TampaMike

I am aboard Eurodam. I am 5 star and prepurchased Premium wifi. A 5 star credit was added to my onboard account but then reversed. So no you do not get both Prepaid benefits and then a Mariner credit atop of the prepaid  charge. Prepaid packages do seem to be the better value over the Mariner credit at the onboard rate. I cannot speak for a prepaid lower tier and onboard upgrade, you need to do the math.

Starlink is now on Eurodam. Overall connectivity is good, but still has room for improvement. Streaming has hiccups. I have an Android 13 phone and occasionally need to clear cache. With Android, the Airplane mode will block text and Wi-Fi calling. So I  leave Airplane mode off, but set network for NO DATA, Wi-Fi calling ON and Intl Roaming off.  This will keep your Android using wifi for all data and voice communication. It will also prevent your phone from using the ships cellular transponders $$$. What a surprise to have my phone ring while onboard with Caller ID.

I also use Nord VPN and can access bank, utility, home security cams / smart home and various apps with VPN active. However Navigator is not very stable. Periodically I have to close Navigator, momentarily disable VPN, relaunch Navigator then re-enable the VPN. I can watch TV programs on Pluto and home TV provider via their apps.

Also, I have experienced on recent cruises from FLL that onboard WiFi and Navigator are unstable on embarkation until the next day.  HAL should not charge or credit for these days.

Overall, not perfect, but works much better than wifi a few years ago.  It is not as seamless as they project for the top tier. But now I leave the laptop home.

Seems like a lot of people are fretting about what they cannot control nor what they have complete factual information.  The majority of dialog here is speculation.  Breadcrumbs of facts at most, do not tell the whole story. 

For the record, Florida is already under a state of emergency declaration.  As with hurricanes and other disasters, this permits the state to receive federal funding for emergent care and support.

Can we defer the invoicing for now and feed positive thoughts, prayers and healthy distraction to those in need?

Priorities.

HAL currently has approx 1000 employees in Seattle - only a portion of them are assigned cruise, flight reservation for passengers.  But I am sure 'all hands on deck' is real right now.

HAL currently has approx 15,000 passengers at sea / aboard ships right now. Many will need assistance rebooking flights and debarkation changes still fluid as ports close and ships halted mid cruise. Even if every employee was assigned to address this, 1 employee for every 15 pax needing assistance (for perspective). 

HAL has fleet wide crew disposition to arrange as all are not staying aboard during lay up.

HAL has to address informing cancellations for the announced 30 day shut down.

HAL has to address potential cancellations based on port closures announced past the 30 day shut down (i.e. Canada).

HAL / Carnival / Cruise Lines has to be sourcing insurance, legal and government guidance to keep operations in place.  in today's world, sharing information to quickly or incorrectly will be met with litigation.

HAL has, right now, real time, crew who do not know how to get home, if they can, how will they pay for it, will they be held  en-route, once leaving the ship. etc, etc, etc.

Is that enough to 'excuse' HAL from not updating their website and booking mechanism?

Indeed.  Cruise lines do not call the shots as to which port they may enter.  It may be planned, but as we see, that can be countered by the port officials.  This is a very fluid situation and what is happening behind the scenes is likely changing before it can be communicated to those affected.

For those cruises still in progress, with anticipation to end 'as scheduled' - do not be surprised if they terminate early in whatever port the cruise line can get docking permission, as just what happened with Rotterdam in Puerto Vallarta.    

5 minutes ago, neuronbob said:

Well.  This sucks.  I’ll have to call in to reschedule.  It’s for the greater good, but still disappointing now that it’s here.

Same neuronbob from AZ?

Although we have no details, I would assume that passengers will not be permitted ashore except for being dispatched in groups directly to their charter flights.  I would expect the debarkation over a few days is being coordinated to dispatch by charter flight group.

There is a lot of legal mumbling here with assumed 'facts'.  While ships do their best to monitor and report SYMPTOMS of the caronavius - there is no means to declare no one on board is infected or a carrier from exposure.  Caronavirus test kits are just being distributed in the past few days.  I do not think these test kits are aboard Westerdam or any ship jockeying the reactions from public, political entities or the media.  At this juncture, no cough, no fever or typical respiratory infection symptoms are ASSUMED to mean no caronavirus.  The second best tool of the moment is the 14 day clear for any incubation period.  However, once one case is identified, the potential quarantine clock is restarted.

This thread brings back many memories.  It also makes me think my November Niew Amsterdam voyage will be my last with HAL.

Interesting names here.  When I was CD on Crown Odyssey and Star Odyssey I had on team, Frank Buckingham as port lecturer, Barbara Haenni was future cruise consultant and Kevin Farwell was Shorex Manager.  Fine people who deliver(ed) a product HAL cannot support nor understand.

I sailed the May 28 Maasdam 21 Day Alaska.  I will never tire of Alaska.  The EXC staff did a decent job of lectures and it was better than my Rotterdam cruise last December.  But counting the list of tradition cruise events, activities and personnel that HAL has done away with makes it painful to remember how wonderful cruising can be.  HAL is an oxymoron.  It is the traditional cruise brand that has banished nearly all aspects of traditional cruising.  I am convinced HAL management is not experienced in the cruise experience and would go so far to say is they have contempt for traditional cruising and those (us) who appreciate it.  Only HAL can take a simple activity as daily trivia and turn it into a shell of an experience.  They do not understand that a social staff is important to engage passengers in activities no so much for the activity, but for the relationships built between guests and between crew / staff and guests.  THAT is what makes cruising special.  Those relationships, those memories and the result of a simple trivia game, golf putting event, a poolside mixer, an on deck evening under the stars, a voyage long competition of some silly nature.  THOSE are the experiences people remember...not by the activity itself, but of the people they met, enjoyed and relationships forged.  HAL management cannot comprehend that is the greatest component of an ocean voyage.  We chose a ship - not a hotel where you would never speak to the people in the next room.  The most poignant representation I see of HAL's effort to engage it's guest is a dumbed down, daily program that might as well be an a sales flyer and most of the activities are run by some very busy staff member named 'unhosted'.

EXC would have had a chance if it did not try to replace traditional cruising activities.  It would have been successful if the guides were out and about to socialize more than the 20 minute hit and run meetings they were programmed to do.  But not even the ships musicians even behave as ships crew....aside from their music sets they were more relaxed, chilled out and using ships resources more than the paying passengers.  There is no decorum there anymore.

So HAL will indeed replace EXC with one day denture vendors and the like.  Mr Prince has been on a mission to kill off cruise staff, Hostesses and CDs for years (who knows what his beef is with traditional cruises and more puzzling is how HAL management permits him to do so).  Personally I do not miss the cast shows as the cast was often too young with too much time on their hands so they engaged in attention getting prima donna stunts onboard.  The best casts were those who share cruise staff activities and socializing which was their best product and it brought people to the shows to see the friends they made who hosted shuffleboard.  I fear with HAL, the passenger is not their focus anymore. Only your wallet is.  

So I will see what happens on Niew Amsterdam this fall.  But each voyage for the last few years has been more a memory of what has been lost and less of a memory to relive in the future.

The remains as her last iteration Ocean Dream, being dismantled:

The former star/ship Atlantic refloated in Goa and sent for scrap:

http://englishnews.thegoan.net/story.php?id=38352

The star/ship Oceanic scrapped in China and the star/ship Royal sunk (as SeaBreeze) off the mid Atlantic US coast.

These were the original PCL ships during it's days as Official Cruise Line of Walt Disney World.  All of which were my home for some time.  Always painful to see the end.

Meaning of co-branding is a tie in between two brands in attempt to draw more attention and consumption of the brand(s).  HAL pays to have a connection with these brands in expectation to improve revenue.

Examples:  Oprah, Microsoft, Sophia Fiori, New York Times, ESPN, Cariloha, etc.  None of these I see as any investment that improves the cruise experience.

Some do work, such as BB King, America's Test Kitchen (maybe, not my interest, but seems to please some passengers).

But overall, I think some of the co-branding would be money better spent on improving the cruising experience over attaching brands that IMHO do nothing for the cruising experience - especially when so much of basic cruise activities have been cut.

In short, you want me to cruise HAL more. make the CRUISE the focus.  Adding co-branding experiences is a nice addition when your foundation product (a CRUISE) is strong.  I feel HAL's cruise experience has been pummeled into anonymity and no amount of co-branding gee whiz will compensate for that.  Put the money where it matters, HAL.

As I stated previously, as I watch this brand devolve, I wonder if the Seattle management making such decisions even LIKE cruises.

Just off 3 weeks on Rotterdam.  There were one or two performers in Main Stage I thought were good.  But I have to agree with the majority of comments above.  HAL seems more interested in spending money on co-branding activities than investing in live entertainment / musicians / performers / social staff. There were many evenings before or after dinner you could walk the Upper Prom Deck (the primary evening entertainment venues) and the only think you would hear is air conditioning hiss.  What little they have left is scheduled poorly for the standard dinner sitting guests.  If you just count the number of empty stages in the various rooms of the ship you can see how much has been cut back in favor of co branding.  They even close the upper level of Main Stage now - so little attendance.  Sail Away is now 2 speakers and recorded music.  No live bands at the 'Sea-No-Pool' or the Lido Pool. No Mix Entertainer.  No Crows Nest entertainer.  But hey, some Oprah consultant told me how to wear metallic eye shadow and use a scarf as a belt.  I feel so enriched - thank's O.

The strings remain a blessed reminder of HAL.  They were the most attended live entertainment, with the Piano Bar performer a close second.  The CD Rebekah and her ACD Kelly were far better caliber than HAL deserves.  If they had astaff, it could be a nice activity schedule.  The Ocean Bar was usually on break when I passed by, and not even recorded break music.  And speaking of music, the ship's 'musak' was the worst mix of disjointed, poor audio quality and irritating tunes which was not rotated in 3 weeks.  Digital music is cheap...but not even HAL can muster up for that.  Whoever in Seattle approved this noise should be locked in a room for 3 weeks with this on replay for punishment.   The paint chipping atop of Crows Nest was a welcomed addition.

HAL has lost itself.  It is trying so hard not to be a cruise line.  They pay a good chunk of change to co-brand with non cruise stuff they have all but decimated the cruising experience.  Personally, I think that cash should be invested to the waning cruise product, musicians, social staff and Seattle management should be asked 'do you EVEN like cruising?'.

Add Maasdam 28 May 2019:  21 Day Ultimate Alaska r/t San Francisco

Maasdam June 29, 2018 14 Day Canada / New England (Boston - Boston)

Rotterdam December 2, 2018 21 Day Southern / Western Caribbean (Tampa)

I am sitting in the Crows Nest right now and there is no Christmas music. Nor was there any in th we Lido at breakfast earlier. I have not heard 24/7 Christmas music in public areas. Since leaving last Tampa, I would say 75% was holiday music and some Big a band sprinkled in. Since there are 4 music channels onboard, what usually happens is the staff changes the channels in their work area before going totally mad. Seattle may mandate the programming from ashore, but it is easily overridden by the flip of a switch by a quivering hand.

I can also promise you for every complaint on the holiday music there is one to counter due to lack thereof.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Forums mobile app

There is sushi almost every day in the Lido Market's Asian Station. The only day I did not see Sushi was the Indonesian day. I found it fresh and not chilled. But due to the buffet venue, the selections are typically limited to 3 types of rolls.

The new menus have the vegan, chef suggestion, heathy choice each night. Still there is beef, pasta and a seafood most nights. The soup and salad courses is more limited, with Ceasar salad and French onion soup the mainstays (however there area salad entrees). My only gripe is that when cruising, I like to have lobster, duck and lamb during the voyage and these offerings are usually offered together on gala nights only.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Forums mobile app

I am aboard Oosterdam right now. The area you question is the Casino office and storage.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Forums mobile app

I was aboard this cruise and I am still aboard for the next 3 weeks. There will always be pros and cons to changes made. Concerning the library reduction, the primary reason was to reduce staff members by dropping the librarian as the cabin space was needed to accommodate the additional musicians with billboard and BB King. There were sections of shelving removed from the library with additional seating added especially the row of windows opposite of the coffee bar. Where the Crow's Nest falls down is it no longer is an evening venue as there is no piano player or movement of other musicians to the Crow's Nest to draw people up there in the evening. After Sundown, it is cold dark and silent.

Concerning the Lincoln Center arrangement, yes they have chopped the Explorer's Lounge in half. The pro is you still have opportunity for both an intimate musical presentation and a adjacent lounge environment. The lounge portion actually became the better quiet reading place during the daytime as The Crows Nest / Library was used for two or three trivias a day along with the chatter of the coffee bar. And the Lincoln Center theater although not as comfortable allows more intimate focus on the musicians. In the past the strings or chamber music was often interrupted by the noise of people passing from the dining room past the open air Explorers Lounge with no regard for the live musicians or the passengers enjoying the intimacy of the venue.

Shockingly the Dueling Pianos for billboard actually caused the removal of some casino games. But it does blend nicely between the casino and the new Gallery bar. I like the Gallery Bar but I just find the lighting too bright inside.

I think the Ocean Bar changes are a mistake. I miss having the Neptunes in the Ocean Bar. There was always music spilling throughout the atrium area on various decks, all the way down to the atrium bar and even the front office before dinner. Now you have trivia babble filling the atrium. It was also very difficult to get bar service anywhere unless you sit right at the bar itself.

Last, the change in musicians and venues has removed having poolside music outside of steel drummer. This is the case either under the Lido pool or the Sea View pool during sail away. I always enjoyed the Halcats playing poolside during the lunch time it seemed a bit lively especially when the weather was poor.

This attempt to add more music venues seems to also truncate some traditional aspects of the product. Trivia is so popular because they simply do not have the staff to handle more activities. And they no longer utilize a cruise staff with focus on socialization and activities. If you were to ask for a hostess onboard a Holland America ship you would be likely to be handed a Twinkie.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Forums mobile app

The delay for embarkation yesterday had several factors. With the Oosterdam's initial arrival in Tampa, there were several inspections from the USCG, USPH and all crew needed to be inspected by CBP. None of that can be controlled by HAL. Add to that the need to sanitize the ship, restore the ship's depleted stores, a large crew turnover typical of a seasonal re-positioning and yes, the embarkation will be impacted.

Further, it is not appropriate for Captain's Albert's blog to be the information source for situations as this. This is to be communicated by HAL corporate and once on board, the Captain (of the ship) and Medical officers.

https://parkwayparking.com/location/cruise-parking-port-of-tampa?gclid=CjwKEAjwkJfABRDnhbPlx6WI4ncSJADMQqxduo3L4dVDOzaUVBDpD14KQH5X96WpxqqR5TO4LIcocBoCrR7w_wcB

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=tampa cruise parking&tbs=lf:1,lf_ui:3,lf_pqs:EAE&rflfq=1&rlha=0&rllag=27949488,-82487422,4116&tbm=lcl&rldimm=1746848551134655002&fll=27.946214055502214,-82.44580457724612&fspn=0.1753154522721374,0.14249151380391822&fz=12&oll=27.9679222,-82.4882298&ospn=0.06701523994971126,0.09647693566125781&oz=12&qop=1&rlfi=hd:;si:1746848551134655002

I've sailed on two Prinsendam cruises while Capt. Roberts was serving as master. On one, in the Explorer's Lounge one evening, he expressed his fondness of previously working on board Windstar ships. The Windstar brand was of course once owned by HAL, but is no longer. So it seems to have joint HAL from a linked company, and now has moved over to another linked company (within the HAL group).

 

One thing that I have wondered about is the possible future British exit from the EU. I know the referendum was to encourage that to happen, but the Brexit hasn't actually been scheduled, to my knowledge. Also, since HAL ships are flagged in the EU, the master must be a citizen of the EU (as I understand things). An allowance seems to be made for citizens of the English Commonwealth, as they seem to be accepted as long as the UK is part of the EU.

 

In the past, HAL had a mix of Dutch and Bahamian flagged ships, with the British captains only on the Bahamian flagged ships. HAL only re-flagged all their ships under the Dutch flag once the EU passed a rule that member countries could not have rules favoring their own citizens over other EU citizens. Once that was true, Brits could command Dutch flagged ships.

 

In the future, if the Brexit actually happens, HAL will either need to re-flag some ships outside the EU once again or recruit more EU citizens as captains and send their current English Commonwealth captains to other lines with ships flagged outside the EU.

 

I see Seabourn ships are flagged in the Bahamas. So Tim Roberts would be welcome there. Perhaps more British/Canadian/New Zealand officers now at HAL will move to Seabourn and Norwegian (or EU officers) might move to HAL.

 

This is all just a theory. I have no idea how much longer English Commonwealth citizens will be able to serve on EU ships, and it might be indefinitely. But if we see more senior deck department officer swaps between HAL and Seabourn, that might hint as to what the executives of the HAL Group are thinking.

The HAL ships are all registered in Rotterdam. Although the Netherlands are part of the EU, the Maritime certifications are aligned by country, not the EU as a whole. The Netherlands and UK have complimentary certifications which permits UK Officers to serve on Dutch registered ships. This was a purposeful alignment, as HAL could not recruit sufficient Dutch maritime candidates (who tend to gravitate towards better paying merchant & oil shipping positions). You are correct that UK Officers could contract to Bahamian registered HAL ships - but that was too limiting. Also being part of Carnival Corp, there were already a pool of UK officers from Cunard, P&O & Princess. This would permit assignments across brands as needed. In fact several UK HAL officers are still with the P&O Pacific Even and Pacific Aria (former Statendam & Ryndam) which are no longer registered in Rotterdam but now UK registered. This was all decided and arranged well before Brexit was on the radar. It occurred several years ago when HAL registered the entire fleet in Rotterdam.

But again, the maritime regulations are specific by country and not necessarily reciprocal. You will not find Greek certified captains (part of the EU) on HAL ships unless they have acquired additional certifications from the Netherlands or UK.

Also, FYI - The Arison Maritime Training Center in Amsterdam this past July to serve training for all 10 Carnival brands (over 6,500 bridge officers).

Thanks for the info TampaMike. I'm not surprised that the S class ships are being dealt before Prinsendam as we were told several times the S class were not profitable compared to the Prinsendam. Do you think HAL will give up on the more exotic itinerarys?

I do not think HAL will have any major change in itinerary offerings when Prinsendam leaves. As far as the S-Class, they can be replaced with a Vista for the most part - and Vista's are already sailing former S & R class itineraries (i.e Australia, Caribbean from Tampa, Tahiti, Europe & Alaska).

I do expect HAL will replace the Prinsendam with some other smallish 'Elegant Explorer' type for those Kiel Canal transits, and the Amazon. With Seabourn's newbuilds, it is possible that should Seabourn not be able to fill them one could easily transfer to HAL as a Prinsendam III. Again, HAL, Seabourn and Princess are merging Maritime Operations.

Prinsendam has been listed for sale with ship brokers for over a decade. At some point operational / maintenance costs will exceed profitability (Prinsendam has the highest profit margin per person in the fleet). And since she sails mostly full she still satisfies as a HAL product. But until the point is reached where she is not profitable, will require too much investment operationally or has lost market draw HAL will field potential buyers.

For that matter, virtually ANY cruise ship is for sale....given the right price. Or charter....the last generation Nieuw Amsterdam and Noordam sailing under Thomson Cruises are still owned by HAL.

Veendam is also actively listed with brokers (but may not have much interest from buyers) and I believe the Maasdam is under a purchase agreement (perhaps not finalized) to leave the fleet after the 2017 season.

As several have mentioned it is due to the Europe market facing many challenges. The Eastern Med (Turkey) is becoming less friendly for cruise ships. The embarkation ports of Athens and Civitavecchia have been nightmares for the cruise lines these past seasons with strikes at the port, stevedore strikes and transportation strikes (train, bus and even taxi). Capacity is surplus with more ships staying longer seasons into winter and megaships deployed to the Med cannot be filled. HAL cannot rely on North Americans to fill the ships and Europeans travelling habits are reacting to economy and socio political issues on the continent. North Africa is all but off limits with even Costa with year round presence in the Med, reducing calls. And reminiscent of the Haitian boat lift of the 80s in the Caribbean, cruise ships are regularly called to standby for refugees fleeing North Africa. Suez transits are becoming rare and not uncommon for a military vessel to escort (as was Prinsendam). For some time now, cruise ships have been a concern for attacks in the area and quietly precautions are mounting. One incident will all but shut down the Med market.

This happened to the Prinsendam back in 2004 when she was abruptly yanked from eastern Med deployment and re-positioned to SFO for 14 day Alaska cruises. I am sure HAL is sorry for the inconvenience (with reasonable forewarning), but the stakes are getting high.

In a way, he is not really leaving HAL as HAL and Seabourn maritime departments are one. Quite possible there will be officers commuting between the brands, as did Captain Dag (who I worked with aboard Song of Flower over a decade ago).

There are two basic components of your cruise per diem / pd (cost per day per person).

The first is your cruise fare. This is what it takes to get you onboard the ship. This is the marketed / competitive price for the brand, as related to it's market segment, competition, ratings and itinerary demand. This is the price MOST people use to determine which cruise to buy. Per diems of $100 -$125 day/person has not changed much in 30 years. In fact, more often LOWER per diems are available in today's rich cruise market offerings (those < $599 seven day cruise offers). Once onboard the second component comes into play: Onboard Revenue (OBR).

Onboard revenue is really where the cruise lines track profit margin. Most cruise lines have a target OBR expected for each passenger (on average) for each ship, itinerary and season. As well all know, OBR has infiltrated much of the cruise experience. Some view that as an intrusion (being nickel'd and dime'd) while others tune it out and capitalize on the still low per diem rates and remain thrifty onboard. OBR includes, tours, bar, casino, shops, spa and every incidental imaginable they can shoehorn in (poolside teeth whitening....really?).

With today's technology, cruise lines can track the ship's daily real time OBR. Those convenient scannable cards (boarding pass / cabin key) are watched real time by shoreside OBR tracking applications (with most major sophisticated cruise lines, Carnival, RCI, NCL). They can determine if the average OBR targets are being made even before the voyage has ended. So say, a day at sea is not tallying up well they can advise the onboard management to offer new, additional or revised promotions to get the $$$ flowing. So remember each time the barman swipes your card, some accountant shoreside smiles (and maybe an angel gets it's wings).

What can be shocking is the ACTUAL per diems realized. Take your cruise TOTAL cost (cruise fare + the total of your OBR charged to your cabin folio) and divide by the # of days = your per diem rate....whether solo a couple or a family unit. Mainstream to premium cruise lines per diems run as low as $75 - $200 pdpp (based on double occupancy standard cabin - oceanview). Luxury lines usually track $225+ but may include, gratuities, tours, some or all alcohol, premium accommodations, etc. So if you compare your actual pd to luxury line offerings you may find you are paying more for the mainstream / premium product. But because we shop by cruise fare, most never realize that opportunity.

There are overlaps of course, a suite on a mainstream ship is not an apples to apples comparison to a standard outside double on a luxury (however most luxury line offerings are already in the suite level accommodations wise). This also factors in ship density or space per passenger ratio. Further, studies show that clientele who shop by fare price are actually more prone to overspend onboard (with exception to those 'thrify' cruisers...you know who you are). THAT is what the cruise lines are banking on and the ship is designed to achieve that. This is the Carnival model. Start with the average pd you wish to achieve and compete with, build a ship with amenities and programs that will enable you to achieve such. And of course econonmy of scale has be refined and honed to the mega-ships we see today.

While HAL has been a value premium product (though fares are rising), the true luxury brand cruisers may, in fact, be the real 'pay one price' cruisers realizing the best per diem.