Pavovsky

What are the prices they are charging on board for the UDP for a 7 day European cruise on WOTS. Booked very late (less than 48 hours) so cannot seem to be able to buy any of the packages. 

The law will decide. If there is negligence then they pay up, if not then so be it. Cruise companies have been a little dismissive when it came to passenger rights so perhaps no harm having some rebalancing. 

8 hours ago, Cachecara said:

No, not unless a very good treatment is discovered.  
I’m retired healthcare, I had 3 past co-workers die due to first responder responsibilities. 
I know many(over a dozen) that got ill and recovered.  The majority were under 50 and none said it took less than about a month to feel close to pre morbid state.  
A close friend and neighbor died who had no other health issues.  He had literally just turned 70.  His was a horror story. 
currently, I have 3 friends who have lost parents. 
I don’t need to risk this nightmare or the nightmare of being quarantined on a ship, etc for weeks.  
If there is no successful vaccine or worthy treatment, I think many things we are currently spoiled with on cruising will vastly change and/or become very expensive. JMO 
 

This is a hugely important post. We will get a vaccine and drugs will be found to help fight the virus, but I agree with you that it is not worth the risk. Plus we have to think about spreading the virus to countries visited. 

Will Cruising ever be the same again?
 

Will ports who do not have a major dependence on cruises be willing to take any risks before there is a vaccine? 
 

Will ships need to retrofit to give more space to crew accommodation?

Will RCCL continue to run the three brands or will there be some downsizing/focus on the core brands?  

2 hours ago, Von & John said:

For those wondering why there are still PAX on board the Eclipse,

I believe it is the South American Passengers who were not allowed to disembark in Chile.

And I believe the borders & airports were closed in their home countries for flights originating in the US &/or were closed completely.

 

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/business/tourism/story/2020-04-30/cruising-has-stopped-but-ships-with-thousands-of-crew-members-still-in-san-diego-waiting-to-return-home

 

NO passengers were allowed to disembark in San Antonio, Chile,

NOT Even South Americans...

No new passengers were allowed on in San Antonio, Chile either...

 

 

Which was probably a good decision by the Chilean authorities in terms of protecting their own citizens. 

On 5/2/2020 at 6:14 AM, blobby113 said:

We were on the Azamara Pursuit that was eventually allowed to offload us in Miami. The Australians on board were put on an AA flight to SF. We boarded the United Flight to Sydney, along with all of the Celebrity Eclipse Australian passengers, many of whom were coughing badly the whole flight back to Sydney. All Australian passengers except the most ill were put in two weeks’ quarantine in Sydney, not allowed to leave our rooms (security guards sat outside our doors 24 hours a day). I read on the NSW health site that all passengers in rows 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 31, 32, 33, 34 and 35 had been in close contact with passengers known (later) to have coved-19. My wife and I were in row 22, and the person across the aisle from me was wearing a mask and coughing. We managed to last the quarantine without symptoms and have now been In our own home for more than two weeks. I think things could have been a lot worse. Our boat had no sick people, and the Captain was able to tell us this even on the day we disembarked. But he couldn’t have known we would end up on a sick flight home.

This is extraordinary. Was this just coincidence or was the flight a charter/arranged by the cruise line? 

7 hours ago, NMTraveller said:

 

Nursing homes and assisted living centers that I have been to are not a good example of social distancing.  You can't put 10 pounds in a 1 pound bag.  They are highly condensed living areas.  Not good conditions for a pandemic.  Nursing homes should have every other living area populated during this time.  One in four would be better.  I fail to see social distancing in these homes.  Homes that only have 4 or 5 occupants?  Perhaps...  Homes that have 100 or more are making the news...

An important aspect to remember in respect to nursing homes is that it was visitors and staff in those homes who introduced the virus in. All valid points on the spread of the virus within. 

1 hour ago, Pushka said:

The chances of catching the virus from another passenger as a direct consequence of being on the same plane are extremely low. And limited to two rows adjacent to the passenger. 

In the case of the US, the virus was in circulation weeks before it was officially recognised. And yes, a plane brought the virus to the US just as it did to Australia, interestingly the major source of our infections were from Europe and North America. Not China. However it was on land that the virus spread in the US. 

 

 

I think this is a relevant point. People who were on planes brought the virus from Europe to the US. International travel linked to the globalised economy helped spread the virus. However, most infections have been community based. Cruise ships had (and indeed are having) community based transmissions.
 

One aspect in all this is the density of crew accommodation - no possibility for isolating until it is too late. I wonder will this aspect be considered when cruising returns. 

This is the current state of play in Europe. There is very little “green” And while there is some movement from “red” to “yellow” in Spain and Germany the process for “normalising” will be taken very slowly.  Other countries have quarantining in place already with an expectation that this will be more institutionalised as restrictions are eased and there may still be bans on travel from jurisdictions which are still experiencing a high number of cases (this will not be a negotiation given unilateral actions and non conciliation in the early part of the pandemic).

There is still a massive amount of uncertainty with tensions arising between the public health advice which is ultra cautious (having more in-depth knowledge of how lethal this virus is) and politicians who are getting it in the neck from people and business weary with the lock-down. 
 

Many Europeans are at the point whether they are hopeful of a late summer vacation (in hope rather than expectation). Countries like Spain and Greece are trying to ascertain what parts of the land holiday season can be salvaged even with domestic tourism (these are critical for their economies). Meetings/conferences scheduled for the Autumn are already being deferred to December. 
 

Maybe (just maybe) there could be cruises in Europe in the Autumn but perhaps these will be limited to one country only e.g. Greece but not at the risk to either citizens or to broader freedom of movement. 

Even if European ports are not open, hopefully there will be some element of tourism to support those many hotels, restaurants and small shops over the period ahead. 
 

although I wonder will Venice open up at all for cruise ships. 

6 minutes ago, BigAl94 said:

In all likelihood, none.

that is what I would have thought. I am wondering even on land holidays - Spain does not expect a tourism season this year. 

What is interesting is that the bonus FCC is increasing prices. Had been watching some cruises in the Adriatic which in previous years had reduced in price around now and they are either static or increasing. While Greece is expected to re-open to a degree (I have not seen  specific info on cruise ships) we may find that there are still restrictions on trans Atlantic flights if the US is not under control. If Adriatic sailings happens (doubtful) but there are no US guests, will prices drop or will they sail sub capacity? 

What European ports are opening in August? 

Maybe all the happy customers can come together to get a retirement gift for Larry? How would this work in practice? 

24 minutes ago, pip43 said:

Are you saying that this cruise from Venice to Barcelona and TA to Tampa aren't going to happen in Oct. 2020?

 

I think the person was referring to the refurbishments but no guarantee the cruises will happen either. 

Someone suggested an online funding campaign. Anyone know if this was set up?

The Dublin Port Company decided to invest in cargo facilities instead of investing in developing the cruise facilities.The reason for this is business reasons in terms of cost-benefit analysis and focusing on what is their core business.

One of the aspects raised is that cruise passengers do not bring much money to the port itself. Other areas of the city economy do benefit to a degree e.g. tour companies, but all in all there is also a view that many cruise passengers do not spend money off the ship - others are of the view that it makes a busy city even busier.  Similar debates are happening in other European cities. 
 

I can understand the perspective of the port company - they have to invest in what gives them the best return. I can also see (having been on cruises) how many do not spend money off the ship - we did. The key benefit to a city is probably to the tour operators (although seemingly the cruise companies squeeze their margins) with a less tangible benefit being those cruise tourists who will return. Of course, as a “home port” there can also be benefits in terms of hotel nights (but some are of the view that is overstated).
 

Dublin is a great destination for 3/4 days and the the road network is very good to facilitate land touring around the country where people will get a far more immersive and rewarding experience. 

I expect that insurance companies will add cruising to outdoor sports/skiing as requiring supplements. 

That post is probably in the past tense now. But very legitimate concerns being raised. 

Naturally people are going to speculate and like with Princess in Sydney there will be questions asked. Interestingly, the same company in the last few days was highlighting the brilliance of Captain Carl on Azamara, and we also saw the enormous pressure put on Chile including at political level. 
 

And one thing is clear - this whole virus has created questions and sustainability issues for the entire cruise industry. 

Would love if they were back in action then but expect Viking may be right. 

Perhaps this should work the other way also. Cruise lines should have to produce a certificate of cleanliness and healthiness including in respect to cases of Noro Virus,  and if there were cases where people were ill on board what steps they have taken to clean the ship.

1 hour ago, hubofhockey said:

I have a cruise with Silversea for May 23 in Galapagos.  Thankfully, they are now in the RCCL family and have the same cancellation policies.  The 125% Future Cruise Credit does us little good though because they are replacing our ship with a ship whose rates are 150%.  I'll ask my TA if they'll move our booking to the same week next year on the new ship, but if not,  I'm more than happy to get our money back.  It's all wait an see at this point, but I don't understand why these cruise companies think they can charge more when this pandemic has probably damaged their industry more than other industries.

this is an industry which will truly suffer at least for the next couple of years. Il

1 hour ago, AJCM said:

Isn’t it obvious???? Azamara (and undoubtedly others) have an administrative nightmare. They can only cancel up to a certain date to have any hope of dealing with the affected clients. Our cruises are scheduled for late June onwards and I’m not worried at all. I have every confidence that in good time they’ll get through the March, April, May backlog and cancel June/July cruises and, in turn, get to us. Similarly with travel,insurance, hotels and flights, I’m not even attempting to contact them yet - why bother when they can’t handle the volume?

points well made. I have a holiday booked to the US in May and not even thinking of going near the airline yet. Will decide mid April whether I move to another date, take the voucher on offer with a 10% bonus or seek a refund. Will likely take the voucher Unless they are in severe difficulty as it is in all our interest that as many as possible operators emerge on the other side of this crisis. 
 

the only caveat is future bookings. There is too much uncertainty right now. 

Interesting and a bit more sensible but I would not be too confident that everything will be ok in Europe on 11 May for citizens. Even if some restrictions are lifted you may still find restrictions on travel and indeed there may be specific restrictions on cruise ships. Note that Ryanair have said they do not expect to fly in April or May.  
 

Bottom line if someone has a booking then not much can be done as there is a lot to play out. And having being in lock down for two weeks already I would be very grateful if this crisis is over by 11 May. 
 

But I certainly would not be making a new booking at this point in time.