How exactly DO you luxe up a mass-market cruise?

[Oceans&Rivers]

LeeAnn, I am really looking forward to your review about your upcoming cruise on Crystal. I hope that you will feel free to give an honest review. You usually (so it seems to me) make comments pro and con and that is what I'd like to read. We cruised on Crystal last autumn and had a very nice cruise, so we made an onboard booking for 2009 and 2010, with cruises to be chosen later.

 

Because Crystal did not extend the "Save Now, Save Later" program to North American cruises, we will probably not cruise Crystal this year. We simply aren't interested in flying to Europe or South America this year, and unless there are some further incentives beyond those that are offered for Canada New England, we'll just wait for 2010 to take advantage of the Birthday promotion, and we are interested in some other itineraries in 2010.

 

We have also been hoping to read that the Avenue Saloon on Crystal has become non-smoking, but no word on that yet. It was a topic of discussion last year, and most seemed to want this, too. I know that you also enjoy smoke-free areas, and I hope you can let someone at Crystal know that is important to you. :)

 

We were actually toying with the idea of going back to Celebrity for their Canada New England itinerary which seems more interesting to us with the two days in Québec City than two days in Boston (Crystal's itinerary). The cruise (in CC class) is certainly much less expensive than Crystal. However, I have been reading about some changes at Celebrity that are very dismaying.

 

Ah....decisions, decisions.

[Leejnd4]

Ancientmariner - I agree that Crystal's As You Wish promotion is a win-win. We get to live lavishly on our cruise, and they are assured we'll spend all of it on board. The funny part is, if it wasn't for the fact that we wanted to take their day-trip to Moscow (which is $1000 each), I'm not sure we could have even come up with a way to spend that $2000 OBC! We're already getting several hundred OBC from our TA (on top of all gratuities covered), as well as a $500 OBC for Crystal's Share the Experience program. That's close to $3000 of OBC! Considering we don't normally even take the ship's shore excursions, preferring to do private tours, that's a heckuva lot of money to try to spend on board. If it wasn't for the Moscow shore excursion (which we wouldn't try to do independently), we'd be having daily massages and buying nightly bottles of Dom Perignon to spend it! :D And of course, it works in Crystal's favor - instead of having the money come off the top, it only costs them their cost of the service/product.

 

I also think that it might spur participation in their Vintage Room experience. This is a special dining venue in which you choose an array of fine wines from their exclusive Reserve Wine List, then the executive chef creates a gourmet multi-course dinner to complement the wines, for a cost of $210 pp. Normally we wouldn't consider spending this much money on a special dinner, given that the dining on Crystal is supposed to already be so sublime. But with the $500 STEX OBC, we consider that sort of like "found" money, and so we're going to blow it on something extraordinary. I suspect that use of the Vintage Room will increase as pax are looking for memorable ways to spend their As You Wish money.

 

O&R, Celebrity was the ONLY mass-market line I was contemplating. Unfortunately, as you point out, the recent posts and reviews I've read indicate they no longer have the edge that I thought they had...they are really no different from the other lines. And I'm particularly concerned about their newest Solstice-class ships. They planned these ships back when things were flush. They're not so flush now...and the cutbacks seem to be drastically affecting the passenger experience. And the ship we were booked on, Equinox, hasn't even been finished yet. Most of its build time has fallen after the economic slow-down, which leaves me believing that they had to have made some additional cutbacks in the construction of that ship, as opposed to its earlier sister Solstice, which was built mostly before the recession hit. I have no facts to back up these opinions...these are just assumptions. But as I pointed out earlier, I cruise so rarely that I'm just not willing to chance a sub-standard experience.

 

Thanks for your kind words about my reviews. (You must have read some earlier ones of mine?) I will definitely write a review for this cruise. There are so few for this ship, and none that are very recent! As a first-time Crystal cruiser, I hope to have something of value to offer others contemplating trying out this cruise line.

[Keith1010]

LeeAnn, you have this right. First, you are right. The on board credits are a win win for everyone. The passaengers get lots of credits and the money is spent on board the ship. And, really the concept is that you can spend the money as you want. So, for those who like to drink there is more than enough money so that they feel that the drinks are all inclusive plus they will have money to use for other things. You gave a great example; The Vintage Room. At the same time others might rather use the money for the Internet or maybe for some on board shopping, or maybe for some additional tips or whatever they so choose. My analogy is that with our travel consortium they give us a credit and on the world cruise a very large credit. Their philosophy is that their clients know best what they want. There are other consortiums who give a smaller credit and on the world cruise give a compimentary all day excursion with lunch. There are many who like the latter. For us we would rather pass on that and have the credit to do as we please.

 

In many ways it's fun to have more credit than we believe we know what to do with.

 

Keith

[Leejnd4]

Keith, my TA also offered us a free shore excursion from the travel consortium, for our port stop in Helsinki. Fortunately they also offered us the option of an OBC instead. We opted for the OBC, because everything we've read about Helsinki says that it's a port that we can comfortably do on our own. So that was another OBC! Yup, it's LOTS of fun to have more OBC then we know what to do with! :D

[Oceans&Rivers]

O&R, Celebrity was the ONLY mass-market line I was contemplating. Unfortunately, as you point out, the recent posts and reviews I've read indicate they no longer have the edge that I thought they had...they are really no different from the other lines. And I'm particularly concerned about their newest Solstice-class ships. They planned these ships back when things were flush. They're not so flush now...and the cutbacks seem to be drastically affecting the passenger experience. And the ship we were booked on, Equinox, hasn't even been finished yet. Most of its build time has fallen after the economic slow-down, which leaves me believing that they had to have made some additional cutbacks in the construction of that ship, as opposed to its earlier sister Solstice, which was built mostly before the recession hit. I have no facts to back up these opinions...these are just assumptions. But as I pointed out earlier, I cruise so rarely that I'm just not willing to chance a sub-standard experience.

 

Thanks for your kind words about my reviews. (You must have read some earlier ones of mine?) I will definitely write a review for this cruise. There are so few for this ship, and none that are very recent! As a first-time Crystal cruiser, I hope to have something of value to offer others contemplating trying out this cruise line.

 

Yes, one review I remember was about Windstar, which I re-read recently. I like the way you organized your review. I was looking at some shorter cruises that we might add before or after a Crystal cruise that we are considering, and interesting Windstar itineraries popped up several times so that's how I found your review again. The problem is that the clothing requirements between Crystal and Windstar are so different and now that Crystal has a more favorable smoking policy than it used to have (not good enough yet, though!) that Windstar looks even worse. Still, the allure of a porthole cabin...

 

Our very first cruise we had a porthole cabin and my husband often says how he misses being down lower near the water where you can hear the laps against the side of the ship.

 

So, in a few months we'll get to read your review of the Symphony. I'm looking forward to it! :)

[ancientmariner]

LeeAnn,

 

I'd hate you to have more OBC than you know what to do with. Might I suggest you gift wrap it and leave it with reception with my name on it "to await collection in December"? I don't get one extra $ from my Travel Agent; it doesn't seem to be the norm in the UK as it is for you. Consequently, a Crystal cruise is a rare luxury for me, as wine, internet, and excursions all add to the initial cost.

 

Enjoy the Baltic; it's one of my favourite cruises and, as you say, easy to do independently.

 

Trudi

[Leejnd4]

Trudi, I'll tell ya, I really think Crystal is onto something with this free OBC thing. I spoke to a gentleman on the phone yesterday who is on our cruise (we connected through our roll call thread) who is currently planning what to do in each port stop. When I mentioned all of the private tour plans we've made, he said he wasn't even going to consider using private tour ops, because he's got more OBC than he's afraid he can spend! So in ports where usually a large percentage of pax do things independently, his party (and probably lots of others) are going with Crystal.

 

Some might think this is disingenuous of Crystal, since they're basically giving away their services. But on the other hand, they really haven't reduced their prices...at least not in comparison to other cruise lines. Contrast this approach with the other lines: many are are drastically reducing prices, which means less money coming in...while their budget-conscious pax are still booking private tours. Crystal has the same revenue coming in, but are having to do more for it. With Crystal's approach, their pax are happier, feel more pampered, and become more loyal to the line. And things like tips for shorex's go to Crystal's people, rather than private tour ops.

 

I'm just blathering here, but in my opinion, Crystal seems to have the better solution for weathering these tight times. :)

[Keith1010]

Leeann, you are again correct. I do think they have come up with an excellent approach on this one. In addition, I think they wanted to do something that would work for everyone and one that would differentiate themselves from the other lines.

 

One other thing for someone who might have extra money from all these credits. It's not available in all ports but on the first day or so of your embarkation you can talk with the shore excursion desk to see if there are any private tours available. In some ports Crystal can arrange private tours with the same tour operators that do the other excursions. The good thing about these is just like the ships tour if the private one is running late the ship will wait. Some private tours include just a driver, others a driver who is also is the tour guide and some will include a tour guide and a driver. You can customize some of these and the added benefit is since you are booking this through Crystal you can use your on board credit for this as well. I'm not saying it's the right one for everyone but if someone had a lot of credit and didn't want to use it for other things this is another good one to look at.

 

Keith

[Leejnd4]

Keith, that's exactly what Barry (the gentleman I spoke to yesterday) is planning for Berlin. He is averse to cruise-line bus tours (as am I). But he's got all this OBC to spend, so he doesn't want to book a private tour, which would be cash out of pocket. Instead, He's talking to Crystal about using their private-guide program, wherein he will take the Crystal bus to Berlin - not the tour, but just the round-trip bus transport. There he'll be met by a private guide with a car arranged by Crystal, to give a fully private tour, which will end at the bus depot for the return via Crystal's bus to the ship.

 

We'd planned on getting a rental car and doing our own thing at that port, but now we're reconsidering joining him, which will bring the per-person price down. And I can tell you that none of us would even consider doing this if it wasn't for the As You Wish OBC.

[ancientmariner]

You guys are determined to rub salt in my wounds. Have you got any pull with the Crystal management?

 

Trudi

[nancygp]

Leeanne, I totally agree with you on Crystal's approach with the generous shipboard credits. I feel it's a win-win for Crystal and us passengers.

 

I'm so delighted that you are going to sail on Crystal. I know you and your mom will have a wonderful cruise.

 

Nancy

[Suncoast Gal]

Leejnd4, I say whatever "floats your boat" is what you should go for. Hubby and I have had sailed quite a few lines and all have had ups/downs. We can't afford the luxury lines due to our limited income as 'county employees' but have worked long enough to not be in any kind of steerage!!!!!!!! I agree it's what you make it. Princess' food/service has dropped since being bought by Carnival but I think we still cruise w/them as we still enjoy certain aspects. I love the Promenade and activities on RCCL but it has become too big and commercial for us. Chops was outstanding. We went to Celebrity and LOVED it up until Solstice in 1/09. Beautiful ship, great staterooms w/wonderful bathroom w/nite lites, quiet, but very disappointed in the MDR food/service this time which was disappointing for X. We won't give up yet and will pony up now to try X Aqua class 9/4/10 to Spanish Med. I've even had friends go on Carnival with pics/stories of a cruise much better than they thought after being with RCCL/Princess. So I just think the bottom line is cruising is so 'subjective' according to what your wants/needs are. All you can do is go for it and find your niche on that particular cruise that helps w/your next cruise destination decision. Our bottom line is we cruise so much out of FL where we live just being on a ship is heaven. We are now branching out to experience more world ports as much as we can afford! With the expense it's either a couple of cruises out of FL or one big one out of the country. You don't know until you do it...and whatever you choose will give you more insight for future cruise decisions...Good Luck to you and Mom and have a great cruise...:)

[editor@cruisecritic]

Hi, LeeAnn, this is a fascinating question and I hope you don't mind if I jump in because I'm actually working on a feature for Cruise Critic on how to luxe up a mass market ship!

 

There are three different approaches in big ship cruising toward the higher end of the market (suite-dwellers and such). One is, similar to Princess, Celebrity and Holland America, to basically give you the cabin and a few extra bells and whistles, but not much else.

 

There's the Azamara/Crystal/Oceania approach, where certain category cabins get some extra services, such as butlers, VIP attention for reservations, and such, but still, by and large live within the greater life of the ship.

 

The third is those lines that are actually creating small ships within their big ones. So you can buy a nice cabin, sure, but you get so much more for it. Cunard does this with its Princess and Queen's Grill, NCL does it with the courtyard villas, and MSC is doing it with its Yacht Club on Fantasia. You get butler service and dedicated restaurant for breakfast and lunch (on QM2 you get a separate restaurant for all meals). There are special events, a dedicated pool and sundeck, etc. So you can venture out into the ship for the stuff that you like about big ship cruising -- but also stay in a more cozy ambience.

 

A lot of folks hate the idea of this -- hate the idea that there's a class system of sorts on board -- but I frankly like it for a couple of reasons. One is that my husband loves big ships (the nightlife, the options for dining, etc.). I like smaller ones. When we cruised on MSC Fantasia in January (and resided in a "yacht club" cabin) we both got what we wanted. Same went with a Queens Grill cruise on Queen Mary 2.

 

This is also a good option for families (particularly when parents want the bigger kids clubs).

 

These are not altogether luxury and anyone who really wants an all-luxury experience should stick with the mainstream small ship lines. But if you want to bridge the gap, the system's excellent....

 

Carolyn

 

Carolyn Spencer Brown

Editor in Chief

Cruise Critic

 

.

I'm disappointed that this thread has not received the type of responses I was looking for - and that I thought I asked for.

 

If those of you who insist that it is flat-out impossible to luxe up this cruise had actually read my entire post, you would see that I was asking for advice on HOW to improve my cruise experience to come as close as possible to the luxury cruise lines which I've come to love. I am well aware that there are some things that simply cannot be changed - pax to space ratio for one. But the fact is that ARE things that CAN be done...and I was hoping for some actual assistance, rather than just "forget about it, it can't be done, if you don't spend the big bucks you'll get a substandard experience."

 

I went into some detail as to why I've chosen this cruise over similar itineraries on the luxury lines. The reality is that there are some things that are simply more attractive about this cruise than the luxury line itineraries I was considering. There are also some things that are LESS attractive. But taken as a whole, there are enough distinct advantages to make me willing to overlook the downsides.

 

I'm well aware of the math, with regards to things like pax-to-space ratio. What I was HOPING to get were some ideas of things that I could to do overcome some of those mass-market-line annoyances. I ended my post with:

 

I realize I should have added: this question is also not for folks who think NOTHING can be done...it's for folks who might actually have some constructive suggestions.

 

But thanks for your input anyway.

 

By the way, as it turns out we DO get free bottled water with this cabin, because it's Aquaclass. It's delivered daily.

 

Anyway, after doing lots of research, I am now convinced that, while this cruise may not have all of the little extras that I loved on my luxury cruises, there are enough things I can to do mitigate at least some of the mass-market aspects of this cruise...and that the ones that remain are just not worth $6000 dollars to eradicate.

[nancygp]

Carolyn,

 

Since Crystal is a luxury line and Azamara and Oceania are premium lines, I wouldn't list them all in the same breath. Yes, if you have a penthouse on Crystal, you do get a few extra perks. Since you're discussing luxing up a mass market line, Crystal shouldn't be used as an example.

 

Nancy

[Keith1010]

Carolyn, I agree with Nancy.

 

I am not sure why you grouped Crystal (Luxury Cruise line) with zamara//Oceania as these two are Premium Cruise Lines.

 

I might have grouped Crystal with Regent. Regent provides Butler service with some of their suites as does Crystal. And the butlers really are what is the perk when all is said and done.

 

Keith

[MMDown Under]

 

With that in mind, you probably won't be surprised to learn that I actually cancelled my Celebrity cruise, and switched to a Baltics itinerary on Crystal, which departs in two months. After all the reading I did about Solstice, I came to the ultimate conclusion that my idea of "luxing up" a mass-market cruise was simply untenable - at least right now, on these ships, with the type of cost-cutting measures that seem to be going on across the mass-market cruise industry.

 

Yes, my Crystal cruise is more expensive - but when you include the promotions that they are offering (including something they are calling "As You Wish", which is giving us $2,000 in OBC, on top of several other promotions leaving us with almost $3000 in OBC!), it's really not all that MUCH more! And from all that I have read, Crystal is one cruise line that has made it a priority to NOT degrade the passenger experience in order to reduce costs and increase profits during this economic downturn.

 

I do understand the business needs resulting in the degradation of some mass-market cruises...and I am certainly sympathetic. And as so many others have said, I agree that the worst day cruising is still better than the best day NOT cruising. But I get to go on so few cruises that, for me, I would rather have the experience be exceptional from EVERY perspective - and not have to work so hard at trying to make it exceptional by trying to turn it into something it's not. Celebrity is a great product, but they are not one of the luxury lines. Crystal is. And from all that I have read and heard, the experience of passengers on both lines confirms that.

 

So I am basically taking back everything I said earlier in this thread, when I was so convinced I could luxe up a mass-market cruise! :o

 

Thanks so much for sharing how you came to make your cruising choice. I wish you and your mother Bon Voyage and look forward to reading your review.

 

I guess many of us do what you did, as we try to convince ourselves that something is equivalent, when we know in our heart it isn't. As you said, it would be lovely to be rich enough, where it didn't matter, however, it does matter for most of us.

 

I suspect many people are disappointed with their modern cruising experiences, because they didn't do enough research beforehand to see whether the cruise line/ship, as well as the itinerary meet their needs. I, for one, am often blinded by the itinerary. :)

[vjmatty]

And the butlers really are what is the perk when all is said and done.

 

Actually, what we do is stay in Princess Grill on Cunard and just pay for our maid to come with us, instead of springing for Queen's Grill and butler service. This way, she is there from the start of the journey until the very end, and we have someone who we know taking care of things. The cost actually comes out quite a bit less for what I consider to be a better arrangement.

[Leejnd4]

Hi, LeeAnn, this is a fascinating question and I hope you don't mind if I jump in because I'm actually working on a feature for Cruise Critic on how to luxe up a mass market ship!

 

There are three different approaches in big ship cruising toward the higher end of the market (suite-dwellers and such). One is, similar to Princess, Celebrity and Holland America, to basically give you the cabin and a few extra bells and whistles, but not much else.

 

There's the Azamara/Crystal/Oceania approach, where certain category cabins get some extra services, such as butlers, VIP attention for reservations, and such, but still, by and large live within the greater life of the ship.

 

The third is those lines that are actually creating small ships within their big ones. So you can buy a nice cabin, sure, but you get so much more for it. Cunard does this with its Princess and Queen's Grill, NCL does it with the courtyard villas, and MSC is doing it with its Yacht Club on Fantasia. You get butler service and dedicated restaurant for breakfast and lunch (on QM2 you get a separate restaurant for all meals). There are special events, a dedicated pool and sundeck, etc. So you can venture out into the ship for the stuff that you like about big ship cruising -- but also stay in a more cozy ambience.

 

A lot of folks hate the idea of this -- hate the idea that there's a class system of sorts on board -- but I frankly like it for a couple of reasons. One is that my husband loves big ships (the nightlife, the options for dining, etc.). I like smaller ones. When we cruised on MSC Fantasia in January (and resided in a "yacht club" cabin) we both got what we wanted. Same went with a Queens Grill cruise on Queen Mary 2.

 

This is also a good option for families (particularly when parents want the bigger kids clubs).

 

These are not altogether luxury and anyone who really wants an all-luxury experience should stick with the mainstream small ship lines. But if you want to bridge the gap, the system's excellent....

 

Carolyn

 

Carolyn Spencer Brown

Editor in Chief

Cruise Critic

 

.

 

Carolyn,

 

I look forward to reading your feature article!

 

It's been interesting to see the twists and turns of this thread. I actually started this thread over a year ago, when I was torn between my current booking on a luxury cruise line (which is all I've traveled on recently), and switching to a mass-market cruise line, which was more in line with my budget at the time. What I wanted to know was, is it possible to go on a mass-market ship, spend a bit more money for some extras, and get anything resembling a luxury ship experience, WITHOUT having to spend the same amount as you would on a luxury cruise?

 

I see what you are saying about the three different approaches. Although, I have to say I agree with Nancy and Keith that they are kind of different animals than what I was looking for when I first posted this thread. I was getting some advice from other cruisers that they felt it was entirely possible to get at least reasonably CLOSE to the experience I've come to expect from a luxury cruise, on a mass-market ship, without having to spend luxury-cruise prices, PROVIDED I was willing to spend some additonal money, and do some specific things to "luxe it up". That is what I was looking for in this thread - advice on exactly how to do that.

 

I did eventually get some great ideas and suggestions - and based on those, I went ahead and switched my booking to a Celebrity cruise. I became quite convinced that this was going to work for me! Convinced to the point, in fact, that I would brook no dissent about it. :o Darn it, I was going to MAKE it work! I believed I had specific situation that would allow for this to take place...the Aqua-Class category on a Celebrity Solstice-class ship, which I suppose you could say is akin to your "third" category in your post - the "ship within a ship" concept. I thought that's what I had found.

 

But then the reviews started coming in from Solstice...and reality set in. While this ship seems to be offering a very nice mass-market product, the "luxury ship within a mass-market ship" really wasn't there. The benefits of Aqua Class appear to be lots of fluff that sounds great in a brochure, but doesn't really amount to much in practice. (Perfect example: what they were marketing as "aromatherapy scent selections" exclusive to Aqua Class cabins, which really turned out to be nothing more than diffuser air fresheners). What I realized was, in order to get to the point where I would receive any real benefits beyond what everyone else gets, I would have to book a higher-end suite, and end up paying the same amount as I would to book a standard cabin on a true luxury ship. But even if I did that...in the end, I'd still be on a mass-market ship. That's what I was getting out of the reviews and reports...that no matter how swanky my actual cabin was, the moment I walked out of it, I'd be on a standard Celebrity ship. And if I'm going to pay those kinds of prices for my cruise, well then I want it to be luxe THROUGHOUT the ship, not just in my cabin.

 

So I actually ended up switching back over to a luxury cruise line - Crystal.

 

I'm not so sure your article is going to cover my specific questions and concerns. Of your three different approaches, none of them involve getting a closer-to-luxury experience without having to pay luxury prices, which is what I was looking for...and which I've decided I really can't get. I'm back to that old maxim: you get what you pay for. If I want a luxury cruise, I have to GO on a luxury cruise.

 

As for springing for the higher-end cabins on the mass-market lines, I realize now that it makes no sense, at least for me personally. I would rather have the smaller cabin, and a more luxurious overall ship experience. As for the higher-end cabins on the luxury lines like Crystal/Oceania, sure I'd LOVE to do that, and I would expect that to be an even MORE luxurious experience! For that much money, you'd darn well BETTER get some serious perks! But now you're into a stratosphere of pricing unreachable to me. As for the "ship within a ship" model a-la Cunard...that could be a viable solution, but once again, you're still on a mass-market ship. It would be like going on a cruise that is Crystal on the top decks, and Celebrity on the lower decks. I would rather just go on the cruise that is all-Crystal.

 

Anyway, these are the conclusions that I ultimately settled on. The bottom line is that we are all so fortunate to have all of these choices available to us, and we all can choose what works for us in terms of budget, itinerary, and overall experience.

[ancientmariner]

I thought, in the 21st century, that we had become a classless society. It now seems with the introduction of Yacht Clubs and Aquaclass that we are in danger of returning to the divisive system that prevailed on cruise ships and liners in the 1950s.

 

It took me years to persuade my late husband to try a cruise, after his first experience crossing the Atlantic on the ORIGINAL Queen Mary, returning on the ss France. He recalled being cramped into a small area of the ship, while the first class passengers had the freedom to roam wherever they desired. Indeed, he always refused to sail on the QE2 because he considered they imposed a class system. In 1998, while aboard the original Pacific Princess, our travelling companions were upgraded to a butler-serviced cabin, which they found most embarrassing and intrusive. I think they disposed of their uneaten canapes while ashore, to avoid hurting the butler's feelings.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm still in favour of the luxury lines, where everyone is treated as an equal regardless of the price they paid.

 

Trudi

[Leejnd4]

Trudi, your feelings about the "classes" on cruise ships is not uncommon - I've read numerous posts on Cruise Critic about this, and I believe it has been discussed quite a bit in the Cunard forum.

 

I wanted to just point something out. While I understand your aversion to such a system on a cruise ship, especially given your husband's experience, the reality is that it's NOT the same as it was back in the days of yore. I do believe our society HAS made some advances, and you will no longer find such things as steerage. These days, people don't take cruises to get from point a to point b. They take cruises for a vacation - and if they were not treated as vacationers, if they were made to feel unworthy because of the "class" they were sailing in, they simply wouldn't go! It's not like this is the only vacation option, or even the only cruise option. Certainly, nobody is going to go on a vacation where their noses are rubbed in the fact that they are "lower class".

 

However, the fact remains that people who pay more expect to get more than the people who pay less. How that translates itself today, on such ships that offer this, is not so much the way the different classes are treated - in other words, those paying less should not expect to be treated as if they are less worthy as humans. The difference is in the quality of the product received - the size and luxuriousness of the cabin, the ritziness of the decor, the quality of the food, the space-to-pax ratio, the crew-to-pax ratio. When people pay more for their cruise, they certainly have a right to expect something better, in terms of these factors, than those who pay less. Otherwise, why pay more?

 

My sole issue with the "ship within a ship" concept is that I'd rather be on a ship that has one level of quality throughout. This is primarily because, unless you actually have VERY distinct lines between the two different categories, it's inevitable that there will be some blending of the two experiences. And please know I'm not talking about blending of pax - I certainly wouldn't have a problem with that. But, unless it's a fully luxury ship, there are going to be some mass-market qualities to it that even the higher cabin categories are going to encounter...whatever that may be. And my personal feeling is, if I'm going to pay luxury cruise prices, I'd rather go on a ship that is luxury throughout.

[Travelcat2]

Hi, LeeAnn, this is a fascinating question and I hope you don't mind if I jump in because I'm actually working on a feature for Cruise Critic on how to luxe up a mass market ship!

 

There are three different approaches in big ship cruising toward the higher end of the market (suite-dwellers and such). One is, similar to Princess, Celebrity and Holland America, to basically give you the cabin and a few extra bells and whistles, but not much else.

 

There's the Azamara/Crystal/Oceania approach, where certain category cabins get some extra services, such as butlers, VIP attention for reservations, and such, but still, by and large live within the greater life of the ship.

 

The third is those lines that are actually creating small ships within their big ones. So you can buy a nice cabin, sure, but you get so much more for it. Cunard does this with its Princess and Queen's Grill, NCL does it with the courtyard villas, and MSC is doing it with its Yacht Club on Fantasia. You get butler service and dedicated restaurant for breakfast and lunch (on QM2 you get a separate restaurant for all meals). There are special events, a dedicated pool and sundeck, etc. So you can venture out into the ship for the stuff that you like about big ship cruising -- but also stay in a more cozy ambience.

 

A lot of folks hate the idea of this -- hate the idea that there's a class system of sorts on board -- but I frankly like it for a couple of reasons. One is that my husband loves big ships (the nightlife, the options for dining, etc.). I like smaller ones. When we cruised on MSC Fantasia in January (and resided in a "yacht club" cabin) we both got what we wanted. Same went with a Queens Grill cruise on Queen Mary 2.

 

This is also a good option for families (particularly when parents want the bigger kids clubs).

 

These are not altogether luxury and anyone who really wants an all-luxury experience should stick with the mainstream small ship lines. But if you want to bridge the gap, the system's excellent....

 

Carolyn

 

Carolyn Spencer Brown

Editor in Chief

Cruise Critic

 

.

 

 

Just want to add a couple of comments to your post. The "class" system was in effect when most of our ancestors came across the Atlantic to the United States. Most of them were "steerage" (sorry if that is misspelled). Just thinking about a "class" system is very negative. However, if certain perks were available to those who pay for them and it is not obvious to others, I'm 100% in favor.

 

For instance, on mainstream cruise lines, you sign for cocktails (and everything else). If, however, you pay for an all-inclusive experience, you still sign, however, your bill would simply not reflect the cost of your drinks. This way, the fact that you are receiving special treatment (that you paid for) is not being thrown in the face of those who may not be able to afford such a "perk". This is how Regent currently handles the some perks for their Seven Seas Society members. I "buy" hundreds of minutes, for instance, of internet time -- just like everyone else. However, it never shows up on our final bill.

 

I believe that first and foremost, there must be equal respect for all passengers on board. If some receive special treatment, no one should be aware of it.

 

Just my opinion.:)

[martinsfo]

I have to put in my two cents on class systems. I have only sailed on Crystal and the service is identical for all cabin types. The penthouses may have a butler in cabin, but that special treatment does not carry over to the rest of the ship. On our last cruise, one of our table mates was in a penthouse and was treated just the same (great) as the rest of us. I do not like the idea of the ship within a ship. Why pay for that when you can have the whole ship with great service and treatment, probably at similar price points.

[editor@cruisecritic]

Hi, LeeAnn, great post -- may I adapt some of your insights to my story if they fit? I won't know until I sit down to write, though.

 

I'm glad you made the switch. I definitely agree with you that nice as Celebrity is, it's a nice mass market line. Its ads and marketing, to me, promise more than is usually delivered.

 

Will say that one of our most critical contributors just got back from Celebrity Solstice and loved it! He's our go-to luxury guy when I'm not cruising so I was interested in his reaction.

 

Working on the Crystal review now. One of the nicest things about writing about trips (whether member reviews or the job I do) is that when you go over your notes once back home you get the pleasure of reliving the experience. I'm currently (in my head) on a sea day on Crystal Symphony, wondering if the Cuisines of Sun feast will be laid on today!

 

After I'm done with writing work today I have to vacuum. Grrrrh.

 

Carolyn

 

Carolyn,

 

I look forward to reading your feature article!

 

It's been interesting to see the twists and turns of this thread. I actually started this thread over a year ago, when I was torn between my current booking on a luxury cruise line (which is all I've traveled on recently), and switching to a mass-market cruise line, which was more in line with my budget at the time. What I wanted to know was, is it possible to go on a mass-market ship, spend a bit more money for some extras, and get anything resembling a luxury ship experience, WITHOUT having to spend the same amount as you would on a luxury cruise?

 

I see what you are saying about the three different approaches. Although, I have to say I agree with Nancy and Keith that they are kind of different animals than what I was looking for when I first posted this thread. I was getting some advice from other cruisers that they felt it was entirely possible to get at least reasonably CLOSE to the experience I've come to expect from a luxury cruise, on a mass-market ship, without having to spend luxury-cruise prices, PROVIDED I was willing to spend some additonal money, and do some specific things to "luxe it up". That is what I was looking for in this thread - advice on exactly how to do that.

 

I did eventually get some great ideas and suggestions - and based on those, I went ahead and switched my booking to a Celebrity cruise. I became quite convinced that this was going to work for me! Convinced to the point, in fact, that I would brook no dissent about it. :o Darn it, I was going to MAKE it work! I believed I had specific situation that would allow for this to take place...the Aqua-Class category on a Celebrity Solstice-class ship, which I suppose you could say is akin to your "third" category in your post - the "ship within a ship" concept. I thought that's what I had found.

 

But then the reviews started coming in from Solstice...and reality set in. While this ship seems to be offering a very nice mass-market product, the "luxury ship within a mass-market ship" really wasn't there. The benefits of Aqua Class appear to be lots of fluff that sounds great in a brochure, but doesn't really amount to much in practice. (Perfect example: what they were marketing as "aromatherapy scent selections" exclusive to Aqua Class cabins, which really turned out to be nothing more than diffuser air fresheners). What I realized was, in order to get to the point where I would receive any real benefits beyond what everyone else gets, I would have to book a higher-end suite, and end up paying the same amount as I would to book a standard cabin on a true luxury ship. But even if I did that...in the end, I'd still be on a mass-market ship. That's what I was getting out of the reviews and reports...that no matter how swanky my actual cabin was, the moment I walked out of it, I'd be on a standard Celebrity ship. And if I'm going to pay those kinds of prices for my cruise, well then I want it to be luxe THROUGHOUT the ship, not just in my cabin.

 

So I actually ended up switching back over to a luxury cruise line - Crystal.

 

I'm not so sure your article is going to cover my specific questions and concerns. Of your three different approaches, none of them involve getting a closer-to-luxury experience without having to pay luxury prices, which is what I was looking for...and which I've decided I really can't get. I'm back to that old maxim: you get what you pay for. If I want a luxury cruise, I have to GO on a luxury cruise.

 

As for springing for the higher-end cabins on the mass-market lines, I realize now that it makes no sense, at least for me personally. I would rather have the smaller cabin, and a more luxurious overall ship experience. As for the higher-end cabins on the luxury lines like Crystal/Oceania, sure I'd LOVE to do that, and I would expect that to be an even MORE luxurious experience! For that much money, you'd darn well BETTER get some serious perks! But now you're into a stratosphere of pricing unreachable to me. As for the "ship within a ship" model a-la Cunard...that could be a viable solution, but once again, you're still on a mass-market ship. It would be like going on a cruise that is Crystal on the top decks, and Celebrity on the lower decks. I would rather just go on the cruise that is all-Crystal.

 

Anyway, these are the conclusions that I ultimately settled on. The bottom line is that we are all so fortunate to have all of these choices available to us, and we all can choose what works for us in terms of budget, itinerary, and overall experience.

[editor@cruisecritic]

Hi, brilliant point when you said this: "I believe that first and foremost, there must be equal respect for all passengers on board. If some receive special treatment, no one should be aware of it."

 

That's the crux of the whole issue. As long as it's not obvious, who cares what people who paid a whole lot more got that you didn't?

 

Carolyn

 

 

Just want to add a couple of comments to your post. The "class" system was in effect when most of our ancestors came across the Atlantic to the United States. Most of them were "steerage" (sorry if that is misspelled). Just thinking about a "class" system is very negative. However, if certain perks were available to those who pay for them and it is not obvious to others, I'm 100% in favor.

 

For instance, on mainstream cruise lines, you sign for cocktails (and everything else). If, however, you pay for an all-inclusive experience, you still sign, however, your bill would simply not reflect the cost of your drinks. This way, the fact that you are receiving special treatment (that you paid for) is not being thrown in the face of those who may not be able to afford such a "perk". This is how Regent currently handles the some perks for their Seven Seas Society members. I "buy" hundreds of minutes, for instance, of internet time -- just like everyone else. However, it never shows up on our final bill.

 

I believe that first and foremost, there must be equal respect for all passengers on board. If some receive special treatment, no one should be aware of it.

 

Just my opinion.:)

[wripro]

First of all I agree with Nancygp and Keith that Crystal should not be lumped in with Oceania and Azamarta. It is a true luxury line and therefore not germane to this topic.

 

Now, let me also say that I have only read the last page of this thread so what I am about to say may have been posted before. If so, I apologize.

 

You can give 'em a large suite. You can give 'em butler service. You can give 'em perks and benefits. You can do what you want but you can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. There is no way you will get a luxury experience on a mass market ship unless you embark, walk to your suite and stay there for the entire cruise. The moment you step out into the public areas you are confronted with masses of people, inferior service and food. This may not mean anything to many people but those who have really experienced what a true luxury cruise is will immediately recognize the difference. The irony is that by the time you pay for that big suite, pay for your gratuities and drinks, pay for alternative restaurants your final tab will probably be the same or more than on a luxury line. But the good thing is there are options for anyone's tastes and needs and we should all be grateful this is what we are discussing.