Buyer Beware! SCAM

[SissasMomE]

Yep. Sounds like the guy is experiencing a serious cashflow problem. He is paying when he gets more money (from poor new customers).

 

and that is illegal LOL VERY illegal.

[SissasMomE]

Isn't that a Ponzi scheme?:confused:

 

It sure is ... and since he is using the internet to do it, there are a slew of other federal charges that can be added. The guy isn't too bright.

[Fydlstyx]

I would like other Cruise Critic Readers to be aware of a scam that I fell into. I made a reservation for an NCL cruise with a travel company that responded to my ************* request. This agent had the best price, so without hesitation I booked my cruise through him. I have booked several cruises through ************* agents and never had a problem. I was told there was a $250.00pp deposit required at booking, which I am used to. I still don't remember doing this, but the agent asked me for my credit card number for $250.00 and requested me to make another $250.00 to his PayPal account, which I apparently did. I received an invoice from the agent by email reflecting the $500.00 deposit being made, with the final payment due in July.

In July I called the agent to make the final payment and I was told to make the payment to his PayPal account, when I questioned this, he told me that is how he takes payment. I made the PayPal deposit as requested and was sent an invoice from the agency via email reflecting the payment and marked Paid in Full.

Three days ago (28 days from sailing) I received an email from NCL saying I had a balance due. At first I thought it was some kind of scam, but all the information was correct including an advance payment I had made for dinner reservations. It showed that only $250.00 was paid at booking, with another $250.00 still owed and the final payment amount. In August a $200.00 payment was made using a MasterCard on the account with a balance due amount of over $1200.00.

I called the agent and he told me that there must be some mistake and he would look into it and get back to me in 24 hours.

I decided to call direct to NCL to find out what was going on. The first person I talked to at NCL told me that I would have to take it up with the travel agent.

The next day when I did not hear back from the agent, I called him and he told me that it would be taken care of, that he some accounting issues in his office and he was working on it.

Later that day I got another invoice from NCL reflecting a $300.00 MasterCard payment on the account, still a balance due of over $900.00.

I again contacted NCL and again I was told to take it up with the travel agent. At this point I lost it, I demanded to speak to a supervisor. After waiting on hold for a supervisor for 20 minutes, I was cut off. I called again and after losing it again, I was connected to a supervisor. Mr Lopez was very helpful, he call the agent and vowed the check into it further and get back to me.

Later that evening I received a call from the agent and he assured me that it would be a cleared up by the next morning. (Yeah right)

I waited until almost noon the next day, then I created a dispute With PayPal for the amount of the final payment. That apparently got his attention, within an hour he called me and assured me that the balance due was paid to NCL and he emailed me a copy of the paid in full invoice from NCL. He wanted me to contact PayPal and get his funds released, which I told him I would after I called NCL and confirmed that we were paid in full. I asked him why he never made the full deposit to NCL at booking, his answer was that NCL only asks for $250.00 so he keeps the other $250.00 in his account.

I tried to cancel the dispute with PayPal online, but I guess it did not take.because I got a call from him later that night desperately begging me to call PayPal and get his funds released. Which I did.

I also disputed the PayPal payment with my credit card, which I had to cancel.

I also reported the agency to ************* and was told that it was the second complaint with the same issues and they had severed their relationship with him.

The moral of the story is, always make any payments for your cruise directly to the cruise line.

In over 30 Cruises, this is the first time I have ever had such a problem, hopefully never again.

__________________

 

I think you are terribly lucky that NCL was so helpful. They did not have to be. I wouldn't have "lost it" with them. I would have lost it with the guy who stole my money. I am glad it all worked out, but why NCL customer service was somehow responsible for fixing the issue is something I do not understand.

[SissasMomE]

I think you are terribly lucky that NCL was so helpful. They did not have to be. I wouldn't have "lost it" with them. I would have lost it with the guy who stole my money. I am glad it all worked out, but why NCL customer service was somehow responsible for fixing the issue is something I do not understand.

 

They are allowing this guy to sell NCL cruises. They admitted that they were aware of the issues with this guy, and yet still allow him to sell NCL cruises. Sounds like liability to me.

[rimom71]

Exactly, the guy told my husband "you're not the only ones!", which means there are others in this situation who probably don't know it (as I wouldn't have if I hadn't been lucky enough to read the original post). My husband spoke to someone at NCL corporate yesterday, but they seemed to have little interest in addressing the fact that an agent who is contracted to sell their product is playing fast and loose with their customers' money.

 

We tried to get NCL to transfer our booking to them, in which case we could stop the original payment and pay the balance directly to them. We were told that basically we were out of luck and would lose the deposit if we switched the booking. We are even willing to pay the current rate for the cabin, but NCL refused. I'm having a lot of difficulty understanding the rationale behind this, and it does frustrate me that NCL seems unwilling to help us problem-solve this.

 

We're putting a lot of pressure on the TA, and still hoping he makes good, otherwise we are out a cruise and the deposit.

[luddite]

Exactly, the guy told my husband "you're not the only ones!", which means there are others in this situation who probably don't know it (as I wouldn't have if I hadn't been lucky enough to read the original post). My husband spoke to someone at NCL corporate yesterday, but they seemed to have little interest in addressing the fact that an agent who is contracted to sell their product is playing fast and loose with their customers' money.

 

We tried to get NCL to transfer our booking to them, in which case we could stop the original payment and pay the balance directly to them. We were told that basically we were out of luck and would lose the deposit if we switched the booking. We are even willing to pay the current rate for the cabin, but NCL refused. I'm having a lot of difficulty understanding the rationale behind this, and it does frustrate me that NCL seems unwilling to help us problem-solve this.

 

We're putting a lot of pressure on the TA, and still hoping he makes good, otherwise we are out a cruise and the deposit.

 

Have you spoken with the credit card company?

[deerby27]

NCL was not all that helpful with my resolution. The first two people I talked to at NCL told me there was nothing they could do, that I had to take it up with the travel agent. It was only after I lost it that I even got to speak to a supervisor. He promised to look into it and get back to me, and he did, but not until I had disputed the PayPal payment and forced the agent to make the final payment. This will be our first NCL cruise and based on the amount of customer service I received with this problem, it will likely be the last.

[luddite]

NCL was not all that helpful with my resolution. The first two people I talked to at NCL told me there was nothing they could do, that I had to take it up with the travel agent. It was only after I lost it that I even got to speak to a supervisor. He promised to look into it and get back to me, and he did, but not until I had disputed the PayPal payment and forced the agent to make the final payment. This will be our first NCL cruise and based on the amount of customer service I received with this problem, it will likely be the last.

 

It's hardly right to hold NCL responsible for a shyster travel agent.

[ldlewis45]

I don't understand why people are ticked off at NCL. The booking was made through a 3rd party. It's not NCL's issue, and I'm not sure what people are wanting them to do. They can't force the guy to give them the money he owes, and they're certainly not going to just take your word that you've paid and transfer the booking over and call it good. It's between you and the crook, not you and NCL. You're contracting him to provide a service as a middleman between you and NCL. NCL didn't tell anyone to use this guy's services. I don't blame NCL for not getting involved in it. It sucks, but you chose to book with a middleman, so now that's who you're required to go through for any contact with NCL, even when the guy turns out to be a crook. Take the guy to court if you have to, get a full refund, and book directly with NCL or with a travel agent that doesn't use PayPal.

 

It's like signing a contract with a independent, 3rd party personal shopper and giving them $1000 to go do some shopping at Macy's for you. If the shopper only brings you back $300 worth of merchandise, are you going to call Macy's and yell at them and ask them how they're going to fix it? No, your issue is with the personal shopper, not with Macy's. They provided the items that were paid for and their involvement ends there.

[EBONI325]

always use my green "don't leave home without it" credit card. This company has an excellent reputation for resolving problems.

 

We bought a home theater set up a few years ago for our new house and put everything on our card. The equipment came from a famous bb company. From the moment of delivery things went down hill rapidly.

After repeated visits and calls we had no help or resolution from the bb company.

 

The matter was turned over to the green credit card folks for resolution. And, they acted quickly. The bb company had 30 days to respond and begin the resolution process. They never responded. After the 30 days we were issued a full refund and told that the equipment was ours. Incredible, but true.

 

 

No debit cards when i make major purchases, i stick with my favorite green card!

that's why i always use my green card. Love the way they handle disputes

[halos]

...or to a reputable travel agent, of which there are many.

 

I agree.

I have only one time out of all my cruises, booked direct with the cruise line and I have never had this issue. But then again, I work with very large on line agencies that I have nothing but good things to say about.

[B6ConMe]

This will be our first NCL cruise and based on the amount of customer service I received with this problem, it will likely be the last.

 

It would be really unfortunate, although understandable, to allow the behaviour of a 3RD PARTY TRAVEL AGENCY to determine your preferred cruise line. I was lucky because I went straight to a PCC at NCL and after reading this I'm not unhappy. I'm not saying that everyone should book direct through NCL, I'm just saying I'm thankful that I did. It's also too bad that not more can be said on this board about the problems caused by this specific TA but it is, as far as can be told, only one among many TAs, and while it only takes one to spoil things, there are many other TAs who do a great job for the many pax who use their services.

 

I hope you have a cruise that will change the way you feel about NCL and one that helps you forget the bad taste this has left in your mouth.

 

Cheers,

[cle-guy]

Not sure what benefit it would be to the agent to have funds deposited into Paypal account.

 

My daughter sells on ebay and whenever someone pays her through Paypal, she is charged a certain percentage of the sale in fees by Paypal.

 

So if a travel agent was receiving cruise payments through his paypal account, I can't imagine how much in fees he would be paying back to Paypal. Seems like a losing situation to me! (And would indicate that something just wasn't right with the whole transaction).

 

Even if TA processed credit card the standard way, there are still fees imposed by the card processor, quite similar in percentages to PayPal especially if cards are taken over phone or email and not "swiped" where they can get a lower processing rate by swiping.

 

I like using PayPal, it's a second layer of protection I get PayPal batting for me in disputes, and I got my Credit card I used to pay PayPal also working for me. And with PayPal, I will have an instant receipt as proof of payment.

[SissasMomE]

Thank you, same agent, same company! What do I do now?

 

Check and see if NCL was paid. If they were not, you need to file a complaint with the Florida Attorney General. This can be done online. If all 3 of you do it, this will definitely get their attention. Also, dispute the transaction with paypal.

[Demonyte]

NCL was not all that helpful with my resolution. The first two people I talked to at NCL told me there was nothing they could do, that I had to take it up with the travel agent. It was only after I lost it that I even got to speak to a supervisor. He promised to look into it and get back to me, and he did, but not until I had disputed the PayPal payment and forced the agent to make the final payment. This will be our first NCL cruise and based on the amount of customer service I received with this problem, it will likely be the last.

 

I have to agree with the others, NCL is not to blame here. If they have helped you directly, that's great customer service in my books because they have absolutely no obligation to do that - even if one misbehaves by "losting it" when the cruise line has nothing to do with the matter at that point.

 

Unfortunately sometimes you get exactly what you pay for and in this case there was a pretty grim flipside to the cheaper price or some other perks than booking direct with the cruise line.

 

P.S. I think that ldlewis45's comparison to a personal shopper and Macy's was spot on - that's exactly what is going on here.

[cle-guy]

There is a way to make personal payments through Paypal that don't incur a fee.

 

I believe the down side of a "personal payment" thru paypal, is you lose the ability to dispute the charge and have PayPal defend you in a dispute, since its just personal gifting, and thus they waive the fees.

[WaldosPepper]

Thank you, same agent, same company! What do I do now?

 

Based upon your countdown clock, I am guessing that so far you have only made a deposit. If that is the case, I would immediately cancel my booking with that agent, and book either directly with NCL, or with a reputable TA.

 

When you cancel, if you don't see an immediate credit on your credit card account, contact the issuer of the card and dispute the charge. (Credit can take a few days to appear, so at least allow time for that before disputing.)

[rimom71]

It's not NCL's issue, and I'm not sure what people are wanting them to do. They can't force the guy to give them the money he owes, and they're certainly not going to just take your word that you've paid and transfer the booking over and call it good.

 

It's like signing a contract with a independent, 3rd party personal shopper and giving them $1000 to go do some shopping at Macy's for you. If the shopper only brings you back $300 worth of merchandise, are you going to call Macy's and yell at them and ask them how they're going to fix it? No, your issue is with the personal shopper, not with Macy's. They provided the items that were paid for and their involvement ends there.

 

I have an invoice from the TA showing that I have paid in full. NCL does not need to "take my word" for it, I have the documentation, which I would be more than happy to share with them. I am not asking them to honor the price the agent gave me, I merely want them to use the deposit that they have, which was made with my credit card, towards a re-booking on the same cruise. How is this unreasonable?

 

Also...to use your theoretical Macy's argument, one needs to add that the personal shopper was contracted with Macy's to provide personal shopping services through their store and sell Macy's products. If that personal shopper took off with my money, you can darn well bet I'd have a problem with Macy's.

[cle-guy]

I have an invoice from the TA showing that I have paid in full. NCL does not need to "take my word" for it, I have the documentation, which I would be more than happy to share with them. I am not asking them to honor the price the agent gave me, I merely want them to use the deposit that they have, which was made with my credit card, towards a re-booking on the same cruise. How is this unreasonable?

 

 

NCL doesn't have to take that piece of paper invoice from the TA as proof of payment either. Anyone can make a paper invoice. It's sad but true, you have to deal only with the TA.

 

IF you had paid deposits by credit card and you have credit card statement showing NCL as the vendor who was paid, not some 3rd party TA or something, you MAY have a claim with NCL, but it'd be an uphill battle. YOu may have better success disputing charge with Credit card company if the original TA is playing around. If the charge shows NCL, then call NCL asking for backup for the charge so you have THEIR actual documentation tell then you saw a charge on your statement and do not recognize it and just need a copy of the receipt.

 

Your deal is between the TA and you.

[SissasMomE]

I have to agree with the others, NCL is not to blame here. If they have helped you directly, that's great customer service in my books because they have absolutely no obligation to do that - even if one misbehaves by "losting it" when the cruise line has nothing to do with the matter at that point.

 

Unfortunately sometimes you get exactly what you pay for and in this case there was a pretty grim flipside to the cheaper price or some other perks than booking direct with the cruise line.

 

P.S. I think that ldlewis45's comparison to a personal shopper and Macy's was spot on - that's exactly what is going on here.

 

Doesn't NCL have to "approve" who can sell their cruises? Do they contract with TA's? I think they do.

[SissasMomE]

Based upon your countdown clock, I am guessing that so far you have only made a deposit. If that is the case, I would immediately cancel my booking with that agent, and book either directly with NCL, or with a reputable TA.

 

When you cancel, if you don't see an immediate credit on your credit card account, contact the issuer of the card and dispute the charge. (Credit can take a few days to appear, so at least allow time for that before disputing.)

 

If he didn't make final payment, can't he just transfer the booking over to NCL, so he doesn't lose his rate?

[BiXLL]

Based upon your countdown clock, I am guessing that so far you have only made a deposit. If that is the case, I would immediately cancel my booking with that agent, and book either directly with NCL, or with a reputable TA.

 

When you cancel, if you don't see an immediate credit on your credit card account, contact the issuer of the card and dispute the charge. (Credit can take a few days to appear, so at least allow time for that before disputing.)

I paid in full! LOL, what a chump I am! My fisrt cruise and I screw it up!

[Demonyte]

Doesn't NCL have to "approve" who can sell their cruises? Do they contract with TA's? I think they do.

 

I think so too, but even then the deal and transactions were made only between the TA and the customer. If NCL hasn't gotten the money according to the contract payment schedule, there is very little they are obligated to do.

 

There have been numerous similar cases during the years where the TA has dissappeared, not paid the cruise line, or something similar and that's why most people suggest at least finding out how the payments are made with a specific TA and avoid those that take the payments to their own accounts first (although there is at least one very, very big online cruise TA with a very simple and short cruise-related domain that does exactly that - at least for the two cruises I booked thorugh them in late 2008).

[Demonyte]

If he didn't make final payment, can't he just transfer the booking over to NCL, so he doesn't lose his rate?

 

I don't think that NCL will honor any other than price from the normal price list at the time of the booking - it sounds like this TA has given customers discount from their own commission or something similar and NCL won't honor that because that's forbidden.

[BiXLL]

I am now sick to my stomach! 2 years of saving to do this and now I gotta deal with this! I have never felt so stupid in all my life!