and about her same size.

 

Whats a middle aged guy know about young girl tastes and fashions? So he asked her a million questions about all kinds of outfits . DD was very patient and answered all his questions and helped him the best she could.

 

in the end he bought $5000 worth of clothing (of which DD gets a commision) and as he left he handed her a $100 bill and said thank you for being so helpful.

 

DD said she couldn't take it , it was her job to be helpful, and it was against store policy to take tips.

 

The gentleman told her "Sweetheart, (insert famous designers name ) has no qualms for having the balls to charge $700 for a dress made out of $20 worth of fabric, and paying nice girls like you peanuts to sell the stuff with a straight face. You should have no qualms about taking a little something extra for going out of your way to help a customer"

 

She took it :)

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Thinking on it, 25 does seem to be a bit high. That would be 50 passengers, assuming double occupancy (more if 3 or 4 in the cabin). On our last cruise, our dining room waiter handled 3 tables with 16 passengers (our table of 8 and 2 tables of 4--assuming all were full) times two seatings would be 32 passengers. Since the cabin steward and waiter have the same tip recomendation, I would assume that they probably serve the same number of passengers. So a cabin steward probably services more like 15 or 16 cabins per cruise, rather than 25 to 30. That seems more reasonable. At $3.50 per person per day, that would be $112 per day (at 16 cabins double occupancy) or $784 per week or about $26,000 per year (assuming they only work 8 months out of the year), most of which is probably sent home to family. Now $26,000 per year is not enough for most Americans to quit their day jobs and go work on a cruise line (especially under the conditions that these crew members put up with), but in a lot of these other countries (especially in the 3rd world) that is a lot of money. Now added to that would be any base pay these crew members receive from the cruise line. And not to mention when they started working, they made even less than that.

 

These numbers look pretty accurate, based on my observations. However, you must deduct from these totals for those "people" who stiff the crew and leave no tips...(there are a few here on CC who are quite proud about that.)

 

LL

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This (and other) tipping threads reminds me of an incident that happened to my DD a while back.

 

She was working at a clothing store that is named after a very well known, very expensive clothing designer, and of course only sells that designers clothing.

 

One day a middle aged gentleman came in and was looking at all kinds of clothing for his daughter who was suposedly the same age as my DD and about her same size.

 

Whats a middle aged guy know about young girl tastes and fashions? So he asked her a million questions about all kinds of outfits . DD was very patient and answered all his questions and helped him the best she could.

 

in the end he bought $5000 worth of clothing (of which DD gets a commision) and as he left he handed her a $100 bill and said thank you for being so helpful.

 

DD said she couldn't take it , it was her job to be helpful, and it was against store policy to take tips.

 

The gentleman told her "Sweetheart, (insert famous designers name ) has no qualms for having the balls to charge $700 for a dress made out of $20 worth of fabric, and paying nice girls like you peanuts to sell the stuff with a straight face. You should have no qualms about taking a little something extra for going out of your way to help a customer"

 

She took it :)

 

thanks for sharing that..........great story.........:)

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I'd rather pay extra money in the price of the cruise then have tips added to the sail and sign card at the end of the trip.

Not me, when I was on NCL where the tips are added to your seapass, service was awful!

 

We tipped more than $10 at dinner last night, and that was just for dinner. So I think the guidelines are a bargain. But this is NY we are generous, I have been to some smaller towns where I was told by another patron not to leave 15% " we do not want them to get used to it". So I then left :p 20%

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This all reminds me of a conversation I had with someone today. I am in Real estate and do not usually take out people who are looking for rentals, but that is because it takes as much time as someone buying a house, and in the end I get less than a few dollars. With the cost of gas and advertising I do plus the fact as an independant contractor, I pay my own taxes and Social security, I would not walk away with more than dinner money.

But a friend asked about some apartments advertised by in the RE listings. So I thought I would do her a favor. She then went on to tell me that in no way was she going to pay a RE fee. I told her it was not up to me, the company had the agreement with the owner. She said I am not going to pay you, you are my friend and should do it for free. I was taken aback, but I told her, well even if I rebated my portion, the rest of the fee goes to the agency and in reality, I would have only gotten get 1/8 of that ( I work with a partner and we split 50/50 on everything). So she said they do not have to know...sure I am going to lose my license over that.

 

And to add insult to injury she lives 20 miles away and I would have to go and pick her up and bring her back after each outing. So some people are just cheap and do not see that they are not owed everything from everybody.

 

There are fees in everything, look at your phone bill, what about the surcharges? just because you look at the total amount does not mean you are not paying it. The same goes with a cruise, but the sad thing is service does suffer when it is prepaid, like on NCL.

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Ditto!!

 

BTW, did you see the fireworks in Narberth? A little wet, but they were still good.:)

My son and his friends went, and said that there were far fewer people than usual.

 

Have you moved out in my direction?????

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.....Someone else's post on this thread. I really don't have the time to read the whole thing. We disagree with RCI's policy of including tips in your Seapass. We tipped generously on our recent Navigator cruise. We knew that we would not be eating in the main dining room prior to cruising and told Guest Relations at the start of the cruise. We tipped our Steward (well over the suggested rate) and also tipped the greeters in the Windjammer together with our favourite bar tenders. All of these excellent ambassadors for RCI thanked us profusely and explained that they are normally ignored when it comes to tipping.

 

Also, our friends had their 14 year-old son with them and he was about to be charged, despite the fact that he shared a suite with his Mum and Stepfather.

 

I believe that all newbies should be aware that unless you sign a form specifically stating that you would prefer to make your own tipping arrangements, the suggested rates will be added to your Seapass account. I'm sure that in many instances this leads to double-charging.

 

Alan

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