Denied boarding

[dec2007w3boys]

 

Really I hope our governement just gets it together and makes passports mandatory, that would solve a lot of this

 

I totally agree, our government just makes everything they touch better!! :D

[nrdsb4]

I am looking at my DH's "Certificate of Live Birth" issued in TN and it clearly states "This becomes a legal record when properly executed and filed".

 

Mine and our children all issued in California say "Certificate of Live Birth".

 

All 5 are recorded and appear to be on embossed paper with a stamp.............

 

Do they get any more legal that this??? This thread concerns me :(

 

The poster you quoted is wrong. I am looking at my California birth certificate, which I used to obtain a passport. At the top, it says

"Certificate of Live Birth"

 

underneath, it says :

 

"State of California-Department of Public Health"

 

It has a raised seal-on the back of the BC it says "This is to certify, if impressed with the seal of xxxxx County Recorder, that this is a true copy of the permanent record on file in this office" and is signed by a "recorder."

 

I also have a newer certified copy of my BC, which is blue/pinkish, with blue borders and a large watermark over the contents of the BC. It also has a raised seal and says "Certificate of Live Birth."

 

As far as your California BC's go, if it's from the Bureau of Vital Records, California Dept. of Health, this is a valid government generated ID.

 

My husband's Missouri birth certificates say "Standard Certificate of Live Birth" (his "original" certified copy) and "Birth Certification" (a more recent certified copy) and both come from the Missouri State Registrar of Vital Statistics.

 

Note that both the California and Missouri BC's were generated by state governmental agencies-not hospitals.

 

Hope that helps.

[nrdsb4]

No you can't use "A certificate of Live Birth" for departing on a cruise but apparently that is all that is required if you want to run for President.

 

strange world>>

strange rules

 

WRONG. My certified copy of my California birth certificate plainly says "Certificate of Live Birth" on the top. It IS my official birth certificate, used to obtain my passport.

[nrdsb4]

Again I ask the question how great is the risk...really? When I look at how long I am at port and the type of activities we do in a port, I see very little risk compared to the cost. I've yet to receive an actual example of someone getting stranded and not being able to get quick help home in an emergency without a passport. To me that means the risk of it happening are extremely low and not worth the cost. If we end up missing the ship, then I am going to blame myself for getting in that position and will pay for it in the necessary wait and cost to get home. That is the risk I take. So many of the "Get a Passport or Else" claim the risk is too high. I just don't see the risk as being that high, so I can't justify the cost of purchasing passports for our family.

 

I can provide you with one-it took them several extra days, at the additional cost of $2000 (and they already had passports; they were stolen). However, don't know that I need to hunt it up as the fact remains that you are correct that a)it's pretty rare from what I've seen on this site and b)no US citizen will be indefinitely stranded-they'll get the passport eventually and be home as soon as they can get on a flight.

[nrdsb4]

I agree with this as some make it sound that because they have declared a personal emergency they will be able to just go to the airport and get on the next flight out of there. It may but most likely they will be on a standby list with very limited options.

 

I have posted this before and my wife is a flight attendant with a major airline and can tell you for sure twice passengers have boarded flights back from the Caribbean with faxed permission to fly (no passports).

 

The only thing that happen was TSA met those passengers at the jet way upon arrival to check ID and have them sign documentation. She does not have all of the specifics but if it happens again she will get all of the details.

 

 

 

 

I really don't see a problem with people following the rules that are in place at this moment to go on a cruise. As long as they understand the issues that may arise.

 

 

Vinnie

 

While going through the Homeland Security web site, I came across a section which describes certain individuals who can enter the US without a passport. Certain government employees, etc. and a few others. I don't remember all of the details and I probably couldn't find it again if I tried, but those "exceptions" might well explain what your wife observed.

[Cruise, J.D.]

While going through the Homeland Security web site, I came across a section which describes certain individuals who can enter the US without a passport. Certain government employees, etc. and a few others. I don't remember all of the details and I probably couldn't find it again if I tried, but those "exceptions" might well explain what your wife observed.

 

Here is a link to the list of exceptions to the passport requirement. There are quite a few.

http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=3dbeea9f93a19ee9f19416a6ac3f79e9&rgn=div8&view=text&node=22:1.0.1.6.35.0.1.2&idno=22

 

22 CFR 53.2

[nrdsb4]

Here is a link to the list of exceptions to the passport requirement. There are quite a few.

http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=3dbeea9f93a19ee9f19416a6ac3f79e9&rgn=div8&view=text&node=22:1.0.1.6.35.0.1.2&idno=22

 

22 CFR 53.2

 

 

Yay! Would have taken me all day to find that.:p

[COMBOY]

Before you start flaming. I don’t have a passport and don’t travel enough to have one. We cruise maybe every other year and we don’t go out of the country any other time. Now for what happened we were suppose to cruise on the Dream today but when we got to the port we were denied boarding. The Documents we had was my birth cert. and my driver’s license. DH had his driver’s license and a certified birth record which he have used on the other 3 cruises we have been on with Carnival and there was no issue BUT as a 2 weeks ago they no longer except that document. And we weren’t the only ones there were families with children that were refused boarding. I called Carnival and spoke to 3 different people regarding this and was told if we didn’t take the insurance out that Carnival offered we were SOOL this just FYI if you have a certified birth record and have used it before you can’t use it now. You need a birth certificate. We thought since we used it in the past we could still use it. And regular insurance won’t cover them denying you boarding.

 

No, Carnival did not deny you boarding...the US State Dept did. Carnival just enforces the government policies for US citizen traveling outside the US. Whatever document your husband had wasn't a county issued birth certificate. It's hard to believe that Carnival accepted it on past cruises, but I have nothing to prove that they didn't. I'm wondering what your plans were if you had to fly home to the US from a foreign port for a medical or family emergency? Airlines wound not allow to board the plane and fly without a valid passport nor would US immigration allow you back into the country. Yes, I've heard plenty of horror story where this has happen. Sorry this happen to you; however, passengers are always the ones responsible for proper documentation and much check with the State Department each and every time they plan to leave the US for current travel requirements. This is why traveling with a passport is the best advise.

[mgm61]

Apparently allot of people only leave the country on closed loop cruises. It suprised me too, but I guess that's the case.

 

 

exactly correct I don't see how ya all afford all this cruisin'. It feels like more of a treat to actually go out of the country on a cruise boat. more like the upper crust. Our land vacations don't cost like this cruise is.

We don't fly period. so I don't see the need for the passport. We are hoping nothing will 'happen' so I guess we are taking a chance. But thats my choice.

 

Unless you see me with my hat in my hand asking for donations to get home ....:p:)

[Kurbanfan]

No, Carnival did not deny you boarding...the US State Dept did. Carnival just enforces the government policies for US citizen traveling outside the US. Whatever document your husband had wasn't a county issued birth certificate. It's hard to believe that Carnival accepted it on past cruises, but I have nothing to prove that they didn't. I'm wondering what your plans were if you had to fly home to the US from a foreign port for a medical or family emergency? Airlines wound not allow to board the plane and fly without a valid passport nor would US immigration allow you back into the country. Yes, I've heard plenty of horror story where this has happen. Sorry this happen to you; however, passengers are always the ones responsible for proper documentation and much check with the State Department each and every time they plan to leave the US for current travel requirements. This is why traveling with a passport is the best advise.

 

Linkage please:D

[centurycruiser]

I believe experience is the most expensive teacher.

[chasinraynbowz]

No, Carnival did not deny you boarding...the US State Dept did. Carnival just enforces the government policies for US citizen traveling outside the US. Whatever document your husband had wasn't a county issued birth certificate. It's hard to believe that Carnival accepted it on past cruises, but I have nothing to prove that they didn't. I'm wondering what your plans were if you had to fly home to the US from a foreign port for a medical or family emergency? Airlines wound not allow to board the plane and fly without a valid passport nor would US immigration allow you back into the country. Yes, I've heard plenty of horror story where this has happen. Sorry this happen to you; however, passengers are always the ones responsible for proper documentation and much check with the State Department each and every time they plan to leave the US for current travel requirements. This is why traveling with a passport is the best advise.

 

You are correct that Carnival is not the one who denied them boarding. But it amazes me that you are saying that you have heard plenty of horror stories of folks who could not get back to the USA because they didn't have a passport. If they could not come back, how did you hear about it? Sorry, but I think you are using scare tactics.

 

While I agree that using a passport is probably best ITS NOT REQUIRED on a closed loop cruise!

[salty dingo]

But it amazes me that you are saying that you have heard plenty of horror stories of folks who could not get back to the USA because they didn't have a passport.

Do you think the US Government is just pulling your leg when it says the Passport Card is not valid for air travel?

 

If you have a Passport Card, you will never get to plead your case to someone at an airport in the US. The airline at the point of departure will refuse to let you board. I have been in airports and have seen this. If you do not have proper documentation you cannot board teh flight.

 

The reason the airlines are so strict is that they have to pay to cart your undocumented carcass back out of the USA!

[chasinraynbowz]

Do you think the US Government is just pulling your leg when it says the Passport Card is not valid for air travel?

 

If you have a Passport Card, you will never get to plead your case to someone at an airport in the US. The airline at the point of departure will refuse to let you board. I have been in airports and have seen this. If you do not have proper documentation you cannot board teh flight.

 

The reason the airlines are so strict is that they have to pay to cart your undocumented carcass back out of the USA!

 

 

LOL... you are too much. Where was I referring to a passport card?

[CanadaJulie]

I can provide you with one-it took them several extra days, at the additional cost of $2000 (and they already had passports; they were stolen). However, don't know that I need to hunt it up as the fact remains that you are correct that a)it's pretty rare from what I've seen on this site and b)no US citizen will be indefinitely stranded-they'll get the passport eventually and be home as soon as they can get on a flight.

 

Sorry - you just proved Warmbreezes point ! Even if you have spent the extra money to obtain passports that were not required for your cruise, you could still be up ****$ creek if they are stolen.

 

In the scenario mentionned above, these people paid to get passports, got stranded, (had their passports stolen) had to spend 2000$ and several days to get back home

 

WarmBreezes is saying that she does not pay for the passport, and if she gets stranded will spend 2000$ and several days to get back home. She still comes out ahead of the game... ;)

 

Many people who have passports leave them in the safe when they go into port, some bring a photocopy, some don't. So if you get stuck in port, you still can't just walk up to the nearest airline counter and buy a ticket to the next port (or back home). It will take time to get the passport info and you'll have to spend money while things get sorted out.

 

Having a passport is not foolproof or a guarantee unless you happen to have it in your hands you when something goes wrong. Am I going to leave my passport on a boat when I go snorkling in GCM - uh... no. It will be in the safe on the ship. (I might have a copy, but you still can't travel with that !)

 

Makes no difference to me who gets what. I am Canadian and require one - but I totally see WarmBreezes point.

[salty dingo]

Makes no difference to me who gets what. I am Canadian and require one - but I totally see WarmBreezes point.

Yes, I am sure the other nations of the world laugh at us when we let people enter the country with a birth certificate for ID. As if they could possibly keep track of the countless authorities which have issued birth certificates over the lifetimes of people who are alive today!

[Kurbanfan]

Yes, I am sure the other nations of the world laugh at us when we let people enter the country with a birth certificate for ID. As if they could possibly keep track of the countless authorities which have issued birth certificates over the lifetimes of people who are alive today!

 

A little drunky tonight:confused:

[e150club]

This thread is like beating a dead horse.

[IslandCruz]

Don't need a lecture about having a Passport as it is in process. Does anyone know if they are denying Birth Registration Cards now? I've always used it from the Commonwealth of Virginia. It is a plastic card issued by the state.

[SkaterJasp]

In regards to travel, Birth certificate in the past were never used as a valid form of ID but as a proof of US Citizenship. That is why yup always present a government issued photo ID along with your birth certificate.

[SkaterJasp]

Going forward only Passport and Passport Cards are valid for travel on cruise ships according to the State Departments website. http://travel.state.gov/travel/cbpmc/cbpmc_2223.html

 

I highly recommend a passport over passport card because passport cards are not valid for air travel to/from the United States. Passport Cards are good if all you plan on doing is travel to/from the US by land or sea to/from an approved list of countries such as Canada and Mexico.

 

Examptions:

"Closed Loop" Cruises: U.S. citizens who board a cruise ship at a port within the United States, travel only within the Western Hemisphere, and return to the same U.S. port on the same ship may present a government issued photo identification, along with proof of citizenship (an original or copy of his or her birth certificate, a Consular report of Birth Abroad, or a Certificate of Naturalization). Please be aware that you may still be required to present a passport to enter the foreign countries your cruise ship is visiting. Check with your cruise line to ensure you have the appropriate

documents.

 

(Dont know how much longer this will last)

[friedshrimp]

I would be shocked if the average on board purchases exceeded $300 per perosn, far less than the cost of the cruise.

 

My wife and I spent (after tips) a combined $148 on our last 7 night cruise. I guess we're cheap dates! :p

[goose30]

Certificate of Live Birth.

 

If you are carrying it it had better have been a live birth!

[CruzVinnieCruz]

While going through the Homeland Security web site, I came across a section which describes certain individuals who can enter the US without a passport. Certain government employees, etc. and a few others. I don't remember all of the details and I probably couldn't find it again if I tried, but those "exceptions" might well explain what your wife observed.

 

No these were actual cruise passengers that had a faxed permission to fly from Homeland Security. She did not think much of it at the time to ask questions but since it is a rather hot topic on these boards of late she will get details if it happens again.

 

Your link does somewhat prove that the Department of State can waive the passport requirement for emergencies.

 

(9) When the Department of State waives, pursuant to EO 13323 of December 30, 2003, Section 2, the requirement with respect to the U.S. citizen because there is an unforeseen emergency; or

 

Vinnie

[dforeigner]

No these were actual cruise passengers that had a faxed permission to fly from Homeland Security. She did not think much of it at the time to ask questions but since it is a rather hot topic on these boards of late she will get details if it happens again.

 

Your link does somewhat prove that the Department of State can waive the passport requirement for emergencies.

 

(9) When the Department of State waives, pursuant to EO 13323 of December 30, 2003, Section 2, the requirement with respect to the U.S. citizen because there is an unforeseen emergency; or

 

Vinnie

 

Yes, there are exceptions but it is not like you get on a plane right away. It usually takes several hours to a couple of days for this approval to go through.