redandrea7119

23 hours ago, Nic6318 said:

 

Hi

 

… but, I think it was proportionate. It wasn't over 3 ice cream cones. It was about repeated incompetence by multiple personnel. At a point where it starts appearing to be a Monty Python sketch, and a supervisor is not summoned after being requested (before this had escalated), then losing one's temper is appropriate. Walking away at any point would have accomplished nothing but rewarding this sort of lunacy, and reinforcing the continued incompetence for the next person in line.

 

Of course I wasn't there and I am only hearing one side, but the scenario seem pretty straight forward. To have the charges reversed shouldn't have taken more than 5 minutes, one time. 
 

Thanks Nic6318

You have understood the situation and how I felt perfectly.

1 hour ago, ziggyuk said:

 

I think you were missing the point, it's how you conducted yourself and treated members of staff.

Principle is fine but shouting at staff, throwing money over the counter, being threatened with security over your behaviour and having managers defuse the situation, all over 3 ice cream cones? It's just not proportionate and never justifiable. Quite honestly I would be too embarrassed to admit what I had done let alone put it in print for the world to see.

It's not what you do but how you do it, losing your temper and bullying people rarely gets you anywhere.

To be honest I think it is you who is missing the point. It wasn't over "just 3 ice-creams" - far from it. It was over the fact that I had spent 2 prior occasions dealing politely and calmly with this situation. The 1st time waiting a ridiculous amount of time before the member of staff checked with a superior that the items were in fact included in the old classic package and then reassuring us they would be removed.

The fact that the 2nd time the lady had printed each receipt, wrote the package no's and said she would go up to the relevant bars and get them removed.

So twice I had been calm and polite, twice I had had confirmation that they were included in the package and twice I was told the charges would be removed.

On the 3rd occasion I spent 40 minutes being calm and polite - despite it being the same gentleman that had dealt with the situation the 1st time. Despite reminding him of this occasion, and despite telling him of the ladies confirmation as well on the 2nd occasion. Despite him trying to tell me the cone and cup ice cream referred to on the print out of my drinks package was the soft serve ice cream (which has nothing to do with any of the drinks packages and is free to everyone), despite being ignored when I asked to speak to a manager.

If anyone was rude and a bully it was this member of staff.

Even when I lost my temper I did not in anyway insult the member of staff personally (though given his level of ineptitude and ignorant attitude I could easily have done so) as I am not a bully and have never bullied anyone in my life despite what you say. My comments were "this is absolutely ridiculous" "this is a joke, the items are included in our package, I know that and it has also been confirmed on the 2 prior occasions we've been to sort this out" "you know what, we will pay, just take the money" "yes I'm losing my temper because we are just getting nowhere in trying to sort this out when it was already supposed to have been sorted twice". I didn't throw they money at the member of staff I threw it over the counter in frustration. I didn't  swear at all. I probably wasn't even that loud as I had had a sore throat for the past 3 days and was losing my voice.

How MSC handled the issue of "just 3 ice creams" was disproportionate and unjustified. It should have been followed through on the 1st occasion when confirmation that the items charged for were included in our package was received from a senior member of staff. All it would have taken was a phone call up to the bar. 

Where is the justification in telling customers who have paid a lot of money for a relaxing and stress free holiday that something will be done only for it not to be done twice and not done for 40 minutes on the 3rd occasion whilst I was staying calm and polite?

I am not at all embarrassed. I put the experience into print for one main reason:

 So future customers (especially those on an old drinks package) can watch out for wrong charges. Maybe if they expect it may happen and may take 3 attempts to sort it they will be better prepared than I was and not lose their temper.

I don't like to lose my temper. I don't think it is dignified in anyway. Nor do I think it is the answer in most cases and I always do my best to approach any issue in a calm and polite manner. Usually this works. Usually it works in leaps and bounds if it is your second time returning to the same issue. As for the 3rd time it should be that the organisation is falling over to apologise and rectify the issue. As much as I don't like losing my temper  nor do I like being taken advantage of, having to repeatedly deal with the same issue despite having been told it would be sorted, having the same member of staff completely ignore the reminder that he had spoke to his superior only a couple of days before who had confirmed what we had told him then and what we were now telling him again. Then having that member of staff ignore my (polite) request to speak to a manager.

Yes dealing with a situation by losing your temper rarely gets you anywhere. Especially if you have a temper from the outset. Unfortunately in this case being polite and calm got me nowhere and, again, unfortunately, it took losing my temper to bring forth a manager (again whom I had already asked to speak to and been ignored) who then promptly sorted out the situation. I would likely still be trying to resolve it now had I continued to remain calm. Although that would have meant another cruise so on that basis yes i do regret losing my temper.

9 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

Wow. I have to ask: how much money are we talking for the 3 ice cream cones? I'm sorry you went through this, but my first impression on reading this is: were 3 ice creams really worth 1) several different visits to GS, 2) all the time you spent arguing with them and 3) the stress you put on yourself at 1 am, a scant 6 hours before you had to disembark and catch your flight? I guess since I've been in your shoes more times than I care to admit, I've learned that some times being in the right isn't worth all the stress and anxiety, and for my own sake (to say nothing of those around me), it's better just to let it go. I try to remind myself that more often than not, people like those you dealt with are just ordinary human beings doing the best they can under the circumstances. Our MSC experience was on a relatively new ship and there were still kinks being worked out and staff didn't always seem to know how systems worked and such. We just took it in stride. Nonetheless, I'm glad things were eventually sorted out for you.

I get what you are saying and I think from what you have said you have realised that it wasn't the cost - it was the principle. And yes totally sometimes it may not be worth the stress involved to make a point of principle but at what point do you realise you are flogging a dead horse and leave it. Had from the outset I had a crystal ball and could see that it was going to take so many visits and in the end the stress it did then totally I may well have left it and just paid.

But each time we were told it was sorted. The 1st time we had another unrelated reason to go to guest services so had to queue and wait on that occasion anyway.

When we thought it sorted then realised it wasn't we had already invested time in sorting it out and been told we were correct. The 2nd time was the least stressful and the woman was totally professional, knew the items were included, explained that they had to get the bar to take off the charges etc. Plus at this point we were still just over half way through. We wanted to know that we and our son could continue having ice cream without being charged. It could have kept happening and the amount increased.

The 3rd occasion - again we had gone to guest services at that time to discuss an issue with the fun pass, to settle our bill so we didn't have to in morning as well as query these charges again.

The stress was largely on getting the same member of staff as the 1st time and being astonished at his ineptitude. By the time I was so stressed I was prepared to pay rather than continue getting nowhere other than increasingly stressed I wasn't as quiet as started out and the issue came to the attention of others whom sorted it.

Also had we just not bothered and paid it what does this do for staff training and correcting when they get things wrong. It just reinforces for them to get it wrong or convinces them they are right which is then burdensome for future customers. I think giving in and knowing that the staff hadn't learned as a result but had just got the message reinforced that they were right would have played on my mind and irritated me even more.

From the UK - also just back from a b2b cruise on MSC Seaside. Service charge removed no problem at all. Also my partner heard an American woman asking for it to be removed and stating that she wasn't going to pay it & again the guy on guest services told her he had removed it - she had no problem either.

In fact it was easier to get this removed than it was to get 3 charges that were mistakenly added to our bill for items included in our drinks package - these turned out to be an absolute nightmare to remove. 4 visits to guest services over the course of our 2nd week.

1st time took about 40 mins - man was adamant goods were not included in our package. I was adamant they were & also we had had many more of the relevant items that we had not been charged for (because they were included in our drinks package) but had been charged on 3 occasions. He took ages looking at the computer, printing stuff out, finding a booklet and reading sections of it - all without speaking to us. I told him we had booked the drinks package prior to the changes, I told him I had screenshots of what was included on my phone up in my cabin but it was out of charge at that time and being temperamental charging on the in room port.

Eventually he spoke to someone else who was obviously a superior who must have confirmed they were included and told us they would be removed.

The next day when we checked, they hadn't been. We waited another day, still hadn't been removed.

Guest services again - spoke to a lady this time, explained everything including all that had been said on prior occasion. She printed each individual receipt then wrote package numbers on the top of them, confirmed the items were definately included and said she had to go to the individual bars to get the charges removed and she would do that.

Checked next day - still not removed. On our final night we went to try and sort it again - unfortunately got the same guy as the 1st attempt (you would think this would have been fortunate as surely he would remember speaking to his superior etc etc. - nope). We explained everything yet again, reminded him we had spoke to him and after speaking to his superior he had assured us he would remove the charges, we told him about the 2nd conversation with his colleague and her writing the package no on individual receipts and saying she would go to the bars etc. Again he took an inordinate amount of time on the computer, got the little book out again, hushed me when I tried to remind him we had the old classic drinks package. Printed out the classic package and showed us where it said ice cream in cup or cone (the items under scrutiny)- I said exactly and that is what the charges are for - ice cream in a cup & it states there it is included. Told him again between myself, my partner and my son we had had many of these of all different flavours so if it wasnt included why had we only been charged for 3. He just ignored me. I pointed at print out again, he ignored me, I asked to speak to a manager, he ignored me. He continued insisting it wasn't included. He tried to fob me off by saying the ice cream stated on the drinks package print off was the soft serve from the buffet (never mind they didn't have tubs in the buffet only cones, never mind thst the soft serve was nothing to do with any drinks package but was free for everyone).

This was at gone 1am when we had to be up before 7am to do self disembarkation to make the airport for our noon flight. Every other time we had looked at guest services that night the queue had been out into the corridor near the lifts. We were not prepared to spend our last night queuing that long so had waited until late.

Eventually as a result of frustration, stress, tiredness, getting absolutely nowhere etc I lost my temper. I acknowledged I was now losing my temper with the situation and said it was absolutely ridiculous. I didnt swear or call anyone names but I did get loud. The lady at the next service point asked me to calm down and said she would look into our query in a moment. We had been trying to sort the situation for getting on for 1 hour by then. I didn't calm down and just ended up saying you know what, forget it, we will just pay, its an absolute joke and we are getting nowhere so here is the money (I then threw a bundle of money over the counter). The lady at the next point was again telling me to calm down or they would call security. I told her to go ahead and that I was fine with spending the night in their cell (I was very angry and had just had enough of the situation. Also very tired and had an horrendous sore throat and was losing my vioce by now so wasn't shouting shouting but hoarsly trying to shout!) Surprise surprise though - suddenly a number of people appeared from the back office including a woman who said she was head of guest services.

She promptly looked at the situation, confirmed the items were indeed included in our package (not that I needed confirmation) and agreed that they would be removed 1st thing in the morning at 6.30am when she could speak to the relevant bar.

Maybe I embarrassed my partner and even myself somewhat  (though I dont regret it) but we were getting nowhere having spent the best part of 1 hour trying to sort it calmly. Within just over 5 mins of losing my temper it was sorted ... kind of. When we asked the woman in charge why we had been charged for some of these ice creams but not others she said that some staff knew what the codes signified and knew to override the system when it came up the item wasnt included when actually it was but other staff didn't know to do this. So the old packages ARE NOT programmed into the scanners but rely on the staff knowing all these different packages. Another couple we spoke to who also had classic package and soft drinks package for their kids were not only getting charges for the gelato like us but also several times for cokes - so what was going on there I don't know.

To end the saga, the following morning at 7am the charges were still on! We really thought it was going to be a nightmare again but my partner went down (I couldnt face it again and since my partner had left it all to me on each prior occasion then wondered why I lost my temper, he could deal with it now). But the woman in charge must have left a note on the computer as the man my partner spoke to just phoned up to the bars and the charges were removed.

I know I have kind of gone off topic but my point is it is not the service charge you need to worry about removing - rather it is faulty charges for items included in your packages that you will have a nightmare with.

It is such a shame that this was our final experience onboard as everything else over the duration of our 2 week cruise had been fantastic and this issue could have been so easily avoided with better systems and staff training rather than causing as much stress and wasted time as it did.

2 hours ago, Omega1 said:

The impact is the same but the methodology isn’t - one is legal,  the other isn’t (in the UK). As others have said, MSC should now build the DSC into the upfront cost, but they probably won’t because they want to advertise low fares. There will be people who are new to cruising where the t&c’s they have been given make no reference to a mandatory DSC, MSC hasn’t directly informed them and their TAs don’t even know about it. How can that be fair? Is it MSC stiffing the passenger?

 

This last part of this comment describes my situation to a T. As a first time cruiser I had no knowledge of auto gratuities/daily service charge and no reason to suspect there would be one. I thought I had researched my cruise (all online) quite well and knew what would cost extra if I chose to add them (drinks packages, excursions, certain restaurants, spa, internet, photos etc.). You don't know to look for something you don't even suspect.

Of course I had in mind that at the end of my holiday I would tip certain staff - bar, waiters and room stewards in the same way I do on a holiday in a hotel.

Upon booking my TA never informed me of this daily charge in over 20 emails exchanged between us and 4 telephone calls (and I did point out to her that this would be our 1st cruise).

I found out some time later via a Facebook group. Via the same group I also found out that many people "opt" out and tip staff direct. I also read debates about whether the auto daily charge actually went to the front line staff.

Based on everything (not having known about the charge at the outset and thus not having worked it into my budget, the option to tip direct & the debate over where the auto charge actually went) I decided to tip direct & yes I will admit that the amount wouldn't have come to the £400 that would be added the daily charge way.

At no point did I believe this made me mean or tight or that I shouldn't cruise. My family and I have saved for 4 years for this cruise. It is by far the most expensive holiday I have ever had and a "once in a lifetime" type experience for us. To now be told the daily charge is mandatory weeks prior to going (6th April) is like a slap in the face - and again to find out via a Facebook group is unprofessional to say the least.

Hi

Whilst in port in ocho rios (arrival 9am/departure 5pm as per ships itinary) we are hoping to go to dunns river falls, blue hole and the bobsled on mystic mountain. 2 adults and an11 year old child. Please could I get advice re:

1. Is it feasible to do all 3 in the time we will have - once disembarked and getting back on ship the required 30 or 60 mins before departure?

2. Is it best to hire a tour guide/driver for the whole day or get taxis to and from each location.

3. How much is a reasonable expected amount to pay for each of the above alternatives? (The entrance fee for the 3 of us is $61 Dunns River; $184 Mystic mountain bobsled and $45 Blue Hole - so $290 for entrance fees - how much on top for all day driver or taxi to each place and back to port.

4. Recommended companies if goung for all day driver - already contacted and awaiting reply from Jacques Tours and Marvyns Paradise. Any other companies recommended.

5. Do these companies guarantee that they will get you back to your ship on time and what do you tell them re what time to meet you given you don't know how long from arrival in port it will take to clear customs etc and disembark.

Thanks for any tips

Andrea 

730 am will put you in rush hour traffic. So 15 minutes to the airport may not be accurate.

Is it rush hour even on Saturday? If so how long do you estimate to get to airport? Thanks

It is doable if things go to plan, but is tight.

 

You have to hope customs / passport control do not hold you up and you are able to get a taxi to the airport without queuing.... something that may be difficult given the passenger count.

 

Is there not a later option? If it was an hour more, I’d personally be comfortable.... but less so because you are reliant on immigration and transport which could* delay you.

No later option for our budget - it would be on the Sunday which then wouldnt get us back into the UK until the Monday and my partner would have to then go straight to work after long flights and my son would miss another day off school (he's already missing Fri 5th) which is really frowned upon in the UK nowadays. Even the Sunday one is £400 more expensive.

Can we increase our chances of quicker disembarking by being ready at in the area you disembark from at 6.30am/7.00am?

Thanks CruiserBruce

if we get in line to disembark at 7am - will that allow us to get off asap?

- is it correct that it takes approx 15mins in taxi from port to airport?

Hi All

Our cruise onboard MSC Seaside ends in Miami at 7.30am. If we express disembark will we have enough time to make a 12:15 flight out of Miami. Do we have to be at the airport 2 hours before flight time or longer (it's 2 hours in UK but I don't know if its the same in USA). Thanks for any advice.