jaywoods678

On 3/10/2024 at 4:09 PM, Hanoj said:

Decline seems widespread in the travel and hospitality industries, though it appears more acute with cruising since this form of travel/vacationing is more expensive compared to other modes, and the supply logistics are more problematic, thus affecting food quality (and quantities) in particular.

 

It feels like cruise patrons (across different lines and luxury categories) must expect less (to match expectations with present realities) but pay more. Not a great recipe for business success for what most consumers consider as discretionary consumption. This discretionary spending will manifest differently as some will cruise less frequently, some not all, and others will select lower cabin categories, shorter cruise durations, and or sail with different lines. It appears the present challenges will be met by more crossovers (between cruise lines and between vacation modes - land based vs cruise, etc) and thus less brand loyalty. Hopefully this will temper fare increases. We are definitely in this camp, and will probably be favoring more resort destinations, travelled to by plane or automobile. We plan to do more “tours” on such trips, especially when visiting a new locale. 
 

The timing of Oceania’s new Simply More campaign, regarded by some as a thinly veiled price increase initiative, in the current cruise “decline” climate may not have been the most astute. But, then, there seem to be many company executives, both with publicly owned and privately held companies of all sizes, making inexplicably poor and myopic decisions. 

 

Who is John Galt?

I absolutely agree. We do all kinds of travel, and there have certainly been declines everywhere, nothing to the level of the cruise line, and I'm referring to all cruise lines from the mainstream lines like Royal, to the lines like Celebrity and Holland America, and to the upper premium lines like Oceania. We are done, at least for a while.

On 2/11/2024 at 4:37 PM, keys-prig said:

I will be cruising on the Eurodam in March.We booked a shore excursion in Jamaica. My husband is concerned about our safety. I believe the current status is a level 3. Should we cancel our excursion?

I personally will never get off at another Jamaica port ever again. The pushy aggressive vendors are terrifying. We even had some get in our face and threaten us if we don't buy. Again, just my opinion, but I would never get off in Jamaica. If my cruise stops there, we just stay onboard.

We were on that cruise and received our bronze ones. No special ceremony at all. It was just in our mailbox. I also assume it's just another one of many HAL cuts.

On 12/1/2023 at 9:59 AM, gerelmx said:

I Never book a GTY cabin if there are no cabins available, the risk that you will not be able to board is VERY HIGH

I agree. To me booking a guarantee cabin is just now worth the risk, even if there is substantial savings. But the main reason we don't book them is because we are very picky with cabin selection. We like a quiet room with little motion, so for us that is low and mid-ship with cabins above and below. We make sure we are not above or below bars, lounges, entertainment venues, restaurants, lido decks, etc.

14 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

The entertainment in Eden is no longer Avant guarde performance art but instead a mix of performers from singers, musicians, trios, violinists acrobatics, gymnastics. The shows that debuted on the Edge during its first year haven't existed for years. 

That's great news! Thank you.

14 hours ago, Presto2 said:

Do they still have the strange entertainment?

I've heard they've toned it down a bit. When it first started, it was this strange cringe-worthy performance art. That's when we stopped going on Celebrity. It was clear to us the Edge Class was geared towards suites and millennials.

On 8/15/2023 at 7:44 AM, ace2542 said:

Most expensive one outside of the super luxury ones from what I have seen.

I've traveled most all cruise lines - from budget to semi luxury, and actually on a per diem basis Disney is more expensive than the premium lines and sometimes as much or more than the semi luxury lines. I love Disney Cruises, but it is completely ridiculous.

3 hours ago, 3Goofys said:

For goodness sake, if Disney Cruise Line can maintain an adults only area, Celebrity should be able to.  I certainly understand if the weather is poor, family time should be allowed for part of the time.

And Disney enforces it MUCH better. It's not perfect, but they enforce it much better than the other lines. Some of the lines don't even enforce it at all.

Oceania.

On 10/14/2023 at 11:27 AM, ECCruise said:

Agree with the Princess take but disagree on HAL.  The Dive In burgers are hand formed, cooked to order, lots of variations available and pretty darn good, frankly.  IMHO, head and shoulders above Mast Grill. 

I agree. I don't know where he got a burger on HAL, but the Dive In burgers are some of the best as sea, if not the best. And not just my opinion, it is widely known.

7 hours ago, bEwAbG said:

Once the minimum wage started rising in the U.S. during the pandemic, call center jobs that historically had paid a few dollars more per hour than other places had to start competing with a new reality.  The available labor suddenly had more choices, and it became increasingly difficult to staff appropriately.  I have had a couple of different friends whose companies wanted to (and were) using U.S.-based call centers but staffing became such an issue that it was causing the corporations real problems with providing reliable service.  Just a bit of background to add to the mix and not offering opinions on right or wrong on the specific situation at X.

I completely agree. Also, I think it's a combination of both. The cruise lines are trying to save money by moving overseas, but also they are having a hard time finding staff here in the US.

I just heard Holland America started doing it too.   😔

21 hours ago, KAKcruiser said:

I consider "offshore" representatives to be people who work in call centers.  They usually stick to a script and can't answer any questions or address any problems without putting you on hold for a long time while they check with their supervisor.  And, then usually the answer to any question is "no."

And they don't listen and will just continue repeating the script over and over. It's very frustrating.

I just heard that Celebrity has too.  😔

54 minutes ago, Linda W. said:

Seems like Celebrity is making lots of changes now they have a new CEO.  Celebrity is definitely NOT the superior cruise line it used to be.  I know I am studying other cruise lines and after our next cruise in February may say goodbye to Celebrity.  I'm wondering just what this new CEO is REALLY trying to accomplish besides getting rid of loyal Celebrity cruisers? 

I switched to Holland America long time ago. We also love Oceania, Disney, and Princess. We're even starting to look at Carnival, especially their new ship Mardi Gras. There are good choices on the menu, and they have lots of different food venues, many of which do not have an upcharge.

23 hours ago, poeticlicensed said:

There are many parents who take the kids to Disney, but will not do a Disney cruise or a cruise with roller coasters or water parks. I think X is priming themselves as the alternative to Disney cruises (which are wildly expensive) and Royals "turn it up to 11". I think X sees themselves as the reward for parents who don't want a theme park experience. 

 

And as someone who lives15 minutes from the mouse, I see tons of kids in the parks all year round. We never did that, I dont believe in pulling kids out of school for vacation. But believe me, there are plenty of parents who would. 

 

And again, I think this is a slow move to the a new Celebrity. It will take a couple of years, but by 2025 your experience will be very different. 

 

I think the demographic for cruising generally is changing and the different cruiselines are positioning themselves for where they want to be.

It's a few things. Some districts have year-round schools with multiple breaks throughout the year, a lot of kids are home schooled now, different regions of the country have week-long breaks like Spring break but also a week for fall (Fall break) and a week for winter (Winter break), etc. Mostly any given week some school district in the country somewhere has a school week off. But also as you mentioned, parents have no qualms about pulling kids out of school these days, usually for selfish reasons like because it's cheaper that time of year, etc. I've been on several cruises during school year that had many many kids, and even on 2 week cruises. I've asked some of the parents, and they said they pulled them out of school. I personally think it's irresponsible, but who am I to judge I guess.

On 8/29/2023 at 2:31 PM, poeticlicensed said:

In my opinion, each change they make  is part of a laid out plan to change the direction of the company and make it more closely align with RCCL. I think the c suite looked at the future of cruising and decided its in the Caribbean, where profits are high, and its families, who have disposable income. Families generally don't take 14 day and longer cruises. They are firmly in the 3 to 7 day, where parents have to get back to work and kids to school and activities . So that's the new X focus, 3 to 7 day Caribbean cruises. 

 

RCCL made a huge investment in Cococay and they are gonna wring every dollar they can from it. The move to start sailing from Canaveral is part of it. Get those Disney family dollars. Mom and dad and grandparents bring the kids to Disney for several days of madness then are rewarded by a non Disney cruise that goes to Cococay for the kids. Thats a huge opportunity for X to cash in.

 

Taking away menu selections,  paying for little add ons, those  changes will only be known and felt by loyal customers, and that is clearly not the demographic they are chasing. Its simply not as lucrative. Do you think they've forgotten longtime cruisers exist? Nope, but in the macro, the new direction pays more. Will they lose some cruisers? Yup. But not enough to make it unattractive to move this direction.

 

The repackaging of all in to take away tips was probably on the drawing board last year. They figure people aren't gonna stiff the staff, and they want you in that bev page and wifi because they are huge moneymakers.

 

It is what it is. No amount of complaining is gonna change what is clearly a long range plan. Im not their sought after demo. So im not happy and will look elsewhere for future cruises.

I agree with this 100%. Families and first timers spend more onboard, and they know that's really the only way to make more money.

On 8/29/2023 at 2:17 PM, AtlantaCruiser72 said:

 

I jumped ship after my December 2018 cruise on the Summit and no longer even consider Celebrity when looking at cruises.  HAL and Princess have become my go to's as I feel their pricing, both for fares and ancillary items, is much more fair and consumer friendly, even with some of the recent changes.

I completely agree. Although both Holland America and Princess have also gone downhill, not nearly as much as Celebrity, and at least with them you can still get a decent price.

22 hours ago, mnocket said:

That's been my choice.  X no longer offers the experience I desire.  My next 3 cruises are on Windstar, Regent, and stepping down a bit - MSC Yacht Club.  I used to be happy with the Celebrity and Princess products, but not so much anymore. So my decision was to cruise a little less frequently, but pay up for a luxury, small ship experience.  

 

Do I think Celebrity cares?  Not necessarily.  I'm sure they would prefer that I trade up to their luxury line Silversea and I'm sure many do.  On the whole, it's my opinion that the major cruise corporations are finding that their Premium lines don't generate the same profit per customer as their luxury or mainstream lines do. Hence all these changes to the Premium lines are intended to essentially make them mimic their mainstream product.  Their bet is that their loyal Premium customers will either accept the changes or move to a luxury line - most of which are part of the very same corporations.  It's a win-win for the corporations as the less profitable Premium lines are essentially phased out in favor of the more profitable mainstream and luxury lines. 

I completely agree with this. You basically wrote down my thoughts exactly. And I believe this is a good theory. I'll elaborate. The large mainstream lines have economies of scale. They may have lower fares but have lots of first timers and families. These customers spend onboard. They spend on alcohol, excursions, photos, souvenirs, art auctions, spa services, etc. They also have a lot more cabins filled with four people. All of this obviously makes them more money. On the other end, the true luxury lines make more money simply because of the high fares. Then you have the lonely premium lines in the middle - HAL, Celebrity, and Princess. From my own personal experience and from others, these are the lines making the most cuts. Yes, all lines are making some cuts, even the upper premium lines like Oceania but NOTHING like the others. In fact, even on mainstream line Carnival, on their newest ships, they've actually eliminated extra charge fees for many of their specialty restaurants, so not only are they not cutting as much, they are actually giving more. They are still providing free lobster on formal night whereas their premium brand Holland America is not. Go figure. For all of us experienced cruisers who prefer the aforementioned premium lines, we've sailed a lot. We are most likely not purchasing photos, we are probably booking our own private excursions, I can't remember when I've last been to a spa onboard, and we don't spend money in the shops. So the lines don't know what to do with us or ways to squeeze more money out of us. They know we are not going to fall for all the gimmicks, so they are simply just going to cut cut cut until they can't cut anymore. At this point, these lines have already cut so much that they are pretty much indistinguishable from their mainstream counterparts. I think they would love to get rid of this category and just roll these lines in with the mainstream ones and just consider these lines the more "adult focused" versions. For me, there is really no reason to pay more to sail with the premium lines. I will just start sailing the mainstream lines and, if I want a better experience, will from time to time sail on a line like Oceania.

Depending on itinerary and time of year, we've been able to book Oceania for only slightly more, and in one case even less, than Celebrity on a per diem basis. And Oceania is a true premium line. I can no longer justify the cost of Celebrity especially considering all the cuts. I've even heard some people say they've been able to book the true luxury lines like Silver Sea, Seabourn, and Regent for only slightly more.

On 8/28/2023 at 12:20 PM, PTC DAWG said:

I drink tea as intended, over ice and sweetened, 🙂

Me too! I noticed you're from Peachtree City, GA. Southerner like me. I was born in Georgia and live in Florida, and we LOVE our sweet tea.   🙂

3 hours ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

What I find interesting is the no big deal attitude that some have when it comes to cruise line cuts/changes.  It's especially easy to say it's no bid deal  if the cut doesn't directly impact a particular cruising group.  But the fact is, a cut doesn't have to directly impact every passenger in order for it to impact the over all product.  I never ate dinner at the buffet but I wasn't happy when Celebrity cut down their dinner time offerings.  I rarely used my butler but I know people who did and it was a nice perk for those who had more butler needs than others.  I don't relish the bubbly they used to hand out on embarkation day but I do relish the symbolism of having someone greet me with a glass when I step on the ship.  I could go on but my point is, just because one isn't personally impacted by a change or a cut doesn't mean that others will or even should feel the same way.  We all cruise for different reasons and when a brand that we've come to know and love makes sweeping changes and cuts, it stings...IMO.

I completely agree with you. I just don't understand all the excuses. I am a huge fan of Holland America, but I will NEVER make excuses for them. They have also gone way downhill (maybe not quite as much as Celebrity, but that is subjective), and I was furious at them when they started trying to charge $10 for an extra entree in the MDR. The optics are bad, and it cheapens the brand. This was even a couple of years before the pandemic. Then a couple of years ago they started NOT giving free lobster on formal night. Even the budget lines like Carnival still do. Both HAL and Celebrity claim to be on the premium end of the mainstream lines, and I'm tired of all the cuts. Just raise the price. Nothing they're doing now is premium, anything but. Getting back to my point, I never defended them for this, even some of the other cuts that did not affect me. It downgrades the product and is completely unnecessary. There is very little distinction now from the "premium" lines and the mainstream lines. A few years ago there was a big distinction. I have no problem calling out my favorite lines, but some on here just refuse to no matter what. I just can't understand it. I can't understand the blind loyalty.

2 hours ago, rolloman said:

To answer your question...yes there are quite a few. So many that they will fill any Celebrity ship that comes to Port Canaveral. I live about 14 miles from the Port...now you tell me, with all the cruises that leave from my backyard from one of, if not the largest port in the world...why would I drive 3 hours down a super speedway to go on a ship? I am sorry that you have to fly...but that has nothing to do with my situation. I moved where I am for a reason and I am taking advantage of it. Celebrity is my favorite cruiseline and I couldn't be happier I can now take an uber to sail them. 

Same here. Completely agree. We're in St. Augustine so only about an hour and 45 minutes away versus 4 hours to FLL.

We love this. We are in St. Augustine and are only about an hour and 45 minutes away. Now we wish that Holland America would also position a ship there.

8 hours ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

And me as well.  Finally, a port I can drive to!

Me as well. This is great. We are in St. Augustine - just about an hour and 45 minutes away.