Sheheen's comment about drifting casino smoke, really????

[Paraveina]

Looking at this from a logical standpoint:

 

Smoking is important enough to smokers to affect their choice of cruise line (ie they aren't going to book Celebrity)

 

Being smoke-free is important enough to very sensitive non-smokers to affect their choice of cruise line (these ones are likely already loyal guests of a non-smoking cruise line).

 

Non-smokers who aren't extremely sensitive (the majority of non-smokers) aren't going to care enough to switch lines.

 

So if I were CEO - I'm going to make those smokers feel welcome.

 

 

As a non-smoker, I'd love for them to put up glass, or create a slightly negative air pressure zone, etc. But those things all cost money and time. On the Breakaway, would they even had time to retrofit that sort of thing? I sure wouldn't want them hammering away putting in the required frames during my cruise. For the Getaway, I'm going to bet they considered doing it and then decided against it because it would make people angry that they hadn't done it on the Breakaway.

 

I'm going to hold out hope that it's being considered for the next two ships though - we're likely early enough in the design stage that they can work with this.

[Froggitt]

Non-smokers who aren't extremely sensitive (the majority of non-smokers) aren't going to care enough to switch lines.

But they probably care enough not to play in the casino when the smoke at their table gets too bad.

 

Why NCL panders to the 20% rather than the 80% is beyond me.

[Paraveina]

But they probably care enough not to play in the casino when the smoke at their table gets too bad.

 

Why NCL panders to the 20% rather than the 80% is beyond me.

 

But the majority of that 80% will sit and play nicely with the smokers. Only the sensitive ones will refuse to go to the casino - so it isn't really 20/80. Even if you're generous and say a full quarter of the non-smoking population is sensitive enough to smoke to avoid the casino, that's going to break even (20/20).

[sdmike]

 

Why NCL panders to the 20% rather than the 80% is beyond me.

 

Do some simple math. The majority of the 80% will still cruise with this issue. The 20% spends more money, plus they tend to sail NCL because others have restricted smoking more than NCL has. So if they can still fill their ships plus make a higher amount of money in onboard spending, it's a no brainer business decision for them.

 

The only way it will change is if they have issues maintaining rates or filling ships due to this policy. To this end, for the people bothered by the NCL smoking policy, there are plenty of ships out there you can sail. I'm an adamant non-smoker, but I've not found NCL's policy or the onboard conditions bad enough to switch lines. If I do, then I'll go somewhere else.

[Warm Breezes]

Just jumping in with one comment .. Of all the ships I have sailed , not once have I smelled smoke on most of the decks. Maybe around the casino of course , but throughout the ship ?? Come on .. Thats more than sensitive ..

I dont smoke but I do find these threads to be a bit "overboard" ..

 

So whats the new ruling on Pot smoking on board ?? Legal ? Not ?? dont ask ??

 

Carry on ;)

 

It seems you have not sailed the ships in question.....How would you know if the posters complaining are "more than sensitive" or a "bit overboard" if you have not had their experience? The layout on these ships and the placement of the casino is much different than the ships you have sailed. Come back and post your opinion after you've experienced the ships being discussed.

Edited January 21, 2014 by Warm Breezes

[Froggitt]

But the majority of that 80% will sit and play nicely with the smokers. Only the sensitive ones will refuse to go to the casino - so it isn't really 20/80. Even if you're generous and say a full quarter of the non-smoking population is sensitive enough to smoke to avoid the casino, that's going to break even (20/20).

And Im sure the majority of the 20% of smokers would still gamble in a non-smoking environment.

[mpk218]

It seems you have not sailed the ships in question.....How would you know if the posters complaining are "more than sensitive" or a "bit overboard" if you have not had their experience? The layout on these ships and the placement of the casino is much different than the ships you have sailed. Come back and post your opinion after you've experienced the ships being discussed.

 

I suppose Im relying on the other 600 smoking threads that make similar claims

as my basis . But you are correct , I have not sailed on that ship .

Of course you do realize that after that Last Great push about smoking in cabins.

( now banned) That the smokers are so concentrated in the casino due to it being the last safe harbor even when they are not gaming.

I dont see it getting any better . The only option for the super sensitive is another line .. But Im guessing that wont be the choice . Because is not prefered by the Me group to have the entire World molded into their vision of Utopia.. ;)

 

I know this would play better If I smoked :p Oh Well . Carry On .

[Warm Breezes]

I suppose Im relying on the other 600 smoking threads that make similar claims

as my basis . But you are correct , I have not sailed on that ship .

Of course you do realize that after that Last Great push about smoking in cabins.

( now banned) That the smokers are so concentrated in the casino due to it being the last safe harbor even when they are not gaming.

I dont see it getting any better . The only option for the super sensitive is another line .. But Im guessing that wont be the choice . Because is not prefered by the Me group to have the entire World molded into their vision of Utopia.. ;)

 

I know this would play better If I smoked :p Oh Well . Carry On .

 

I'm not a smoker either. I does bother me some (irritates my contacts and I normally have to dump them for new ones after being in a smokey place)....and I do like to gamble some on vacation. But I don't think the point of this thread is really the smoking in the casino, but the smoking on these particular ships that tends to spill into places other than the casino, making not only the casino off limits for some, but the areas surrounding the casino. Having actually been on the Epic, I can see where the complaints are coming from. The ideal situation would be for NCL to upgrade the ventilation systems to stop the smoke from not only going to other areas of the ship but lighten the smoke in the casino area which is a major walkway through the ships. That would be a win win for smokers and non-smokers alike. IMHO it's not about the Me group wanting their own Utopia, its about making these new and beautiful ships enjoyable for all people to use and not just the smokers and those who are not affected by the smoke.

[Winston Wolf]

But they probably care enough not to play in the casino when the smoke at their table gets too bad.

 

Why NCL panders to the 20% rather than the 80% is beyond me.

 

NCL has confined smoking to certain areas. Just because they have a design flaw on keeping smoke confined to those areas doesn't mean they're pandering to the 20%.

[mpk218]

Okay , fair enough . ;) But you do realize that if they ban ( my word not yours) smoking on the ships . They wont be able to sell those suitcase size cartons of cigs in the gift shop.. Philip Morris (Altria) will be very unhappy.

[sdmike]

And Im sure the majority of the 20% of smokers would still gamble in a non-smoking environment.

 

I'm not sure that's true. Studies have shown a very close tie between smoking, drinking and gambling. Maybe it has to do with addictive personalities, but the facts are that the ones that drink and smoke the most are also the ones that gamble the most.

 

Remember, there have been non-smoke ships and casinos tried before, and I think most of gone away due to financial reasons.

 

I, for one, love that smokers, drinkers and gamblers can subsidize my cruise fare.... as long as the smoking and drinking doesn't get so pervasive as to impact my good time. :)

[sdmike]

I'm not a smoker either. I does bother me some (irritates my contacts and I normally have to dump them for new ones after being in a smokey place)....and I do like to gamble some on vacation. But I don't think the point of this thread is really the smoking in the casino, but the smoking on these particular ships that tends to spill into places other than the casino, making not only the casino off limits for some, but the areas surrounding the casino. Having actually been on the Epic, I can see where the complaints are coming from. The ideal situation would be for NCL to upgrade the ventilation systems to stop the smoke from not only going to other areas of the ship but lighten the smoke in the casino area which is a major walkway through the ships. That would be a win win for smokers and non-smokers alike. IMHO it's not about the Me group wanting their own Utopia, its about making these new and beautiful ships enjoyable for all people to use and not just the smokers and those who are not affected by the smoke.

 

Well stated. The problem with smoke is that it doesn't read no smoking signs, or stop at area boundaries. Unless controlled, it will expand into areas that impact the ability to enjoy other areas of the ship that are supposed to be non-smoking. It's not impossible. Casinos in Vegas have been managing smoke effectively for 25 years (some better than others, for sure)

[LrgPizza]

 

So whats the new ruling on Pot smoking on board ?? Legal ? Not ?? dont ask ??

 

Carry on ;)

 

Have you ever seen when they take the drug dogs through the luggage? It's quite fun to see one hit on a bag. Figuratively and literally, of course.

 

(I'm just saying, you might want to keep it in your carry on as you carry on. :p)

[che5904]

I'm not sure that's true. Studies have shown a very close tie between smoking, drinking and gambling. Maybe it has to do with addictive personalities, but the facts are that the ones that drink and smoke the most are also the ones that gamble the most.

 

Remember, there have been non-smoke ships and casinos tried before, and I think most of gone away due to financial reasons.

 

I, for one, love that smokers, drinkers and gamblers can subsidize my cruise fare.... as long as the smoking and drinking doesn't get so pervasive as to impact my good time. :)

 

It's OK Mike I will continue to try and keep your costs down.

 

In answer to your first paragraph. Although you may be partially right, but probably not something I would agree with. It's hard to explain but I will try, hope it makes sense.

 

Here's the thing from a smoker and a "gamer" (the casinos are very nice to me).

 

Most people, unless you live on the inside of a tree, understand that you won't ever "beat" the casino. No matter what, even if you have a good night, the casino is going to come away ahead eventually if you stay there long enough. Otherwise they wouldn't stay in business long, if they didn't make a profit. So in other words, you are pretty sure when you donate your money, you are doing just that. But enjoy what you are doing.

 

Smokers (at least any that I know), enjoy their cigarettes. Cigarettes are not cheap anymore, especially where I'm from. They are albout $8-10 / pack. What do u do with cigarettes, they burn.

 

So if smokers are willing to "burn" up something for their enjoyment they are certainly willing to take that $8-10 and gamble it for the enjoyment and the chance to double it.

 

Now a lot of non-smokers, who are unaware of the cost of smokes, probably just gasped when I wrote the amount down. There's your difference. We are just not afraid to "burn something away" (for our enjoyment) .

 

"For the poster who wrote that making the casino no smoking, the smokers would still gamble." Perhaps they'd keep a few, but I know every casino I went to before the smoking bans have now lost my business. On the ship there is plenty to keep me amused besides the casino if they went no smoking. So yes the casino would probably lose a lot of their higher gamers.

Edited January 21, 2014 by che5904

[tiffygirl]

It's OK Mike I will continue to try and keep your costs down.

 

In answer to your first paragraph. Although you may be partially right, but probably not something I would agree with. It's hard to explain but I will try, hope it makes sense.

 

Here's the thing from a smoker and a "gamer" (the casinos are very nice to me).

 

Most people, unless you live on the inside of a tree, understand that you won't ever "beat" the casino. No matter what, even if you have a good night, the casino is going to come away ahead eventually if you stay there long enough. Otherwise they wouldn't stay in business long, if they didn't make a profit. So in other words, you are pretty sure when you donate your money, you are doing just that. But enjoy what you are doing.

 

Smokers (at least any that I know), enjoy their cigarettes. Cigarettes are not cheap anymore, especially where I'm from. They are albout $8-10 / pack. What do u do with cigarettes, they burn.

 

So if smokers are willing to "burn" up something for their enjoyment they are certainly willing to take that $8-10 and gamble it for the enjoyment and the chance to double it.

 

Now a lot of non-smokers, who are unaware of the cost of smokes, probably just gasped when I wrote the amount down. There's your difference. We are just not afraid to "burn something away" (for our enjoyment) .

 

"For the poster who wrote that making the casino no smoking, the smokers would still gamble." Perhaps they'd keep a few, but I know every casino I went to before the smoking bans have now lost my business. On the ship there is plenty to keep me amused besides the casino if they went no smoking. So yes the casino would probably lose a lot of their higher gamers.

 

That explains why the cigs on the Epic were selling like hot cakes per pack, i think it $3 to $4 a pack..unless I heard wrong. Did i hear wrong?....maybe since you said you spend $8-$10 pack.

 

I love the casino bar so i just watching the folks buy cigs. I didnt realized that they sold them by the pack as well.

[hildob100]

Tiffygirl -

 

Are the cigarettes sold on board available for immediate consumption, or are they like duty-free liquor and only given to you prior to disembarkation? Thanks in advance for the info!

[GSLMOM]

That is the problem with the smoking debate. Some are super sensitive to smoke and others are not. I had a coworker to sail on the inaugural sailing on the Breakaway she came back and said it was so smoky you could smell it everywhere. Now granted inside her office on the job, she can smell the smoke outside and the smoking section is nowhere near her office. I went on the Breakaway a few months later. I smelled it but i was in the casino talking to the smokers smoking many times, so i may have gotten desensitized to it. LOL so i didn’t smell it like others did.

 

No one is lying on this issue or presenting it worse than it is; How bad it [smoke] really is or isn't is based upon each one's perception. Unless the ships goes completely nonsmoking. I believe somebody will ALWAYS complain about the smoke no matter what they do..

 

Exactly. My point is that not everyone smells that smoke, so people shouldn't make a decision about not sailing this class of ship because some people are sensitive to smoke.

[che5904]

That explains why the cigs on the Epic were selling like hot cakes per pack, i think it $3 to $4 a pack..unless I heard wrong. Did i hear wrong?....maybe since you said you spend $8-$10 pack.

 

I love the casino bar so i just watching the folks buy cigs. I didnt realized that they sold them by the pack as well.

 

Well I know U.S. cigarettes are far cheaper than ours, here in Canada. So I have no idea on whether that would be a deal or not. I don't buy U.S. brand cigarettes.

[tiffygirl]

Tiffygirl -

 

Are the cigarettes sold on board available for immediate consumption, or are they like duty-free liquor and only given to you prior to disembarkation? Thanks in advance for the info!

 

I don't know about the cartons that are sold in the shops, but I know if you purchase by the pack at the casino bar those you can use immediately.

 

I hope that helps.

[terrymtex01]

You know.. some times I wonder if the non-smokers think if they just keep HOUNDING this subject to death that things will change.. For this instance it wont until the non-smoking casino dollars are more than the smoking ones.. It is as simple as that. Everyone will tell you the Casino is the most profitable venture on the ship. Speak with your non-smoking dollars and that will get it changed. Spend more in the casino as smokers and guess what.. issue resolved.

[KeithJenner]

It seems you have not sailed the ships in question.....How would you know if the posters complaining are "more than sensitive" or a "bit overboard" if you have not had their experience? The layout on these ships and the placement of the casino is much different than the ships you have sailed. Come back and post your opinion after you've experienced the ships being discussed.

 

 

I've been on all three of the ships in question, admittedly only for a day on one of them, and I haven't ever had a problem with smoke outside the Casino. I spend a lot of time in o'Sheehans and loved the Noodle bar on the Breakaway, which gets a lot of complains about smoke.

 

This is a big problem about this debate, I really don't like the smell of smoke, but I just don't seem to notice it in these places. My initial reaction is always that people are exaggerating the problem, but there are surely too many complaints for that to be the case. I don't understand why there seems to be such a difference in people's perception of the problem, but it doesn't help the understanding of the other sides view.

 

 

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Edited January 21, 2014 by KeithJenner

[lowroller]

I wonder if Mr. Sheehan is a smoker.

Just askin'......

 

(snip) Since it seems most gambler's do smoke, that is a good indoor space to allow it.

 

This not true, the lastest data I saw it was around 22% of the gamblers smoke. The smoke on the Breakaway did appear to linger longer. I'm a former smoker, I don't care if anyone smokes, just don't let that cigarette smoulder in the ash tray!

Glenn

[Froggitt]

This not true, the lastest data I saw it was around 22% of the gamblers smoke.

But of course the 22% who smoke account for 80% of the casino revenue......:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Edited January 22, 2014 by Froggitt

[Froggitt]

I guess the NCL policy on casino smoking wont change until they receive the first batch of lawsuits from casino staff dying from second hand smoking related diseases. A few million bucks a time will certainly make them think again.

[DMH15]

But of course the 22% who smoke account for 80% of the casino revenue......:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

It is kind of hard to be in there spending money, well, ugh, if we're not in there. Case in point, on my last cruise I went to the casinos in Aruba and Curacao where it was NOT smoky and gave them my money instead of NCL.

 

I am a very tolerant non smoker. Rules are NCL allows smoking in the casino. So, I ususlly go sometime during the day. Most of that time it is not too bad. Yeah, would like to go after dinner but it can be pretty rough. Usually means having to wash and dry my hair to be able to stand myself for sleeping.

 

I would definatelty spend more money in the casino if the conditions were more favorable to me.

 

 

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