MrCo9

I have a question for anyone here who has worked craps tables. On my upcoming cruise, I expect the table to be lightly patronized - often I am the only player. So, they only open one half of the table. I am strictly right-handed and prefer the RS1 ir 2 position. If they open the left half, is it a bad breach of etiquette to ask them to change to the right half, or should I just play on the open side?

I have never worked a cruise ship, JUST 15 years experience in Las Vegas as a dealer and a supervisor. At some casinos you the player are given the "Take it or leave it" option. In other words, "This is how we run OUR casino, if you don't like it, go spend your $$ somewhere else". At others it's "The customer is KING", if you want the base dealer to move 6 feet one way or the other so that YOU are comfortable, that is what we are going to do for you the player.

 

It doesn't make any sense, when they do open the other side, another dealer just shows up and they move some chip stacks over to him. Perhaps if the table is empty, tell them you'll be back when the other side is open. Sounds to me they are just being lazy.

Sounds like you are right to me. OR some dealers are better at dealing one base and not the other. OR they were not very customer service oriented.

 

Me, I am comfortable rolling from any position on the table. I can roll a 7 when there is a point from anywhere.

So I want to play around $20 on a $5 table. What is better PASS with 3X odds or PASS 1X with place the 6 & 8?

Depends on what rolls first, the point or the 6 or 8. Make sure you bring your crystal ball to know for sure.

"If the shooter does not seven out or make his point, eventually they will announce "last three rolls." "Last two rolls." "Last roll." Here is a hint...Whenever it gets down to "last roll," and it does not happen often, bet the table max on the come. If the last roll is a seven or eleven (8 chances), you win. If the last roll is a craps (4 chances) you lose. Any other roll, you get the come bet back. Odds are two to one in your favor. You will never get better odds than that in a casino." That's my strategy when I am in a craps tournament. I will hedge with a "any craps" bet to cover the bet.

I agree with you about not always playing the pass/don't pass. Curious to understand a bit more about your strategy in changing your betting style. how do you play it?

I don't have a set way of playing. If I'm at a casino that offers better than 3-4-5 xs odds I will probably bet all the numbers and go down with odds as they roll. Instead of making bigger come bets, I like to place place bets after a number has rolled 3 times. That way, I can have just my place bets, or just my come bets working at one time or another if I get spooked. If I come up and start a dead table I might be on the dark side. I figure there is a reason they are dead and I doubt it was because the other players left with full pockets. Other times I'll be on the Don't Pass for $50 or $75 and take the other numbers for $52, $54, $78 or $81, take 5 or 6 few hits and then place the point for $60 if it's a 6 0r 8 $55 on a 5 or 9 and $40 on a 4 or 10, almost guaranteeing a profit no matter if the point is rolled or a 7 out comes instead.

 

I had my own interesting situation with some cards at a black jack table in Las Vegas earlier this summer. They had to bring in a all new cards to make up a fresh shoe. Took a long time.

Do you know why they changed cards on a live game? If a drink was spilled on the table they will usually just change the affected cards. Usually they will wait until a game has no players before changing the cards. Even then a decent dealer will have the new cards in play in less than 5 minutes. Which can seem like an eternity if you were on a roll.

Here is what I was thinking instead of playing my "usual":

 

Roll #1

- $60 DP Bet w/$2 Yo

 

Roll #2

- $30 DC Bet

- Place $72 inside, $100 no 4 and no 10

 

Roll #3

- #45 DC Bet

- Drop to $48 inside and only one $100 no 4 or 10 bet

 

After third roll, come down off of the inside bets and the no 4/10.

 

My thinking with this strategy:

 

I see the numbers coming on the inside and I think I could make money money on those with the place bet. Of course, If a 4/10 come out I lose the $100. But even if I lose the $100, I'm still in 2/1 position with the $45 or $30 to win a portion of it back. Another option is on Row #2 to not place the 5/9, but only place the 6/8...and leave only one lay bet up...but I haven't thought through that yet.

 

Just curious to get thoughts/constructive criticisms.

How exactly would you be spreading your $72 and 48 inside? $6 on 6 and 8 and $30 on 5 and 9? Or $36 on 6 and 8 and $0 on 5 and 9? $66 and $44 would be more reasonable. I've watched people lay the 4 and 10 progressively, each time taking their winnings and adding it to their original bet. They all lose eventually. The reason the casinos spend the extra $1 in ink to put those numbers on the layout is they DO roll.

 

I feel the ONLY way to win at craps is to be flexible enough to change your betting style. Always play the do or the don't and in the long run you'll lose.

Three card poker goes too fast for me. My wife plays the three card poker side bet on Let It Ride. She has had some sizable wins at it.

 

I'll play blackjack if the craps is not open. But its a long hard grind to make any money. I do enjoy watching those that split 10's.:rolleyes:

How can any game besides craps and roulette go to fast??? The dealer can not move forward until you have decided to play your hand. Players control the pace of the game at 21, let it ride, 3 card poker etc..

Was at the Sands in Pa. last night and while playing craps a gentleman can to the table threw $200. on the table and said "$200. don't come" I did not pay much attention to this at the time. There were three tables going and I noticed him roaming from table to table.

So my question: How would he get paid and how much?

A little more info: The point was up.....$15 table...3x,4x,5x odds. He did not have odds.

I did go home with $200 of their money. A good day for me.

Thanks in advance

ed :D

While his money sat on the Don't Come spot he would have won on 2 or 3 and lost on 7 or 11. The chips would have sat behind the next number rolled and he would have won if the 7 rolled before that number rolled again and he would have lost if that number rolled again.

If you want a fun sucker bet, put it on the yo.

$15 dollars is nothing to brag about. Turning $1 into $1,000 NOW that's a story.

Rolled 4 individual points at the Hilton the other day, made the 9 twice and I was on the 6 for the second time when the dreaded 7 rolled. I won $125 on that "Sucker bet" and the dealers made $25 on it. I rolled for about 15 minutes with 2 other players on the table. Table was VERY bouncy and 5 or 6 times I had a die leave the table. I'd just ask for a specific die out of te bowl and kept on rolling. I started with $34 in when I was shooting and had $350 in profit when my roll was over, dealers made $100-150 on line, place and Fire Bet. Next two rollers had lousy rolls. But I was hoping for good things as 1 of them was a first time roller, so I bet BIG on her $255 spread between the 5, 6 and 8 and $35 in the field. After establishing the point she rolled 9 and then 7. I went $160 across including on the next shooter, he rolled 3 8s, I took mine to $42, then $60 and made my 6 $60 and the next roll was a 7. Had a good time, but lost $110.

 

That night at work a shooter rolled 5 different points and was on the 6th when the 7 rolled. He held the dice for 40 minutes and made less than $200 as all we could get him to bet was $10 on the Pass Line with $10 odds. Only 1 person was on the Fire Bet for $1.

Have any of you ever won big with this outrageously impossible bet?

I have rolled 4 points three times while having $5 (for me) and $1 (for the dealers) on the Fire Bet. Only one time did I come out on the 5th point and I forgot to lay against it. It was a point of 4 and I probably would have laid $400 against it as rolling the 4 would have gotten me $1250, laying it for $400 (All I ad in the rail at the time) would have won me an additional $190 ($400/2 less $10 vig).

 

Last night at Caesars Palace someone rolled all 6 points with 5 people on the Fire Bet including the shooter. 2 people had $5 each on it, 2 had $10 and one person had $3 on it. Even with the $33,000 payoff the casino probably still made $$ with the bet as it's been a few months since all 6 numbers rolled when someone had a bet on it.

Wheel biases aside, who has more control over an outcome of a game of chance: a player making a random roll of dice or a trained dealer rolling a ball around a wheel?

I'm going with trained dealer. My best friend that used to deal in Las Vegas and is now back in AC as a supervisor was hired to demonstrate a new wheelead at a trade show and I watched him land the ball 9 rolls out of 10 in a 6 number section of the wheel for 30 minutes. He can not make it land on red or Black, odd or even, high or low, but if you were to take 6 consecutive numbers on the wheel 00, 1, 13, 36, 24 and 3 he could make te ball land on one of those numbers 9 times out of 10. He swore e'd never do it on a live game and I believe him, but I did see im do it on a demonstration game.

HHHHHEEEEELLLLLLLLLLOOOOO MrCo9: It may have been a 4+ hour roll, however, were players making hardway bets and prop bets? I don't know, I wasn't there, just heard about it a few hours after it happened as I was working at a Las Vegas Boyd property later that day. If so this could have led to the 4+ hour roll because it would have taken longer to pay out the prop bets and hardway bets. If players were just making Pass Line, Come, Don't Pass and Don't Come bets with odds the payouts would have taken less time. Really???? I've only been dealing and supervising on Las Vegas craps tables for 14 years, really didn't need you telling me that prop bets can slow a game down. BUT, they sure can make a casino a LOT of $$, that is why a good stickman (From the casino's point of view), not only knows the payouts, but they SELL the prop box at EVERY opportunity. Or did the shooter keep rolling numbers for that time defying what the odds would be for a seven to come up? Having been the shooter when a few good rolls came up from personal experience when you had lots of players making prop bets and hardway bets that slowed the game down.

A good dealer will have the prop box payouts ready to go after they are done paying the place bets or line on teir side of the table. Makes te game go faster.

 

Not sure about the other players, but the shooter at the Borgata was a 2nd time player. Started with $100 and was pretty happy with winning less than $5,000.

PLUS, the Borgata is where the 4+ hour roll occurred.

I don't think Andy knows what a call bet. The definition of a call bet (From a casino worker's stanpoint) is a bet called out when no chips or cash is visible.

 

They can be used to take a shot: "I want 5 on the Pass Line" "You have 5 on the Pass Line, bet" 7 rolls on the Come Out and the player pulls out 5 $100 bills from left side pants pocket and claims they had $500. 2 rolls and a $5 bill comes out of the right side pants pocket.

 

Or person has $100 bill in hand "I want $80 red, $20 white" 7 rolls and player claims they had $80 on Big Red AKA the 7.

If the table is dead and you are the only one there why not announce your change? Let the dealer know you are going right side so there is no confusion. ( i am aware the placement of your bet should give it away)

You're absolutely right. What I should have done was left my bet on the Don't pass, but say "I'm betting $100 on the Pass Line" that way I can not lose. Even though my chips would be on the Don't Pass, I announced that I was betting the pass line and the dealers would have to pay me no matter which way the dice rolled.

 

Sorry, but after 12 years as a dice dealer and supervisor I go by one rule and one rule ONLY. "The chips play as they lay."

Does "flexible" mean you play hunches?

You betcha, rub my lucky rabbit's foot and bet whatever my troll doll tells me to bet. :rolleyes:

That's another good reason that I stay consistent with my betting. The sharp dealers learn your method and will even remind you if your forget to place a COME bet for example. And they get into a rhythm with you.

Us sharp players know that it's the flexible player that's going to win more $$. Always play the same way and you're more likely to LOSE.

My observation of the craps dealers on cruises is that many are newbies just learning the game themselves. I've been present when some have been removed from a busy table as they couldn't keep up with the action. They are used to simple bets with most players only betting the PASS line or a couple of numbers. Once in a while I've encountered some that are really sharp. Bottom line, you have to watch your bets and your payoffs. I have to watch very closely if I have a couple of COME bets in action.

I agree with you here. If I come up to a dead table, I'll play the dark side for the first few points and then switch to the right side. I did this on a Carnival cruise, starting off with $25 on the Don't Pass, missed my point and let my bet ride, missed again and then let the $100 make it's way to the Pass Line. When I rolled a Winner 7, the dealer took instead of paying my bet. When I said I was on the Pass Line, dealer's response was "No, you ALWAYS play the Don't Pass", Hmm, 2 times and he thinks I ALWAYS play the Don't Pass. Spoke with the supervisor and a quick review of the tape and I got my $200.

Random question - Can you make lay bets not work for a few rolls (as you can with place bets)? On the last cruise I had a bunch of numbers placed and my friends came to the table to talk. I asked them to make the bets not working for a few rolls while I talked but they told me that I needed to take everything down until I was ready again. Is this correct?

 

I've seen a few "weird" rules on cruise ships. For example, I was told on RCCL that I wasn't allowed to pass the dice mid roll unless I took off my DP bet. Which also seemed a bit suspect...

The dealers were correct. "Right side" bets can be turned off, wrong side bets can not be turned off. Were you using some sort of mind control on the dice? Is that why you wanted to turn them off while you talked with someone else? The dealers could have saved any possible winnings for you until your full attention was returned to the game.

Would it be a good idea to keep your comes working and hop the red? Thanks!

One or the other is the way I'd do it. Either work the odds (The Come Bets are ALWAYS working) or hop the Sevens with just enough to replace your come bets. The 7 with a 16.66% house advantage is not a real good idea. What I have seen some players do is make both Come bets and Don't Come bets and take or lay the odds. Then other than when the 12 rolls whether you are taking odds or laying them the odds are truly "Free odds" for you.

What is the difference between face up blackjack and fun 21? If my memory serves me correctly, fun 21 takes out all the queens? but what is face up? just the cards are dealt face up, but its a full deck?

Spanish 21 is the game where some of the 10 value cards are removed. Fun or Super Fun 21 is where a Blackjack pays even money unless both cards are Diamonds, then it pays double. On this game you're allowed to double down even after hitting, you're allowed to re-split Aces and there are special payouts for 5 and 6 card 21s. Player Blackjacks are always paid even if dealer has Blackjack. (At least those are the Las Vegas rules for Fun 21).

 

Face up Blackjack is dealt from a multi deck shoe, Fun 21 is usually Single or Double deck and the cards are pitched by the dealer.

After a point is made put an odds bet for the dealers, "the boys have legs."

Legs? Seriously? Must be a regional thing. In Las Vegas we call them "shoes".

I've recently been on Carnival and Princess. They will only allow you to make a 2X odds bet. You should also know that they don't have any hopping bets on the layout.

 

Dicenator

They don't have to be spelled out on the layout to be allowed. Ask and the dealers will tell you if they are allowed.

One of the things I always liked about craps is that the poor choices of others at the table have no impact on my bets. In blackjack you can be stuck at a table of rookies who split their kings and are afraid to hit, etc.

I'm guessing you've never seen the dice hit a late bettor's hand as they were putting their $5 chip in the Field and watch in horror as they land on a 5 and a 2.

That does make the field into an even money proposition. the 17:1 or 17 for 1 was most likely for the 3 and 11 and I would guess that the 2 and 12 also paid off at 33:1 or 33 for 1. Sounds like a better place to play if you like the sucker bets.